Would Cherry MX switch tester give me an accurate impression? A couple questions

[macguy80]

I want to have one Cherry MX board in my collection and am REALLY curious about MX clears. I found blues too light, and I REALLY hate the high pitched click. I found blacks fatiguing, but I realized later that was probably because I was always bottoming out, which is natural on a linear switch. With clears I should be able to NOT bottom out, yes?

No local stores (Portland, OR metro area) have any clear boards.

I see that I can get a tester from WASD cheaply, which includes keycaps and even o-rings, so, much better than actuating a bare switch and trying to imagine typing on an actual key.

but given that it is one key per switch type, do you think I would get an accurate impression on whether or not I would find it fatiguing? Due to cerebral palsy, I only use a couple fingers on each hand, so at least I don't have 10 fingers to test

Bonus question: If I find I DO like clears, does anyone have an opinion on KUL ES87 vs WASD 87? I read that WASD can sometimes have ping issues, which I would want to avoid.

Thanks!

[julayyy]

I don't have any of those but I'm researching about this as well. Kul has cherry stabilizers while wasd uses costar. So that could be a deal breaker for you depending on what kind of stabilizers you like.

[inanis]

A switch tester will give you a general idea of what to expect, but nothing compares to typing on a full board. A lot of how a switch can feel and sound depends on how keyboard is constructed. But, you can get a feel for what you think. I have two switch testers and I have found benifits to having them.

As for KUL  vs WASD, I can tell you that my WASD  Code with Clears pings like a piano. If ping is something you want to avoid, I would avoid the WASD. I don't have any experience with the KUL.

[macguy80]

Thanks, inanis!

I will avoid WASD and go for the KUL. They seem to get good reviews, and I don't recall reading about any ping issues. Plus, I kinda like the looks of the KUL more than the WASD

[wlhlm]

As inanis  said, typing on a full keyboard differs from typing on a single switch.

There is the Ducky Shine 4 69 Edition Fire, which basically is the most expensive switch tester

[macguy80]

There is the Ducky Shine 4 69 Edition Fire, which basically is the most expensive switch tester

Yeah, that's overkill, I think

[unipsykal]

My switch tester didn't do me any good. I'm still trying to figure out what my perfect switch is, pressing one button repeatedly with the same finger didn't give me an idea of how it would feel like to do finger rolls. I ended up buying a few keyboards, tested them for a few weeks each, then sold the ones that didn't agree with my fingers.

[Oobly]

To be honest, I'd go straight out and get the KUL. Switch testers can help work out the general type of switch you MAY prefer, but they don't give an impression of what actually typing on a full board of the switch feels like.

I have the same problem with linears. Clears are the easiest MX type to not bottom out. The bump tells you when it's actuated and the spring force increases more near the bottom out point. What I find is that the tactile bump makes me stop pushing when it actuates, so even if I do bottom out, at least I'm not still mashing the key down.

[unipsykal]

To be honest, I'd go straight out and get the KUL. Switch testers can help work out the general type of switch you MAY prefer, but they don't give an impression of what actually typing on a full board of the switch feels like.

I have the same problem with linears. Clears are the easiest MX type to not bottom out. The bump tells you when it's actuated and the spring force increases more near the bottom out point. What I find is that the tactile bump makes me stop pushing when it actuates, so even if I do bottom out, at least I'm not still mashing the key down.

Would you say clears are your favorite switch?

[Oobly]

To be honest, I'd go straight out and get the KUL. Switch testers can help work out the general type of switch you MAY prefer, but they don't give an impression of what actually typing on a full board of the switch feels like.

I have the same problem with linears. Clears are the easiest MX type to not bottom out. The bump tells you when it's actuated and the spring force increases more near the bottom out point. What I find is that the tactile bump makes me stop pushing when it actuates, so even if I do bottom out, at least I'm not still mashing the key down.

Would you say clears are your favorite switch?

