Which Topre board to get

[mozaiq]

Hi,

so the NovaTouch somehow got me infected with Topre. I'm still not entirely sure how I should feel about Topre switches but typing feels really good. Originally I thought that the question was to Topre or not to Topre, but the NovaTouch convinced me that the question is which Topre instead. Of course I could just stick with this board but I fell in love with that green Topre keyset some time ago and of course I'm looking for a reason to buy it as well
So I somehow narrowed it down to the Realforce models. But I'm not sure which weighting to get. Every time I switch to the NovaTouch from my board with Cherry MX red switches I realize how much I like that thock and the feedback Topre switches provide. If I switch back to my reds I realize how much I like the light touch of the reds, which definitely feel much lighter to me than 45g Topre. So this is where I'm stuck. I know that there are 30g Topres available but I'm not sure whether this would somehow kill at least parts of feedback feeling. I didn't manage to find much information about it, but some people claim that 30g Topres feel mushy. On the other hand many say 55g is even better than 45g in terms of feedback so I'm tempted here as well but then again, 45g already feel slightly tiring to me. And I guess a (factory) silenced board feels different again. So far I thought about getting a variable weighted one so that I have all Topre switches in one board. If I realize that I prefer one wight over the overs I could sell it and get the board I like. Do you think this plan could work out? What slightly bothers me is the fact that I'm tend to primarily use my middle and index fingers to press the keys, so I'm not sure whether the variable weighting will be a good thing.
And then there's still the question of silenced vs unsilenced left. I guess they somehow differ in feel, but is it possible to describe how they differ? I don't think that Topres are overly loud but the silenced version is still tempting to me.

[dante]

There are a billion threads on this; Use the search function.

[Hypersphere]

After trying many keyboards with different form factors, layouts, switch types, and keycap varieties, here are my own favorites:

Form factor: 60% or TKL.

Layout: ANSI + Mac/HHKB.

Switch: Topre 55 > Topre 45; IBM capacitive buckling spring (Model F).

Keycaps: Dye-sub PBT.

Keyboards: RF 87ub 55g  ~ IBM F62 "Kishsaver" > RF 87ub 45b ~ HHKB Pro 2 ~ IBM Model F XT.

Silencing: I've tried the Type-S HHKB Pro 2 and didn't like it as well as the standard model. The RF boards are quieter than the HHKB Pro 2 and I felt no compelling need to get a silenced RF. The silenced RF is only available in a variable-weight; therefore, to get a silenced uniform-45g or uniform-55g would require two keyboards and doing a dome transplant -- this was not worth it for me.

[Ngt]

After trying many keyboards with different form factors, layouts, switch types, and keycap varieties, here are my own favorites:

Form factor: 60% or TKL.

Layout: ANSI + Mac/HHKB.

Switch: Topre 55 > Topre 45; IBM capacitive buckling spring (Model F).

Keycaps: Dye-sub PBT.

Keyboards: RF 87ub 55g  ~ IBM F62 "Kishsaver" > RF 87ub 45b ~ HHKB Pro 2 ~ IBM Model F XT.

Silencing: I've tried the Type-S HHKB Pro 2 and didn't like it as well as the standard model. The RF boards are quieter than the HHKB Pro 2 and I felt no compelling need to get a silenced RF. The silenced RF is only available in a variable-weight; therefore, to get a silenced uniform-45g or uniform-55g would require two keyboards and doing a dome transplant -- this was not worth it for me.

Can't you silence your RF using Spicebar's method that he used for the Novatouch? Here is the link : https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=65821.msg1540860#msg1540860

[Hyde]

Topre rubber gets softer after some use, so you'll get used to it.  45g feels heavy to me initially but after a while it start to feel a bit too light.

As for switch weight, personally I don't like variable because it feel inconsistent and the 35 domes feels mushy.

If I were you I'd stick to 45g Realforce.

Though have you consider the Leopold 660C Dye Sub version?  Those are pretty nice too and are 45g weighted.

[Hypersphere]

After trying many keyboards with different form factors, layouts, switch types, and keycap varieties, here are my own favorites:

Form factor: 60% or TKL.

Layout: ANSI + Mac/HHKB.

Switch: Topre 55 > Topre 45; IBM capacitive buckling spring (Model F).

Keycaps: Dye-sub PBT.

Keyboards: RF 87ub 55g  ~ IBM F62 "Kishsaver" > RF 87ub 45b ~ HHKB Pro 2 ~ IBM Model F XT.

Silencing: I've tried the Type-S HHKB Pro 2 and didn't like it as well as the standard model. The RF boards are quieter than the HHKB Pro 2 and I felt no compelling need to get a silenced RF. The silenced RF is only available in a variable-weight; therefore, to get a silenced uniform-45g or uniform-55g would require two keyboards and doing a dome transplant -- this was not worth it for me.

Can't you silence your RF using Spicebar's method that he used for the Novatouch? Here is the link : https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=65821.msg1540860#msg1540860

Yes, I suppose I could undertake a DIY silencing of my RF 87ub 55g, but it is quiet enough that I do not feel a compelling need to do a silencing mod.

