Author Topic: Good keyboard shop in Europe?  (Read 5542 times)

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Offline fuzzybyte

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« on: Thu, 02 April 2009, 16:26:57 »
Does anyone know good shops in EU which sells mechanical or scissor switch keyboards?

The only mechanical switch keyboard I could find in Finland was the SteelSeries 7G with those ****ty black cherry switches which have no tactile feedback and so are horrible to use.

I need to find a good keyboard with either finnish or US layout.

Offline lam47

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #1 on: Thu, 02 April 2009, 16:51:37 »
Blacks are good switches. The same as blue or brown only as you say they do not have a tactile bump or a click.
You could try cherry in Germany. Although they tend to only have the qwertz layout.
I dont know how different that would be to a Finish layout but then It has to be closer than a US board.
Keyboards. Happy Hacking pro 2 x2. One white one black. IBM model M US layout. SGI silicone Graphics with rubber dampened ALPS. IBM model F. ALPS apple board, I forget what it is. And some more I forget what I have.

Typewriters. Olivetti Valentine. Imperial Good Companion Model T. Olympia SM3

Offline lal

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 03 April 2009, 10:42:59 »
http://www.cherry.de/english/products/office_business_G80-3000.htm

This can be had with any kind of color MX switch and very probably with Finnish layout too, if you ask for it.  If you're considering the SteelSeries 7G it seems money isn't ultra scarce, so I'd recommend a Customizer or SpaceSaver from Unicomp.
BS: Customizer, Model Ms; Alps: CSK-2101, FK-2002, AT-101 (SGI & Dell), MCK-860, FKBN87Z/EB; Cherry: Poker X, FKBN87MC/EB, WY60, G80-3000, G84-4100, TDV 5010

Offline itlnstln

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 03 April 2009, 10:45:49 »
Quote from: lal;26819
http://www.cherry.de/english/products/office_business_G80-3000.htm

This can be had with any kind of color MX switch and very probably with Finnish layout too, if you ask for it.


Mmmm... G80-3000 with browns.  Veeeerrry nice.


Offline Hak Foo

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 03 April 2009, 21:34:21 »
Honestly, I find the look of the black G80-3000 (that "big solid slab" look) very appealing.

Can they make it with buckling springs? :D :D :D
Overton130, Box Pale Blues.

Offline ssb

  • Posts: 54
Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 04 April 2009, 08:54:59 »
The real problem with Cherries and other mechanical keyboards is that most EU shops stock GB/UK layout models only. Recently I was searching for a G80-3000 with US layout and I was not able to find it in most European shops.
Please excuse my poor English.

Offline huha

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #6 on: Sun, 05 April 2009, 12:33:39 »
I recently bought a G80-3000LSCDE-2 (German layout, blue MX) for my secondary computer. The good: It's really inexpensive, I paid about EUR 45 for it, which is a real bargain considering the price the MX modules alone would cost.
But the build quality was disappointing. The only screws to be found were two tiny ones holding the controller PCB in place, the rest is just held together by plastic clips. The whole case warps. Plus, it's incredibly light (960 g), making it feel extremely cheap.
If you open it up and glue down some steel rods, the warping gets considerably better and it'll weigh a bit more as well.
Also, the windows keys have a really unpleasant feel to them; so unpleasant I switches the one windows key I use and the application key.


Other than that, it's quite a nice keyboard, but the build quality is mildly disappointing. On the other hand, it's not only one of the few decent keyboards you'll find in Europe, but also by far the cheapest, so you get what you pay for.


-huha
Unicomp Endurapro 105 (blank keycaps, BS) // Cherry G80-3000LSCDE-2 (blues, modded to green MX) // Cherry G80-3000LAMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Cherry G80-11900LTMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Compaq G80-11801 (browns) // Epson Q203A (Fujitsu Peerless) // IBM Model M2 (BS) // Boscom AS400 Terminal Emulator (OEM\'d Unicomp, BS, 2x) // Dell AT102DW (black Alps) // Mechanical Touch (chinese BS) Acer 6312-KW (Acer mechanics on membrane) // Cherry G84-4100 (ML) // Cherry G80-1000HAD (NKRO, blacks)

Offline keyb_gr

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #7 on: Sun, 05 April 2009, 16:30:13 »
Quote from: huha;27144
But the build quality was disappointing. The only screws to be found were two tiny ones holding the controller PCB in place, the rest is just held together by plastic clips. The whole case warps. Plus, it's incredibly light (960 g), making it feel extremely cheap.

