Author Topic: Zealios V2 - opinions  (Read 6404 times)

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Offline killyou

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Zealios V2 - opinions
« on: Fri, 21 December 2018, 10:32:21 »
Hello. I would like to start a thread on Zealio v2 since it started shipping and some people already received it. Post your thoughts, experiments with different housings, springs etc.

Here is my experience so far with stock Zealio V2 67g:

Positives:

- Almost no wobble, great enhancement versus Zealio v1. I don't think this can get any better
- The sound is a little bit deeper
- Due to the above they feel and sound snappier
- This is subjective but they feel a little bit smoother
- They are a lot more tactile and not everyone might like that. I think version 1 should be revamped (get rid of the wobble, make it smoother) and should remain an option for medium tactility.

Negatives:
- Two switches were dead on arrival (tested 63 out of 70 on my 61 key Pok3r). One of them had a shorter leg and the other one had a shorter, crooked leg and shifted leaf inside
- Tactile bump was moved removing pre-travel but the actuation point unfortunately remained the same. That means you can overcome the tactile bump without activating the switch and you can deactivate the switch while pressed down without going back over the tactile bump.
- Not sure whether that can be categorized as negative, not for everyone perhaps, but the force to overcome the tactile bump has increased significally and that essentially negated the ability to not bottom out the switch.

Other changes:
- No pre-travel in comparison to version 1

All in all it feels premium and the experience is great but very different. Perhaps it should be named differently as this might not be the replacement for Zealio v1 for some people. I for one would welcome R12 of Zealio v1 with the aforementioned less wobble, deeper sound and better smoothness we get with Zealio v2. If you are ordering Zealio v2 consider getting a lighter version than the one you are used to since it feels heavier due to bigger bump.
« Last Edit: Fri, 21 December 2018, 10:35:58 by killyou »

Offline MonsterZero

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 21 December 2018, 10:42:16 »
Is there a force graph for these yet?
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Offline killyou

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 21 December 2018, 10:59:04 »
Is there a force graph for these yet?
I don't think so. Considering there was no official force graph for any of the v1 switches we probably will have to wait for Haata to step up and do it.

Offline MonsterZero

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 22 December 2018, 09:29:20 »
Is there a force graph for these yet?
I don't think so. Considering there was no official force graph for any of the v1 switches we probably will have to wait for Haata to step up and do it.

I'm sure Manofinterests will make one some day too!
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Offline Hypersphere

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 22 December 2018, 10:12:02 »
I agree it would be good to see force-displacement curves for both v.1 and v.2 switches. I am especially interested in the Zilent switches. I have v.1 67g Zilents in my Tokyo60. I like the switches, but they feel somewhat too light. However, I would be reluctant to go with the next higher value of 78g even in v.1 without more information.

Offline Marutks

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 22 December 2018, 13:39:27 »
I want to try Zealios V2.   I use 67g V1 Zealios but I would like them to have more tactility.
I wonder if V2 Zealios are similar to Holy Panda switches.

Offline Zeimus

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 22 December 2018, 15:39:57 »
Negatives:
- Two switches were dead on arrival (tested 63 out of 70 on my 61 key Pok3r). One of them had a shorter leg and the other one had a shorter, crooked leg and shifted leaf inside
- Tactile bump was moved removing pre-travel but the actuation point unfortunately remained the same. That means you can overcome the tactile bump without activating the switch and you can deactivate the switch while pressed down without going back over the tactile bump.
- Not sure whether that can be categorized as negative, not for everyone perhaps, but the force to overcome the tactile bump has increased significally and that essentially negated the ability to not bottom out the switch.

The fact about the bump and actuation is something I have noticed on some switches before and look to avoid it if possible.  V1 zealio don't have this issue as the tactile bump and actuation meet nicely i suppose.  But do you think that you could actually notice this issue from the v2 in daily use?  Perhaps only with a heavier spring and floating?

Offline killyou

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #7 on: Sat, 22 December 2018, 18:46:54 »
I want to try Zealios V2.   I use 67g V1 Zealios but I would like them to have more tactility.
I wonder if V2 Zealios are similar to Holy Panda switches.
I'm not familiar with Holy Pandas but v2 is much more tactile in comparison to v1. The only comparison I have is BOX Navies and Jades and it's up there.

The fact about the bump and actuation is something I have noticed on some switches before and look to avoid it if possible.  V1 zealio don't have this issue as the tactile bump and actuation meet nicely i suppose.  But do you think that you could actually notice this issue from the v2 in daily use?  Perhaps only with a heavier spring and floating?
While it's there I don't think this will be that big of a deal since the tactility forces you to bottom out, at least on 67g version.
« Last Edit: Sat, 22 December 2018, 18:48:32 by killyou »

Offline poodude

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 22 December 2018, 19:56:50 »
I have Zealios V2 in 67g weight and really like them. I highly suggest you lube the entire slider and spring ends. I used a thin coat of 3204 and it makes them even more smooth and gives a slight rounder bump. It also removed the spring ping and thockier sound to the key press.

