RAZER BlackWidow Razer switch

[raditz visnar]

Hi All,

just wanna ask about Razer Switch, i found this image somewhere else :



about this Kailh Switch...is there any good? because razer used Cherry MX before...but why Razer choose Kailh switch to replace the cherry and say "NEW RAZER SWITCH" can anyone explain pros and cons about kailh switch.

Thanx

[Sagii]

Hi All,

just wanna ask about Razer Switch, i found this image somewhere else :

Show Image

about this Kailh Switch...is there any good? because razer used Cherry MX before...but why Razer choose Kailh switch to replace the cherry and say "NEW RAZER SWITCH"??? can anyone explain pros and cons about kailh switch.

Thanx :thumb: ;D

For one, I've heard they're cheaper. But I've also heard they are more prone to being faulty and breaking and similar stuff. And Razer in general being with quality checks. I might be wrong though. Other than cheaper and apparently worse quality (don't really think there's a huuuge difference tbh), there shouldn't be many differences between a Kailh and a Cherry switch :)

[raditz visnar]

Hi,

okaiyy but cheaper?? i dont think so..because the price is not far from the previous BW...
some people said that kailh switch is the BOOTLEG from cherry....

[Rafen]

From what other people have posted on this forum is that they are cheap knock-offs. They don't last as long as a cherry mx and are faulty. I tried them out at my local best buy and I wouldn't waste the money on them.

[Rafen]

Hi,

okaiyy but cheaper?? i dont think so..because the price is not far from the previous BW...
some people said that kailh switch is the BOOTLEG from cherry....

I think he meant build quality, not the actual price of the board.

[raditz visnar]

From what other people have posted on this forum is that they are cheap knock-offs. They don't last as long as a cherry mx and are faulty. I tried them out at my local best buy and I wouldn't waste the money on them.

Yeah...agree..i'm still using my ol' BWU. but still they PRINT the Kailh's logo on "razer" switch..OMG....

[rowdy]

See here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56406.0

[raditz visnar]

See here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56406.0

Hi,

Nice info dude...but how's the quality? MX Compatible VS Cherry MX?

[Sagii]

Hi,

okaiyy but cheaper?? i dont think so..because the price is not far from the previous BW...
some people said that kailh switch is the BOOTLEG from cherry....

Not cheaper for us We're talking about Razer for crying out loud!
I mean razer, it's cheaper for razer I remember reading somewhere that it was some other reason for them choosing Kailh, can't remember what it was though. I don't know too much about this stuff )

EDIT: I got ninja'd :c better listen to the others ^^' they know way more than. But I've got a question as well. Is that the reason why they're using Kailh instead? Or are there more reasons for it?

[GhostofHarry]

i have read about reviews of the razer switch

most of them said its are really similar to the blue switch compare to the typing experience
but the durability shall be determined after some time.

here are some review about the switch in china
if you dont mind to use chrome to translate them.
The pictures there should be enough to worth a visit
http://www.weistang.com/thread-636-1-2.html
http://www.weistang.com/thread-635-1-2.html

there are at least 3 cherry mx clones manufacturer in china atm

kailh, gaote and gateron
kailh has been making cherry clone for the longest time and has double click problems in their early production
gaote are rather new, first seen at January 2014 i guess in Noppoo Lolita. Really cheap cost around 0.18 usd per switch
gateron are new switches, and claims to have modification in the dust prevention part (dust causes double clicks they said)

[Findecanor]

Kailh switches are copies of Cherry MX. Like most other clones, they are regarded as being lower-quality than Cherry MX and there have been pictures of broken Kailh switches posted on this board and elsewhere.

Razer switches are a new revision of Kailh switches, designed by Razer and Kailh/Kaihua in cooperation and made in Kaihua's factories. (Company name: Kaihua, Brand name: Kailh)
Razer claims that quality of materials and manufacturing has improved over Kailh switches (as well as over Cherry MX...), but as the switches are quite new, we still don't know how good they will fare in the long run.
One objective difference though, is that the Razer switches have gold-plated contacts inside (like Cherry MX) while Kailh switches don't.
There are rumours that new regular Kailh switches would be built like Razer switches, but that has yet to be confirmed.

Razer's motivation behind the "Razer switches" is not only to get them cheaper, but also because they have been afraid that Cherry GMBH wouldn't be able to fill their demand of key switches.

