Das III Vs. Abs M1

[erricrice]

I know I know, they're completely different keyboards.  I'm completely aware of that fact.

Anways, to the point!  I just got my Abs M1 that I was going to use in place of my Das III Pro.  I do like it, but I realized not as much as my Das.  It's keys seem to be much more weighted(harder to push down) and the action doesn't seem to be really smooth, more of a grinding feel to it than the das.  I was just wondering your guys' opinions on the comparison of the two and also if you had any suggestions as to what might be a good in-between for the two.  I like the non-clicky style of the abs, but the feel of the switches in the das.  I was thinking maybe brown cherries since they are not clicky but are still tactile and still made by cherry so they might be similar to the blues in the das?  I have never tried them but that was just my guess.

Thoughts anyone?

[Binge]

I completely agree.  I have an ABS M1 and Filco Tenkeyless with cherry browns.  My friend owns my old Das, and I miss it.

[watduzhkstand4]

Blue cherry ftw!

[erricrice]

ok, that's kind of what I thought.  I may just stick with the DAS as I quite like it.  How does the key weight on a model M compare?  Roughly how many grams for a keystroke on one of those?  

Kinda strange though, I don't see much on this forum about the DAS and really the main thing that I have seen is about how it is terrible(the input issue) but everyone seems to still have some respect and like for it haha.  I also don't really see it in many people's sigs

[rdjack21]

Personally I prefer my brown Cherry Filco board over my iOne Scorpious M10 with blue Cherry switches. I've been debating weather or not to get a Filco with the blue Cherry switches. But I just haven't convinced myself that I will like the Filco any better than the Scorpious. I can't really put a finger on what it is I don't like about the Blue Cherry switches but for some reason I have more typing mistakes on it verses Brown Cherry switches or the Black Alps in the ABS M1. The only thing I can think of is I type with more confidance on the Browns.

My thoughts on the ABS M1 pretty much come down to I really don't like the play in the keys. They just seem to be more sloppy to me compaired to any of the Cherry boards. Don't get me wrong I can type on it just fine but the key action just does not feel quite as clean as a cherry board.

If you want to try the browns before spending the money on a Filco PM me I have a Compaq MX11800 I got from another member that I used just for this purpus myself. It's not a great board but it will let you know if you like Cherry browns or not (The layout sucks). And the feel of the Compaq is very close to the Filco the main differance is that the Filco is a better constructed board.

[sprintf32768]

The truth is that blue cherries rock.  I am using browns all the time at work now, but I recognize and respect the blues.

The Scorpius M10 has some other issues, the Das III has some other issues, but the blue switches are kickass.  That is really why all of us are holding our breath for a 104-key Blue Cherry Filco.  Because then the issues are gone and we can just enjoy the switches.  

There is going to be pandemonium on the day Majestouch puts those things up for sale, AH TELL YOU WUHT!

[erricrice]

ahh, i see now. well I can't wait myself!  The issue with the DAS has not come up with me since I'm only typing about 70-85wpm now, but I am working on my typing skills and getting faster every day, so who knows, I might hit that 120 some day.  A little off topic, but what can some of you guys type?  Also, for the faster of you out there, any tips?  Hand placement, height, anchored, etc?

[kyamei]

I don't think the problem affects only people who type 120+ wpm, but rather anyone who can type a burst of letters at 120+ wpm (pretty easy with words like "the").


On topic:
Yes, I also prefer the feel of Cherry blue switches over Alps.  Cherry's just seem smoother and the tactile point isn't as high on the downstroke.

[patrickgeekhack]

ahh, i see now. well I can't wait myself!  The issue with the DAS has not come up with me since I'm only typing about 70-85wpm now, but I am working on my typing skills and getting faster every day, so who knows, I might hit that 120 some day.  A little off topic, but what can some of you guys type?  Also, for the faster of you out there, any tips?  Hand placement, height, anchored, etc?

