Apple's G3 hockey puck "mice"

[EverythingIBM]

The apple iMac G3 hockey puck mouse:

I don't think there are any mice that are more notorious (even old vintage equipment boasted of more ergonomy; but then again, I don't find vintage peripherals all that bad).

These are *OKAY* for children or hobbits, but other than that, I found it really hard to grip and manouver. It tends to be really clumsy, especially with that thick cord making it very sluggish. Think about it, the smaller the mouse, the more annoying the cord would become.

One weird thing about the ball inside the mouse is that it's actually in two coloured halves:


I can't understand that, because, it would significantly increase design costs to make the mouse ball into two seperate rubber halves. But fear not! Apple had a solution in order to compensate for their fancy mouse balls:


Yep, these 1998 iMac G3s were all assembled fully in china with no remorse. IBM had their mice during that time made in Thailand or places with higher quality control.
However, Apple seemed very proud of their parts being made in china, they didn't try to hide it... back then. But now, all of Apple's mice will say "DESIGNED in california" BUT "assembled in china":

Ah yes, as if the concepts being made in california add credibility to the parts being made in china. Frankly, I think it would be better if they were designed in china and assembled in california. But who am I to complain?

Many people praise the iMac G3 for introducing many new concepts that were "debated" very much, as the wikipedia page chants:
"Apple's move was considered ahead of its time and was hotly debated... both features that attracted debate"
Well I would 'debate' about using cheap techniques rather than giving customers full quality. Especially in 1998.

The handle at the back really annoyed me:

The heavy CRT outweights the flimsy plastic handle at the back. I'm surprised the "assembled in china, BUT, designed in california" handle didn't break off. It's very akward to carry.

However, using Apple's mice (the oval white ones) aren't all that bad. It turns out OSX was programmed to handle mice in a very austere way (with my experience anyways). When I used even my IBM mice on OSX, it couldn't detect rapid movement and would feebly wobble around in the middle not knowing what to do. On my thinkpad however, it ran like a dream actively dragging the window right to left no matter how fast I shook it side-to-side. Even the oval Apple mouse!

I often had to "lift and slide" any type of mouse when using OSX: I really can't stand that, mice shouldn't move more than an inch for the cursor to go from one edge to the screen from the other. Apple should at least predefine OSX with faster cursor speeds. Lifting and dragging a mouse all day could cause some wrist strain, that, and if you use an undersized circular mouse.

If you want to really get crazy, connect the G3 hockey puck mouse to OSX; it didn't work very well at all. Maybe others had better experience, but I certainly didn't think it was a good combination.

[hyperlinked]

The handle at the back really annoyed me:

Show Image

The heavy CRT outweights the flimsy plastic handle at the back. I'm surprised the "assembled in china, BUT, designed in california" handle didn't break off. It's very akward to carry.

We have a retired G3 iMac that I've had to lug around by the handle numerous times. It's not made of steel like old XT workstations, but I really don't think you could call the handle flimsy and I'm not sure if you'll ever find a CRT that's not awkward to carry around. Besides, if the handle irks you so much, why are you carrying it by the handle?

However, using Apple's mice (the oval white ones) aren't all that bad. It turns out OSX was programmed to handle mice in a very austere way (with my experience anyways). When I used even my IBM mice on OSX, it couldn't detect rapid movement and would feebly wobble around in the middle not knowing what to do. On my thinkpad however, it ran like a dream actively dragging the window right to left no matter how fast I shook it side-to-side. Even the oval Apple mouse!

 

There are few people who have any nostalgia for the puck mice. The size wasn't the biggest problem. For some people it's actually a feature. My wife has small hands and I couldn't convince her to ditch the crappy puck mouse when she was still using it.

The bigger problem was that because it was round, it became hard to tell which way it was pointing so if you'd accidentally grab it sideways and the mouse would move the wrong direction.

I often had to "lift and slide" any type of mouse when using OSX: I really can't stand that, mice shouldn't move more than an inch for the cursor to go from one edge to the screen from the other. Apple should at least predefine OSX with faster cursor speeds. Lifting and dragging a mouse all day could cause some wrist strain, that, and if you use an undersized circular mouse.