Offline portbaron

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 23 December 2018, 00:33:12 »
My take:

-I put 67g v2 zilents in an 1800 today and they definitely feel different from v1's. Like everyone is saying, they have a big bump high up. It's not a sharp or scratchy bump like on box switches so I prefer the feel and sound of v2's over royals etc. It takes a little force to start, so you won't be accidentally pressing keys. When compared to topre I'm not sure how to explain the difference, but I like the v2's better (esp once lubed). They're snappier. With smooth high bumps it sounds like they should feel quite similar, but this isn't really the case to me. I'll be interested to see a force curve. Overall they feel solid and smooth with less wobble than v1s.

-Testing the switches without keycaps I could go past the bump without activating the key if I tried.
I cannot replicate this with keycaps on, however, where it seems to activate as soon as the bump is over even when typing slowly. So this is not an issue when typing. It is possible to double tap quickly without having to go back into the bump since the activation point is a fraction of a mm below it.

-I would recommend lubing springs and sliders on zealios/zilents as it improves the sound and feel noticeably IMO.

-I'd say these are the best silent switches available.

-I like them and got used to the initial resistance quickly, but I normally type on heavyish switches. If you preferred 62g zealios to the other weights in v1, v2's may not be for you. But if you are smooth, round, tactile person who doesn't tiptoe around the keyboard, you can't go wrong with these.

As a side note, I'd rate v2's above the Hako Royal frankenswitch which had a similar concept; strong tactility high up like a box royal, but with a rounder bump than the royal due to a thicker leaf/stem combo.


« Last Edit: Sun, 23 December 2018, 00:55:30 by portbaron »
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Offline Hypersphere

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 23 December 2018, 14:16:13 »
@portbaron: Thanks for the detailed write-up. I have 67g v1 Zilents in my Tokyo60. I found these a bit too light. I wrote to Henry at ZealPC, and he recommended the next higher grade, which is 78g. This seems like a big jump. From your descriptions, it looks as if I might find 78g in v2 too heavy. Although not the same as typing on a full-fledged keyboard, I might purchase a sample pack and test them in a switch tester. Alternatively, I could install some in my Tokyo60, given that it has a swappable PCB. In the meantime, if you have any recommendations, I would be interested in your thoughts.




Offline portbaron

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #11 on: Sun, 23 December 2018, 14:55:08 »
@portbaron: Thanks for the detailed write-up. I have 67g v1 Zilents in my Tokyo60. I found these a bit too light. I wrote to Henry at ZealPC, and he recommended the next higher grade, which is 78g. This seems like a big jump. From your descriptions, it looks as if I might find 78g in v2 too heavy. Although not the same as typing on a full-fledged keyboard, I might purchase a sample pack and test them in a switch tester. Alternatively, I could install some in my Tokyo60, given that it has a swappable PCB. In the meantime, if you have any recommendations, I would be interested in your thoughts.
The 78g  v1 is heavier, but not massively more than a 67g. Don't get hung up on the "11g" number difference, a lot of people prefer them. I have two boards with 78g v1's and they are very satisfying, and still lighter than mx clears.

I'd say get a few v1 78g and try them against a few v2 67g and v2 78g. Especially if you have hot swaps. The v2 is a totally different switch, and if you like the feel of the v1s they are still a totally viable option.
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Offline Zeimus

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #12 on: Sun, 23 December 2018, 16:10:18 »
...
-Testing the switches without keycaps I could go past the bump without activating the key if I tried.
I cannot replicate this with keycaps on, however, where it seems to activate as soon as the bump is over even when typing slowly. So this is not an issue when typing. It is possible to double tap quickly without having to go back into the bump since the activation point is a fraction of a mm below it.
...

Awesome! Thanks!  I will definitely try some of these if that is a non-issue.

@portbaron: Thanks for the detailed write-up. I have 67g v1 Zilents in my Tokyo60. I found these a bit too light. I wrote to Henry at ZealPC, and he recommended the next higher grade, which is 78g. This seems like a big jump. From your descriptions, it looks as if I might find 78g in v2 too heavy.


I find that 78g v1 don't feel as heavy as other switches at similar rating.  For the v1 the 78g almost felt less tactile than the lower weights.  Like portbaron said the 78g is like a light, satisfying mx clear.  I actually really like 78g v1 and want to try the v2 to compare myself.  Don't be afraid of 78g zealio!  :thumb:  But as the OP said perhaps the 67g v2 will feel heavier to you because of the bump change.  The 78g might feel cushier though.

