Author Topic: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars: In Limbo/Unfulfillment  (Read 428180 times)

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Offline Willyc277

  • Posts: 373
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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1350 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:25:27 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.

Dude some members just lost several hundred bucks. Ivan ain't coming back. If he planned on ordering the kits or making amends he would have responded to Hoff by now.


Going to go start a group buy real quick, collect funds, then never deliver. People like you will make it waaay too easy.

Offline demik

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1351 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:25:55 »

This thread should be locked unless Ivan comes back. This isn't the spot to ****-fling unless it's at Ivan. If you have any ideas for something please post it to the thread over at site feedback.

Not trying to start a riot, but can we stop bumping this dead GB? If Ivan comes back he should be able to unlock it.
+1. If there is any update or relevant information someone has, they can share it with the mods, that can update us all on. Same goes for the other two GB threads.

Or.. you know... not? There isn't any "**** flinging" going on. Closing this will only look shady.

And no mods this isn't a "personal attack" against moz. I don't need another BS warning like the one I got the last I replied to him.

"there isn't any **** flinging"

lol.

How would closing it look shady? What's the point of keeping the GB open? I'm sure the mods can update the OP just like they did for sprit's posts. What's the point of people *****ing over and over and over while a handful of other pretend they are not getting robbed.

At the end of the day this GB is not moving forward since we have confirmation from GMK that this never even got submitted.

Why do you want to keep this open?

Why not? People are letting out their annoyance from the whole situation. They're giving their opinion and others are commenting on it. How is that **** flinging? Locking this isn't going to change anything so what's the point? Mor censorship?

This thread wasn't  about crying. It was about a GMK GB.

Again I'm not saying people can't be pissed or vent their frustration. Just at this point it's off topic and the attention should be directed at finding a solution not solely on whining.


More censorship? What censorship?
Alright bro. Whatever you say.
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline inanis

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1352 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:30:25 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.

Dude some members just lost several hundred bucks. Ivan ain't coming back. If he planned on ordering the kits or making amends he would have responded to Hoff by now.


Going to go start a group buy real quick, collect funds, then never deliver. People like you will make it waaay too easy.
I don't think he is saying Ivan is going to pull through and deliver, he is saying he didn't start out these buys with an intention to scam. I think that is a reasonable assumption. I would hope at this point no one is under the impression they still might get their order.

He is also pointing out that people are looking for revenge, not necessarily justice. Which in some cases, I think is true. Or at least people believe that revenge is a form of justice. Maybe it is, I dunno. But revenge isn't what I'm interested in, not in this case anyway.
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Offline flabbergast

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1353 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:33:38 »
Dude some members just lost several hundred bucks. Ivan ain't coming back. If he planned on ordering the kits or making amends he would have responded to Hoff by now.
Yes. He doesn't communicate. That's bad. But reading the stuff in this and the other three threads would definitely not make me want to come back and explain some possibly very personal stuff.

And I lost way more money to actual scumbags - car mechanics, insurance companies, several governments. If my money in the buy helped Ivan to cover some medical expenses, all the better.

EDIT:
Quote from: inanis
I don't think he is saying Ivan is going to pull through and deliver, he is saying he didn't start out these buys with an intention to scam. I think that is a reasonable assumption. I would hope at this point no one is under the impression they still might get their order.

He is also pointing out that people are looking for revenge, not necessarily justice. Which in some cases, I think is true. Or at least people believe that revenge is a form of justice. Maybe it is, I dunno. But revenge isn't what I'm interested in, not in this case anyway.
Exactly. Thanks.

Offline Lepidus

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1354 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:35:21 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.

Right, so nobody should do anything? You cant get your money back anyway, so just let him go away without any consequences? Its because of this behavior so many people come to this forum lately just to scam.
« Last Edit: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:36:54 by Lepidus »

Offline qwack

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1355 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:36:04 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

In any case that's what he has been doing after being asked details on his last buys by Hoff a week ago. If there really is a good reason behind all this he'd better come back and tell people what's happening instead of keeping everyone is the dark, which is pretty much the worst thing he can do right now.

Yes. He doesn't communicate. That's bad. But reading the stuff in this and the other three threads would definitely not make me want to come back and explain some possibly very personal stuff.

