Advice on what would be fair with an amazon bad seller

[Kliee]

I've purchased a DELL AT101w board 1 month ago from an Amazon.com seller.
The keyboard was listed as new in box.

Total (keyboard + shipping = 90€ (~$120)).

I received it only today (in France), but it seems that most of the delay is actually USPS fault.

Anyway, the keyboard is far from new, dirty and have some malfunctions (keys not working properly if at all).

I imediatly sent a mail to the vendor and asked him what would be a good solution to deal with this problem. I was thinking of a full refund, including shipping costs, and him paying the return fees (as it's not the item I wanted, and his fault I got this).

He replied quickly but don't seems ready to pay the return fees. Here's our exchange :

Hello,


I received today the keyboard I ordered from you 1 month ago. When I placed my order, the item was listed as new in box. The keyboard I received is far from being new in box, is dirty and have some malfunctions.
Is that an error ? Can I expect you to fully pay for the return fees ? Because I clearly have no need for a damaged item.

Please find attached the picture of the keyboard I received.


I wish you a good day !

Kindest regards

I can either take it back for a full refund or give you a partial credit.

Hello,


Thank you for your quick reply!

In that case, I'd like to go with you taking it back for a full refund. I'd like to be sure though that the shipping cost is included in the refund and that I'll not have to pay for shipping it back, as the item clearly isn't the one I purchased.
I'll send it back to you as soon as you give me the procedure you want me to use.

Thank you again for your response.

Kindest regards

I will give you a full refund of what you paid us.

Seems like he is not willing to pay for the return fees. Is that normal ? Last time something like that happend to me, the vendor paid the return fees.

I know that by filling an A-Z claim I can have my money back easily, but I don't want to be unfair because in that case he won't be getting his item back (even though, for me, it's not worth a cent).

What would you do in that situation ?

Attached is a pic of the supposedly "New in box" keyboard. It's even dirtier IRL than on the pic.

[riotonthebay]

The seller should pay for your return shipping as well as the full refund. You should incur no loss due to his failure to adequately describe the keyboard.

[Lanx]

go bully this amazon seller
1. say you'll talk to amazon directly and file a complaint
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=541260

also you have credit card protection, unless you used debit.

remind him/her that this is fraud, and as such you are protected and it is up to YOU to escalate this issue however far you go.

amazon will not tolerate fraud from 3rd party sellers so they usually give them a warning or just cancel their seller account which really hurts them since they can't sell.

remember to put this scumbag through his/her paces, scumbag sellers do not deserve any sympathy.

[Kliee]

Thank you both for your responses !

It was what I was thinking of doing, but as I've had only a few problems with online orders I was wondering what was considered a good way to act.

Here's the message I just sent the seller :

Hello again,


As I understand it, you're saying that you'll refund the cost I paid through Amazon.com. That's to say $119.98 (item+shippment). To beneficiate of this refund, I must return the item to you.
As I wasn't the one making the mistake (sending a used and defective item instead of a new one) I also expect you to take care of the return process, sending me a prepaid return shipping label via mail.

The few times I had to deal with a seller who made a mistake it was the solution they offered.


Kindest regards

If that doesn't work I'm gonna fill an A-Z

[hoggy]

Don't wait too long to file a complaint, he's not going to play ball.

[fohat.digs]

Don't wait too long to file a complaint, he's not going to play ball.

I must agree.

"Grading" is a huge issue in some collectible markets, a "Near Mint" coin may well be worth twice what a "Fine" is, which is itself worth twice what a "Good" is.

For many buyers, there is a wide gulf between "New" and "Like New" but that can vary widely. I would be a lot happier with a "Like New" shovel than I would with a "Like New" pair of shoes.

But selling an item that is clearly used (and dirty! - at least you would think he would clean it up well!) is outright fraud.

This is not a seller that will be receptive to honor and logic.

[tricheboars]

that is super whack. i hope he pays for shipping back.

btw in my opinion a at101w isnt even worth 60$ let alone 120$.  to each their own though.

[Zeal]

I find it funny that the keyboard has "morte" written on the face, signifying that it's dead..  )

[Kliee]

Thank you all for those advices.

