it is coming... SA RETRO!

[Elrick]

I agree with you guys, but it depends who will do logistics. If it's on me or (hopefully) BunnyLake I need to keep them contained. If it's PMK who cares

Please bare in mind that Bunny has a child coming in the next few weeks hence would it be right to force him into another Key-set Group Buy and Distribution Job?

[Matt3o]

No R3 1.75 stepped Control in Pro Mods?

if you insist

I agree with you guys, but it depends who will do logistics. If it's on me or (hopefully) BunnyLake I need to keep them contained. If it's PMK who cares

Please bare in mind that Bunny has a child coming in the next few weeks hence would it be right to force him into another Key-set Group Buy and Distribution Job?

We talked lengthily the other day and we are both excited to start the collaboration. AFAIK there's still quite some time before the newborn. Also SA retro could start as soon as next week!

[rickyhobby]

Awesome.  I'm definitely on board with this.  Since this is a C64 themed kit, I'm going for the grey true retro.  And probably several child kits. 


This may be a bit late, but since this is a C64 themed kit what about (think TKL board) all brown alphas, modifiers, and F row along with all grey print screen, scroll lock, run stop, ins, del home, end, pgup, pgdn, arrows?  This would mimic the color layout of the C64 with it's all brown on the left, and all grey F keys on the right.

[Matt3o]

Awesome.  I'm definitely on board with this.  Since this is a C64 themed kit, I'm going for the grey true retro.  And probably several child kits. 


This may be a bit late, but since this is a C64 themed kit what about (think TKL board) all brown alphas, modifiers, and F row along with all grey print screen, scroll lock, run stop, ins, del home, end, pgup, pgdn, arrows?  This would mimic the color layout of the C64 with it's all brown on the left, and all grey F keys on the right.

that's actually a nice idea!

[Elrick]

We talked lengthily the other day and we are both excited to start the collaboration. AFAIK there's still quite some time before the newborn. Also SA retro could start as soon as next week!

BEAUTIFUL  .  SA Retro coming down NEXT WEEK, what more could a Geekhacker ever want here at this place  .

I've hand restless nights next to the Mrs and she was worried about me, but in reality I have been lusting after these Retros despite my evil wet-dreams getting all of my attention  .

[rickyhobby]

I agree with you guys, but it depends who will do logistics. If it's on me or (hopefully) BunnyLake I need to keep them contained. If it's PMK who cares

Perhaps you are already in contact with Bunny, but he recently said that penumbra round 2 is "gonna be the last SP buy i ever do, thats not to say there may not be other ctrl alt buys with sp at some point, but itll be the last one i ever do"
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=51026.msg1689499#msg1689499
FYI

[Matt3o]

Updates



Don't worry guys I talked with Bunny, everything's fine. it's not 100% fixed yet, so we might still go GMK or MD, but I would prefer having Bunny handling this

[Elrick]

Updates

Show Image

Don't worry guys I talked with Bunny, everything's fine. it's not 100% fixed yet, so we might still go GMK or MD, but I would prefer having Bunny handling this

Now you mention GMK, and this suddenly goes into ORBIT as something truly SPECTACULAR.

Please stop doing this, suddenly I'm thinking it's a Sperical SA Key-set and now a 100% German Made one, you are a fvckin-sadist beyond belief.

Which ever way this falls into either countries molds, I shall be buying three of everything (excluding Ergodox).

[DanielT]

^^ I think he meant PMK not GMK, sorry Elrick:(

[Matt3o]

yes, sorry guys PMK...

[Eszett]

MD = www.massdrop.com
PMK = www.pimpmykeyboard.com

[Matt3o]

Colors

[Zebadule]

I'm really liking the new ErgoDox kit. It's visually interesting, and having only one set is better for price reasons.

There are a few punctuation keys on the side in the ErgoDox kit that seem a bit odd. Is it just that since they need to be produced for the base set, they're cheap enough that it doesn't matter?

[abjr]

What would you do for the last column of a 65%? (brownfox kit perhaps?)

I guess you could do ins/del, pgup/pgdn, or home/end for r1 and r2. There is a Fn key in the pro mods for r4, but what to do for r3 ... the r3 del from the pro mods I guess? Although if you used something else on r1 that throws it all off.

Edit: I'm blind.

[Matt3o]

What would you do for the last column of a 65%? (brownfox kit perhaps?)

I guess you could do ins/del, pgup/pgdn, or home/end for r1 and r2. There is a Fn key in the pro mods for r4, but what to do for r3 ... the r3 del from the pro mods I guess? Although if you used something else on r1 that throws it all off.

It's impossible to foresee all scenarios. Technically you'd need both pgup/pgdn and home/end in R3 and R4... or maybe I could just add a jolly key in R3

[rickyhobby]

I'm really liking the new ErgoDox kit. It's visually interesting, and having only one set is better for price reasons.

There are a few punctuation keys on the side in the ErgoDox kit that seem a bit odd. Is it just that since they need to be produced for the base set, they're cheap enough that it doesn't matter?