I prefer my Cherry G80-3000 to my ABS M1 as well. But, since I use them in two different environment, it's not a big deal. Different keyboards for different purposes.

As far as my typing speed go, it's anywhere from 85-95 WPM. My personal best is 100 WPM :-). But, like someone said in another thread, it's just for bragging right or personal satisfaction than anything else. A very good keyboard typist once told me this:

- Don't use useless power
- Don't  hit hard, but try light touch
- Find a keyboard that fits your style

Personally, I don't rest my wrist when I type, but that just me, and I try to have my arms at a 90º angle as much as I can. The closer to the ground you keyboard is, the more negatively tilt it should be and vice versa. Otherwise, you'll experience pain sooner or later.

[IBI]

I just got my Abs M1 ...  I do like it, but I realized not as much as my Das.

Don't judge on initial impressions, use it for a month and then decide. If it's new it needs time to break in and you need time to get used to the switches.

[keyb_gr]

Personally, I don't rest my wrist when I type, but that just me,

Actually that's recommended. As I happened to read today (unfortunately I mislaid the link), it avoids stretching the hands into awkward positions; the should be moved by the stronger arm muscles. Makes sense.

I could use an arm rest here. (The forearms themselves seem about the safest part to rest during inactivity. Elbows and wrists apparently are somewhat sensitive.)

and I try to have my arms at a 90º angle as much as I can. The closer to the ground you keyboard is, the more negatively tilt it should be and vice versa. Otherwise, you'll experience pain sooner or later.

Yep. The wrist should basically be a straight extension of your arms. A classic upwards-tilted keyboard thus pretty much requires that your elbows are lower than your hands (which typically implies an angle of less than 90°, generally conssidered non-ideal). If this conflicts with chair height, your desk is too low. Then the tilt should be reduced, up to inversion if necessary. If the chair ends up too high, some footrest may be needed. Those ergonomics are tricky!

[patrickgeekhack]

Actually that's recommended. As I happened to read today (unfortunately I mislaid the link), it avoids stretching the hands into awkward positions; the should be moved by the stronger arm muscles. Makes sense.

I could use an arm rest here. (The forearms themselves seem about the safest part to rest during inactivity. Elbows and wrists apparently are somewhat sensitive.)

Yep. The wrist should basically be a straight extension of your arms. A classic upwards-tilted keyboard thus pretty much requires that your elbows are lower than your hands (which typically implies an angle of less than 90°, generally conssidered non-ideal). If this conflicts with chair height, your desk is too low. Then the tilt should be reduced, up to inversion if necessary. If the chair ends up too high, some footrest may be needed. Those ergonomics are tricky!

You're right, ergonomics can be tricky. This is why I think it's better to pay attention to good practice before speed. Over the years, I've developed some bad habits which are virtually impossible for me to get rid of. For example, I don't use the right shift and control keys at all. CTRL+C and CTRL+V would have been more comfortable. The more one focuses on speed at the beginning the higher the risks of developing and retaining bad habits. There are times when I say to myself that I should slow down my pace and think about doing it right.

[ch_123]

ok, that's kind of what I thought.  I may just stick with the DAS as I quite like it.  How does the key weight on a model M compare?  Roughly how many grams for a keystroke on one of those?  

I don't know what the force of a Black Alps switch is in grams, but from using both, I'd say that the Model M is somewhat stiffer, but with the Alps, they're really stiff just at the top of the keypress, which makes it feel rather clunky to type on. In the Model M, the stiffness is further down, and it feels much smoother. The Alps are usuable, but I find they slow me down. Gaming-wise, the Model M is perfectly usable.

[IBI]

Make sure to specify which type of alps you're talking about - the black ones in the M1 have a quite different spring to the black ones in the AT102W for example.

[MR.B0y]

Don't even consider the ABS, mine is only 2 months old and the paint is already wearing of the keys. Complete piece of SH**!. I have older cheaper keyboards and they paint is not even showing signs of wear. Please consider this if your reading and trying to decide on a keyboard. It is not worth it.