For now he hasn't reply to the last message, but it's too soon to draw conclusions. Even though I really think he did that on purpose, he's a new seller with not even a rating yet and he's not starting good .

that is super whack. i hope he pays for shipping back.

btw in my opinion a at101w isnt even worth 60$ let alone 120$.  to each their own though.

Yeah, I know. It was the only NIB on Amazon and until now I really prefered to buy there rather than on ebay, even at double price. But that's gonna change I guess... $120 is with shipping.

Don't wait too long to file a complaint, he's not going to play ball.

I must agree.

"Grading" is a huge issue in some collectible markets, a "Near Mint" coin may well be worth twice what a "Fine" is, which is itself worth twice what a "Good" is.

For many buyers, there is a wide gulf between "New" and "Like New" but that can vary widely. I would be a lot happier with a "Like New" shovel than I would with a "Like New" pair of shoes.

But selling an item that is clearly used (and dirty! - at least you would think he would clean it up well!) is outright fraud.

This is not a seller that will be receptive to honor and logic.

If by sunday he hasn't replied nor accepted to pay for return fees, I fill an A-Z.

I find it funny that the keyboard has "morte" written on the face, signifying that it's dead..  )

Actually, first I saw the dirty cable hanging out of the plastic envelope he put the keyboard in (inside the original box, at least this fit the description ) then I took a quick glance inside the envelope and hmmm, it's dirty : dust, hair and bug molt (not that much, but still, new in box  ) and then I extracted it from the envelopes and "MORTE". Awesome grunge custom KB!

Other defects includes led cover degraded as if a kid had pushed on the plastic with a pen on top of each led, a lot of erased/almost erased writing which makes me think this keyboard was serving in a middle/high school computer room, dirty bottom, aso...

The practical defects are some keys not registering at all (left ctrl for instance) other registering 1 time out of 3 or 4 pushs (']' key for instance), no scroll lock led (even if not useful, it's still a feature I'm expecting form a NIB KB  ) and so on.

I don't even know what I'll/can do with it if I ever have to fill an A-Z and/or the seller doesn't want it back anyway.

[hoggy]

I'd recommend that you just put in the complaint now.  Ask for all of your money back and that you get to dump the keyboard, or return it to him at his cost.  He's stolen from you, don't be nice back.

[paicrai]

I'd recommend that you just put in the complaint now.  Ask for all of your money back and that you get to dump the keyboard, or return it to him at his cost.  He's stolen from you, don't be nice back.

+1

[Kliee]

Seller didn't answer my last message.

You're gonna say I'm overly nice, but I chosed to try the standard return procedure. If the seller provides me with a prepaid return shipping label, I'll just put a bad customer comment on him, if he is not paying for the return, A-Z.

I hope this is gonna settle with this.

Thanks for all your advices and if you wanna know the seller's id on Amazon.com, to avoid ordering from him, just PM me . Might be useful as he have a lot of vintage geeky stuff to sell that might interest geekhackers.

Edit :

He sent me a label with postage required -_-

[Zeal]

Seller didn't answer my last message.

You're gonna say I'm overly nice, but I chosed to try the standard return procedure. If the seller provides me with a prepaid return shipping label, I'll just put a bad customer comment on him, if he is not paying for the return, A-Z.

I hope this is gonna settle with this.

Thanks for all your advices and if you wanna know the seller's id on Amazon.com, to avoid ordering from him, just PM me . Might be useful as he have a lot of vintage geeky stuff to sell that might interest geekhackers.

Edit :

He sent me a label with postage required -_-

A-Z time!

[Kliee]

A-Z time!

Indeed, done!

[fohat.digs]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "A-Z time"?

[Novus]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "A-Z time"?

It's the amazon dispute/arbitration thing.

[uzoc]

go bully this amazon seller
1. say you'll talk to amazon directly and file a complaint
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=541260

also you have credit card protection, unless you used debit.

remind him/her that this is fraud, and as such you are protected and it is up to YOU to escalate this issue however far you go.

amazon will not tolerate fraud from 3rd party sellers so they usually give them a warning or just cancel their seller account which really hurts them since they can't sell.

remember to put this scumbag through his/her paces, scumbag sellers do not deserve any sympathy.

I second this,
He took advantage of you, since your're out of the country,
he taught that he could get away with it...
Get in contact with Amazon & your credit card company.