The 1.5 TAB and PIPE definitely seem out of place as having legends.  I'd say make those two legendless as all of the other non-alpha are legendless.  But keep the 1.5 "C=" commodore logo one!

[Matt3o]

There are a few punctuation keys on the side in the ErgoDox kit that seem a bit odd. Is it just that since they need to be produced for the base set, they're cheap enough that it doesn't matter?

sorry I missed your question.

they are part of the standard alpha kit, so they would be pretty inexpensive, same as tab and pipe. I wouldn't really know where to put them since ergodox is very personal, but it doesn't hurt having them I guess.

[Matt3o]

- added dvorak to colemak kit
- added stepped ctrl
- moved "super" to base kit
- removed OS kit
- merged UK with ISO kit

PLEASE review the Ergodox and the colemak+dvorak kits! I know nothing about them I need your feedback! You have 24h.

[jackiecanev2]

Are the mods and base kit still going to be sold together, or is that tbd based on distribution?

[Eszett]

@Matt3o Which font are you using?

[Matt3o]

when switching from R3 to R4 in the bottom row I introduced some errors here and there. I hope everything's fine now, but please help reviewing it!

@Matt3o Which font are you using?

standard SP (WYSE).

Are the mods and base kit still going to be sold together, or is that tbd based on distribution?

they will be very likely sold together, unless we go through PMK

[Eszett]

standard SP (WYSE).

Thanks, Matt3o. Another issue. In standard US-layout there is Y(row2) and Z(row4), and in german layout both keys change place: Y(row4) and Z(row2). Now I see in the DE-NO-SE Kit no Z(row2). Did you forget it, or am I blind? :-)

[Matt3o]

standard SP (WYSE).

Thanks, Matt3o. Another issue. In standard US-layout there is Y(row2) and Z(row4), and in german layout both keys change place: Y(row4) and Z(row2). Now I see in the DE-NO-SE Kit no Z(row2). Did you forget it, or am I blind? :-)

if you flip Z row-2, you get Z row-4! It's like magic

[Eszett]

Oh, alright then.*facepalm I am so stupid*

[Zebadule]

they are part of the standard alpha kit, so they would be pretty inexpensive, same as tab and pipe. I wouldn't really know where to put them since ergodox is very personal, but it doesn't hurt having them I guess.

Makes sense if it's cheap enough. I suppose it may make someone's day.

PLEASE review the Ergodox and the colemak+dvorak kits! I know nothing about them I need your feedback! You have 24h.

Colemak kit still checks out. I'm not a Dvorak typist, but I don't see anything wrong after a quick search.

I'd be tempted to do the following to the bottom row and thumb clusters for the ErgoDox:


I'm not sure if everyone would like my thumb cluster idea, but I really do think most ErgoDox users would like the R4 bottom row.

Edit: "its" to "it's"

[Matt3o]

I like your ergodox layout a lot. The R4 in the bottom row makes perfect sense. Not sure about the two R1 on top of the thumb clusters though. R1 is pretty tall.

[Zebadule]

I like your ergodox layout a lot. The R4 in the bottom row makes perfect sense. Not sure about the two R1 on top of the thumb clusters though. R1 is pretty tall.

I've always had a hard time pressing the top two, so the taller the better in my experience. Really though, I can just get a few blank kits to add the R1s, so it's probably safer to go with something less pronounced for the actual kit.

[Matt3o]

unfortunately I have no experience with ergodox, so I stand to what ergodox people suggest.

[Loligagger]

That profile layout looks good to me. Although separate blanks would also work.

[Matt3o]

I really can't come up with a sane layout for ergodox.

Maybe something like this

[Oobly]

Colors

Show Image

I still think even TBN is too light to match the original colour and TAA is the closest (could just be my eyes, though). Comparing existing DSA Retro pictures, none of them look dark enough, but I guess most people will be expecting this in TBN like the DSA sets. Sorry if it's just me, but please add your voice if you think so, too.

[Matt3o]

TBN is actually pretty dark, in my picture is against black so it pops up. If you put it on beige it looks pretty much like the first of your pictures.

I'll take a pic of TBN and TAA together

[Oobly]

TBN is actually pretty dark, in my picture is against black so it pops up. If you put it on beige it looks pretty much like the first of your pictures.

I'll take a pic of TBN and TAA together

Okay, great Would be awesome to see them against a beige background, but just side by side is also good. The mockups also look quite light, with the burgundy almost the same shade as the brown, whereas "in the plastic" it looks like there's more difference.

I don't mean to stir up negativity / controversy, I'm just a stickler for colour accuracy.... sorry.

For sure won't affect whether I buy the set or not, either, Retro SA is going to be legendary!

[Matt3o]

Took the picture on neutral gray

[Elrick]

I don't mean to stir up negativity / controversy, I'm just a stickler for colour accuracy.... sorry.

For sure won't affect whether I buy the set or not, either, Retro SA is going to be legendary!

Don't worry Matt3o is a designer hence colour accuracy is his number one goal when launching any Colour-way here on Geekhack  .

Because it's an SA profile, this will become LEGENDARY beyond anyone's expectations  .