[Sagii]

Kailh switches are copies of Cherry MX. Like most other clones, they are regarded as being lower-quality than Cherry MX and there have been pictures of broken Kailh switches posted on this board and elsewhere.

Razer switches are a new revision of Kailh switches, designed by Razer and Kailh/Kaihua in cooperation and made in Kaihua's factories. (Company name: Kaihua, Brand name: Kailh)
Razer claims that quality of materials and manufacturing has improved over Kailh switches (as well as over Cherry MX...), but as the switches are quite new, we still don't know how good they will fare in the long run.
One objective difference though, is that the Razer switches have gold-plated contacts inside (like Cherry MX) while Kailh switches don't.
There are rumours that new regular Kailh switches would be built like Razer switches, but that has yet to be confirmed.

Razer's motivation behind the "Razer switches" is not only to get them cheaper, but also because they have been afraid that Cherry GMBH wouldn't be able to fill their demand of key switches.

Ahh, that last bit is probably what I read somewhere else! It'll be interesting to see how well these switches fare with hardcore gamimg and typing though

[Fragil1ty]

Hi All,

just wanna ask about Razer Switch, i found this image somewhere else :

Show Image

about this Kailh Switch...is there any good? because razer used Cherry MX before...but why Razer choose Kailh switch to replace the cherry and say "NEW RAZER SWITCH" ??? can anyone explain pros and cons about kailh switch.

Thanx :thumb: ;D

Check out my review on the latest Razer Blackwidow Tournament Edition /w orange switches.


You may enjoy it.


Link here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=57466.msg1316316#msg1316316

[raditz visnar]

Hi All,

just wanna ask about Razer Switch, i found this image somewhere else :

Show Image

about this Kailh Switch...is there any good? because razer used Cherry MX before...but why Razer choose Kailh switch to replace the cherry and say "NEW RAZER SWITCH" ??? can anyone explain pros and cons about kailh switch.

Thanx :thumb: ;D

Check out my review on the latest Razer Blackwidow Tournament Edition /w orange switches.


You may enjoy it.


Link here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=57466.msg1316316#msg1316316

Hi,
Nice review dude...hope that kailh switch will last longer.... :D

[Novus]

No, it's bad don't use it get a better keyboard.

[raditz visnar]

No, it's bad don't use it get a better keyboard.

Hi,

thanx for advice...i think i will go to Tesoro Durandal or Ducky Zero....whaddaya think?

[rowdy]

Ducky Zero would be a good choice

[ynrozturk]

One is made in China and one is made in Germany.

Think about that for a second.

[Jaky]

Kailh switches feel rusty, kind of. Hard to explain but they have a weak spring in 90% of the switches in their boards ...and OK, so razer is using Kailh for their switches, doesn't mean they are going to feel like Kailh MX clones. Razer has staff watching the development over at Kailh for quality control. Although I can't vouch for either company since I very much dislikes Razer and Kailh.

[Razor Lotus]

One is made in China and one is made in Germany.

Think about that for a second.

What's wrong with made in china?

[ynrozturk]

Not sure if serious..

[Razor Lotus]

Not sure if serious..

serious. hit me with some reasons

[ynrozturk]

You really want me to sit down and explain the differences between German engineering, craftsmanship and most importantly quality to Chinese?

I still don't think you're serious. If you are, then you don't know too much about design/manufacturing/quality.

[Bucake]

china is, in general, alot more about quantity than they are about quality.
i think kailh is just a matter of less quality for less money, compared to cherry.

razer is not exactly about quality, either.

i'd suggest to stay away from crap, but razer is obviously great at marketing.
and i'm not saying that they've only made crap but, in general, that's just what they do.

[Findecanor]

Back when my dad was young, Japan used to be associated with cheap goods of low quality, but a few decades later when I was a kid Japan was associated with electronics of the highest quality. The cheaper goods helped the industries get established, but then it grew up and evolved. The same thing happened in Korea and Taiwan and is happening in China.

But there will still be factories making crap next to factories making quality stuff. "Made in China" means less and less as things progress. Practically everything is made in China these days. "Designed in California - Made in China" ... pfft.

[ynrozturk]

Yes, which is why when you have something designed AND made in Germany, you know that 99% of the time it's going to be of the utter best quality that they can make. Period. It's what Germany is known for. They didn't become one of the manufacturing power houses of the world by producing crap, it's because they are so dedicated to quality. Of course it's more expensive, but you get what you pay for.

