Author Topic: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?  (Read 4539 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Hauksort

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: Havnegata 37, 9800 Norway
Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« on: Wed, 23 September 2015, 15:20:55 »
Hey!
First off, no clue where to put this, might be better under some sort of support section. (:
I have a CM Novatouch TKL that has a few 'broken' keys, since my cat spilled water on it a few months ago. The keys are the shift key, '<','z','x' and the escape key. I followed some steps of a recovery post Ripster re-posted on another forum. I cleaned the PCB but nothing else changed, the same keys are still not functional. Is there anything I can do to fix the keys somehow? No clue if it's the switch or the PCB or anything else really, considering I'm pretty new to this.
I have another keyboard, a Razer Black Widow Ultimate 2011 edition that I have as a spare keyboard.I honestly don't like the switches at all compared to the ones on the Novatouch, so I'd prefer to not use it at all.
If there is no way to fix the switches or the PCB on the Novatouch, is there any way to splice the keyboards somehow to at least make the Novatouch as functional as possible?

I really appreciate all answers, thanks in advance!

Edit; changed the title a little bit!
« Last Edit: Thu, 24 September 2015, 08:17:57 by Hauksort »

Offline rowdy

  • HHKB Hapster
  • * Erudite Elder
  • Posts: 21175
  • Location: melbourne.vic.au
  • Missed another sale.
Re: Some keys stopped working - splicing two keyboards/any fix?
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 23 September 2015, 21:55:07 »
Unfortunately Novatouch uses Topre switches and Razer uses probably Kailh switches (or Cherry, depending on its age) and they are completely incompatible.

I don't think I've heard of anyone spilling liquid on a keyboard with Topre switches before, hence little experience in how to clean one.

I'd guess that the contacts and everything would have to be super clean for the capacitative contacts to work, so you might have to disassemble and wipe the innards down with some sort of, maybe, rubbing alcohol.

But don't do that until someone else can chime in whether it is a good idea or not.  At least it might give you an idea what you might be down for.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline Hauksort

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: Havnegata 37, 9800 Norway
Re: Some keys stopped working - splicing two keyboards/any fix?
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 04:09:47 »
The Razer keyboard has Cherry MX Blue switches. Now that I've been using the Novatouch for so long I don't feel too good using these switches, they're so noisy and don't feel as good imo haha
If there's no way at all to fix the keys on the Novatouch I guess I'll get a Realforce when I can afford it.
I don't have an issue disassembling the Novatouch as I've done it a few times now without any issues.

Offline rowdy

  • HHKB Hapster
  • * Erudite Elder
  • Posts: 21175
  • Location: melbourne.vic.au
  • Missed another sale.
Re: Some keys stopped working - splicing two keyboards/any fix?
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 05:48:04 »
Unless you try thoroughly cleaning the contacts, and/or swapping some dome around, I don't think so.

But please wait and hopefully someone else with knowledge of the Novatouch will chime in.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline microsoft windows

  • Blue Troll of Death
  • * Exalted Elder
  • Posts: 3621
  • President of geekhack.org
    • Get Internet Explorer 6
Re: Some keys stopped working - splicing two keyboards/any fix?
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 05:50:18 »
THROW THE KEYBOARD AWAY. IT'S DEAD.
CLICK HERE!     OFFICIAL PRESIDENT OF GEEKHACK.ORG    MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN MERRY CHRISTMAS

Offline infiniti

  • I <3 KB
  • * Senior Moderator
  • Posts: 2405
  • Location: Thrilla, Manila, Philippines
  • Bob was here
    • PM me and ask for a custom title!
Re: Some keys stopped working - splicing two keyboards/any fix?
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 07:54:48 »
Moved this to the keyboards sub-forum for better visibility.

Offline Hauksort

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: Havnegata 37, 9800 Norway
Re: Some keys stopped working - splicing two keyboards/any fix?
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 08:15:52 »
THROW THE KEYBOARD AWAY. IT'S DEAD.

Haha, well it's definitely not dead, a few keys aren't functional. So that won't happen until I've managed to ruin it completely somehow!

Moved this to the keyboards sub-forum for better visibility.


Thank you!