We've heard that before. "There are people with pitchforks on the internet, and I'm too afraid to post a message." Please. No one is asking him to explain very personal stuff, people just want to know what happened to the money he collected and the products he promised to deliver. And staying in the dark won't exactly calm down people.
« Last Edit: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:40:40 by qwack »

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Offline flabbergast

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1356 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:38:52 »
...so many people come to this forum lately just to scam.
Hmm... like who?

Offline appleonama

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1357 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:41:25 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.
lol...... if the guy needed money he could've taken out a loan.

Offline Baddy126

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1358 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:49:37 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.
lol...... if the guy needed money he could've taken out a loan.

Except... you have to pay back a loan + interest...

Offline romevi

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1359 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:55:36 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.
lol...... if the guy needed money he could've taken out a loan.

Except... you have to pay back a loan + interest...

I dunno; risk everyone's money and suffer extreme, life-altering consequences, or take out a loan with interest that seems a lot more reasonable in comparison?

Offline appleonama

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1360 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 15:59:25 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.
lol...... if the guy needed money he could've taken out a loan.

Except... you have to pay back a loan + interest...

ok? so its better to screw people than take a loan? lol   :blank:

Offline Halvar

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1361 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 16:25:55 »
Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.

While I agree with you on the speculation that Ivan didn't plan this as a scam from the beginning, this part that I quoted is bull****. Going to the police when something is stolen from you is considered "revenge" in your book?

The fact of the matter is that Ivan will get away with most of the money he's apparently stolen. When I say let's go to the police to at least make this as uncomfortable for him as possible, that means let's see that he doesn't get away without any consequences at all, because sueing him for the money in a civil court is not going to happen. We all know that nothing much will happen to him in the end anyway.
« Last Edit: Mon, 21 March 2016, 16:38:00 by Halvar »

Offline sambarugh

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1362 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 16:51:45 »
Yes. He doesn't communicate. That's bad. But reading the stuff in this and the other three threads would definitely not make me want to come back and explain some possibly very personal stuff.

And I lost way more money to actual scumbags - car mechanics, insurance companies, several governments. If my money in the buy helped Ivan to cover some medical expenses, all the better.

Wow the levels of nativity here are staggering. At this point Ivan is aware of the situation that is blowing up and still he choose not to respond. His silence is deafening.

Offline flabbergast

  • Posts: 234
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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1363 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 17:15:21 »
Wow the levels of nativity here are staggering. At this point Ivan is aware of the situation that is blowing up and still he choose not to respond. His silence is deafening.
I've seen my share of people like that (meaning choosing to do nothing under pressure). I do think that upping the pressure isn't going to accomplish anything. (EDIT: remove flame.)

Quote from: Halvar
Going to the police when something is stolen from you is considered "revenge" in your book?
Quote from: ShardZer0
This is about causing as much trouble for Nicholas as possible under the law, IMO.
« Last Edit: Mon, 21 March 2016, 17:17:12 by flabbergast »

Offline Pieminister

  • Posts: 178
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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1364 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 17:55:29 »
Guys I don't think that flabbergast is suggesting that he is happy just pissing money down the drain. He is simply trying to understand how an individual might have found himself in Ivan's situation. I think he is speculating that his original intention wasn't to scam people (otherwise why bother with all the hassle with the groups buys he had run so far - even as recently as PBT4), but that something out of his ability to cope happened and he saw an easy way out by stealing money.
That isn't to say that this excuses his actions, but it helps contextualise them, and personally it helps me keep a positive mental attitude. Even if it's just pure speculation, I prefer to believe he needed the money because his house burned down or something rather than because he spent it on drugs or something.
Understandibg peoples actions can also help us with managing risks in the future.
In any case, he owes us an explanation, but everyone deserves his day in court. Still, he shouldn't feel like he just 'got away with it' and so far his actions have shown a lack of insight and respect towards us and if he never shows up then I would not feel guilty if he were to experience the consequences of legal actions 

Offline romevi

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1365 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 18:05:05 »
I too am of the mindset that something emergent happened and he needed a great deal of money fast; probably something to do with his injury. If so, and this is just speculation, he thought he could "borrow" the money and pay for the GBs out of his pocket at a later date. Unfortunately, time's up and the GBs are long past overdue.
His track record doesn't paint him as a scammer, but these three outstanding buys are absolutely awful and don't bode well for future community-based runs.