I haven't checked the weight, but pretty much the same can be said for my G80-3000LFADE /01 that I already bought used in early 2002. There are four round holes on the bottom that look like they may be intended for screws but there aren't any.
I never quite figured out how to open the board without damaging anything though (better safe than sorry!).

It's got a few subpar keys as well, like the right shift (very annoying). Can you really just pull out and swap the switches on these?

Maybe I'll get me one of the old G80-1000HFDs one of those days. A G81-1000 at least is a pretty sturdy piece of kit. (Seems to have a somewhat longer key travel when compared to its modern-day counterparts.)

Meanwhile I'm back to the Model M on my main comp, even though the sloppy return key is bothering me. The G80 is nicer for actual typing (less force), but after well over 7 years on IBMs I like some of the modifiers to be somewhat heavier, along with a generally more solid keyboard feel. (What I do not like is the IBMs' enormous desk footprint.)

The modern-day Cherrys (both G81 and G80), in spite of feeling a little cheap, still seem to be holding up well in actual use. A well-used sample may be showing shiny spots on the case surface from wear (which I saw when cleaning one recently), but they just keep on ticking.
« Last Edit: Tue, 05 May 2009, 04:33:27 by keyb_gr »
Hardware in signatures clutters Google search results. There should be a field in the profile for that (again).

This message was probably typed on a vintage G80-3000 with blues. Double-shots, baby. :D

Offline huha

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #8 on: Sun, 05 April 2009, 17:05:31 »
Quote from: keyb_gr;27160
I haven't checked the weight, but pretty much the same can be said for my G80-3000LFADE /01 that I already bought used in early 2002. There are four round holes on the bottom that look like they may be intended for screws but there aren't any.
I never quite figured out how to open the board without damaging anything though (better safe than sorry!).


My G80-3000 has five hooks/clips at the top of the case and five at the bottom; they can be opened fairly easily with a screwdriver, giving access to both PCBs (key matrix and controller). The main PCB is attached to the controller PCB by a pretty stiff and short cable, so the easiest way is to flip the main PCB to reveal the two screws holding the controller PCB in place and unscrew them.
It doesn't compare at all to the build quality of any other decent keyboard I've seen. In fact, I'm quite disappointed by the incredibly cheap construction, considering this is one of Cherry's more expensive keyboards. Luckily, this doesn't apply to the keys, it's just the case.

Quote
It's got a few subpar keys as well, like the right shift (very annoying). Can you really just pull out and swap the switches on these?


The MX modules are directly soldered on the PCB, but it's quite well made and should be easy to replace a defective switch.
What really annoys me is the strange feel of the key lettering. I don't know what technology they use, but it feels almost embossed. This is not of concern on all keys except the windows keys--their feel just annoys me.

Quote
Meanwhile I'm back to the Model M on my main comp, even though the sloppy return key is bothering me. The G80 is nicer for actual typing (less force), but after well over 7 years on IBMs I like some of the modifiers to be somewhat heavier, along with a generally more solid keyboard feel. (What I do not like is the IBMs' enormous desk footprint.)


I'm using a Model M on my main computer as well and I think its feel is just superior. The blue MX modules don't really click; their click is almost inaudible when typing, clicky feeling is not as pronounced and they have a really weird behaviour when releasing them slowly (they almost seem to stick at one level).
I really like the old clicky Alps switches; they're a bit easier to press than the buckling springs and still produce a wonderful click.

Quote
The modern-day Cherrys (both G81 and G80), in spite of feeling a little cheap, still seem to be holding up well in actual use. A well-used sample may be showing shiny spots on the case surface from wear (which I saw when cleaning one recently), but they just keep on ticking.