[Kliee]

I second this,
He took advantage of you, since your're out of the country,
he taught that he could get away with it...
Get in contact with Amazon & your credit card company.

For Amazon, that's done. I've filled an A-Z claim and it's gonna be investigated by the 16th of this month. As it's Amazon, I wouldn't be surprised if they were to give me the result of their "investigation" by tomorrow .

For now I'm in "wait and see" mode.

[Hak Foo]

If you're not averse to eBay, I recently bought one from this listing - http://www.ebay.com/itm/380809516010?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

and it was much closer to "new"... honestly, I'd have said it was new if the seller hadn't explicily said otherwise.  The plate and insides were basically dust-free.

[Kliee]

Little update.

At the same time I filled the A-Z I contacted the seller about the return shipping label, still hoping that somehow he would come to reason.

Here's the exchange :

Hello,


I received your return shipping label which indicates that I have to pay for return. As the item you sent clearly doesn't match the description, is defective and not near worth the price I paid for it, I expect you to also pay for the return fees.

Otherwise I'll fill an Amazon claim, as this clearly is fraud.

I hope you can address this problem ASAP.


Kindest regards

Item was new and you said used so I said I will give you a full refund including shipping.

Hello,


I understood that, the only point for which I don't agree is that I have to pay for the return of the item, as the label you provided me with requires postage.
If you provide me with a prepaid return shipping label, meaning I don't have to pay for the return fees, we're good.


Kindest regards

Funny he insists on the "The keyboard I sent was new, you picky nerd, I'm doing you a favor indeed!" attitude, especially when Amazon have copies of the mail with the pics of the keyboard he really sent me attached -_-.

[berserkfan]

Don't wait too long to file a complaint, he's not going to play ball.

I must agree.

"Grading" is a huge issue in some collectible markets, a "Near Mint" coin may well be worth twice what a "Fine" is, which is itself worth twice what a "Good" is.

For many buyers, there is a wide gulf between "New" and "Like New" but that can vary widely. I would be a lot happier with a "Like New" shovel than I would with a "Like New" pair of shoes.

But selling an item that is clearly used (and dirty! - at least you would think he would clean it up well!) is outright fraud.

This is not a seller that will be receptive to honor and logic.

second fohat here.

I am thoroughly sick of sellers who sell crap as new or like new. I don't care if it is a vintage keyboard; like new means minimal rust, minimal dust, minimal scratches. If it looks like it came from the trash pile, call it used and I won't complain.

[tricheboars]

i am interested in how this turns out and hope everything ends groovy. 

[Kliee]

second fohat here.

I am thoroughly sick of sellers who sell crap as new or like new. I don't care if it is a vintage keyboard; like new means minimal rust, minimal dust, minimal scratches. If it looks like it came from the trash pile, call it used and I won't complain.

The seller's listing clearly stated "new" and was in the "new" section of the amazon seller's page, not "used" with a "like new" status.

Here's the invoice :



Here are pics of the global state of the keyboard and it's shipping package (once again, the photos tend to lighten the dirty look) :



Here's a close up on the led cover :



And here's the inside of one of the envelopes. The yellow thing at the bottom is a bug molt :

[SpAmRaY]

Wow, that is so awful. I think Amazon should clearly see the seller did you wrong.

You  might try this seller next time http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dell-Keyboard-English-US-M-C-AT101W-vintage-mechanical-keyboard-new-in-box-/131169454097

[Computer-Lab in Basement]

It's an open and shut case. If there is any justice left in this world they will find in your favor.

[Folio]

Yea, that case looks all jacked up. And pencil & pen marks? Jesus.

[Kliee]

Here's the response from Amazon.com :

Hello from Amazon.

We are writing to follow-up with your Amazon.com A-to-z Guarantee claim on order 104-1444643-9557801.

The seller has agreed to reimburse you upon return of the item to this address:

[...]

You will need to ship via USPS if the seller's return address is a P.O. Box.

We recommend that you insure the item and request signature confirmation delivery service.  If you do not use a trackable method to return your item and the seller does not provide a refund to you, we may not be able to cover you under the A-to-z Guarantee.

Within three business days, please reply to this email with tracking information. If we do not receive a reply within this time, we will close your claim until we hear from you.