I'm not giving him excuses; what he did was wrong. I guess that, since I've only the space bars invested, I'm in no rush and, quite honestly, would still carry on with the GB were Ivan to come out and explain himself, all the while planning to carry out the GBs.

But that's me and me alone.

Offline ShardZer0

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1366 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 18:06:40 »
Wow the levels of nativity here are staggering. At this point Ivan is aware of the situation that is blowing up and still he choose not to respond. His silence is deafening.
I've seen my share of people like that (meaning choosing to do nothing under pressure). I do think that upping the pressure isn't going to accomplish anything. (EDIT: remove flame.)

Quote from: Halvar
Going to the police when something is stolen from you is considered "revenge" in your book?
Quote from: ShardZer0
This is about causing as much trouble for Nicholas as possible under the law, IMO.

Ivan is that you?

Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1367 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 18:25:19 »
Wow the levels of nativity here are staggering. At this point Ivan is aware of the situation that is blowing up and still he choose not to respond. His silence is deafening.
I've seen my share of people like that (meaning choosing to do nothing under pressure). I do think that upping the pressure isn't going to accomplish anything. (EDIT: remove flame.)

Quote from: Halvar
Going to the police when something is stolen from you is considered "revenge" in your book?
Quote from: ShardZer0
This is about causing as much trouble for Nicholas as possible under the law, IMO.

Ivan is that you?

* suicidal_orange checks IP addresses

Not a chance!
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Offline balthaz4r

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1368 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:24:01 »
Tinfoil hat theory: Ivan got into a BMX accident and needed expensive surgery. He got desperate and Massdrop got to him. Massdrop offered him a buyout and a job in exchange for going AWOL. Massdrop will come to the rescue, taking over these GBs, and deliver the products that they already know people want, all for a reasonable fee.

FOLLOW THE MONEY


Offline livingspeedbump

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1369 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:26:44 »
Tinfoil hat theory: Ivan got into a BMX accident and needed expensive surgery. He got desperate and Massdrop got to him. Massdrop offered him a buyout and a job in exchange for going AWOL. Massdrop will come to the rescue, taking over these GBs, and deliver the products that they already know people want, all for a reasonable fee.

FOLLOW THE MONEY

Show Image


dumbest thing i've heard today.  :thumb:
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Offline calvinhousecat

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1370 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:37:16 »
I too am of the mindset that something emergent happened and he needed a great deal of money fast; probably something to do with his injury. If so, and this is just speculation, he thought he could "borrow" the money and pay for the GBs out of his pocket at a later date. Unfortunately, time's up and the GBs are long past overdue.
His track record doesn't paint him as a scammer, but these three outstanding buys are absolutely awful and don't bode well for future community-based runs.

I'm not giving him excuses; what he did was wrong. I guess that, since I've only the space bars invested, I'm in no rush and, quite honestly, would still carry on with the GB were Ivan to come out and explain himself, all the while planning to carry out the GBs.

But that's me and me alone.

Could be very plausible, like medical bills in America are super expensive. What if Ivan doesn't have health insurance?

Offline Lepidus

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1371 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:41:15 »
Tinfoil hat theory: Ivan got into a BMX accident and needed expensive surgery. He got desperate and Massdrop got to him. Massdrop offered him a buyout and a job in exchange for going AWOL. Massdrop will come to the rescue, taking over these GBs, and deliver the products that they already know people want, all for a reasonable fee.

FOLLOW THE MONEY

Show Image


Nice one. I also have mine:

Ivan was a nice happy guy with lots of keyboards, until one day he suffered a very serious bike accident. Later, at the hospital, the Doctor brought the bad news: His arm was broken in 30 different places and Ivan would never type properly again.
On the following days while in recovery, a hateful feeling grew inside Ivan. He was bitter. All those years, all those groupbuys, his mod status, all those nice keycaps... he would need to use an one handed Maltron keyboard that types like **** for the rest of his life.
No. If he cant type, nobody can.

Decided to get revenge, Ivan now intends to steal every keycap in the world.

Will we let him?
« Last Edit: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:43:22 by Lepidus »

Offline demik

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1372 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:42:27 »
Obama opened relationships with Cuba to stash Ivan in there for protection.