Yup, they're my favourite MX switch. I like them stock, but they become amazing when modded if you have the patience for it. I tend to use 62g springs, switch stickers and little rubber balls in the slider tubes to dampen the bottom out (for when it happens). Sometimes I'll also shave the sliders to make them smoother and add latex to the top housing to dampen the release sound. Perhaps a bit overboard (and lots of work to do), but the results are worth it IMHO.

You can reduce the ping on a WASD board by lubing the springs, using softer springs or dampening the plate.

[loki993]

To be honest, I'd go straight out and get the KUL. Switch testers can help work out the general type of switch you MAY prefer, but they don't give an impression of what actually typing on a full board of the switch feels like.

I have the same problem with linears. Clears are the easiest MX type to not bottom out. The bump tells you when it's actuated and the spring force increases more near the bottom out point. What I find is that the tactile bump makes me stop pushing when it actuates, so even if I do bottom out, at least I'm not still mashing the key down.

Would you say clears are your favorite switch?

Yup, they're my favourite MX switch. I like them stock, but they become amazing when modded if you have the patience for it. I tend to use 62g springs, switch stickers and little rubber balls in the slider tubes to dampen the bottom out (for when it happens). Sometimes I'll also shave the sliders to make them smoother and add latex to the top housing to dampen the release sound. Perhaps a bit overboard (and lots of work to do), but the results are worth it IMHO.

You can reduce the ping on a WASD board by lubing the springs, using softer springs or dampening the plate.

First off you can definitely bottom out with clears, I do. Second if you found blacks fatiguing I think you'll probably find clears even more so, they're stiffer.

Second yes modding them is an option but keep in mind 90 percent of the production keyboards out there have plate mounded switches and modding them isnt very easy. I fell into the same thing and Im left with 2 MX clear boards that I dont like very much until I get them modded.

[drewba]

A switch tester helped me narrow down the switches that I didn't want. It won't help give you an accurate impression of how a full keyboard will feel, unfortunately.

Even though the tester is an investment itself, I've gotten enough use & insight from it that I'm happy I spent the ~$15.

[Blaise170]

A switch tester helped me narrow down the switches that I didn't want. It won't help give you an accurate impression of how a full keyboard will feel, unfortunately.

Even though the tester is an investment itself, I've gotten enough use & insight from it that I'm happy I spent the ~$15.

It makes a nice desk toy for me, though soon I'll be making my own "sampler" keyboard. I have something like 55 different switches I can use so it should be interested. I'll need a plate that can support Alps+Cherry though.

[blcksqrrl]

Bad news, my first board was a KUL with clears and it pinged pretty badly. I ended up getting rid of it and getting the KUL with blues instead, which don't ping, at least for me.

[macguy80]

Bad news, my first board was a KUL with clears and it pinged pretty badly. I ended up getting rid of it and getting the KUL with blues instead, which don't ping, at least for me.

As with anything, I guess it's the luck of the draw no matter what you buy, but from what I've read/seen and some of the the responses here, ping seems at least a little more likely with WASD than KUL.

[demik]

gather up poop, type on it. you've got yourself some cherry switches

[Oobly]

gather up poop, type on it. you've got yourself some cherry switches

Ah, so that's how you became enlightened... Good to know.

[drewba]

A switch tester helped me narrow down the switches that I didn't want. It won't help give you an accurate impression of how a full keyboard will feel, unfortunately.

Even though the tester is an investment itself, I've gotten enough use & insight from it that I'm happy I spent the ~$15.

It makes a nice desk toy for me, though soon I'll be making my own "sampler" keyboard. I have something like 55 different switches I can use so it should be interested. I'll need a plate that can support Alps+Cherry though.

Nice desk toy indeed - I just put my artisan keys on there and mash on the MX blues/greens as a stress reliever.

The sampler sounds like a cool idea, I'd love to see a build log + pictures once you get started.

[rowdy]

FWIW Massdrop has the CM switch tester on sale at the moment:

https://www.massdrop.com/buy/cm-storm-cherry-mx-switch-tester?mode=guest_open

This would be one of the better switch testers, as it has a plate and a case.