We appreciate your cooperation in resolving this claim.

What does they mean exactly with them beeing able to cover me under the A-Z guarantee? What I understand is that I have to pay anyway for the return of the keyboard.
Gonna ask them a few question and send more pics of the keyboard (they only have the first one I put in this thread).

Maybe what they mean is that he'll refund me, including return fees, but when I had to do something like this the seller always sent a prepaid return label...

In the end, if I have to do that, I'll do it. Better cut a hand than an arm.

[Kliee]

In the end, I paid for the return of this piece of junk. Amazon didn't reply to my mail and the deadline is really soon. Better to loose a "little" than a lot. A little meaning here $44.3.

The seller's gonna be able to happily put this keyboard back in his item list )

This exept if I get lucky. The french postage service offer an insurance for packages. For 1€ I can insure it for a 150€ compensation in case of loss or damage. I kinda hope they loose it ...

Last time I buy from a third part seller who's not a known company.

Does a list of known bad amazon/ebay sellers exists here on GH?
It could be a good tool to avoid, or at least reduce, those kind of bad experiences.

Edit :

Actually I just checked my bank account and I received a $46 income from Amazon.com 1 day ago (just after I sent my mail to them). This matches the return price. In the end, it seems like it turned ok...
I wonder if it's a commercial gesture or if the seller finaly agreed to pay for return.
Now waiting for the complete refund

[dorkvader]

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

[Folio]

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

But wouldn't shipping someone a completely faulty item that they know is not NIB cause for paying for shipping back?

[nubbinator]

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

Generally I agree with that, but if they lie about the condition of what you're buying, it's my opinion that they should pay for return shipping.  I'm still pissed with an eBay seller who sold me glow in the dark powder that did not glow, then made me pay return shipping.  As a seller, it is your responsibility to be honest about the product.  If you lie about it, you should pay for the return shipping.

[Pacifist]

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

Generally I agree with that, but if they lie about the condition of what you're buying, it's my opinion that they should pay for return shipping.  I'm still pissed with an eBay seller who sold me glow in the dark powder that did not glow, then made me pay return shipping.  As a seller, it is your responsibility to be honest about the product.  If you lie about it, you should pay for the return shipping.

what the hell how does that work?

[nubbinator]

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

Generally I agree with that, but if they lie about the condition of what you're buying, it's my opinion that they should pay for return shipping.  I'm still pissed with an eBay seller who sold me glow in the dark powder that did not glow, then made me pay return shipping.  As a seller, it is your responsibility to be honest about the product.  If you lie about it, you should pay for the return shipping.

what the hell how does that work?

Open case with eBay, buyer says to return it, eBay says they made good and I still have to pay return shipping.  It was really UV reactive powder, not GITD powder.  I was pissed since it wasn't cheap and I had to pay a couple of bucks and go out of my way to return it.

IME, eBay almost always sides with the seller, especially if they're a power seller, and Amazon is usually on the side of the buyer.  That's why I'm a little surprised at this outcome.

[dorkvader]

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

But wouldn't shipping someone a completely faulty item that they know is not NIB cause for paying for shipping back?

Sure for the item, but the shipping worked perfectly fine... unless it was damaged in transit. unless there was a problem with the shipping, it makes sense in a lot of cases to not cover it.

I'm not trying to make a claim here either way, just thinking about what would be fair to everyone in a normative argument, etc.

[nubbinator]

Sure for the item, but the shipping worked perfectly fine... unless it was damaged in transit. unless there was a problem with the shipping, it makes sense in a lot of cases to not cover it.

I'm not trying to make a claim here either way, just thinking about what would be fair to everyone in a normative argument, etc.

As far as I'm concerned, the buyer should only pay for return shipping if the product is not in the condition advertised.  If it's advertised as new and a used product is sold, the seller is responsible for return shipping.  If the product is sold in the condition and workingto the best of the seller's knowledge (meaning they are not lying or misrepresenting the product, but the occassional faulty product slips through), the seller should not be responsible since they made a good faith effort to sell exactly what they advertised.  They should not be held accountable for products faulty from the manufacturer if the manufacturer sold it to them as functional and new.

