Tried a Topre (Thanks, Megarat!)

[wellington1869]

So I got to try out a Topre board today, thanks to Megarat.
 
Megarat was in town (thats NYC) in order to participate in a certain *major* athletic event taking place in the city this weekend which is going to be nationally televised...
 
So I had mentioned somewhere that I was wondering what Topres feel like since everyone raves about them in these forums. Out of the blue and out of the kindness of his heart, showing a true geekhacky spirit no doubt, Megarat offered to bring his HHKB for me to try out. Isnt that really decent of him?
 
So we met at (one of the many) starbucks' near Columbus Circle and I finally got to see what the famous Topre switch is like.
 
Topres: Okay, I see what the big deal is about this switch. Though it will be a long while before I can afford one, maybe once I'm out of school and have a job
 
Basically the Topre switch is...
-very very very smooth, friction-free
-linear (and fairly light) resistance.
-unique "soft landing". Even if you bottom out, the feel is somewhat "soft". NOT mushy, but also not "clacky". Its different. Nice.
-NO wobble in the keys; tight keys.
 
The net result is CRISP and quiet and "precise". Very high quality construction, smooth and velvety/crisp feel (if that makes any sense. Its smooth on every part of the keystroke but never mushy, always precise and crisp and tight).
 
Sure, I could see why it gets rave reviews.
 
Couple of other thoughts:
-its NOT "tactile" in the "ordinary" sense. Ie, there isnt really a bump, click, or much friction, or even much bottoming-out-clack. At best there is only the mellow thunk when you bottom.
-Therefore I thought the "closest equivalent" was black cherries (which are also smooth, quiet, and linear). HOwever this is an approximation only; the topres are indeed more smooth, and more quiet. Also their resistance is lighter than black cherries. Also the black cherries seem to me to have a slightly deeper downstroke than the topres.
 
Anyway, so I can understand the rave reviews. The topre "capacitance" keyswitch is definitely unique and very appealing. That said, as a poor student I'll have to live with the black cherries on the SMK for now. But it was great to experience the Topres in person, and I have Megarat to thank for that

[Korbin]

You also have to love the pleasant "thock" sound the switch makes when it goes back to it's starting position

[iMav]

Awesome.  Love seeing fellow geekhacker's helping each other out.

Major athletic event, eh?  

[wellington1869]

Major athletic event, eh?

Yup. And its his fourth one!

[doctorpiorno]

If you will excuse me for blatantly spamming the thread, I thought I'd take the chance to point out that I'm selling a Topre Realforce 'board. The ad is on the marketplace section, if anyone is interested.

Thanks and sorry for the intrusion!

[Korbin]

Grats on finally trying the best keyboard switch on earth

[wellington1869]

doctorpiorno: No problem. I'd be interested except for the japanese layout.
 
Marketplace here moves very slowly, from what I've seen.

[lowpoly]

its NOT "tactile" in the "ordinary" sense. Ie, there isnt really a bump

The bump is soft but it is there:

[wellington1869]

Grats on finally trying the best keyboard switch on earth

Thanks. and best of all I did it without having to spend $250

[wellington1869]

The bump is soft but it is there:
 

I would never have guessed. I'd have to really study it to feel it!

[lowpoly]

I didn't look at the Cherry graphs right now but I think the Topre bump stretches over a longer part of the way.

[lowpoly]

The Topre only clacks on the way back, unlike, for instance, the Model M switches. To hear this "back" click loudly: press a key and bottom it out, and then quickly release it by pulling your finger up quickly. If you touch type or slowly release it, it makes much less noise.

Left shift sounds best.

[megarat]

Awesome.  Love seeing fellow geekhacker's helping each other out.

Hey, all I did was stick my keyboard in a carry-on bag and then meet a stranger for breakfast.  

On an earlier thread, someone once joked about wanting to visit, in person, a geekhack brick-and-mortar store, where they could try out the various types of these expensive boards and different switches w/o having to pony up the $$$ in advance.

In the absence of that, about we do this the grass-roots way?  I.e., open up our collection to forum members, at least for in-person visits?  It might not have the same impact as would an extensive boutique for keyboard connesieurs, but it might help influence some decisions regardless.

I'll start it off:  I'm based in Seattle, and I have an HHKB Pro 2.  If you're curious about the HHKB Pro 2 and want to give it a test-drive, let me know and we can work something out.  You can even compare it to my HHKB Lite 2 if you want a good laugh.

[xsphat]

I'm in central Wisconsin and we all know what I have.

[itlnstln]

I'm in central Wisconsin and we all know what I have.