Plus you can do neat things with it!

[macguy80]

Thanks rowdy! I'd go for it if I hadn't already ordered the WASD tester. It, too, has a case and a plate.

It may have cost a little more, but won't take a month to ship.

Thanks for turning me on to Massdrop, though. I never knew what the fuss was about, but I can see it now.

[robscomputer]

While I think the testers are great, they don't really help with the overall use of the switches. I can type for hours on Cherry Browns, my favorite switch but feel somewhat slower on Cherry Clears and Reds. Not sure why but I think it's due to the difference in "snap" where the Clears feel slightly duller, and the Reds don't have any snap so I bottom out.

Another issue is if the keys under your fingers are stiffer, think about the keys on your weaker fingers. Using Cherry Blacks for me didn't work well as reaching for the Esc and Backspace keys was on my pinkys, which took more force to press down. Honestly, it's going to be some learning less to find out which switch you really like, took me about three keyboards before I landed on Cherry Browns, and now have a benchmark to compare other keyboards.

[rowdy]

Thanks rowdy! I'd go for it if I hadn't already ordered the WASD tester. It, too, has a case and a plate.

It may have cost a little more, but won't take a month to ship.

Thanks for turning me on to Massdrop, though. I never knew what the fuss was about, but I can see it now.

Nothing wrong with having several testers - I have, er, 3 or 4 now, I think.

They make excellent display stands for artisan keycaps

Also: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48073.0

[macguy80]

Another issue is if the keys under your fingers are stiffer, think about the keys on your weaker fingers.

At least in my case, since I have cerebral palsy in both hands, my weaker fingers don't get used at all!  )

[macguy80]

So, my WASD tester arrived. I've learned two things:

1. Clears feel every bit as wonderful as I'd hoped. Definitely the switch for me. To my fingers, they actually feel very similar to the dampened white Alps (not cream) that are in my Apple Extended Keyboard II (1995, Made in Mexico), except that clears are slightly stiffer with slightly sharper tactility.

2. When I recommended a keyboard with blues for an elderly friend of mine, I was disappointed, though she was (and is) completely pleased, which is the most important thing. I thought blues were entirely too light, and I made typos quite frequently on it. Now, I still don't care for the high-pitched click, but if I were going to choose a clicky Cherry switch, it would definitely be greens. To sum greens up in a single sentence: Greens are what I had expected blues to feel like before I had ever typed on blues.

[ander]

I agree—the only way to know if a switch is right for you is to try a real KB of them, connected to a real computer.

Switches aren't just about how they feel as individual buttons. They're about how they actuate under your unique typing touch, using all of your fingers.

In my experience, these switch "testers" can do more harm than good by giving false impressions of how an actual KB will respond to you.

It's like those little individual sample cards you get at paint stores. Anyone who's painted a room knows the cards give you only the most general idea of how a color actually looks. You may think a sample is perfect—then you paint just a square foot or two and realize it's completely wrong. There's no substitute for the real thing.

[macguy80]

I agree—the only way to know if a switch is right for you is to try a real KB of them, connected to a real computer.

Oh, I completely agree, and your paint sample analogy is spot on. What I can say is that I am feeling adventurous enough to get a board with clears, if I don't get a Unicomp first.

[fknraiden]

If you want to check out different switches, you should come to the meet up we have.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=70335.msg1693838#msg1693838

[False_Dmitry_II]

I can tell you that a friend of my dad's has that. He had been typing on just random whatever, domes and such. After hearing that I was into mechanical keyboards, he asked me what he should get so that feedback would be higher than something like one of those. He got a Model M. Likes it alot. After that he got his work to get him something for use there, and IIRC it was some fake Alps with a blue looking switch. That one was bought new from somewhere. Likes that too.

[macguy80]

Yeah, I have lots of experience typing on Model M's. There'll be no buyer's remorse there.