I'm pretty certain that those switches will not last as long as German made Cherry switches. I haven't tried them, so maybe it's stupid to jump the gun like that but - German vs Chinese engineering/manufacturing - Germany just flat out wins.

[Jaky]

china is, in general, alot more about quantity than they are about quality.
i think kailh is just a matter of less quality for less money, compared to cherry.

razer is not exactly about quality, either.

i'd suggest to stay away from crap, but razer is obviously great at marketing.
and i'm not saying that they've only made crap but, in general, that's just what they do.

Best answer World. And you're right. Razer does make some good products, though IMO they also go a bit too far. Honestly who has a hand fit for most of their alien tech looking mice LOL. Sorry, 'gamer' mice... Although I do like the the old Razer blackwidow, it feels different to other kb with blues I've used ...probably the PCB used I guess. Also I have no biased opinion towards the 2014 edition.

~OP I'll let you know how it feels compared to my k70 with blues if I decide on buying it or not within the next week or so. 

[Folio]

Why re-invent the wheel? These manufacturers from China are just trying to take a piece of the pie. I'm not saying stop all evolution of switches, but it's the same exact switch in this case (only more ****). Stick with Cherry.

Furthermore, Razer products, while innovative, are really shoddy imo. Their QA is terrible.

[digi]

Kailh switches are for nubs, they dramatically decrease APM.

[Razor Lotus]

Of course it's more expensive, but you get what you pay for.

Except in the case for razer, we don't unfortunately

[ynrozturk]

That's debatable. I mean, they're not that expensive. Not as expensive as Filco, Ducky or even Das. Sure there are better boards for cheaper (QFR) but Razer isn't stupidly expensive or anything. Except for some of their mice.

They DO make some nice products, but their marketing is just eeeehhh. Throws a lot of people off.

[raditz visnar]

Hi All,

but the kailh switch model is more cool than standard cherry..

[raditz visnar]

That's debatable. I mean, they're not that expensive. Not as expensive as Filco, Ducky or even Das. Sure there are better boards for cheaper (QFR) but Razer isn't stupidly expensive or anything. Except for some of their mice.

They DO make some nice products, but their marketing is just eeeehhh. Throws a lot of people off.

  agree....except for their Razer Blade....

[Elrick]

but the kailh switch model is more cool than standard cherry..

Damn, this boy wants to start another Cherry V's Razer War here on Geekhack  . 

Trust me, it won't be pretty.

[Awful]

Hi,

okaiyy but cheaper?? i dont think so..because the price is not far from the previous BW...
some people said that kailh switch is the BOOTLEG from cherry....

Hi All,

just wanna ask about Razer Switch, i found this image somewhere else :

Show Image

about this Kailh Switch...is there any good? because razer used Cherry MX before...but why Razer choose Kailh switch to replace the cherry and say "NEW RAZER SWITCH"??? can anyone explain pros and cons about kailh switch.

Thanx :thumb: ;D

For one, I've heard they're cheaper. But I've also heard they are more prone to being faulty and breaking and similar stuff. And Razer in general being with quality checks. I might be wrong though. Other than cheaper and apparently worse quality (don't really think there's a huuuge difference tbh), there shouldn't be many differences between a Kailh and a Cherry switch :)

Razer use something cheaper? You don't say?! haha.. scumbag company making money from people who don't know better, imo.

[Candyflip]

scumbag company making money from people who don't know better

When people ask me for opinion on Razer I tell them exactly this.

[Razor Lotus]

scumbag company making money from people who don't know better, imo.

Exactly why I'm starting to dislike them quite a bit

[ynrozturk]

That's debatable. I mean, they're not that expensive. Not as expensive as Filco, Ducky or even Das. Sure there are better boards for cheaper (QFR) but Razer isn't stupidly expensive or anything. Except for some of their mice.

They DO make some nice products, but their marketing is just eeeehhh. Throws a lot of people off.

  agree....except for their Razer Blade....

That keyboard is just stupid.

[raditz visnar]

but the kailh switch model is more cool than standard cherry..

Damn, this boy wants to start another Cherry V's Razer War here on Geekhack  . 

Trust me, it won't be pretty.

nope...just curious why Razer choose kailh? but true when the keycap is pulled, kailh switch model is cooler than standard cherry....my opinion

[raditz visnar]

Hi,

okaiyy but cheaper?? i dont think so..because the price is not far from the previous BW...
some people said that kailh switch is the BOOTLEG from cherry....