If you want to really get crazy, connect the G3 hockey puck mouse to OSX; it didn't work very well at all. Maybe others had better experience, but I certainly didn't think it was a good combination.

No thanks. I never owned one of those pucks myself, but I have plenty of bad memories of having to use them on other people's computers.

Anyway, I've always used non-Apple branded mice and other peripherals on OSX. I used to get accused of cheating because I had such good accuracy at headshots in Unreal Tournament. I did this on OS X and a PC mouse. I think your experience may be unique to that one mouse. It's a USB mouse. I don't see why a standard USB mouse would be so erratic on any computer of any make vs another.

[EverythingIBM]

Lessee, let me check the China Population Clock.  Yep.  19.63% of the world's population is Made In China.

Just thought I'd point that out.

My next door neighbor has one of those.  He asked for some help and I said, "I'm a PC, he's a Mac" and sent him down the street.

Okay, you got me there.

We have a retired G3 iMac that I've had to lug around by the handle numerous times. It's not made of steel like old XT workstations, but I really don't think you could call the handle flimsy and I'm not sure if you'll ever find a CRT that's not awkward to carry around. Besides, if the handle irks you so much, why are you carrying it by the handle?

There are few people who have any nostalgia for the puck mice. The size wasn't the biggest problem. For some people it's actually a feature. My wife has small hands and I couldn't convince her to ditch the crappy puck mouse when she was still using it.

The bigger problem was that because it was round, it became hard to tell which way it was pointing so if you'd accidentally grab it sideways and the mouse would move the wrong direction.

No thanks. I never owned one of those pucks myself, but I have plenty of bad memories of having to use them on other people's computers.

Anyway, I've always used non-Apple branded mice and other peripherals on OSX. I used to get accused of cheating because I had such good accuracy at headshots in Unreal Tournament. I did this on OS X and a PC mouse. I think your experience may be unique to that one mouse. It's a USB mouse. I don't see why a standard USB mouse would be so erratic on any computer of any make vs another.

The handle should have been placed in the CENTER of the iMac is what I was getting at (or at least a lip at the from and back). Not at the very back where it tips the screen down.
Apple so efficiently made it sphereical in shape that there are no corners to grapple. So, one usually has to resort to the handle.

As for OSX's mouse accuracy, there's just something about the detection which differs from: Windows, OS/2 warp, Linux, DOS etc.

[D-EJ915]

Actually the insides of the imacs are steel lol, it just has a fancy plastic coating

[hyperlinked]

The handle should have been placed in the CENTER of the iMac is what I was getting at (or at least a lip at the from and back). Not at the very back where it tips the screen down.
Apple so efficiently made it sphereical in shape that there are no corners to grapple. So, one usually has to resort to the handle.

Yeah, I agree that a handle placed more toward the front would have made it easier to move. I do remember feeling a bit nervous about accidentally setting it down hard and cracking the monitor.

On the other hand, while I'm no materials engineer, I'd gander that it's a lot easier to build in a handle solidly toward the back where the shape of the molding would lend structural support.

[hyperlinked]

Saw one of these at my kid's High School concert tonight running the mixing desk.

Show Image

I had one of those monitors for a while. It eventually developed an odd electrical problem that caused the monitor emit a loud crack followed by the picture shrinking and expanding for a brief moment.

Now that monitor was one that was really awkard to move around. The three legged base was kinda cool in that it allowed you to reclaim some of the footprint of the montior as desk space, but it meant you had this unstable claw like object that you couldn't use as a hand hold and you and to be careful with as to not get it snagged on something while you were moving it.

[EverythingIBM]

I had one of those monitors for a while. It eventually developed an odd electrical problem that caused the monitor emit a loud crack followed by the picture shrinking and expanding for a brief moment.

Now that monitor was one that was really awkard to move around. The three legged base was kinda cool in that it allowed you to reclaim some of the footprint of the montior as desk space, but it meant you had this unstable claw like object that you couldn't use as a hand hold and you and to be careful with as to not get it snagged on something while you were moving it.

That's too weird for me. I like plain beige or black.
Can you imagine an IBM CRT in "bondi blue" or "fire red"?


