Author Topic: Apple 2gs keyboard (Read 10265 times)

cchan · « **on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 12:27:37 »

http://search.ebay.com/390013256731

Would an iMate make this work on a modern computer? I've always liked the look of these keyboards and their "HHKB with numpad" form factor. But I have no idea of the key feel.

bhtooefr · « **Reply #1 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 12:35:23 »

An iMate would make it work, although you'd be missing a lot of keys that are unused on the GS. (Function keys, editing keys, and stuff like that.)

(I use an AEK2 on my GS, and those unused keys type random characters, actually.)

Ask xsphat about the feel, he doesn't like it.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #2 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 12:55:34 »

I like the form factor a lot too, but XS says the switches suck.
Also with an imate, if you're using it on windows machines, it wont differentiate between left alt and right alt (alt gr) and has some other minor issues like that (search the forum for imate for more deets on that).

xsphat · « **Reply #3 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 12:57:17 »

Not only so the switches suck, but the keys are shaped stupid too.

Get this one instead:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=200280212895

wellington1869 · « **Reply #4 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 13:09:27 »

Quote from: xsphat;15535

Not only so the switches suck, but the keys are shaped stupid too.

Get this one instead:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=200280212895

xs, what are the switches in that one?

xsphat · « **Reply #5 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 13:12:49 »

Most likely Alps pinks or oranges.

cchan · « **Reply #6 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:07:15 »

I kind of like the key shapes in the one I posted. Just from an æsthetic standpoint. Never typed on one. I do know though that some Sony laptops had keys shaped like that. And I could use autohotkey to overcome the function keys issue.

What are the characteristics of the ALPS pinks and oranges?

xs, was it you that had a bunch of used iMates for cheap?

PS: If all else fails, I'm getting an M2452. I remember thinking they weren't bad for rubber dome boards.

xsphat · « **Reply #7 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:10:26 »

I sold all of the extra iMates I had in about a week.

cchan · « **Reply #8 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:28:20 »

Eh... It doesn't look like I could get an iMate for under $30ish... iirc their msrp is $40 and some ebay stores have them for $60. And it would be a lot harder to get those adb keyboards to work under Windows on a whitebox PC because of the lack of function, navigation, and modifier keys. So I'm taking the easy route out and ordering an M2452.

Chloe · « **Reply #9 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:35:24 »

You could try replacing the controller, but that would cost more.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #10 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:37:43 »

Quote from: Tales;15568

ordering an M2452.

Tales, if you get that can you review it here (and post pics of the switch)?

cchan · « **Reply #11 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:48:43 »

Quote from: wellington1869;15570

Tales, if you get that can you review it here (and post pics of the switch)?

Sure. I'm 90% sure it's a rubber dome board - it's the onethat came with the G3 iMacs. But I used one at school and remember not being exasperated with it.

lowpoly · « **Reply #12 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 15:59:05 »

The M2452 is a rubber dome. I have one, I don't remember how the switches are. Had to repair the cable and sort of ruined the case because the snap together strategy was too clever for me. This board is hated by many, IIRC.

Tales, if you don't mind rubber dome and want that key shape then this might be something:

Fujtsu Siemens KBPC E USB keyboard. The wrist rest can be taken off. Prices vary a lot for these. Layout-wise it's a clone of the Cherry ErgoPlus.

No idea if it's available in the US. One is on ebay Germany right now:

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=320325228888

Shouldn't cost more than Euro 20,-.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #13 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 16:00:02 »

Quote from: lowpoly;15573

The M2452 is a rubber dome.

thanks lowpoly. Tales, never mind the review then

cchan · « **Reply #14 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 16:07:12 »

That's interesting lowpoly, but I was more going for the narrow F-key-less (or little F keys) + numpad layout. That was my main consideration, with the design of the keys coming in second. Yes, the M2452 is hated here. But I have my own preferences

Quote from: wellington1869

thanks lowpoly. Tales, never mind the review then

I"ll still review if I decide it's worth my time and its one of the few rubber dome boards that doesn't suck.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #15 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 16:26:35 »

Quote from: Tales;15575

I"ll still review if I decide it's worth my time and its one of the few rubber dome boards that doesn't suck.

thats cool

For the record I myself dont think that every membrane board sucks

I used membranes happily for over a decade. I've just had a renewed appreciation lately for mechanicals, thats all.
(i'm a proud moderate in all my views, lol)

bhtooefr · « **Reply #16 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 16:29:51 »

I'd just like to note that membrane != rubber dome.

The Model M has a membrane, and is awesome.

Microwave ovens often have membrane, and make rubber dome look like the best keyboard ever in comparison. (Although, my microwave uses dials (and no, dials are not a kind of keyswitch, I mean things that you grab and twist instead of push - and no, it's not a 1960's microwave, I bought it brand new a year ago at Mao-Mart,) and a friend of mine specifically sought out a microwave with actual buttons instead of a membrane sheet.)

wellington1869 · « **Reply #17 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 16:43:09 »

Quote from: bhtooefr;15579

a friend of mine specifically sought out a microwave with actual buttons instead of a membrane sheet.)

only if they're cherries!

bhtooefr · « **Reply #18 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 17:08:25 »

I'm sorry, I wasn't going to go over to her house just to pull a keycap on her microwave.