[Heliosphere]

I own a 45g that was modified using Spicebar's method, but I really don't like the reduced travel. I'm not sure how thick the landing pads are that the previous owner used, but the travel is reduced enough that the tactility of the Topre switches is almost nonexistent. I'm attempting to sell the keyboard right now but I'll attempt to unmodify the keyboard if I can't sell it.


Edit: Reading the post linked, it seems that using a very thin pad won't alter the tactile feedback. I guess the previous owner used thicker pads.

[FrostyToast]

So here is my breakdown of all of the keyboards that I have read about and consider worthy of purchase:

RF UW 55:
The 55g switches are absolutely fantastic. Great thock to them and they make you think you're typing on a real machine. No detachable cable to me is a minus, but there are little canals you can run your cable through

FC660C:
This feels quite good and has everything that a keyboard could ever need.
The form factor, dedicated arrow keys and delete key make for a fantastic compromised travel companion.
The fact that you do need 2 left shift keys however would make replacing the keycaps for it quite difficult, even if you were to mod it with novatouch stems

These next following keyboards are boards that I do not own
HHKB:
A nice travel companion. Not quite as much functionality as the FC660C, but still quite good
This keyboard is not at all meant for gaming as you lose the bottom left keys which some do like using
The plastic backplate offers a somewhat softer "thock" compared to other boards with metal backplates (i.e RF or FC660C)
Unibody construction of the backplate with the housings of sliders means that you cannot mod the larger keys with nova stems (iirc)
This board will definitely satisfy one's superiority complex as with it you can condescend on others and scoff at them
FN keys are cool too and look best on the HHKB so I guess that is cool

TLDR: Get anything except the unmentioned Type Heaven

[mozaiq]

Thanks for you replies. Losing the tactility is something I definitely don't want. This is what defines a Topre switch to me. That's why I would be somewhat reluctant to do a silencing mod myself. Still I'm tempted to try out the stock silencing.
Regarding the Leopold, I definitely consider this board. The layout is imho one of the bests available. If I decided to stick to 45g uniform this could be my board of choice.
The Typeheaven is out already. I've read too many reviews that say "it's okay, but not more". Since I have ship whatever board I get to Germany the advantage in pricing also quickly diminishes. Also I don't want a HHKB. I really like 60% boards, but the HHKB's layout just isn't my cup of tea.

[Veridis]

45g may feel a bit light at the start of the day, but after 8 hours at the office they start to feel heavy!

[Puddsy]

I quite like my RF 45g.

[spiceBar]

Thanks for you replies. Losing the tactility is something I definitely don't want. This is what defines a Topre switch to me. That's why I would be somewhat reluctant to do a silencing mod myself. Still I'm tempted to try out the stock silencing.
Regarding the Leopold, I definitely consider this board. The layout is imho one of the bests available. If I decided to stick to 45g uniform this could be my board of choice.
The Typeheaven is out already. I've read too many reviews that say "it's okay, but not more". Since I have ship whatever board I get to Germany the advantage in pricing also quickly diminishes. Also I don't want a HHKB. I really like 60% boards, but the HHKB's layout just isn't my cup of tea.

BREAKING NEWS......BREAKING NEWS......BREAKING NEWS......BREAKING NEWS......

YOU DON'T LOSE THE TACTILITY WHEN YOU DO A SILENCING MOD ON TOPRE. THOSE DAYS ARE OVER:
  https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=65853.msg1540901#msg1540901

Read this carefully, and don't forget to read the post I'm linking to as well.

[ablooga]

i don't think a novatouch is a good representation of topre experience.
the novatouch seems kinda like a huge nerf compared to a realforce.
only thing it has for it as a topre board is the chery mx stems.
otherwise you'd save a few bucks buying a type heaven.
Also topre switches seem to stiffen overtime.
i have a type heaven and well as a topre realforce high pro
bought em both around the same time. over a year ago
at first they had similar actuation force. but over time after extensive use on my type heaven, and my hi pro which i haven't even taken out to fully use.
the type heaven is quite heavy now. about 20g more than my hi pro

[skuko]

to be completely honest, i prefer the FC660C to the 55g RF. can't put my finger on what exactly makes me prefer it, but i think it has something to do with the smaller plate on the leopold, it has more thock and i prefer the lighter switch as well.

[Topper]

To me the 55g RF feels too heavy, its nice for short stints though. 51g would be optimal imo. The only other Topre I know is the HHKB (Type-S) and I fell in love with the layout. Once you get used to it, it is very comfortable because all the keys are so easy to reach and switching to the mouse is so much faster. Every time I'm forced to go back to a standard layout now, my appreciation for the HHKB grows even more and I can't wait to get back. Only thing that really is sub optimal are the Fn keys, though I will say that I still got used to them and they don't bother much. Though if you use Fn in 3-way key combos, a remap will be necessary.

[atlas3686]

This topic has been discussed a lot but for me 55g Realforce is the way to go, if you think a 60% will be ok for you then I would also consider a HHKB Type-s. If you know you prefer lighter switches then go with the 45g Realforce / Type-s.