Now you can lock the thread. Mystery solved.
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline ideus

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1373 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:48:19 »
I suggest the interested parties to open a new thread for the sole purpose to collect evidence; this one now is a mix of stuff that adds nothing to the possible resolution or clarification of the issue.

Offline LXXXIX

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1374 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 19:49:55 »
Obama opened relationships with Cuba to stash Ivan in there for protection.

Now you can lock the thread. Mystery solved.

omg you triggered my censorship

 :'( :'( :'(

Offline Waateva

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1375 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 20:31:43 »
So what's up guys?
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Offline LunarisDream

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1376 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 20:34:57 »
Ivan comes back

"It was just a prank bro"

Offline ShardZer0

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1377 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 20:37:52 »
There is literally no excuse he could come up with that excuses stealing tens of thousands of dollars. No one cares if he "fell on hard times".

Offline demik

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1378 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 20:49:36 »
Obama opened relationships with Cuba to stash Ivan in there for protection.

Now you can lock the thread. Mystery solved.

omg you triggered my censorship

 :'( :'( :'(
Yawn
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline LXXXIX

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1379 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 21:03:47 »

Obama opened relationships with Cuba to stash Ivan in there for protection.

Now you can lock the thread. Mystery solved.

omg you triggered my censorship

 :'( :'( :'(
Yawn

That was the same reaction I had when you mentioned censorship.

RT though pm me examples. I'm still lost.

Offline demik

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1380 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 21:10:17 »

Obama opened relationships with Cuba to stash Ivan in there for protection.

Now you can lock the thread. Mystery solved.

omg you triggered my censorship

 :'( :'( :'(
Yawn

That was the same reaction I had when you mentioned censorship.

RT though pm me examples. I'm still lost.

k
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline swimmingbird

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1381 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 21:57:35 »
Alright the whole debate at the moment seems to be moving in a very unhelpful direction.

Everyone has an opinion about how group buys should be run, what should happen to the thread and so forth. I would however like to remind people on a view point that we all have in common - that Ivan should come forward and let everyone know what's happening

In hindsight I really should have worded things a little differently in my efforts to get everyone together and this reflects in what some people are saying. I'm even having people ask if I'm going to get their money back for them and stuff. I'd like to reiterate that I'm not anyone's lawyer and cannot guarantee anything.

I would like to say that my efforts are really concerned about getting information together and people unified in case something happens

I honestly cannot say what I think of the situation anymore - I am honestly split on whether this is just a big delay or if the caps are never coming and this is the last we see from Ivan.

Tensions are really high at the moment and understandably so - on one side there are a lot of people who have money riding on this and other group buys and on the other side we have people who are hesitant to blacklist or take action against Ivan, who for better or worse, is a fixture of the community.

At this point I have received responses from about 50 people - about half of those people I have contact info, paypal invoices and receipts from.


Offline ideus

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1382 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 22:09:04 »
Alright the whole debate at the moment seems to be moving in a very unhelpful direction.

Everyone has an opinion about how group buys should be run, what should happen to the thread and so forth. I would however like to remind people on a view point that we all have in common - that Ivan should come forward and let everyone know what's happening

In hindsight I really should have worded things a little differently in my efforts to get everyone together and this reflects in what some people are saying. I'm even having people ask if I'm going to get their money back for them and stuff. I'd like to reiterate that I'm not anyone's lawyer and cannot guarantee anything.

I would like to say that my efforts are really concerned about getting information together and people unified in case something happens

I honestly cannot say what I think of the situation anymore - I am honestly split on whether this is just a big delay or if the caps are never coming and this is the last we see from Ivan.

Tensions are really high at the moment and understandably so - on one side there are a lot of people who have money riding on this and other group buys and on the other side we have people who are hesitant to blacklist or take action against Ivan, who for better or worse, is a fixture of the community.

At this point I have received responses from about 50 people - about half of those people I have contact info, paypal invoices and receipts from.

For your own peace of mind, I suggest you to open a different thread to follow up the recollection of evidence, you do not have ownership of this one and by now it is populated with few comments that add value to your efforts to put something or someone together. In a new one, you can set the purpose, rules and more importantly the scope of your efforts to everyone to understand it properly.

Offline zhihuichan

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1383 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 23:00:03 »
How stupid who is still waiting for Ivan explain!

Franksnewliver posted the email  a week ago! Seven days ago!