[Kliee]

As far as I'm concerned, the buyer should only pay for return shipping if the product is not in the condition advertised.  If it's advertised as new and a used product is sold, the seller is responsible for return shipping.  If the product is sold in the condition and workingto the best of the seller's knowledge (meaning they are not lying or misrepresenting the product, but the occassional faulty product slips through), the seller should not be responsible since they made a good faith effort to sell exactly what they advertised.  They should not be held accountable for products faulty from the manufacturer if the manufacturer sold it to them as functional and new.

This.


I'm not usually the kind to make seller's life complicated. If there are some flaws in the service/item, but not a deal breaker, I wont ask for anything. For instance, If this keyboard was clearly new but not working (not well tested at the factory or damaged during shippment), I would have been pissed, but I would have paid for it's return or keeped it. It would not have been the seller's fault.
Here the seller sent me a dirty overly used keyboard with DEAD written on it when it should have been a new in box. I don't know how he could not see that what he was selling to me didn't fit the "new in box" listing.

To make it a general scheme, I consider that I'm paying the seller for both the item and him shipping it to me (I'm not talking about what can happen during shippment). If it was not the case, I'd have to go to his house to take it. Buying online is a whole service. Of course, if I'm not satisfied with an item that fits the description of the seller, it's my responsability and I have to pay for it's return. But here it's the seller's "mistake" so I paid for something that was not delivered. The one to be penalized is not me, but the seller. Especially here, since I believe he did it on purpose.

It already happened to me, but in this case the seller had no bad intent. I ordered headphones to a music related stuff seller. This particular model of headphones have 2 distinct cable possibility, coiled or straight. I explicitly ordered the coiled one and got the straight. After the seller verified that I indeed asked for the coiled one, he sent me a prepaid return label and did the swap at his expense.


That said it's my opinion and I understand it's an open debate 

[berserkfan]

Nubby

For you, return shipping is a few bucks.

For me, return shipping is a few score bucks.

I have HAD IT with US sellers. The big problem now is not like the 1990s when scammers were everywhere. Now we have 'non-scammers'. I deliberately call them 'non-scammers' so that I can still get this nasty keyword 'scam' inside.

A 'non-scammer' plays very fast and loose with his description. He likes to use 200x300pixel 1990s digital cameras to take photos. He often conveniently drops one or two letters on a model number description. For him, everything is 'working great' regards of whether it's tested or not. Oh, not working great? Return it then. Kindly pay return shipping.

'Non-scammers' can get away with stuff because all disputes are now resolved by return shipment, so garbage that was not worth return shipping still has to be returned for the money. Additionally, nowadays paypal/ebay will penalize you if you file too many complaints. So people who want to complain must think twice.

Having bumped into some non-scammers recently I am really fed up the wazoo. I actually find Taobao sellers more honest, mainly because Taobao is pretty strict with them. Everything in China requires a real bank account linked to your unique national identity card number, so it's a disincentive to scam or 'non-scam'. Their system doesn't work well for buyers, but it's also good because buyers have little incentive to make false claims.

It's common for sellers to not offer to refund shipping. You see the wrong item is heir fault, but shipping isn't.

I think that any seller that does refund shipping is going above and beyond what is necessary, and I make my thanks known.

I'm glad that everything worked out for you though.

Generally I agree with that, but if they lie about the condition of what you're buying, it's my opinion that they should pay for return shipping.  I'm still pissed with an eBay seller who sold me glow in the dark powder that did not glow, then made me pay return shipping.  As a seller, it is your responsibility to be honest about the product.  If you lie about it, you should pay for the return shipping.

[berserkfan]

Kliee,

regrettably, you will only know how good a seller is if you have done business with him before.

I remember greencitizenrecycle (I think that was his nick) on ebay. He sold me something that he rated B (I would have rated it A-).

Item came to me A- as I said, except it was wrapped in a ridiculous sticky tape. It was the stickiest I have ever come across, and it left an incredible amount of residue that took nearly an hour to clean. The item would have been almost unusable, practically C, if you left the residue there.

I normally consider stuff like this 'superficial' and will not file complaint, although it is annoying. So I wrote in to them just to warn them about that tape. I told them I'd be happy to buy from them again, as long as they quit using that tape.