Chloe · « **Reply #19 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 17:13:35 »

Some membrane buttons have tactile microswitches underneath.

dougy · « **Reply #20 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 18:09:09 »

Quote from: wellington1869;15540

xs, what are the switches in that one?

The one I have has the same switches as the AESII.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #21 on:** Sat, 20 December 2008, 18:24:47 »

Quote from: dougy;15598

The one I have has the same switches as the AESII.

dougy, did you mean the aeKii?

xsphat · « **Reply #22 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 00:35:25 »

Quote from: dougy;15598

The one I have has the same switches as the AESII.

Check the model number, make sure we're talking about the same 'board.

Chloe · « **Reply #23 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 07:46:31 »

Quote from: lowpoly;15573

Tales, if you don't mind rubber dome and want that key shape then this might be something:

Do you know if these have light rubber domes? I'm thinking of trying an ergonomic split keyboard but there doesn't seem to be many adjustable ones.

lowpoly · « **Reply #24 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 08:11:51 »

I can try it when I'm back in the office (probably after Christmas).

megarat · « **Reply #25 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 19:52:17 »

Quote from: xsphat;15535

Not only so the switches suck, but the keys are shaped stupid too.

I want to come to the defense of this keyboard, as I had one for a long time and really enjoyed the feel of it. Heck, I even classified it as one of my Top 3 Keyboards of All Time on this forum.

(Admittedly, I never 100% grooved with the layout, as I don't like either L-shaped enter keys, or arrow keys in a linear row.)

Then again, it has been 10-15 years since I've used one. So I'll hold back, as odds are good that I didn't know any better.

Does anyone (XSPhat?) know what switches these keyboards have? I'm tempted to play on one of these again, to see if my high regard for these keyboards is simply nostalgic.

dougy · « **Reply #26 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:18:15 »

I guess my color memory betrays me....
http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=398&stc=1&d=1229911646
The switches are a gold/orange color, same keycap and feel as the Apple Extended Keyboard II.

The rubber dome one is similar
http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=399&stc=1&d=1229911671
but a bit larger and doesn't feel good to type on. Think this came with the beige g3 tower.

Of the 2 the older gs board types much nicer. Although the keys look funny the finger contact area is the same as a standard key.

As an aside all the old keyboards have the keycap dimple on the d and k keycaps, new boards on f and j. When/why did that change?

xsphat · « **Reply #27 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:23:03 »

I was always going to buy one of those with the standard layout because I assumed it had some for of Alps switch. Thanks, you just saved me some cash.

I don't know what kind of switch it was in the one I've posted pictures to here about thirty times in the past week, but I know I loved it until the second I tried a different model of the same keyboard with pink Alps sliders, which is something I have posted here elsewhere on this same topic a couple days ago.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #28 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:32:29 »

Quote from: dougy;15731

I guess my color memory betrays me....
http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=398&stc=1&d=1229911646
The switches are a gold/orange color, same keycap and feel as the Apple Extended Keyboard II.

so sounds like basically this would be an alternate source of those rubber dampers that itln and I were looking for..

dougy · « **Reply #29 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:34:48 »

Hmmm, maybe spend the money on the gs board. I'm on it now and it actually feels almost as good as the blue cherries. Some of the key locations are odd, but if you are just squirting text it types quite well. Pity the fact it has a numpad.

megarat · « **Reply #30 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:48:52 »

Quote

Of the 2 the older gs board types much nicer. Although the keys look funny the finger contact area is the same as a standard key.

Ah, I'm feeling better about my memory. I had the same opinion when I had both of those keyboards for my project SE/30. The IIgs keyboard felt fun to type on. The other keyboard fought back.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #31 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:54:00 »

Quote from: dougy;15736

Hmmm, maybe spend the money on the gs board. I'm on it now and it actually feels almost as good as the blue cherries. Some of the key locations are odd, but if you are just squirting text it types quite well. Pity the fact it has a numpad.

so whats the first one (with the alps) called and whats the second one called (with the domes)? arent they both 'iigs' boards?

bhtooefr · « **Reply #32 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 20:58:58 »

The first one is the "Apple Desktop Bus Keyboard," and was the keyboard sold with the IIGS.

The second one is the "Apple Keyboard II," and was the keyboard usually sold with the Mac SE and SE/30. (I have one of these.)

If that GS keyboard feels almost as good as blue Cherries... damnit, now I'm gonna have to get one, even though I despise L-shaped enters.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #33 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 21:10:00 »

Quote from: bhtooefr;15743

The first one is the "Apple Desktop Bus Keyboard," and was the keyboard sold with the IIGS.

The second one is the "Apple Keyboard II," and was the keyboard usually sold with the Mac SE and SE/30. (I have one of these.)