Hi All,

just wanna ask about Razer Switch, i found this image somewhere else :

Show Image

about this Kailh Switch...is there any good? because razer used Cherry MX before...but why Razer choose Kailh switch to replace the cherry and say "NEW RAZER SWITCH"??? can anyone explain pros and cons about kailh switch.

Thanx :thumb: ;D

For one, I've heard they're cheaper. But I've also heard they are more prone to being faulty and breaking and similar stuff. And Razer in general being with quality checks. I might be wrong though. Other than cheaper and apparently worse quality (don't really think there's a huuuge difference tbh), there shouldn't be many differences between a Kailh and a Cherry switch :)

Razer use something cheaper? You don't say?! haha.. scumbag company making money from people who don't know better, imo.

scumbag company making money from people who don't know better <<< start to like this

[GhostofHarry]

nope...just curious why Razer choose kailh? but true when the keycap is pulled, kailh switch model is cooler than standard cherry....my opinion

u might have missed my messge...

but kailh is one of the company that started developing "MX Compatible" switch the earliest
they should have more mature knowledge and test records or so, comparing to other factory producing "MX Compatible" switch.

maybe a "why not" should be easier to explain why razer chose kailh

[OnTheBrink]

The reason they did this is simple. It is cheaper and since the Razer name is more popular among the casual, they are able to capitalize on acting as if they created the switch.

Directly from the keyboard product description "Introducing the all new Razer Mechanical Switches, designed from the ground up for gaming".

Anyone who can trust a company who blatantly lies about their products deserves to lose their money.

Before Razer became the Apple of gaming, they were famous for their mice among the savvy. They still make great mic and that's where my buck stops with them personally.

[ynrozturk]

Razer have always made idiotic product statements, but that one is probably the worst.

[JinDesu]

So yesterday, I was removing keycaps from my older Razer BW TE MX brown, and in the process of trying to remove the spacebar - I snapped the keycap on the long edge. What happened was that I had every other key out so I pulled on the two ends of the spacebar and got it loose. Then I used my left hand to pull on the space (finger and thumb on the middle of the spacebar), and my right hand to keep the keyboard down.

One side of the spacebar literally cracked off. I'll post a picture later tonight. Not sure if this is normal (keycaps are thin plastic after all), but I've never had this happen with my other ABS and PBT keycaps.

[CPTBadAss]

The reason they did this is simple. It is cheaper and since the Razer name is more popular among the casual, they are able to capitalize on acting as if they created the switch.

Directly from the keyboard product description "Introducing the all new Razer Mechanical Switches, designed from the ground up for gaming".

To go with the marketing angle, I've also heard rumors that Cherry has been hard to source switches from lately. With their own switches, Razer gets to control its manufacturing chain and production times a bit more.

[ynrozturk]

So yesterday, I was removing keycaps from my older Razer BW TE MX brown, and in the process of trying to remove the spacebar - I snapped the keycap on the long edge. What happened was that I had every other key out so I pulled on the two ends of the spacebar and got it loose. Then I used my left hand to pull on the space (finger and thumb on the middle of the spacebar), and my right hand to keep the keyboard down.

One side of the spacebar literally cracked off. I'll post a picture later tonight. Not sure if this is normal (keycaps are thin plastic after all), but I've never had this happen with my other ABS and PBT keycaps.

Same thing happened to me. Razer's caps are very flimsy, when I was replacing the caps with Filco key caps the same thing happened to me and the space bar literally just cracked.

[OnTheBrink]

The reason they did this is simple. It is cheaper and since the Razer name is more popular among the casual, they are able to capitalize on acting as if they created the switch.

Directly from the keyboard product description "Introducing the all new Razer Mechanical Switches, designed from the ground up for gaming".

To go with the marketing angle, I've also heard rumors that Cherry has been hard to source switches from lately. With their own switches, Razer gets to control its manufacturing chain and production times a bit more.

Although a rumor, this makes a lot of sense.

It still frustrates me when companies rebrand something and call it their own. That's like me making a Gucci belt with the same design and slightly different logo and claiming "built from the ground up and engineered for people who like fashion". It's such a cheap form of marketing and blatantly misleading. It's also in the grey area of legality.

Hell, even their Razer laptop has a case design remarkable similar to the Mac book but in black. They copy and paste designs and try to capitalize on consumer ignorance.