They actually offered me a refund! I declined the refund - because, as I've said, I regard this a superficial issue not related to the actual working of the item. A subsequent exchange of emails had them writing back to say they'd identified the maker and batch of the tape, and it was indeed a flawed batch that they will stop using in future.

As you have seen from the above anecdote, it's clear that greencitizenrecycle is responsible, responsive, friendly and professional.

I have also met scumbag sellers on ebay. One really hostile guy (US military veteran) actually filed complaint against me!
Stay away from ewastesolutionsnow on ebay unless you really want to buy ewaste.

This.


I'm not usually the kind to make seller's life complicated. If there are some flaws in the service/item, but not a deal breaker, I wont ask for anything. For instance, If this keyboard was clearly new but not working (not well tested at the factory or damaged during shippment), I would have been pissed, but I would have paid for it's return or keeped it. It would not have been the seller's fault.
Here the seller sent me a dirty overly used keyboard with DEAD written on it when it should have been a new in box. I don't know how he could not see that what he was selling to me didn't fit the "new in box" listing.

To make it a general scheme, I consider that I'm paying the seller for both the item and him shipping it to me (I'm not talking about what can happen during shippment). If it was not the case, I'd have to go to his house to take it. Buying online is a whole service. Of course, if I'm not satisfied with an item that fits the description of the seller, it's my responsability and I have to pay for it's return. But here it's the seller's "mistake" so I paid for something that was not delivered. The one to be penalized is not me, but the seller. Especially here, since I believe he did it on purpose.

It already happened to me, but in this case the seller had no bad intent. I ordered headphones to a music related stuff seller. This particular model of headphones have 2 distinct cable possibility, coiled or straight. I explicitly ordered the coiled one and got the straight. After the seller verified that I indeed asked for the coiled one, he sent me a prepaid return label and did the swap at his expense.


That said it's my opinion and I understand it's an open debate 

[Kliee]

Once again, thank you all for your replies and comment! They did help me to get a better understanding of "best practices" to deal with bad sellers.

Here's a little update on my case :

I sent the package back after amazon.com actually credited my bank account of the amount of the return fees, but now it seems the seller gave me a wrong address. And, once again, I can't help but think he did it on purpose -_-.

On the original package (the one he sent me), his return address in case of non-delivery is (names and numbers changed) :

John Doe
1234 Treeroof #303
Big City CA 900XX
US

On the return label he gave me (names and numbers changed, but match the "differences pattern") :

John Doe inc.
1234 Treeroof #20002
Little district CA 900XX
US

The tracking service said they were unable to deliver the package due to a bad addresse. And actually, because of the French online postal service, I had to enter the address like this :

John Doe inc.
1234 Treeroof
20002
900XX Little district CA
États-Unis US

I don't think this alteration would have been a problem with the local US post office, but I think that actually the number after the '#' is the problem.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I guess this number is for the appartment/room, and that the standard in the US is 1st digit = floor, 2nd and 3rd digit = room number.
a #20002 would mean a 200 story high building, which clearly is not the case when I google map his address.

Maybe I'm getting a little paranoid, but I'm starting to think he only approved return just so the item could be lost in the mail and provides him with a reason not to refund.
I didn't ask for return in case of non-delivery, but they have my address and the status on the tacking service is that they're sending it back to me.
Will contact the seller about this issue but I'm prepared for the "Duh, I gave you my address" kind of reply...

[Novus]

Once again, thank you all for your replies and comment! They did help me to get a better understanding of "best practices" to deal with bad sellers.

Here's a little update on my case :

I sent the package back after amazon.com actually credited my bank account of the amount of the return fees, but now it seems the seller gave me a wrong address. And, once again, I can't help but think he did it on purpose -_-.

On the original package (the one he sent me), his return address in case of non-delivery is (names and numbers changed) :

John Doe
1234 Treeroof #303
Big City CA 900XX
US

On the return label he gave me (names and numbers changed, but match the "differences pattern") :

John Doe inc.
1234 Treeroof #20002
Little district CA 900XX
US

The tracking service said they were unable to deliver the package due to a bad addresse. And actually, because of the French online postal service, I had to enter the address like this :

John Doe inc.
1234 Treeroof
20002
900XX Little district CA
États-Unis US

I don't think this alteration would have been a problem with the local US post office, but I think that actually the number after the '#' is the problem.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I guess this number is for the appartment/room, and that the standard in the US is 1st digit = floor, 2nd and 3rd digit = room number.
a #20002 would mean a 200 story high building, which clearly is not the case when I google map his address.

