Author Topic: Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes  (Read 10221 times)

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Offline caseyandgina

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Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes
« on: Fri, 12 September 2014, 11:49:28 »
So somewhere I had heard good things about this mouse.  Yesterday I stopped by a Best Buy to see how the MX Blue switches on a a Blackwidow keyboard felt compared to the MX Green keyboard I recently purchased (their display model still had the Cherry switches though the boxed ones for sale all used the Razer switches which IMHO felt awful in comparison), and while there, I decided to buy a BlackAdder and give it a shot.  It looked nice enough in the box.

TL;DR:  I really don't like it.  I think it's price should be $10-20.

First off, the Synapse software simply DOES NOT WORK, at least on OS X.  I was so happy to see there were options to disable the annoying device lighting (particularly the constantly-strobing-on-and-off logo is very aggravating), until I discovered that changing the settings to "off" did absolutely nothing.  Also trying fruitlessly to reboot and create different profiles led me to learn that half the time the Synapse software fails to connect to the cloud and the other half of the time fails to recognize that there's a Synapse-compatible device plugged in.  I thought maybe the failure to recognize the device was because of an intermediate USB device I'm using to plug the mouse into, but plugging it directly into the computer yielded identical results.  Sometimes I could not get it to recognize the device again no matter how many times I restarted, but reinstalling the software would magically fix the problem, not that it meant there was any advantage, since I could still not change any device settings.

The ergonomics might be called okay, IF you like using your middle finger on the right button AND like having your two button fingers spread apart more than feels natural.  The buttons depression areas help force your fingers into the "correct" positions, which to me feels unnatural and a strain on my hand.  Naturally my fingers want to be closer, which barely leaves adequate room for the scroll wheel in between, but Razer wants me to nearly triple that distance.  My last mouse that I used before using a temporary stopgap one was an Apple Mighty Mouse, which I wouldn't call phenomenal, but it was better because it didn't try to force my fingers into any particular spread - I could place them as I pleased.  My favorite mice in the past have been those that laid out the buttons such that your first and third finger rested on the two buttons, and your middle finger rested either on a third middle button, or a scroll wheel.  I haven't used/seen anything that fits this bill in a number of years though.  One that I have very fond memories of was the Logitech Trackman Marble T-CH11, and the one that immediately followed it with a scroll wheel put in place of the middle button.  The later grey models that went to a more modern two buttons with a wheel sandwiched in the middle were not as nice.  Those aren't "mice" but they are the models I can remember.  There were other early mice that followed the same button design (particularly those designed for UNIX systems which utilized 3 buttons before other platforms).  Sun Type 5 and Type 6 mice had a nice 3-button arrangement, but I wouldn't call them great mice.

Another thing that I really don't like about the Razer - the surface feels very gritty and rough on the hands.  I don't know what it is exactly, but it feels like paint to me, rather than a nice lightly-textured plastic.  Grabbing the edge of my sharp-edged WASD keyboard's textured plastic feels a whole lot nicer than touching the Razer mouse.  I think that textured is the way to go rather than glossy, but they missed the mark pretty badly here if you ask me.  Maybe it was necessary to pull off that stupid strobing logo thing, which doesn't even look good as the light is somewhere far behind the surface with no light channeling so which part of the logo gets illuminated depends on viewing angle.

How about that scroll wheel?  It's illuminated which isn't necessary and I would prefer to be able to turn off, but it's not so annoying as it's more subtle and doesn't strobe.  Rolling the wheel downward feels very nice - just enough tactile feedback and nice smooth silent operation.  Much better than the crappy Wyse optical mouse I was using temporarily that was difficult to roll due to being completely smooth on the surface and having too much resistance.  That's where the "nice" ends.  Scroll upwards, and you get a loud clattery sound, unless you are pressing *just so" at a particular unnatural angle with steady pressure.  This actually makes the problem worse, because instead of the sound being awful 100% of the time, it's awful 90% of the time, so it's both awful and inconsistent.  Then you go to click the wheel as a third mouse button.  WTF?  It's hinged on the left, VERY OBVIOUSLY, so when you click, the wheel moves to the right.  It's so bad that it's actually easier to press the wheel from the left to the right than it is to put your finger on the top and press down.  I might think that was a design feature except for the fact that it's difficult to press it from the left without also clicking the first mouse button.