It's certainly not a bad keyboard, especially after weighing it down with a 500 g steel rod and relocating the windows keycap. In fact, you can't really go wrong with one as it's comparatively inexpensive and still offers the typing comfort of other MX switch keyboards.

-huha
Unicomp Endurapro 105 (blank keycaps, BS) // Cherry G80-3000LSCDE-2 (blues, modded to green MX) // Cherry G80-3000LAMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Cherry G80-11900LTMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Compaq G80-11801 (browns) // Epson Q203A (Fujitsu Peerless) // IBM Model M2 (BS) // Boscom AS400 Terminal Emulator (OEM\'d Unicomp, BS, 2x) // Dell AT102DW (black Alps) // Mechanical Touch (chinese BS) Acer 6312-KW (Acer mechanics on membrane) // Cherry G84-4100 (ML) // Cherry G80-1000HAD (NKRO, blacks)

Offline keyb_gr

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #9 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 05:25:11 »
Quote from: huha;27163
It doesn't compare at all to the build quality of any other decent keyboard I've seen. In fact, I'm quite disappointed by the incredibly cheap construction, considering this is one of Cherry's more expensive keyboards. Luckily, this doesn't apply to the keys, it's just the case.

Well, if the keyswitches alone cost more than the whole board when bought separately, there probably wasn't too much budget left for the case.

Interestingly enough, I just picked up a G81-3000LRNDE - 0 / 01 (they're a standard keyboard in "my" university department) and subjectively found it to be noticeably heavier and not bending quite as much as my G80 at home. Strangely enough it must be  newer than the G80, given that it already has the raised bumps on F and J rather than deeper key tops.

(BTW, it's not the key travel that's different in 1000 and 3000 series G81s, but seemingly rather the stiffness. While linear key action hardly is the most satisfying, I find that I can actually type pretty decently on the 1000 after getting used to it.)
Quote
What really annoys me is the strange feel of the key lettering. I don't know what technology they use, but it feels almost embossed.

It's lasered (thus the 'L'). The keys usually get flat after some use. The old 1000 series boards had actual filled plastic lettering, like the IBMs.
Quote
I really like the old clicky Alps switches; they're a bit easier to press than the buckling springs and still produce a wonderful click.

I only had the opportunity to type on an old Alps-equpped board once, and yes, I liked the feel. Somewhere between IBM and Cherry blues I thought.
Quote
It's certainly not a bad keyboard, especially after weighing it down with a 500 g steel rod and relocating the windows keycap.

Seems like a neat and (I guess) inexpensive tweak.

Btw, quoting the (unsuspecting) user of the recently cleaned G81: "Someone stole my keyboard!" I had to contain myself not to LOL... :D (And yes, it was visibly on the dirty side before.)
« Last Edit: Tue, 05 May 2009, 04:34:01 by keyb_gr »
Hardware in signatures clutters Google search results. There should be a field in the profile for that (again).

This message was probably typed on a vintage G80-3000 with blues. Double-shots, baby. :D

Offline lowpoly

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #10 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 05:53:35 »
Quote from: ssb;27047
The real problem with Cherries and other mechanical keyboards is that most EU shops stock GB/UK layout models only. Recently I was searching for a G80-3000 with US layout and I was not able to find it in most European shops.

G80-3000LSCEU (which has ANSI/US layout) is easy to find, even in black. It was different when I bought mine half a year ago.

Even G80-3000LQCEU-2 gives plenty of hits now.

Miniguru thread at GH // The Apple M0110 Today

Offline huha

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #11 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 06:29:44 »
Quote from: keyb_gr;27209
Well, if the keyswitches alone cost more than the whole board when bought separately, there probably wasn't too much budget left for the case.


I also thought that might be the case, but why not make it a bit more expensive and add a nice steel backplate and screws? In comparison, the sub-EUR 20 Cherry evolution stream I keep as an emergency keyboard is built really well; it features lots of screws and even a large steel backplate.