Offline apolotary

  • Posts: 279
  • Location: Fukushima, Japan
  • Кто-нибудь купите мои клавиатуры ;__;
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 08:41:17 »
I would try doing this:

  • Get a contact cleaning liquid
  • Disassemble the board, clean up the affected contacts on PCB, clean up the springs and domes around it
  • Check PCB for any irregularities, or even better, clean around the places where you think the water might've gone through
  • Assemble it back and check if it works

Finally you could sell it for a discounted price and get a used Realforce instead

Offline saturnotaku

  • Posts: 680
  • Location: The 'burbs, IL USA
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 09:22:54 »
If cleaning the keyboard as apolotary suggested doesn't work, you could take the purple sliders out of the keyboard and sell them to someone here. You could easily recoup at least half of what you paid for the Novatouch in the first place.

Offline Giorgio

  • Posts: 1846
  • Location: Italy
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 14:17:22 »
Just pick a solder iron and replace a switch. Oh wait. :-X

Offline rowdy

  • HHKB Hapster
  • * Erudite Elder
  • Posts: 21175
  • Location: melbourne.vic.au
  • Missed another sale.
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 21:42:37 »
Just pick a solder iron and replace a switch. Oh wait. :-X

Yeah, Topre :))
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline ideus

  • * Exalted Elder
  • Posts: 8123
  • Location: In the middle of nowhere.
  • Björkö.
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 24 September 2015, 21:45:10 »
A Topre's acute illness?

Offline Sencha

  • HHKB Pro
  • Posts: 131
  • MX Reds <3
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 25 September 2015, 02:50:33 »
How did the cat get water near the keyboard? :D

Offline MJ45

  • HHKB Pro
  • Posts: 530
  • Location: Chicagoland
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 25 September 2015, 04:30:12 »
How did the cat get water near the keyboard? :D
Pee water??

Offline Hauksort

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: Havnegata 37, 9800 Norway
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 25 September 2015, 04:56:32 »
How did the cat get water near the keyboard? :D

Haha, I was stupid enough to leave a half full glass of water near the keyboard while at school. When I came back my mousemat was soaked and the glass was tipped over, so I immediately checked the keyboard for damage and dried it. For some reason she prefers my water over her own ):

How did the cat get water near the keyboard? :D
Pee water??

Err, not exactly haha

Edit; Cleaned the PCB and the keys are still not working.

As I'm living in Norway it probably wouldn't be worth selling the sliders considering the costs of shipping them etc. (?)
« Last Edit: Fri, 25 September 2015, 06:28:28 by Hauksort »

Offline keshley

  • Posts: 417
  • Location: Ohio
    • Blog n stuff
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 25 September 2015, 08:03:01 »
How did the cat get water near the keyboard? :D

Haha, I was stupid enough to leave a half full glass of water near the keyboard while at school. When I came back my mousemat was soaked and the glass was tipped over, so I immediately checked the keyboard for damage and dried it. For some reason she prefers my water over her own ):

How did the cat get water near the keyboard? :D
Pee water??

Err, not exactly haha

Edit; Cleaned the PCB and the keys are still not working.

As I'm living in Norway it probably wouldn't be worth selling the sliders considering the costs of shipping them etc. (?)

Our cat does the same thing. Drinks out of our cups instead of the water bowl if we let him.

I'm guessing something must have shorted then, maybe a digital potentiometer, as that's what registers key presses on a Topre board IIRC. A multimeter might be able to tell you if that's the case. I'm not sure how many the Novatouch has, but my HHKB has 5 or 6 of them as I recall. This Deskthority thread shows where they are on a Leopold FC660C if you want to see what they look like and try to test them on yours.

You can probably get away with shipping the sliders in a padded envelope, so I imagine the shipping wouldn't be too bad if you decide to go that route. I get stuff overseas this way all the time. If you do decide to sell the sliders, let me know :)
  
HHKB Pro 2       Pok3r

Offline Hauksort

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: Havnegata 37, 9800 Norway
Re: Novatouch - Some keys stopped working, any fix?
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 25 September 2015, 11:04:27 »
I honestly can't be bothered to see if anything has shorted, but it probably has. If I decide to sell the sliders I'll definitely let you know!  :)
I guess I'll have to keep on struggling without the keys, and who needs those keys anyway.. pffft