I don't like having equipment that is really rounded. Why? I lugged two of those CRTs down from 3 floors; they would have been difficult if they were rounded. Plus, I think things with edges (boxy) look more aesthetic.

I guess when the iMac G3s were released, all colorful plastics like that were popular, like the N64's "atomic green".

Actually the insides of the imacs are steel lol, it just has a fancy plastic coating

The steel is very miniscule. It's not steel PLATED (I've seen plenty of them, and staring at the monstrous capacitors all sloppily glued inside).

[ch_123]

The handle at the back really annoyed me:

Show Image

The heavy CRT outweights the flimsy plastic handle at the back. I'm surprised the "assembled in china, BUT, designed in california" handle didn't break off. It's very akward to carry.

After having to carry one for about 5-10 minutes yesterday, I definitely agree. I ended up having to kinda 'hug' it as I walked along because the handle was useless.

However, using Apple's mice (the oval white ones) aren't all that bad. It turns out OSX was programmed to handle mice in a very austere way (with my experience anyways). When I used even my IBM mice on OSX, it couldn't detect rapid movement and would feebly wobble around in the middle not knowing what to do. On my thinkpad however, it ran like a dream actively dragging the window right to left no matter how fast I shook it side-to-side. Even the oval Apple mouse!

When I plugged a standard Dell mouse into one, it started off only accepting the middle mouse button as the click. After some while it eventually decided to let me use any button for the job.

[itlnstln]

I use the handle on those to do bicep curls.

[D-EJ915]

carrying a crt with the tube to your chest is the easiest anyway since thats where the most weight is

[Specter_57]

..
...well...read this thread, and I see that others too have a love for the "iWipes" that I too feel....ha!

A more appropriate name should be "puke" mouse, *not* puck mouse.

...So  the G3 was innovative, was ahead of it's time...umm...well...G3s started using some standard components, such as IBMs were already using for years..such as PSUs...HDDs, ATA interface...but still...they were *Macs* in all the other ways that matter....
Guessing that's innovation, as defined in the Mac world.

...and the quote "I find a wheelbarrow most ergonomic."  yep as do I...in order to put Macs into an appropriate location...the curbside


(guess I'll be flamed for my commentary...oh...well....)

.........
Spec57

[ch_123]

I had one of those monitors for a while. It eventually developed an odd electrical problem that caused the monitor emit a loud crack followed by the picture shrinking and expanding for a brief moment.

That was also happening on the iMac I found. I guess it must be a pretty common problem.

Supposedly they've discovered that the latest iMac has kept up Apple's proud tradition of yellowing despite being made of aloomanum - which is a pretty amazing feat if you ask me.

[EverythingIBM]

That was also happening on the iMac I found. I guess it must be a pretty common problem.

Supposedly they've discovered that the latest iMac has kept up Apple's proud tradition of yellowing despite being made of aloomanum - which is a pretty amazing feat if you ask me.

You want to know why those CRTs have problems? Look at the components inside, they GLUED them together. And it's really sloppily done too. So when the glue gets old and cracks up, good bye capacitors. I'll try to take a picture of the capacitors inside one of those iMac G3s later; I've never seen a capacitor that big before.

As for the yellowing of macs; just cheap plastics and parts. But, they'd need a lot of flame retardants because, Macs get HOT. My hand got a bit burned by one of these "intel" macs:

The pathetic fan spins so slowly, and the ventillation isn't made properly (Apple released some update to make them spin faster).

And macbooks are fire hazards, they are officially stated by apple not to be used as laptops.

[ch_123]

Another thing about those things is that it had one of the most cringeworthy applications of Apple's 'i' obsession - the label on the bottom of the unit proudly stated -

'i WAS ASSEMBLED IN SINGAPORE'

And yes, the i was lower case. I wanted to cry after seeing it...

[sethstorm]

That's too weird for me. I like plain beige or black.
Can you imagine an IBM CRT in "bondi blue" or "fire red"?

Show Image

I don't like having equipment that is really rounded. Why? I lugged two of those CRTs down from 3 floors; they would have been difficult if they were rounded. Plus, I think things with edges (boxy) look more aesthetic.

Agreed.