Quote
Interestingly enough, I just picked up a G81-3000LRNDE - 0 / 01 (they're a standard keyboard in "my" university department) and subjectively found it to be noticeably heavier and not bending quite as much as my G80 at home.


It's just a speculation, but maybe the G81 has to have a steel backplate to provide stability to the membrane sheet, whereas the G80's MX modules can just be soldered on a PCB and stuck into the case without further support.

Quote
Strangely enough it must be  newer than the G80, given that it already has the raised bumps on F and J rather than deeper key tops.

They changed the style? That's quite sad, I tend to like deeper/curved key caps more than those with raised bumps.

(BTW, it's not the key travel that's different in 1000 and 3000 series G81s, but seemingly rather the stiffness. While linear key action hardly is the most satisfying, I find that I can actually type pretty decently on the 1000 after getting used to it.)

Quote
It's lasered (thus the 'L'). The keys usually get flat after some use. The old 1000 series boards had actual filled plastic lettering, like the IBMs.


I was talking about the black (G80-3000LSCDE-2) version. The lettering looks really strange under a loupe. It almost looks like screen printing gone horribly wrong with way too much ink. The letters are raised tp a point where they can be felt easily. But maybe it's lasered and then filled (i.e. intaglio) with still too much ink. It doesn't feel especially bad (the one exception being the windows keys), but it sure feels strange.

Quote
I only had the opportunity to type on an old Alps-equpped board once, and yes, I liked the feel. Somewhere between IBM and Cherry blues I thought.


I recently rediscovered one which was sitting around here and collecting dust (I actually learned to type on the keyboard and didn't know what gem it was, so I bought crappy keyboards for years when I just could have used this and be happy :rolleyes:). Clicky Alps, double injection molded keycaps, solidly built but somewhat dirty and the plastic is quite yellow. I'll have to clean it and treat the plastic before it will be usable again.
Does anyone know how the new Alps switches are in comparison?

Quote
Seems like a neat and (I guess) inexpensive tweak.


I bought it at the local DIY store, so it was more expensive than it should have been, but the keyboard sucked so much I just had to. I think I paid EUR 4 for the steel rod (14x5x1000 mm). The G80s plastic ribs are located directly under the keys to provide stability  when keys are pressed, so their distance is about 2/3". I cut the rod into two parts with 440 mm length and affixed them with double-sided tape. The remaining piece was stuck at the very top of the keyboard to act as a counterweight. The results are quite pleasing: The warping is much better and it's heavier. Still not as heavy as the Model M, though, but at least you can now hurt someone with it. ;)

Quote
Btw, quoting the (unsuspecting) user of the recently cleaned G81: "Someone stole my keyboard!" I had to contain myself not to LOL... :D (And yes, it was visibly on the dirty side before.)


:D

Which brings me to the initial question again: Apart from Cherries, are there any good (new!) keyboards in Europe? The lighted Deck models (IIRC they use Cherry ML) are available at a few stores, but is there anything without Cherry switches? (Maybe Alps? Even if the new ones are half as good as the old ones, I'd still like to have one.)

-huha
Unicomp Endurapro 105 (blank keycaps, BS) // Cherry G80-3000LSCDE-2 (blues, modded to green MX) // Cherry G80-3000LAMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Cherry G80-11900LTMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Compaq G80-11801 (browns) // Epson Q203A (Fujitsu Peerless) // IBM Model M2 (BS) // Boscom AS400 Terminal Emulator (OEM\'d Unicomp, BS, 2x) // Dell AT102DW (black Alps) // Mechanical Touch (chinese BS) Acer 6312-KW (Acer mechanics on membrane) // Cherry G84-4100 (ML) // Cherry G80-1000HAD (NKRO, blacks)

Offline cchan

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #12 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 08:54:32 »
Quote from: huha;27215
The lighted Deck models (IIRC they use Cherry ML)


Nope, Décks use MX black switches with integrated LED.
HP Envy17: Core i7-2760QM, 8GB DDR3, 128GB Crucial m4 + 750GB Hitachi, Windows 7 Home Premium x64, Cherry ML4100, Logitech M500, HP zr22w
IBM Thinkpad X60: Core Duo T2400, 2GB DDR2, 128GB Samsung 830, Xubuntu 12.04 x86, Cherry ML4100, Logitech M205, HP zr22w
Raspberry Pi Model B: BCM2835, 0.25GB DDR2, 8GB Samsung SD card, Raspbian Wheezy, human interaction devices as above

Offline lal

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #13 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 11:16:26 »
Quote from: huha;27215

Which brings me to the initial question again: Apart from Cherries, are there any good (new!) keyboards in Europe?