If that GS keyboard feels almost as good as blue Cherries... damnit, now I'm gonna have to get one, even though I despise L-shaped enters.

thanks! I think I'd like to pick one of the iigs boards up too if I need more rubber dampers. They dont seem any cheaper than the aekii tho. both seem to be selling for around $25 to $30 on ebay.

dougy · « **Reply #34 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 21:48:08 »

Are you sure on the Keyboard II coming with the SE30? My memory tells me my SE30 came with the Extended Keyboard and the Keyboard II came with either a Quadra 800 or a beige g3, or maybe with both. I do have 2 of them, and they are the only non-mechanical switch keyboard I've got in beige plastic...

All the later keyboards, in fancy plastic colors, are squishyfeely things that I'm assuming are rubber dome.

megarat · « **Reply #35 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 22:59:33 »

Quote from: bhtooefr;15743

The first one is the "Apple Desktop Bus Keyboard," and was the keyboard sold with the IIGS.

The second one is the "Apple Keyboard II," and was the keyboard usually sold with the Mac SE and SE/30. (I have one of these.)

More specifically: the IIgs keyboard is model A9M0330. The Keyboard II is model M0487.

According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_keyboards), the Keyboard II was introduced with the Macintosh LC, which is of a later vintage than the SE and SE/30. (There was also an all-black version sold with the Mac TV.)

IIRC, the keyboard was an optional accessory with some of those earlier Macs (SE, SE/30), and you needed to specify which keyboard you wanted. (Note that I never bought a Mac until 1994, when I got a Powermac 7100/66, with the unfortunate Apple Design Keyboard.)

megarat · « **Reply #36 on:** Sun, 21 December 2008, 23:11:52 »

Quote from: dougy;15731

As an aside all the old keyboards have the keycap dimple on the d and k keycaps, new boards on f and j. When/why did that change?

I've been interested in this as well, and I don't know the answer. I'll search around and see if I can find anything.

When I started fooling around with the layout of my HHKB, I moved the F/J to D/K, to have the nipples in the original position. I was a little bit surprised to find that I'm much more used to having them at the F/J position and moved them back.

xsphat · « **Reply #37 on:** Mon, 22 December 2008, 00:12:25 »

Quote from: megarat;15748

I've been interested in this as well, and I don't know the answer. I'll search around and see if I can find anything.

When I started fooling around with the layout of my HHKB, I moved the F/J to D/K, to have the nipples in the original position. I was a little bit surprised to find that I'm much more used to having them at the F/J position and moved them back.

I switched them on all my old Apple keyboards.

wellington1869 · « **Reply #38 on:** Mon, 22 December 2008, 00:36:46 »

Quote from: xsphat;15755

I switched them on all my old Apple keyboards.

hooleon sells these nifty "home row locator bumps" (12 for $4). I actually added some to my last purchase from there to put on some of my hotkeys. They work really well.

xsphat · « **Reply #39 on:** Mon, 22 December 2008, 01:22:23 »

judging by the picture, if you got them in the right color, they would look like nipples

Chloe · « **Reply #40 on:** Mon, 22 December 2008, 01:35:04 »

I missed those on the Hooleon site. They would be handy.

sandy55 · « **Reply #41 on:** Sat, 03 January 2009, 07:24:34 »

Seems like this thread was over, but here is an additional information regarding Appl II GS keyboard.

GS keyboard is available in 2 flavors.
One is with ALPS orange/tactile as you know.
The other is with SMK-ish white stem switch. action unknown.
See this web page.

You can see upper housing of white stem is almost identical to SMK and
SMK-ish switch below.

SMK round stem white/Clicky
SMK-ish square stem blue/Clicky
Inner construction is almost same.

I have not yet experienced GS keyboard with white stem switches.
I have an alps/orange version. I like it Over all design is cool, I like those funny key caps
but they drive me crazy when I actually type the 'board.
Grr.... one key cap is missing.

lowpoly · « **Reply #42 on:** Sat, 03 January 2009, 09:04:55 »

Is this the M0116?

sandy55 · « **Reply #43 on:** Sat, 03 January 2009, 11:13:46 »

Quote from: lowpoly;16992

Is this the M0116?

According to megarat, model number of Apple ll GS keyboard is A9M0330.
can't confirm it right now 'cause mine is kept in different place.
M0116 is this one

"SMK round stem white/clicky" can't be displayed on Firefox in certain condition.

xsphat · « **Reply #44 on:** Sat, 03 January 2009, 11:22:45 »

You're right Sandy, the bad one is the Apple Desktop Bus Keyboard Model A9M0330. I don't remember the action but I know it was better than a membrane but no where near pink Alps, so I got rid of it long ago.

lowpoly · « **Reply #45 on:** Sat, 03 January 2009, 14:30:48 »

Quote from: sandy55;17004

According to megarat, model number of Apple ll GS keyboard is A9M0330.
can't confirm it right now 'cause mine is kept in different place.
M0116 is this one

Ah, thanks. I mixed that up when I read "orange/tactile".

News:

Author Topic: Apple 2gs keyboard (Read 10265 times)