You want to know why those CRTs have problems? Look at the components inside, they GLUED them together. And it's really sloppily done too. So when the glue gets old and cracks up, good bye capacitors. I'll try to take a picture of the capacitors inside one of those iMac G3s later; I've never seen a capacitor that big before.

As for the yellowing of macs; just cheap plastics and parts. But, they'd need a lot of flame retardants because, Macs get HOT. My hand got a bit burned by one of these "intel" macs:

Show Image

The pathetic fan spins so slowly, and the ventillation isn't made properly (Apple released some update to make them spin faster).

And macbooks are fire hazards, they are officially stated by apple not to be used as laptops.

One might as well just rework them to be large LCD monitors.  It's a shame that they use some of the best panel technology, but screw up making a good machine.

To be fair, the way that the Txxp (e.g. T42p/T43p/T60p) laptops have failed, I've nicknamed their video chipsets "OnFireGL".  If you don't push the graphics chipset, they're fine.

[Specter_57]

...

..Attention...all mouse users...here is yet another example of Mac innovation and advanced thinking.....

Think of the Kensigton ExpertMouse...or the CH DT225 Trackball...wow at least four (4) buttons to use....

and so...I present to you...the KENSINGTON TURBO MOUSE TRACKBALL FOR MAC 64100  ............

http://cgi.ebay.ca/KENSINGTON-TURBO-MOUSE-TRACKBALL-FOR-MAC-64100_W0QQitemZ120539880158QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMice?hash=item1c10bc9ade

................
Spec57

[EverythingIBM]

Agreed.



One might as well just rework them to be large LCD monitors.  It's a shame that they use some of the best panel technology, but screw up making a good machine.

To be fair, the way that the Txxp (e.g. T42p/T43p/T60p) laptops have failed, I've nicknamed their video chipsets "OnFireGL".  If you don't push the graphics chipset, they're fine.

I use 3D stuff for school on my T60p all the time, the graphics chipset works fine (even for 3D games). The T42 has a really good solid build in my opinion.

...

..Attention...all mouse users...here is yet another example of Mac innovation and advanced thinking.....

Think of the Kensigton ExpertMouse...or the CH DT225 Trackball...wow at least four (4) buttons to use....

and so...I present to you...the KENSINGTON TURBO MOUSE TRACKBALL FOR MAC 64100  ............

http://cgi.ebay.ca/KENSINGTON-TURBO-MOUSE-TRACKBALL-FOR-MAC-64100_W0QQitemZ120539880158QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMice?hash=item1c10bc9ade

That's more like a rat than a mouse.

[sethstorm]

I use 3D stuff for school on my T60p all the time, the graphics chipset works fine (even for 3D games). The T42 has a really good solid build in my opinion.



That's more like a rat than a mouse.

Just saying that as I've seen 80C-90C high load temps off the GPU and had 3 board replacements off the T42p.

The non-FireGL ones aren't as bad, but don't have the Flexview screen.

[EverythingIBM]

Just saying that as I've seen 80C-90C high load temps off the GPU and had 3 board replacements off the T42p.

The non-FireGL ones aren't as bad, but don't have the Flexview screen.

My T60p was running perfectly cool on FireGL. It's the intel CPU that gets warm if anything (and even so, I can run it perfectly fine on my lap -- in fact, the heat doesn't cause any discomfort; it's kind of nice in the winter actually).

I've already been using my T60p with fireGL on many 3D applications for a good some of years now. I didn't have to replace any boards; it runs great.

[hyperlinked]

...Attention...all mouse users...here is yet another example of Mac innovation and advanced thinking...I present to you...the KENSINGTON TURBO MOUSE TRACKBALL FOR MAC 64100
http://cgi.ebay.ca/KENSINGTON-TURBO-MOUSE-TRACKBALL-FOR-MAC-64100_W0QQitemZ120539880158QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMice?hash=item1c10bc9ade

I never understood why all the old Mac mice were one buttoners especially given that two button support was built in even in the OS 9.x days. Steve Jobs and his fanaticism for minimalism wasn't even behind it at that point.