None that I know of.  Unfortunately.
BS: Customizer, Model Ms; Alps: CSK-2101, FK-2002, AT-101 (SGI & Dell), MCK-860, FKBN87Z/EB; Cherry: Poker X, FKBN87MC/EB, WY60, G80-3000, G84-4100, TDV 5010

Offline ssb

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #14 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 15:08:22 »
Quote from: lal;27246
None that I know of.  Unfortunately.

Except Das III from getdigital.de

Yeah I've heared about DasIII quality issues, but my experience from using three of them isn't that bad. Overpriced and certainly not ...IBM build quality but not worst than my Cherries or M10.
Please excuse my poor English.

Offline itlnstln

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« Reply #15 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 15:10:42 »
Quote from: ssb;27312
Except Das III from getdigital.de

Yeah I've heared about DasIII quality issues, but my experience from using three of them isn't that bad. Certainly not ...IBM build quality but not worst than my Cherries or M10s.


I think people are OK with the build quality of the Das, it's just the logic issues that are giving people problems.

BTW, welcome to GeekHack! :)


Offline ssb

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« Reply #16 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 15:13:39 »
Quote from: itlnstln;27314
BTW, welcome to GeekHack! :)

Thank you itlnstln, nice to meet you folks. :)
Please excuse my poor English.

Offline huha

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« Reply #17 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 15:21:11 »
Quote from: ssb;27312
Except Das III from getdigital.de


It may be a nice keyboard, but it still has Cherry MX switches, so apart from unprinted keycaps (which I certainly don't mind, but also wouldn't pay such a large premium for), there's not much to be gained over a G80-3000, especially since the G80-3000 is really cheap (about half the price of the Das Keyboard III). Blue Cherry MX are clicky, but not as clicky as I'd appreciate and they certainly do not resemble buckling springs in any way, form or fashion. Their feel is not similar to buckling springs (as getdigital write), but entirely different. Not bad, but entirely different nonetheless.

I'd love to try the new clicky Alps switches; I wouldn't mind a Filco Zero Tenkeyless, but apart from the high base price, the shipping costs are just killing me.

-huha
Unicomp Endurapro 105 (blank keycaps, BS) // Cherry G80-3000LSCDE-2 (blues, modded to green MX) // Cherry G80-3000LAMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Cherry G80-11900LTMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Compaq G80-11801 (browns) // Epson Q203A (Fujitsu Peerless) // IBM Model M2 (BS) // Boscom AS400 Terminal Emulator (OEM\'d Unicomp, BS, 2x) // Dell AT102DW (black Alps) // Mechanical Touch (chinese BS) Acer 6312-KW (Acer mechanics on membrane) // Cherry G84-4100 (ML) // Cherry G80-1000HAD (NKRO, blacks)

Offline itlnstln

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #18 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 15:29:09 »
Quote from: huha;27317
It may be a nice keyboard, but it still has Cherry MX switches, so apart from unprinted keycaps (which I certainly don't mind, but also wouldn't pay such a large premium for), there's not much to be gained over a G80-3000, especially since the G80-3000 is really cheap (about half the price of the Das Keyboard III). Blue Cherry MX are clicky, but not as clicky as I'd appreciate and they certainly do not resemble buckling springs in any way, form or fashion. Their feel is not similar to buckling springs (as getdigital write), but entirely different. Not bad, but entirely different nonetheless.

I'd love to try the new clicky Alps switches; I wouldn't mind a Filco Zero Tenkeyless, but apart from the high base price, the shipping costs are just killing me.