Which leads us to the sensitivity issue...  The buttons are not at all consistent in how much pressure they require to activate.  The right mouse button is the most sensitive, the left one is noticeably more sensitive, and the middle mouse button takes many times more force to depress.  No consistency at all.  This makes even less sense when you consider that this mouse layout is designed for the user to use the same index finger to press the left and scroll wheel buttons, so at least they should be consistent.  Straight out of the box, one of the first things I noticed before even plugging it in was that the right and left mouse buttons have a totally different sound.  Yes, the middle button is yet another dramatically different sound from either of the other two.  The 4th and 5th buttons also sound different from one another, though they feel about the same.

Last complaint - the lift-off distance is rather high.  What's the point of a high-precision mouse if every time I pick up the mouse to move it the cursor moves 2 inches across the screen?  I guess I just expected that any "gamer" mouse would have a near-zero lift-off distance.  I'm not a gamer but do value precision.  Not really that important to me but I was surprised by it and thought it worth mention.

So what's good about this mouse???  Well, it's probably the best of the Razer offerings, at least compared to the others I was able to see at Best Buy.  I'm not sure that's saying much...  The rubber grip areas on the left and right are nice.  The 4th and 5th (thumb) buttons are perfectly situated.  I also can't complain about the tracking.  I like the black braided cable. That's all.

I bought this mouse expecting it to be a much better experience than a cheap Dell mouse.  I didn't really find it.

So before I return this and go buying something else blindly off the internet, I thought I'd ask for advice for a replacement based on my preferences.  So here we go:

* The BlackAdder is a reasonable size, but it doesn't feel very ergonomic in my hand.  I would like something the same size or slightly larger, nothing smaller, nothing flatter like the horrible Apple Magic Mouse.
* I don't want some weird monstrosity-looking device.  Clean and simple wins.
* Does anybody still make mice optimized for using three fingers for buttons?  That would be nice though not a necessity.  What is a necessity is the mouse not forcing my fingers apart which will cause strain.
* No lights, or if there are lights, let me turn them off.
* Settings should be stored on the device, not in the cloud.
* I like to have 3 main buttons (including scroll click) and a 4th button.  5th is okay but I don't need a huge plethora of buttons like the 12-thumb-key model Razer makes.
* Does any mouse except the Apple Mighty Mouse have an omnidirectional scroll ball?  Not that important really but a nice feature if available

After reading a little bit here, I am thinking the Zowie FK1 may be a good alternative?  Could somebody who has one speak to the above concerns about the Razer?  Any other recommendations?
« Last Edit: Sat, 20 September 2014, 08:25:11 by caseyandgina »

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #1 on: Sat, 13 September 2014, 11:21:14 »
After a lot of reading, I went ahead and ordered a Zowie FK1. Hopefully it works out better!

Offline Elrick

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #2 on: Sat, 13 September 2014, 19:25:57 »
After a lot of reading, I went ahead and ordered a Zowie FK1. Hopefully it works out better!

Trust me the Zowie is way better than anything made and sold by Razer (fact)  :thumb: .  The beautiful thing about any Zowie input device, you adjust it's speed underneath with a single button hence get use to the ease and comfort of selecting your mousing experience.

Currently using the FK1 and it's basically an WMO with side buttons.  Although for me the buttons don't get in the way of using the mouse at all, just the way I like it.  Get use to the button pressing because you will need to get use to pressing these beggars harder than with any previous mouse you've ever owned before.

Enjoy the Zowie FK1, a rodent with an excellent sensor worth acquiring and using.

Offline munch

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 13 September 2014, 20:04:38 »
After a lot of reading, I went ahead and ordered a Zowie FK1. Hopefully it works out better!

I started reading your wall but it was a bit too late into the night to continue, sorry...
but you definitely bought a good mouse. :p

Offline Elrick

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 13 September 2014, 21:47:17 »
Another suggestion for the op here if you indeed want to try a true "Right-handed" mouse then you can't go wrong with a Roccat Pure Optical.  Very robust little device able to withstand my ape like molestation upon it and still remain functional everyday.