Do we got any explain now? Uh?


When swimmingbrid try to do something for us also for himself, what your response?
WHY do you still believe in Ivan? How can you still believe in Ivan ?


Offline roostrc0gburn

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1384 on: Mon, 21 March 2016, 23:29:45 »
Alright the whole debate at the moment seems to be moving in a very unhelpful direction.

Everyone has an opinion about how group buys should be run, what should happen to the thread and so forth. I would however like to remind people on a view point that we all have in common - that Ivan should come forward and let everyone know what's happening

In hindsight I really should have worded things a little differently in my efforts to get everyone together and this reflects in what some people are saying. I'm even having people ask if I'm going to get their money back for them and stuff. I'd like to reiterate that I'm not anyone's lawyer and cannot guarantee anything.

I would like to say that my efforts are really concerned about getting information together and people unified in case something happens

I honestly cannot say what I think of the situation anymore - I am honestly split on whether this is just a big delay or if the caps are never coming and this is the last we see from Ivan.

Tensions are really high at the moment and understandably so - on one side there are a lot of people who have money riding on this and other group buys and on the other side we have people who are hesitant to blacklist or take action against Ivan, who for better or worse, is a fixture of the community.

At this point I have received responses from about 50 people - about half of those people I have contact info, paypal invoices and receipts from.

For your own peace of mind, I suggest you to open a different thread to follow up the recollection of evidence, you do not have ownership of this one and by now it is populated with few comments that add value to your efforts to put something or someone together. In a new one, you can set the purpose, rules and more importantly the scope of your efforts to everyone to understand it properly.

i agree. a link here would be helpful also

Offline sth

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1385 on: Tue, 22 March 2016, 01:23:39 »
There is literally no excuse he could come up with that excuses stealing tens of thousands of dollars. No one cares if he "fell on hard times".

11:48 -!- SmallFry [~SmallFry@unaffiliated/smallfry] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] ... rest in peace

Offline wodan

  • Posts: 551
Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1386 on: Tue, 22 March 2016, 12:30:12 »
Oh wow thank god I missed this GB. At least the organizer is US based right ?

I all the US people here should easily be able to report him to the police for fraud.
Has anyone done that ?

With all the community based GBs going on, it would be very interesting to see how this scenario is treated by the authorities.

Offline Baddy126

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1387 on: Tue, 22 March 2016, 19:24:22 »
I for one do not believe Ivan is a scammer as such. My impression is that he's run into some real life trouble (for which he may have used the GB funds, but maybe not - the only thing that is confirmed is that he did not place an order). If I were in his shoes and wanted to steal the money right from the start, I would go to ground as soon as I had the money.

Anyway, I am very disappointed (well not really surprised) that it's all pitchforks and lynching here now. And not about justice but about revenge ("lets make as much trouble as we can ..."). That's what we need now, right? RIGHT? Well grow up.
lol...... if the guy needed money he could've taken out a loan.

Except... you have to pay back a loan + interest...

I dunno; risk everyone's money and suffer extreme, life-altering consequences, or take out a loan with interest that seems a lot more reasonable in comparison?

What life-altering consequences will Ivan be charged with? I know nothing about the legal actions that can be taken against Ivan, (if there are any at all) but from reading the thread... It seems like people are thinking he's gonna get away with no consequences at all

Offline wodan

  • Posts: 551
Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1388 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 02:25:16 »
It's a textbook example for fraud. And it happened on the internet, every step is documented here. I mean IPs are recorded, payments were made electronically ...

And ... he took all your money without paying taxes ;) Maybe that's the worst part about it ... if he claims that money belongs to him, he better paid some taxes. Come on at least inform the IRS.

Offline livingspeedbump

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1389 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 10:02:09 »
It's a textbook example for fraud. And it happened on the internet, every step is documented here. I mean IPs are recorded, payments were made electronically ...

And ... he took all your money without paying taxes ;) Maybe that's the worst part about it ... if he claims that money belongs to him, he better paid some taxes. Come on at least inform the IRS.

The local law enforcement may not care. The local judge may not care. The IRS ****ing cares about every single penny and just loves going after people  :))
<- My Collection (so far)

Offline DanielT

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1390 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 10:35:42 »
I'd rather not inform IRS ... if they start looking at GB's ... :'(
Semnătura lu’ pește prăjit ....