-huha


Very good point.  There are plenty of good, cheaper sources for Cherry switches than the Das.  While I think the overall build quality of the Filco is better, I am finding that the Cherry G80-3000 gives me a better key feel (both have browns).  Since my Cherry was a custom 'board, I paid about the same for it as my Filco, but I think I like it a little better.  I just got the Filco, though, so i still need to give it a solid chance before I declare one the definitive winner.


Offline ssb

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« Reply #19 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 19:02:14 »
Quote from: huha;27317
It may be a nice keyboard, but it still has Cherry MX switches, so apart from unprinted keycaps (which I certainly don't mind, but also wouldn't pay such a large premium for), there's not much to be gained over a G80-3000, especially since the G80-3000 is really cheap (about half the price of the Das Keyboard III). Blue Cherry MX are clicky, but not as clicky as I'd appreciate and they certainly do not resemble buckling springs in any way, form or fashion. Their feel is not similar to buckling springs (as getdigital write), but entirely different. Not bad, but entirely different nonetheless.

Unprinted keycaps? No thanks! I am an experienced touch typist, though not very fast, but never liked the idea of blank keys. I'm probably too old to play the geek game. :)

About the Das and Cherries, back in the early nineties I used to be big fan of Cherry keyboards, but I've lost my interest after they sacrificed build quality. I do love MX blues though. Certainly they do not resemble buckling springs but I've yet to find anything better (for my taste). Also as much as I love noisy clicky keyboards, my wife hates them; you know my home office is next to the bedroom. :(
Please excuse my poor English.

Offline huha

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« Reply #20 on: Mon, 06 April 2009, 19:15:29 »
Quote from: ssb;27359
Unprinted keycaps? No thanks! I am an experienced touch typist, though not very fast, but never liked the idea of blank keys. I'm probably too old to play the geek game. :)


I like the idea of unprinted keycaps, but wouldn't pay a large premium for it. EUR 10--20 would be okay, but it's not worth more to me. Blank keycaps just look so much nicer; the font selection of keyboard manufacturers is a bit underwhelming; most are set in Helvetica or Helvetica clones, making them look somewhat dull and boring (readability, however, is excellent).

Quote
I do love MX blues though. Certainly they do not resemble buckling springs but I've yet to find anything better (for my taste). Also as much I love noisy clicky keyboards, my wife hates them; you know my home office is next to the bedroom. :(


Luckily, I don't have to cope with other people interfering with my keyboard taste, so it's buckling springs for me. Blue MXs are fairly light to press (remember, I'm used to a Model M--to be precise, a Unicomp Endurapro), so I reckon they're quite suitable for anything requiring a click without being too loud. I'd appreciate if they were a bit harder to press, though. The spacebar on my G80-3000 feels just right, the other keys are too light to press; if they used a bit harder springs in the switches, I think I might like them a bit more.

-huha
Unicomp Endurapro 105 (blank keycaps, BS) // Cherry G80-3000LSCDE-2 (blues, modded to green MX) // Cherry G80-3000LAMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Cherry G80-11900LTMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Compaq G80-11801 (browns) // Epson Q203A (Fujitsu Peerless) // IBM Model M2 (BS) // Boscom AS400 Terminal Emulator (OEM\'d Unicomp, BS, 2x) // Dell AT102DW (black Alps) // Mechanical Touch (chinese BS) Acer 6312-KW (Acer mechanics on membrane) // Cherry G84-4100 (ML) // Cherry G80-1000HAD (NKRO, blacks)

Offline itlnstln

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« Reply #21 on: Tue, 07 April 2009, 06:49:50 »
I would like unprinted key caps just for the letters.  I would still need the legends from time-to-time on some of the other keys.


Offline huha

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« Reply #22 on: Tue, 07 April 2009, 08:34:02 »
Quote from: itlnstln;27438
I would like unprinted key caps just for the letters.  I would still need the legends from time-to-time on some of the other keys.


I think Unicomop will happily make your wish come true. Before I ordered my Endurapro, I asked whether it was possible to have unprinted keycaps (or partially unprinted keycaps), which they affirmed.