Have one installed on a Win 7 setup and has been a solid performer with that PC for over 6 months now.  I know here on Geekhack Zowie is the current fave flavour for everyone but don't forget the Roccat range because they do make solid mice that are up there with Logitech in performance and longevity.

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 13 September 2014, 23:40:22 »
Get use to the button pressing because you will need to get use to pressing these beggars harder than with any previous mouse you've ever owned before.

I read that, but also that the tactile feedback is appreciable. My keyboard uses cherry mx green switches and I love it, so I think I should be fine. I am a little concerned about the scroll wheel/button, but we'll see.

Sadly I couldn't get an unaccelerated high dpi experience with the DA. I disabled O/S acceleration and this was nice and predictable, but very slow. I think I should like the button on the mouse bottom a million times more than the horrible Synapse driver (even if it did work, which it didn't).

Offline Elrick

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 13 September 2014, 23:53:04 »
I am a little concerned about the scroll wheel/button, but we'll see.

I'm only saying because I am use to the free-scroll wheel action within my G500 series and that suits my web browsing perfectly because I need to scroll through hundreds of items super quick to find something of interest.

Plus I don't have free time to browse so for me the ancient G500 serves me well.  But if you have huge blocks of free internet time, then the FK1 is suitable for you.

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 18 September 2014, 11:54:38 »
I got my Zowie FK1 in the mail last night and have been given it a good bit of use since then.

This mouse is SOOOOOooooooooooooo much better than the Razer it's ridiculous.  Absolutely love this mouse!

I read complaints that the mouse buttons were too hard to click, but I disagree.  The two primary buttons are just perfect, not difficult to press at all.  I wouldn't want them changed one bit.  The scroll wheel is also not difficult to roll, but rather feels just right.  It does take more pressure than I would like to click it down as a button, but it's not enough to be a problem and the wheel clicks straight downward like it should, not to the right with lousy hinged design like the Razer.  The side buttons don't feel so obvious as on the Razer, but this is because they are thinner and don't come down as far, which is a good thing - they are subtle and work perfectly - they are actually easier to press than the ones on the Razer, and that's fine because they don't get in your way as much so aren't as subject to accidental presses.  The ones on the side I don't use also stay out of the way.  No annoying LED's  - the one on the bottom to indicate the DPI setting can't be seen unless you want to.  The feel of the buttons is better and doesn't strain my fingers, and if I want to put three fingers on the top of the mouse instead of two, it actually feels pretty reasonable to do that as there is a curved depression above the scroll wheel that my middle finger can rest in when not scrolling, whereas the Razer just has sharp poky edges there.  If I only use two fingers, they are not split apart unnaturally like with the Razer.  The size of the mouse is just right - I imagine the older FK would feel a little small.  The surface looks identical at a glance, but where the Razer feels very harsh and rough-textured, the Zowie does not.  Lastly, the front of the Zowie is as graceful-looking as the back, with smooth curves around the corners.  The Razer flared out on the front corners and had ugly sharp edges there.  Some might say the Zowie looks plain and ordinary, but I think that's a good thing.  I now have a real input device that I feel is qualified to rest beside my WASD Code TKL. :)

I can't wait to get the nasty Razer boxed up and returned to Best Buy.

Offline Elrick

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 18 September 2014, 19:11:38 »
I can't wait to get the nasty Razer boxed up and returned to Best Buy.

Before returning it, put it under the wheel of your vehicle and drive over it.  That way Best Buy do not try and re-sell it to others looking to buy a mouse.

Offline munch

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #9 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 09:03:58 »
very nice, I'm glad you're happy with the mouse! I personally like my switches very light (MX Red, thinking of making them lighter with spring mod. for keyboards. and light omrons in my mouse) so it's on the heavier side for me :p but they feel 'solid' so that's a good thing.

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 10:52:26 »
I can't wait to get the nasty Razer boxed up and returned to Best Buy.

Before returning it, put it under the wheel of your vehicle and drive over it.  That way Best Buy do not try and re-sell it to others looking to buy a mouse.

How about a dab of black sharpie on the optical sensor??