Offline HoffmanMyster

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1391 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 10:53:56 »
I'd rather not inform IRS ... if they start looking at GB's ... :'(

Well normally (in *theory*), individuals don't make any (or at least not a whole lot of) money from group buys, they just act as the middle man and pay the actual supplier of caps. This is different because until he places an order, this is considered "income" as far as the IRS is concerned (stolen income, but that's a different thing). I am not an accountant, but this is my understanding - please correct me.

Offline ideus

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1392 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 10:56:48 »
I'd rather not inform IRS ... if they start looking at GB's ... :'(

Well normally (in *theory*), individuals don't make any (or at least not a whole lot of) money from group buys, they just act as the middle man and pay the actual supplier of caps. This is different because until he places an order, this is considered "income" as far as the IRS is concerned (stolen income, but that's a different thing). I am not an accountant, but this is my understanding - please correct me.


Very few, if any, accountants may be willing to pay hundreds for a keyboard,  :))

Offline HoffmanMyster

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1393 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 10:58:35 »
I'd rather not inform IRS ... if they start looking at GB's ... :'(

Well normally (in *theory*), individuals don't make any (or at least not a whole lot of) money from group buys, they just act as the middle man and pay the actual supplier of caps. This is different because until he places an order, this is considered "income" as far as the IRS is concerned (stolen income, but that's a different thing). I am not an accountant, but this is my understanding - please correct me.


Very few, if any, accountants may be willing to pay hundreds for a keyboard,  :))

Waateva is a tax accountant.  :P  If nothing else I'll just ask my sister, she's an accountant.  :)

Offline TBone

  • Posts: 216
Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1394 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 11:19:29 »
From my understanding, all Ivan has to do is put it on his tax forms as income. If he claims it and pays taxes, he won't get in any trouble. He should claim his gb fees too, but that's up to him. From my understanding, if a drug dealer records his income on his tax form and pays taxes, the IRS couldn't care less. So going there won't really do anything. GMK pays taxes and individual GB leaders should as well on any income - besides that, GB's seem pretty legitimate (Source: my tax understanding and speculation).

Offline MaNiFeX

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1395 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 11:44:17 »
I see a real lack of hype and lack of trust of the leader.  In the absence of Elrich, here's my first attempt at reviving the hype train:

When this set drops, people will be all like, "OMGz I NEED."  All praise to the leader of Miami Nights, some of us still keep the faith.

Show Image


I guess you're the kind of guy that was sipping ice tea wondering what the commotion was when the titanic went down

...I'm with the band  :)

Beat me to it.   :))  But we're still dead.   :(

Offline beehatch

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1396 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 12:47:24 »
From my understanding, all Ivan has to do is put it on his tax forms as income. If he claims it and pays taxes, he won't get in any trouble. He should claim his gb fees too, but that's up to him. From my understanding, if a drug dealer records his income on his tax form and pays taxes, the IRS couldn't care less. So going there won't really do anything. GMK pays taxes and individual GB leaders should as well on any income - besides that, GB's seem pretty legitimate (Source: my tax understanding and speculation).

That cannot be right at all...

Offline demik

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1397 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 12:54:55 »
From my understanding, all Ivan has to do is put it on his tax forms as income. If he claims it and pays taxes, he won't get in any trouble. He should claim his gb fees too, but that's up to him. From my understanding, if a drug dealer records his income on his tax form and pays taxes, the IRS couldn't care less. So going there won't really do anything. GMK pays taxes and individual GB leaders should as well on any income - besides that, GB's seem pretty legitimate (Source: my tax understanding and speculation).
If any of this were true, money laundry wouldn't be a crime.

But it is. Drug dealers filing taxes lol
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline TBone

  • Posts: 216
Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1398 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 13:02:24 »
From my understanding, all Ivan has to do is put it on his tax forms as income. If he claims it and pays taxes, he won't get in any trouble. He should claim his gb fees too, but that's up to him. From my understanding, if a drug dealer records his income on his tax form and pays taxes, the IRS couldn't care less. So going there won't really do anything. GMK pays taxes and individual GB leaders should as well on any income - besides that, GB's seem pretty legitimate (Source: my tax understanding and speculation).
If any of this were true, money laundry wouldn't be a crime.