Maybe I'm getting a little paranoid, but I'm starting to think he only approved return just so the item could be lost in the mail and provides him with a reason not to refund.
I didn't ask for return in case of non-delivery, but they have my address and the status on the tacking service is that they're sending it back to me.
Will contact the seller about this issue but I'm prepared for the "Duh, I gave you my address" kind of reply...

There's no set standard in the US.
It could just be an arbitrary suite number.

[Hak Foo]

You'd probably have the easiest time with "1234 Treeroof, Unit 20002" if possible.

Over the years, the US post office has suggested the address here be written as

1234 Fake St. Unit 56
1234/56 Fake St.
1234-56 Fake St.
and then finally back to the first one.  Some people use various "auto-fix" databases which will add exciting ones to the mix like
56 Fake St (15km from here, may not even be a house, doesn't actually get delivered, annoying as hell)
123456 Fake St (The street ends in the 1300s, typically gets delivered)
1234 Fake St (with no specificartion of which of the 72 houses it goes to)

It's a mess.

[berserkfan]

One of the best tricks that a sleazy seller uses, is to give a fake address/ wrong address.

That way things get returned to the wrong place and they can claim non-delivery.

I'm afraid you are probably screwed here, unless Amazon has additional protections for you. Normally a credit card company or paypal will not side with you, even if you can show them that the seller emailed you explicitly telling you to return to that fake address.

Once again, thank you all for your replies and comment! They did help me to get a better understanding of "best practices" to deal with bad sellers.

Here's a little update on my case :

I sent the package back after amazon.com actually credited my bank account of the amount of the return fees, but now it seems the seller gave me a wrong address. And, once again, I can't help but think he did it on purpose -_-.

On the original package (the one he sent me), his return address in case of non-delivery is (names and numbers changed) :

John Doe
1234 Treeroof #303
Big City CA 900XX
US

On the return label he gave me (names and numbers changed, but match the "differences pattern") :

John Doe inc.
1234 Treeroof #20002
Little district CA 900XX
US

The tracking service said they were unable to deliver the package due to a bad addresse. And actually, because of the French online postal service, I had to enter the address like this :

John Doe inc.
1234 Treeroof
20002
900XX Little district CA
États-Unis US

I don't think this alteration would have been a problem with the local US post office, but I think that actually the number after the '#' is the problem.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I guess this number is for the appartment/room, and that the standard in the US is 1st digit = floor, 2nd and 3rd digit = room number.
a #20002 would mean a 200 story high building, which clearly is not the case when I google map his address.

Maybe I'm getting a little paranoid, but I'm starting to think he only approved return just so the item could be lost in the mail and provides him with a reason not to refund.
I didn't ask for return in case of non-delivery, but they have my address and the status on the tacking service is that they're sending it back to me.
Will contact the seller about this issue but I'm prepared for the "Duh, I gave you my address" kind of reply...

[paicrai]

kick him in the shins

[Kliee]

There's no set standard in the US.
It could just be an arbitrary suite number.

You'd probably have the easiest time with "1234 Treeroof, Unit 20002" if possible.

Over the years, the US post office has suggested the address here be written as

1234 Fake St. Unit 56
1234/56 Fake St.
1234-56 Fake St.
and then finally back to the first one.  Some people use various "auto-fix" databases which will add exciting ones to the mix like
56 Fake St (15km from here, may not even be a house, doesn't actually get delivered, annoying as hell)
123456 Fake St (The street ends in the 1300s, typically gets delivered)
1234 Fake St (with no specificartion of which of the 72 houses it goes to)

It's a mess.

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind for future sendings . As in some countries it's really important to fit in a given standard, I was affraid it couldn't be delivered because of that.

One of the best tricks that a sleazy seller uses, is to give a fake address/ wrong address.

That way things get returned to the wrong place and they can claim non-delivery.