Oh, forgot to mention, the lift-off distance on the Zombie is perfect - very low and probably just enough to not put the accuracy at risk.  It's nice that the small things that you shouldn't notice, aren't noticeable with this mouse, so you don't even think about them, whereas the defects of the Razer scream out at you.  I'm using the 3200dpi setting in conjunction with the lowest "Tracking Speed" setting on OS X, which balances out well.  Higher tracking speeds seemed to imply OS acceleration, which I was able to detect by moving the mouse slowly one direction and quickly back the opposite direction.  I can't reproduce that behavior with the settings as I have them now, but are there any other tweaks for OS X I should know about?  I like that if I want more control, it's a simple lift of the mouse and tap of the button on the bottom, which I can do with my right hand alone.

I am now thinking about ordering a custom key cap set that is yellow labels on black keys, with a few keys in black on yellow, to match the mouse. ;)

Offline munch

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 11:23:29 »
in terminal, have you run this?
defaults write .GlobalPreferences com.apple.mouse.scaling -1
it removes all mouse accel in osx.
there's also smoothmouse or something, forgot the actual name now, that removes some of the mouse input buffering that macos has.

I think you should do that! :p it'd look really nice. and a matching mousepad?

Offline Shapey Fiend

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 11:54:13 »
My daughter broke my Deathadder a month ago. I loved that mouse because it was the first one I bought that wasn't complete junk.

Got a Roccat Lua as replacement because It was cheap-ish and I didn't want to spend another €80.

It seems pretty good so far. Certainly excellent for €30 price point.

My main beef with mice is they always seem so bloody small these days. I've got very long fingers so they all feel so dinky. I'd love to find a really large one that wasn't covered in extra buttons I'm going to be hitting off all the time.

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 11:55:23 »
in terminal, have you run this?
defaults write .GlobalPreferences com.apple.mouse.scaling -1
it removes all mouse accel in osx.
there's also smoothmouse or something, forgot the actual name now, that removes some of the mouse input buffering that macos has.

I think you should do that! :p it'd look really nice. and a matching mousepad?

I have an XXL mousepad from Glorious PC Gaming Race.  It's pretty nice.  I don't think I'll replace it until I can afford to buy this leather one


Offline munch

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 12:23:47 »
oh honestly I think you should keep the XXL pad, leather is not that nice as a mousepad. it might mess with tracking of the FK1 too.

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 14:19:13 »
oh honestly I think you should keep the XXL pad, leather is not that nice as a mousepad. it might mess with tracking of the FK1 too.

Can you please elaborate?

Offline munch

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 17:57:06 »
oh honestly I think you should keep the XXL pad, leather is not that nice as a mousepad. it might mess with tracking of the FK1 too.

Can you please elaborate?

the leather mousepads I've used were very sticky in feeling, not great for small movements or smoothness, just terrible. and if it's patina(? is this the correct word) leather it might just make it unusable for some optical mice like the FK1. meaning it won't read the surface properly and likely skip around a lot.

Offline FinancialWar

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 18:25:05 »
WTF is a blackadder? Do you mean DeathAdder?
Visit the Typing Test and try!

Offline Hypersphere

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 19 September 2014, 18:55:55 »
My favorite mouse of all time is the Razer DeathAdder Black Edition. Perfect shape, easy to click buttons, excellent sensitivity, great scroll wheel that is also easy to click as a middle button, and a surface that does not get sticky even with prolonged intensive use. I like it so much that I ordered extras in case the ones I have wear out. They are now getting scarce.

However, the Razer products can vary from one model to another. I tried the Razer DeathAdder 2013 edition, and it was terrible -- I returned it and got another DA Black Edition.


Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #19 on: Sat, 20 September 2014, 08:25:01 »
WTF is a blackadder? Do you mean DeathAdder?

Haha, yes, not sure how I got that mixed up.

Offline caseyandgina

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Re: Razer BlackAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 20 September 2014, 08:27:09 »
My favorite mouse of all time is the Razer DeathAdder Black Edition. Perfect shape, easy to click buttons, excellent sensitivity, great scroll wheel that is also easy to click as a middle button, and a surface that does not get sticky even with prolonged intensive use. I like it so much that I ordered extras in case the ones I have wear out. They are now getting scarce.

However, the Razer products can vary from one model to another. I tried the Razer DeathAdder 2013 edition, and it was terrible -- I returned it and got another DA Black Edition.