I just hope you don't need medical care for what you have...

OR

You have lots of cheese?

[xsphat]

Another crack like that and you might

[xsphat]

I have thought of how it would be to open a writer's store where I could have a good selection of keyboards and pens and paper, some books, and I'd also cater to the geek set some how. But if I think that'll come to fruition, then I must be smoking something.

[wellington1869]

One solution would be to move to Japan where they know how to feed my fetish

PLUS you'd be able to buy various keyboards too


.
.
.

[wellington1869]

I have thought of how it would be to open a writer's store where I could have a good selection of keyboards and pens and paper, some books, and I'd also cater to the geek set some how. But if I think that'll come to fruition, then I must be smoking something.

I'd visit.  If you attach a coffee shop next to it I'd even stay for hours.
 
They sometimes sell fancy pens in bookstores, so why not fancy keyboards? Its for the same market, readers and writers.

[xsphat]

It's that, "it's just a keyboard" thing. I used to have it, then I was given a box of old Mac stuff which included a IIGS keyboard with Alps pink sliders and the rest, well, the rest made my pocketbook a lot lighter.

[MANISH7]

-its NOT "tactile" in the "ordinary" sense. At best there is only the mellow thunk when you bottom.

How would you compare the Topre's tactility to buckling springs?

[kyamei]

How would you compare the Topre's tactility to buckling springs?

Hard to compare things that are COMPLETELY different.  Topre's have pretty much nothing in common with buckling springs.

[MANISH7]

Let me try to rephrase the question: in terms of “effective tactile response”, how do you rate the Topre vs. buckling springs? I know both keys are completely different but they both have to reach the same destination, even if differently: my satisfaction for tactility. Perhaps there can be different kinds of tactility so I generalize with “effective tactile response”. I realize that is subjective but it's not like I'm going to try the keyboard in person. My goal is simply to get an idea of how tactile the Topre is. That’s it. That’s my question. I tried to compare its effective tactility to a reference key switch that everyone is personally familiar with.

[wellington1869]

In terms of "effective tactile response" as you say, the topres are about the same as the brown cherries probably (if you've used those).
Problem is even on the scale of 'effective tactile response" as you put it, different switches still divide up into classes or leagues that are difficult to compare with each other. The BS is extremely tactile and nothing else really compares except maybe the white alps. The topre is nothing like either switch even in 'effective tactile response'. Its not in-your-face like that in terms of what you feel on your fingers and what you hear with your ears. Compared to them, arguably it'd be hard to even call it 'tactile'. But compared to brown cherries, sure, its sort of tactile, there's a similar light bump and probably a similar force curve and similarly light clack/thock when you hit bottom.  

Problem is everyone is going to define "effective" very differently (in the phrase "effective" tactile response).

[MANISH7]

In terms of "effective tactile response" as you say, the topres are about the same as the brown cherries probably (if you've used those).
Problem is even on the scale of 'effective tactile response" as you put it, different switches still divide up into classes or leagues that are difficult to compare with each other. The BS is extremely tactile and nothing else really compares except maybe the white alps. The topre is nothing like either switch even in 'effective tactile response'. Its not in-your-face like that in terms of what you feel on your fingers and what you hear with your ears. Compared to them, arguably it'd be hard to even call it 'tactile'. But compared to brown cherries, sure, its sort of tactile, there's a similar light bump and probably a similar force curve and similarly light clack/thock when you hit bottom.  

Problem is everyone is going to define "effective" very differently (in the phrase "effective" tactile response).

Excellent...just what I wanted to know. Thanks. This is as good of an answer possible (even with its subjectivity) without being able to try the keyboard in person. In the near future I'll try out a brown cherry to judge its "kind of tactility". The sound of the blue cherries made my ears itch. I guess when it comes to tactile response Model M is still King

[patrickgeekhack]

Someone once asked if he could borrow some keyboards for reviews. I said that I would never lend mine. I was still new to this forum, and did not know that people do lend theirs for test drives. After having been on this forum almost daily for the past month or say, needless to say that I feel pretty stupid to have jumped to conclusion so fast.

Well, I'm North of the border, and will probably never get a chance to meet one of you in person, but who knows what the future might hold. Anyway, I'm in Kitchener, Ontario. I still won't lend my keyboards , but if anyone here wants to try them, and is close to where I live, let me know.

[kyamei]

While I hate putting it this way, I'd say the Topre's are most similar to rubber domes in tactility (that being said, I hate rubber domes, but LOVE Topres).  

Then again, I personally don't think buckling springs are any more tactile than blue Cherries.