But it is. Drug dealers filing taxes lol


From my understanding, all Ivan has to do is put it on his tax forms as income. If he claims it and pays taxes, he won't get in any trouble. He should claim his gb fees too, but that's up to him. From my understanding, if a drug dealer records his income on his tax form and pays taxes, the IRS couldn't care less. So going there won't really do anything. GMK pays taxes and individual GB leaders should as well on any income - besides that, GB's seem pretty legitimate (Source: my tax understanding and speculation).

That cannot be right at all...

These crimes are still crimes, but the IRS are not the ones that handle it. They might turn it over to another agency, and do quite often, who then prosecute the individual. But I was just responding to if the IRS cared about this.

EDIT: This will clear things, up, it's still messed up, but the IRS don't care. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_of_illegal_income_in_the_United_States
« Last Edit: Wed, 23 March 2016, 13:04:07 by TBone »

Offline Waateva

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Re: GMK 'Miami Nights' + CMYKv2 + spacebars
« Reply #1399 on: Wed, 23 March 2016, 13:04:18 »
I'd rather not inform IRS ... if they start looking at GB's ... :'(

Well normally (in *theory*), individuals don't make any (or at least not a whole lot of) money from group buys, they just act as the middle man and pay the actual supplier of caps. This is different because until he places an order, this is considered "income" as far as the IRS is concerned (stolen income, but that's a different thing). I am not an accountant, but this is my understanding - please correct me.

Pretty much any payments you receive are considered income, however, you can usually write those off against the expenses.  So if Ivan received a total of $30,000 from the GB participants and paid GMK $29,500, he would've only showed a profit of $500 and therefore would've only had to report that amount on his taxes.  Now, since I don't think a lot of people in the keyboard community consider this their job and have no profit motive, it would just be considered hobby income and you would just report what you received netted against your material cost and that also avoids having to pay self-employment tax on that income.

In this case, if he took the money but didn't pay the vendor, Ivan should be reporting all of that money on this tax return as income, albeit probably not self-employment income because he probably isn't in the "business" of ripping people off and taking their money.  Either way, he would have a rather substantial amount to report (I don't know the total amount he received but I would imagine it is probably in the tens of thousands of dollars) because any money received illegally, be it from selling drugs or from stealing or from defrauding people, is required by IRS law to be reported which is how they often nab drug dealers and other people involved in criminal activity.  The IRS usually does a reverse audit in these situations, where they say you reported maybe $20,000 of income on your tax return but you have a house that is paid for and multiple cars, so prove to us how you are able to pay for those things and if you can't prove it, they nail you with tax evasion.

From my understanding, all Ivan has to do is put it on his tax forms as income. If he claims it and pays taxes, he won't get in any trouble. He should claim his gb fees too, but that's up to him. From my understanding, if a drug dealer records his income on his tax form and pays taxes, the IRS couldn't care less. So going there won't really do anything. GMK pays taxes and individual GB leaders should as well on any income - besides that, GB's seem pretty legitimate (Source: my tax understanding and speculation).

This is true in a sense, but I think about 35 years ago the IRS nailed a big drug dealer for tax evasion and he ended up getting away with it because he went back and amended all of the years in question by treating his drug dealing business as a legitimate business.  This means he wrote off trips to pick up the drugs, his costs for purchasing the drugs, and everything else associated with his illegal business then promptly paid the taxes owed.  Well, the IRS had to let it slide because of how he went about doing it, but they quickly added something to the tax code called IRC 280E that says:

"No deduction or credit shall be allowed for any amount paid or incurred during the taxable year in carrying on any trade or business if such trade or business (or the activities which comprise such trade or business) consists of trafficking in controlled substances (within the meaning of schedule I and II of the Controlled Substances Act) which is prohibited by Federal law or the law of any State in which such trade or business is conducted."

This is pretty much in regards to controlled substances so not all illegal activity is covered, but it has became a huge hurdle for places that have legalized marijuana now because they can only deduct their material costs but nothing else, so these companies are having to get very creative with their taxes to avoid paying taxes out the ass.

For other types of illegal activity, such as fraud and theft, there have been rules in place for many years preventing deductions of costs related to that illegal activity, but if you claim the whole amount you stole or defrauded people for, the IRS won't care because they just enforce tax laws and their powers end there.
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