You also have to remember that it was a totally different company at that time. One button mice were the least of their flaws and at that time you can't say it was a design decision based on style over substance because there was nothing stylish about the Macs of that era. Outside of the Sony Vaio PC, I can't remember anything that really looked cool around then, but my memory is spotty.

They weren't trying to market themselves as reinventers of anything at that point. They were too busy trying to beat the Pentium chip world to build PowerPC RISC chip based computers that outperformed in laboratory tests. Whether they succeeded at that game or not is a moot point because they were losing software vendors and marketshare left and right until they reinvented themselves with OS X and the iMac, kicking off their identity as a stylish tech company.

That version of Apple needed to beg Bill Gates to invest $150 million dollars in it so it could stay afloat and reinvent its way back to being a player. It was a company that was fighting to remain relevant and there were signs of its lack of relevance everywhere; the unimpressive peripherals market was just one of them.

It was a different company back then and you can probably say the same about just about any company on what they looked like before the Internet boom and after the Internet boom.

[EverythingIBM]

I never understood why all the old Mac mice were one buttoners especially given that two button support was built in even in the OS 9.x days. Steve Jobs and his fanaticism for minimalism wasn't even behind it at that point.

You also have to remember that it was a totally different company at that time. One button mice were the least of their flaws and at that time you can't say it was a design decision based on style over substance because there was nothing stylish about the Macs of that era. Outside of the Sony Vaio PC, I can't remember anything that really looked cool around then, but my memory is spotty.

They weren't trying to market themselves as reinventers of anything at that point. They were too busy trying to beat the Pentium chip world to build PowerPC RISC chip based computers that outperformed in laboratory tests. Whether they succeeded at that game or not is a moot point because they were losing software vendors and marketshare left and right until they reinvented themselves with OS X and the iMac, kicking off their identity as a stylish tech company.

That version of Apple needed to beg Bill Gates to invest $150 million dollars in it so it could stay afloat and reinvent its way back to being a player. It was a company that was fighting to remain relevant and there were signs of its lack of relevance everywhere; the unimpressive peripherals market was just one of them.

It was a different company back then and you can probably say the same about just about any company on what they looked like before the Internet boom and after the Internet boom.

Ask yourself this: why did Jobs incorporate the one button mouse on the macs, and not the NeXT computers? I think the one button mouse is a sad joke on users. Remember, all you have to do "is learn this:"

And holding control each time to right click is annoying (I was amused watching the "Myst" development videos, when they had to keep doing that for context menus). Yes the new apple mice can support two sided clicking; but it's not divided into two buttons, and there's no tactile feedback (I like tactile feedback). PLUS, you have to go into the settings and change it.

Speaking of tactile feedback, there should be some buckling spring mice.

[hyperlinked]

Ask yourself this: why did Jobs incorporate the one button mouse on the macs, and not the NeXT computers? I think the one button mouse is a sad joke on users. Remember, all you have to do "is learn this:"

Why would I ask that when I've already answered it as a funny nonsensical decision that I never understood? For a long time it was only a myth that you could only use a one button mouse on a Mac, but Apple not only didn't start putting out two button mice, they did nothing to even dispell the notion that you were locked into a one button mouse whilst continuing to offer multi-button support in each version of the OS.

The only thing I can think of is that it may have had to do with a belief that their target market segment would only get confused with a two button mouse and given their market segment at the time, there may be some truth to that. Those who are old enough may remember that different computing platforms had strong identities as a "gaming friendly system" or a "strictly business" system. If you mainly do spreadsheets and productivity, buy an IBM PC. Storing recipies, educational software, and home computing, go with an Apple. Graphics? Easy... Amiga. Music? Atari ST.

Why they carried on with it long after they lost their market segment and the association between platforms and primary use faded away is a mystery to me.

[sethstorm]

Ask yourself this: why did Jobs incorporate the one button mouse on the macs, and not the NeXT computers? I think the one button mouse is a sad joke on users. Remember, all you have to do "is learn this:"

Speaking of tactile feedback, there should be some buckling spring mice.

For that same reason, I'd wonder if Apple would also know what the sound of one hand clapping is.

As for buckling spring mice, the mechanism is a bit huge and requires a bit too much force.  Buckling spring trackballs on the other hand, might work.