I'm afraid you are probably screwed here, unless Amazon has additional protections for you. Normally a credit card company or paypal will not side with you, even if you can show them that the seller emailed you explicitly telling you to return to that fake address.

kick him in the shins

Well actually the item is now labeled as "available for pickup" at his local post office. So I sent him a mail saying that I was sorry for the inconvenience but the address he gaves me did not work and that he would have to pick it up himself at the post office.
So, I hope he'll go before it's too late. I don't know for the US but in France you have a limited time to come pick your item at the post office. Usualy around 2 weeks.

I don't know if he did it on purpose. I really don't like putting accusations like this on people, but this buying as been nothing but bad surprises so far, so I became a little paranoid I suppose...

[berserkfan]

Of course he did it on purpose. Everything he has been doing has come across as dishonest so far. He knows he's in good hands if he can trick you into returning to the wrong address.

I'm really fed up with buying things online.

[Kliee]

Of course he did it on purpose. Everything he has been doing has come across as dishonest so far. He knows he's in good hands if he can trick you into returning to the wrong address.

I'm really fed up with buying things online.

All indicate that he did it on purpose, yes. But as it's available for pickup, I think it's a proof that the item can be delivered to him. So maybe amazon.com will be on my side if he choose not to go to pick it up.

Did you got trouble yourself with online orders recently? I mean other than with ewastesolutionsnow.
For me, even if I'm fed up, I can't really do anything about it as there is little to no "quality keyboard" market in France, especialy since I use US qwerty instead of the french layout XD. So I have to order online...

[berserkfan]

Of course he did it on purpose. Everything he has been doing has come across as dishonest so far. He knows he's in good hands if he can trick you into returning to the wrong address.

I'm really fed up with buying things online.

All indicate that he did it on purpose, yes. But as it's available for pickup, I think it's a proof that the item can be delivered to him. So maybe amazon.com will be on my side if he choose not to go to pick it up.

Did you got trouble yourself with online orders recently? I mean other than with ewastesolutionsnow.
For me, even if I'm fed up, I can't really do anything about it as there is little to no "quality keyboard" market in France, especialy since I use US qwerty instead of the french layout XD. So I have to order online...

Kliee,

all payment systems have their own rules. I don't know Amazon's rules, but Paypal/ ebay don't care about local pickup. You MUST send to the seller's registered address. You MUST follow their rules. If not, too bad.

Their rules are open to abuse and fraud by people who manipulate the system. For instance, I have heard that scammers can send garbage to their seller during a return, and get away with it. In contrast, honest people who return to the 'wrong' address, even if it is an address given to you by the seller via ebay's messaging system, will not get refunded. Only the seller's 'top secret address' registered with ebay/ paypal works. Ebay doesn't care if you quote the address the seller gave you; ebay only cares if you use their messaging system to discuss a transaction off-ebay.

In fact, because I heard of such things, I called my local paypal twice to check. The local paypal employees told me I must go through paypal complaint to get seller address for a return, even though there was no dispute with the seller actually. The purpose of filing a complaint is really to get the address.

[Kliee]

Well, this is, I guess, a final message on this case.

The seller never replied to my emails asking him to go get his stuff at the local post office. As a consequence, the keyboard was returned to me.

After weeks of delibaration and several emails from me, Amazon refunded me completly (item + shipping costs).

In the end the seller lost some money and didn't go get his item back (which shows how much it was worth for him). I hope it's gonna make him understand not to do wrong business on amazon buyers, even with people from other countries.
It also shows that amazon have a real and strong customer service.
His rankings in amazon are quite high, so maybe he is targeting specificaly buyers from abroad. In any case, anybody who wants to know this seller's name on amazon, just pm me .

[berserkfan]

JUst one question.

If you are from France, how did you get to buy on Amazon USA?

I am sick of ebay/paypal crap.

[Kliee]

You can buy from Amazon USA (amazon.com) from almost all around the world. Some third part sellers can chose not to ship outside of the US though.

I know other divisions of Amazon that don't allow that (amazon.co.jp for instance), but I never had problems buying from amazon.com. In fact, it's the very same account I use with amazon.com and amazon.fr. When I first created an amazon account, it was on amazon.com and my login/password worked fine when I logged on amazon.fr the first time.

Maybe that possibility is an "artefact" from the time amazon.com was the only branch.