Questions about using o-rings on cherry profile/sp caps

[asgeirtj]

Hi

I was wondering what you guys's experience on using o-rings on cherry profile and signature plastics keycaps are?

I currently have the sp double shot caps and apparently they don't have "crossbars" which means that it doesn't work very well with o-rings.

here is a pic, sp is on the far left the only one without a crossbar:

https://i.imgur.com/eVYrRRm.jpg

So i like the low profile of the sp caps but I want to be able to use o-rings, so it looks like that I have to find some other cherry profile keys and I was considering these ones from imsto:

http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=62&product_id=59

I have an mj2 (iso, but i realize that i will have to live with the enter key being from another keyset, imsto doesn't provide iso keys does he?) those will fit that right?

But those are a little pricey and I realize getting thick caps is useless if you're going to be using o-rings anyway so is there some other alternative?

Also, what o-rings work well with cherry profile caps? Maybe these from imsto?
http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=58

or

http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/keyboard-accessories/cherry-mx-rubber-o-ring-switch-dampeners-125pcs.html#ad-image-0

the 0.2 mm ones?

Thanks!

[IvanIvanovich]

I've never used O ring... but with Cherry key you certainly will want the thinner ones. I have seen that the thick type o ring can actually block the switch from actuation with Cherry key.
What ISO layout do you use? Perhaps you can find one of older Cherry G80/G81 and steal it's keycap. Depending on layout you might even get lucky and find model with original Cherry dyesub for good price. Otherwise if not, G80/G81 still a good candidate to pull ISO enter from. At least the profile will match with imsto set.

[swill]

I did a lot of measurements on this topic. http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174.msg1186392.msg#1186392

[asgeirtj]

Which ones are the thinner/small ones from imsto?

http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=58 or
http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

?

[ViciousWhiskers]

The IMSTO Rubber ones (black) are the old ones. Use the silicone version (red) at small sizes. Typing on IMSTO Cherry Profile Dyesub right now on MX Reds with the small o-rings.

[swill]

Which ones are the thinner/small ones from imsto?

http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=58 or
http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

?

You want these: http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

Be sure to select 'Small' in the dropdown...

I am also typing on thick PBT cherry profile keycaps with these exact orings...

[asgeirtj]

What is the difference between rubber and silicon o-rings?

[swill]

What is the difference between rubber and silicon o-rings?

Not sure, but I would probably use silicone if given the choice. Silicone is used for gaskets in heavy machinery, so it would probably last longer. Rubber historically breaks down quicker, but who knows.

These are my instincts.

[handystack]

I have used WASD red o rings on SP DCS and DSA caps.  The DSA caps have no crossbraces like the one in your picture, but you should still be able to get a consistent feel from them because of their uniform stem height and surface angle. Check out this thread for more info: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=58417.30
The DCS caps have crossbraces, but I have found that across different rows and widths they are very inconsistent in the height and even the angle of the crossbraces.  The home row engages the o rings sooner than the neighboring rows, and the number row barely touches the o rings.  My 1.5x number row keys bottom out hard without touching the o rings.  I have been meaning to remove the o rings from my DCS set, but I may just put that off until I can find a legended ErgoDox DSA set to replace it.

[ideus]

I've never used O ring... but with Cherry key you certainly will want the thinner ones. I have seen that the thick type o ring can actually block the switch from actuation with Cherry key.
What ISO layout do you use? Perhaps you can find one of older Cherry G80/G81 and steal it's keycap. Depending on layout you might even get lucky and find model with original Cherry dyesub for good price. Otherwise if not, G80/G81 still a good candidate to pull ISO enter from. At least the profile will match with imsto set.

I have used fat silicon red o-rings (40A) with original vintage Cherry keys with no issues at all.

[asgeirtj]

Which ones are the thinner/small ones from imsto?

http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=58 or
http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

?

You want these: http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

Be sure to select 'Small' in the dropdown...

I am also typing on thick PBT cherry profile keycaps with these exact orings...

Just curious, isn't it useless to have thick caps if you bottom them out?

[JPG]

I have used o-rings with stock filco key caps and IMSTO keycaps (thick cherry profile) and they worked well on both.


I use Buna o-ring from amazon cause they were cheap :

008

3/16"

5/16"

1/16"

But after using them for a while on my cherry keycaps, at some point I tried it without them and realized that with the cherry profile, I preferred it slightly without the o-rings because of the travel.


But it's so much a matter of preference that you need to try it to know if you prefer o-rings or not with a set of key caps. Other than a little time, you won't lose much trying them.

[swill]

Which ones are the thinner/small ones from imsto?

http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=58 or
http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

?

You want these: http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

Be sure to select 'Small' in the dropdown...

I am also typing on thick PBT cherry profile keycaps with these exact orings...

Just curious, isn't it useless to have thick caps if you bottom them out?

I am not sure why that would be the case.  The thick caps give you a much more solid feel, especially when you bottom out.  With thin caps you feel more vibration and to me the switch and the keycap don't feel like they are one unit.  With thick keycaps, the keycap and the stem feel more like one piece for a more consistent and natural feel.  This is all subjective, but this is how I would describe the feeling.

My favorite setup so far is thick keycap with soft o-rings.  Everything feels solid together with no vibration or tackiness feel when bottoming out.

[swill]

I have used o-rings with stock filco key caps and IMSTO keycaps (thick cherry profile) and they worked well on both.


I use Buna o-ring from amazon cause they were cheap :

008

3/16"

5/16"

1/16"

But after using them for a while on my cherry keycaps, at some point I tried it without them and realized that with the cherry profile, I preferred it slightly without the o-rings because of the travel.


But it's so much a matter of preference that you need to try it to know if you prefer o-rings or not with a set of key caps. Other than a little time, you won't lose much trying them.

Ya I prefer Cherry profile keycaps with smaller o-rings than that.  The keycap does not go all the way on with those o-rings...  The standard key travel of a MX switch is 4mm.  I like a slight reduction of travel.  My ideal travel 3.5mm (with cherry profile, that is a 1.45mm o-ring).

[asgeirtj]

I'm currently using cherry profile keycaps and using o-rings on them I think is horrible because the end travel distance is so short.  I'm using these, which are 1,5mm. 

http://www.keyboardco.com/product/o-ring-switch-dampeners-for-filco-keyboards.asp

Are there any options for thinner o-rings out there?  I understand imsto is 1,45mm but I can't imagine that 0,05mm will make much of a difference.