[Matt3o]

I agree with Oobly that TBN is a pinch too light, but TAA is probably too dark. Also, looking at the actual keycaps they look slightly darker than the color chip. So my fear is that TAA would end up basically black.

The ideal would be a midway between the two, which we don't have (unless we pay for it)

[MAR82]

I agree with Oobly that TBN is a pinch too light, but TAA is probably too dark. Also, looking at the actual keycaps they look slightly darker than the color chip. So my fear is that TAA would end up basically black.

The ideal would be a midway between the two, which we don't have (unless we pay for it)

Yeah I think a mix of the two would look a lot better. But I'm happy with TBN, seeing how much I'm already going to be spending on all of these kits 

[Oobly]

I agree with Oobly that TBN is a pinch too light, but TAA is probably too dark. Also, looking at the actual keycaps they look slightly darker than the color chip. So my fear is that TAA would end up basically black.

The ideal would be a midway between the two, which we don't have (unless we pay for it)

Thanks for the pic!

I 100% agree with you. It should be kinda in between the two, but since there isn't a colour between I guess TBN is best since TAA is very dark. WCK and TAA together really does something to me, though.. love that combination.

Full contour SA profile Retro.... sigh... Best set ever! Thank you so much for running this, Matt3o!

I'm seeing this in my head with semi-matte SA profile and smiling from ear to ear:

[Matt3o]

I agree TAA+WCK is kinda horny

we may run a GB for that another time 

[Wilba]

I'm curious to know why there are two whites used for legends... I like the idea of a not-so-titanium white on the brown, but won't the brighter white on the green/grey/yellow look a bit inconsistent?

[Matt3o]

WCK looks brighter on dark colors. while lighter colors (yellow, gray and red) need a higher contrast legend (hence the pure white).

My educated guess is that they should look very close. It's a bit of an hazard, I admit. If it works it works very well, if it doesn't, it shouldn't be terribly annoying anyway.

[Data]

The small differences in the whites are lost in the caps' base colors.  The fonts aren't bold enough to see the white doubleshots like they appear in their color chips.  Any perception of shade matching or differential on the fonts will appear to be an effect caused by the base color.  In fact, even if they were exactly the same color from the same batch, the different base colors might appear to shift the font colors slightly, depending on the light.  It's an optical illusion.  I had a similar discussion with Muirium @ DT concerning 7-bit's Round 5a, and that was our conclusion at least.

Matt3o is on the right track here.

[Wilba]

Matt3o is on the right track here.

I never doubted that! Just curious to know how the sausage is made. 

[00zeRO]

So, I poke my head out for a little while, and look at what I miss...great job Matt3o! I am definitely looking forward to this set, fo reels! These would be awesome on my Phantom 1.

)

[rickyhobby]

I really love the theme of this set, thanks for organizing this!  For me, (D)SA Retro is all about C64 throwback.  While I was not around for the original DSA Retro, I was always bummed and confused that it had burgandy instead of grey (or yellow).  As a set, on it's own, it looks great, but is not reminiscent of the C64 to me.  Thanks for providing all of the grey options this time!  I'm sure many others will prefer the grey.

I would REALLY like to get an sculpted SA ergodox kit, however I find it to be too busy color-wise, and lacking color options.  In my opinion, Retro feels like it should be more simple, less flashy.  Is there any chance on making the ergodox kit more retro or perhaps with more options?

Here is what I would set mine up as if the options existed - Pure C64 Throwback:


I realize that ergodox is touchy in that too many options price it too high, then it doesn't sell, and too few options make it less desirable and it doesn't sell...

Thanks again,
Rick

[rickyhobby]

How about a TBN R2 1.5u "RESTORE" (to put in place of PIPE optionally)?

[Zebadule]

I really can't come up with a sane layout for ergodox.

Maybe something like this

Show Image

With an ErgoDox kit, you really have two options for the mod keys: single row with legends, or contoured blanks. Trying anything else will just be too limiting for a keyboard that has customizability at its core (and will probably drive you crazy).

Regarding the profile, going with your original idea, but with a R4 bottom is probably the safest route. I'll be getting a bunch of blanks with my kit, and can report back on doing the top thumb keys as R1 for future group buys. I believe that it will be more comfortable, but I'm a sample size of one, and I'd hate to influence the profile in a potentially controversial way on my preferences alone.

[Loligagger]

Blank ergo mods with R4 bottom row is probably the safest route. I'd also make the tab/pipe keys burgundy (even if they're blank). Maybe make a separate kit with legends like the granite buy?

[Matt3o]

I'm waiting for the quotation from SP...

[janvkn]

I agree with Oobly that TBN is a pinch too light, but TAA is probably too dark. Also, looking at the actual keycaps they look slightly darker than the color chip. So my fear is that TAA would end up basically black.

IIRC the Filco Doubleshot SA set is also in TAA color. It looks as good as black under most lighting, the brown only really comes out in direct sunlight.

Here are some shots of them on my Poker II: http://imgur.com/a/G8y8X



In direct sunlight it looks like this