Look at Corsair on the other hand. Even though I'm not a fan of their case designs, they have no problem developing for gamers who aren't keyboard enthusiasts but never hide they are using Cherry MX and give credit where it is due. Then look at how the product quality reflects between Corsair and Razer. Corsair has far superior hardware and doesn't try to capitalize on cheap PR. Sony is another company who focuses more on marketing than delivering a quality product.

The reason this bothers me so much is I feel like this is the nail in the coffin for Razer. I always felt they were going this direction but with this they've completely turned the corner in my eyes. There is no returning from it. First it was when I felt the horrible quality of their $300 keyboard with the LED keys. They called scissor switches "low profile keys for gaming and quick actuation", lmao.

Razer has become the Apple of gaming hardware.

[Findecanor]

Yeah. I want to want to buy a BW Tournament Stealth 2014. The price is good, I like the layout (I use the same on my Phantom!) and the features and from what I have heard about the switches it sounds as if I would like them.
But F***, it is from Razer... and there is no way in L that I would support Razer after all the bullcrap marketing that they have done. Razer deserves to burn in Hell.

[raditz visnar]

The reason they did this is simple. It is cheaper and since the Razer name is more popular among the casual, they are able to capitalize on acting as if they created the switch.

Directly from the keyboard product description "Introducing the all new Razer Mechanical Switches, designed from the ground up for gaming".

To go with the marketing angle, I've also heard rumors that Cherry has been hard to source switches from lately. With their own switches, Razer gets to control its manufacturing chain and production times a bit more.

Although a rumor, this makes a lot of sense.

It still frustrates me when companies rebrand something and call it their own. That's like me making a Gucci belt with the same design and slightly different logo and claiming "built from the ground up and engineered for people who like fashion". It's such a cheap form of marketing and blatantly misleading. It's also in the grey area of legality.

Hell, even their Razer laptop has a case design remarkable similar to the Mac book but in black. They copy and paste designs and try to capitalize on consumer ignorance.

Look at Corsair on the other hand. Even though I'm not a fan of their case designs, they have no problem developing for gamers who aren't keyboard enthusiasts but never hide they are using Cherry MX and give credit where it is due. Then look at how the product quality reflects between Corsair and Razer. Corsair has far superior hardware and doesn't try to capitalize on cheap PR. Sony is another company who focuses more on marketing than delivering a quality product.

The reason this bothers me so much is I feel like this is the nail in the coffin for Razer. I always felt they were going this direction but with this they've completely turned the corner in my eyes. There is no returning from it. First it was when I felt the horrible quality of their $300 keyboard with the LED keys. They called scissor switches "low profile keys for gaming and quick actuation", lmao.

Razer has become the Apple of gaming hardware.

is that true that corsair has far superior hardware? love the design....but i dont really like the size....

[Novus]

The reason they did this is simple. It is cheaper and since the Razer name is more popular among the casual, they are able to capitalize on acting as if they created the switch.

Directly from the keyboard product description "Introducing the all new Razer Mechanical Switches, designed from the ground up for gaming".

To go with the marketing angle, I've also heard rumors that Cherry has been hard to source switches from lately. With their own switches, Razer gets to control its manufacturing chain and production times a bit more.

Although a rumor, this makes a lot of sense.

It still frustrates me when companies rebrand something and call it their own. That's like me making a Gucci belt with the same design and slightly different logo and claiming "built from the ground up and engineered for people who like fashion". It's such a cheap form of marketing and blatantly misleading. It's also in the grey area of legality.

Hell, even their Razer laptop has a case design remarkable similar to the Mac book but in black. They copy and paste designs and try to capitalize on consumer ignorance.

Look at Corsair on the other hand. Even though I'm not a fan of their case designs, they have no problem developing for gamers who aren't keyboard enthusiasts but never hide they are using Cherry MX and give credit where it is due. Then look at how the product quality reflects between Corsair and Razer. Corsair has far superior hardware and doesn't try to capitalize on cheap PR. Sony is another company who focuses more on marketing than delivering a quality product.

The reason this bothers me so much is I feel like this is the nail in the coffin for Razer. I always felt they were going this direction but with this they've completely turned the corner in my eyes. There is no returning from it. First it was when I felt the horrible quality of their $300 keyboard with the LED keys. They called scissor switches "low profile keys for gaming and quick actuation", lmao.

Razer has become the Apple of gaming hardware.

is that true that corsair has far superior hardware? love the design....but i dont really like the size....

Nope.
I like how easy it is to clean a Corsair, but it types like crap.
Corsair also doesn't make any of their own products.