Okay, good to know.  Because I'd read some great reviews of the DeathAdder without knowing the difference between editions, and then went and bought one.  I suppose that they were probably of the earlier Black Edition.  Nice to know that somebody who likes an earlier DeathAdder thought this newer one was terrible as I did.

Offline daerid

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Re: Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #21 on: Mon, 22 September 2014, 13:12:53 »
Currently using my DA2013, and loving it. I must have gotten a decent one.

Offline domoaligato

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Re: Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #22 on: Mon, 22 September 2014, 13:45:37 »
mine lasted 3 monthes before the double clicking. bought a rival. will never buy razer again after dealing with customer service.

Offline pharaoh

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Re: Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #23 on: Wed, 24 September 2014, 19:42:34 »
I had purchased the DA 2013 coming from a Zowie AM, and a  DA 3.5G previously. My main issue with the '13, the textured rubber on the right side felt too jagged for my taste, and the way I deathgrip a mouse with my little finger and thumb, it was extremely uncomfortable, ironically, the 3.5G with no padding at all on that side, was MORE comfortable for my hands. 

After i sold that to a friend. I had ordered a few FK1's when they were restocked on ESEA and Superbiz respectively.  The FK1's sensor is absolutely wonderful.  I had tearing issues (and still do unfortunately) with the AM at the lowest dpi/cpi setting (450*)  while at 6 inches ~ 360, which i play TF2 at.  The AM is fine when i play CS:GO @ 27 inches ~ 360. The FK1 worked flawlessly at both respective sensitivities and dpi settings.  This was very surprising to me since the FK1's lowest dpi setting is 400 and not 450*.  As much as I loved the sensor,  the deal breaker for me was the non rubberized grip, which I've become too accustomed to with the AM.  I sold the few FK1's I had and have been using the AM as my main mouse.  Whenever this gives out on me, I'll buy another AM, and an FK1 to see if latex paint could make it usable for me.  I wish you luck with the  mouse search, for some, finding the perfect mouse is like finding the holy grail.  If your purchase comes down to the DA shape, get and EC1.  It's wonderful.

PS.  Zowie Mice have the lowest LOD on the market, and in my opinion, the best stock mouse feet.


* The ZOWIE AM's sensor is very odd.  After lots of testing and debate, the dpi is often referred to as 497 , and not 450.
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Offline munch

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Re: Razer DeathAdder 2013 woes
« Reply #24 on: Wed, 24 September 2014, 22:05:20 »
I had purchased the DA 2013 coming from a Zowie AM, and a  DA 3.5G previously. My main issue with the '13, the textured rubber on the right side felt too jagged for my taste, and the way I deathgrip a mouse with my little finger and thumb, it was extremely uncomfortable, ironically, the 3.5G with no padding at all on that side, was MORE comfortable for my hands. 

After i sold that to a friend. I had ordered a few FK1's when they were restocked on ESEA and Superbiz respectively.  The FK1's sensor is absolutely wonderful.  I had tearing issues (and still do unfortunately) with the AM at the lowest dpi/cpi setting (450*)  while at 6 inches ~ 360, which i play TF2 at.  The AM is fine when i play CS:GO @ 27 inches ~ 360. The FK1 worked flawlessly at both respective sensitivities and dpi settings.  This was very surprising to me since the FK1's lowest dpi setting is 400 and not 450*.  As much as I loved the sensor,  the deal breaker for me was the non rubberized grip, which I've become too accustomed to with the AM.  I sold the few FK1's I had and have been using the AM as my main mouse.  Whenever this gives out on me, I'll buy another AM, and an FK1 to see if latex paint could make it usable for me.  I wish you luck with the  mouse search, for some, finding the perfect mouse is like finding the holy grail.  If your purchase comes down to the DA shape, get and EC1.  It's wonderful.

PS.  Zowie Mice have the lowest LOD on the market, and in my opinion, the best stock mouse feet.


* The ZOWIE AM's sensor is very odd.  After lots of testing and debate, the dpi is often referred to as 497 , and not 450.

could be worth looking up if the FK1/FK have the same PCB size / mount as the AM. the FK/FK1 have interchangeable internals, and I am pretty sure the FK and AM have the same internals?
so, an AM with the FK1 sensor/buttons/whatever, could that be your perfect mouse maybe?

also welcome to geekhack- I know you from TF2! :p