-huha
Unicomp Endurapro 105 (blank keycaps, BS) // Cherry G80-3000LSCDE-2 (blues, modded to green MX) // Cherry G80-3000LAMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Cherry G80-11900LTMDE-0 (blacks, 2x) // Compaq G80-11801 (browns) // Epson Q203A (Fujitsu Peerless) // IBM Model M2 (BS) // Boscom AS400 Terminal Emulator (OEM\'d Unicomp, BS, 2x) // Dell AT102DW (black Alps) // Mechanical Touch (chinese BS) Acer 6312-KW (Acer mechanics on membrane) // Cherry G84-4100 (ML) // Cherry G80-1000HAD (NKRO, blacks)

Offline itlnstln

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Good keyboard shop in Europe?
« Reply #23 on: Tue, 07 April 2009, 08:36:10 »
Quote from: huha;27445
I think Unicomop will happily make your wish come true. Before I ordered my Endurapro, I asked whether it was possible to have unprinted keycaps (or partially unprinted keycaps), which they affirmed.

-huha


They might for my Ms, but I want them for my two Cherry-based 'boards.  Maybe (member) majestouch can get them hooked up for us.


Offline fuzzybyte

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« Reply #24 on: Tue, 07 April 2009, 23:42:27 »
what's the best keyboard with brown cherry switches?

FILCO Majestouch FKBN104M/EB ?

Offline itlnstln

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« Reply #25 on: Wed, 08 April 2009, 07:19:43 »
Either that, or the Chery G80-3000.  You can get one with browns at DataCal.com.  They only had a few left when I bought mine, so I don't know if they have any left.  They are a custom keyboard for them, so if they are out, it be awhile before they come back in.  Either 'board is fantastic, and you will be happy with either.  I wrote up a comparison in the keyboard reviews forum.


Offline keyb_gr

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« Reply #26 on: Sat, 11 April 2009, 18:45:05 »
A little threadvival since I just had my G80 apart:
Quote from: huha;27215
I also thought that might be the case, but why not make it a bit more expensive and add a nice steel backplate and screws? In comparison, the sub-EUR 20 Cherry evolution stream I keep as an emergency keyboard is built really well; it features lots of screws and even a large steel backplate.

The problem probably was that they just couldn't make it more expensive, or it would have sold even less (sadly), already being rather costly for a "standard keyboard". Cost-cutting already was an issue in the olden days, when the G80-1000, originally full N-key rollover, was step-by-step cheapened (diodes/soldering saved) and finally ended up as 2-key rollover (read more in KBDINFO.DOC, German only).

In my G80-3000LFADE (around 1997 vintage, it seems), I didn't find a single screw. The PCB is somehow clamped between the case halves when these snap together. Kinda Sennheiser-ish. Oh, and lots of flux residue on the back of the board.
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It's just a speculation, but maybe the G81 has to have a steel backplate to provide stability to the membrane sheet, whereas the G80's MX modules can just be soldered on a PCB and stuck into the case without further support.

That would make sense. I looked up the nominal weight, and it's 1200 g for the G80 vs. 1400 g for the G81, which I guess includes the cable. (My, the Cherry website really is not too user-friendly.)
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[Alps boards]
I recently rediscovered one which was sitting around here and collecting dust (I actually learned to type on the keyboard and didn't know what gem it was, so I bought crappy keyboards for years when I just could have used this and be happy :rolleyes:). Clicky Alps, double injection molded keycaps, solidly built but somewhat dirty and the plastic is quite yellow. I'll have to clean it and treat the plastic before it will be usable again.

Nice find there. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any decently widespread classic 'board model with Alps switches around here in Germany, or at least I'm not aware of any. Which is a pity, I certainly wouldn't mind having one. (Then again, even classic Cherry G80s don't appear on the 'bay very often, even though one should assume that they were popular in their day. Maybe their owners either cling to them, or put them in some closet or (unwisely) discarded them years ago.)
Hardware in signatures clutters Google search results. There should be a field in the profile for that (again).

This message was probably typed on a vintage G80-3000 with blues. Double-shots, baby. :D