Offline portbaron

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #13 on: Sun, 23 December 2018, 16:47:32 »
...
-Testing the switches without keycaps I could go past the bump without activating the key if I tried.
I cannot replicate this with keycaps on, however, where it seems to activate as soon as the bump is over even when typing slowly. So this is not an issue when typing. It is possible to double tap quickly without having to go back into the bump since the activation point is a fraction of a mm below it.
...

Awesome! Thanks!  I will definitely try some of these if that is a non-issue.

It's a result of the big bump at top. You can still type without bottoming out, but it's pretty much impossible in real typing to stop immediately after the bump but before the fraction of a mm where it activates. If you artificially press it slowly with 1 finger you can miss it if you try, but such light touch typing won't even clear the bump in the first place so it's irrelevant IMO.
« Last Edit: Sun, 23 December 2018, 16:50:18 by portbaron »
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Offline dream3

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #14 on: Sun, 30 December 2018, 18:29:42 »
Guys, I love my 67g v1, all I wanted was a bit more tactility.

Now with the V2, should I go with the 62g or the 65g?

Ideally I would want the weight to feel the same but get the extra pop from V2.

Offline montydrei

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #15 on: Mon, 31 December 2018, 14:13:56 »
I also love my 67g v1 Zilents a lot. I got the 67g v2 Zilents in the mail today, and I was only able to test a few switches on an actual keyboard (hooray for hotswap). They definitely feel heavier than the v1 switches. Once all the parts come in for my Lumina build, I'll be able to test a full keyboard with them.

My initial impressions, though? Maybe I should've gone 62g for v2 ...
« Last Edit: Mon, 31 December 2018, 14:15:31 by montydrei »

Offline Cavemann6

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 31 December 2018, 16:18:39 »
Just bought some v2 and healios, pretty excited to test it out :cool: I'll probably spring swap the v2s to korean 62g springs though
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Offline dream3

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #17 on: Wed, 02 January 2019, 08:30:32 »
Ok I am disappointed with the 67g V2 coming off of the 67g V1.

It doesnt feel like an improved v1 with more stability and more tactility but rather a completely different switch
« Last Edit: Wed, 02 January 2019, 19:31:23 by dream3 »

Offline Aerizu

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #18 on: Wed, 02 January 2019, 09:02:05 »
Guys, I love my 67g v1, all I wanted was a bit more tactility.

Now with the V2, should I go with the 62g or the 65g?

Ideally I would want the weight to feel the same but get the extra pop from V2.

Here's an opinion based on my experience: I really liked the 67g Zealio V1 variant, but when I switched to V2 I found that 65g felt better than the 67g.
I am using custom springs though (SPRiT 65g S, gold-plated), if that helps.

Offline Marutks

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #19 on: Wed, 02 January 2019, 09:59:30 »
does sprit spring change how zealio switch feels?    I have got some springs from SPRiT.
maybe V2 zealios need to be lubed....  I use 67g V1 zealios and I don't want heavier switches

Offline Aerizu

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #20 on: Wed, 02 January 2019, 19:02:32 »
does sprit spring change how zealio switch feels?    I have got some springs from SPRiT.
maybe V2 zealios need to be lubed....  I use 67g V1 zealios and I don't want heavier switches

Well, I can't really say because I don't have a stock 65g V2 at hand to compare them with (I ordered 62g and swapped the springs).
But I definitely recommend lubing them, including the stem and leaf contact points as they still feel very tactile after lubing.
I used GPL 103 for the springs, and then GPL 205 for the stem, leaf, and housing. They sound rather silent after lubing too!

Offline ArchDill

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #21 on: Wed, 02 January 2019, 19:16:58 »
I need to try the new Zealios and Holy Pandas...

55g Topre is still the tactile Overlord though

Offline eksuen@Drop

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #22 on: Wed, 02 January 2019, 20:06:22 »
I need to try the new Zealios and Holy Pandas...

55g Topre is still the tactile Overlord though

I used to like 55g Topre, but after getting used to the BKE Redux Light domes, I cannot go back. The 55g domes feel mushy and unresponsive now.

Offline phinix

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 05 January 2019, 13:55:11 »
Is there any Zealios switch that is like topre 55g?
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Offline menuhin

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #24 on: Sun, 06 January 2019, 06:00:07 »
Negatives:
...
- Tactile bump was moved removing pre-travel but the actuation point unfortunately remained the same. That means you can overcome the tactile bump without activating the switch and you can deactivate the switch while pressed down without going back over the tactile bump.
...

The fact about the bump and actuation is something I have noticed on some switches before and look to avoid it if possible.  V1 zealio don't have this issue as the tactile bump and actuation meet nicely i suppose.  But do you think that you could actually notice this issue from the v2 in daily use?  Perhaps only with a heavier spring and floating?

That sounds really bad...

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Offline Blasku

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #25 on: Wed, 09 January 2019, 06:03:34 »
Hi!
Decided to register because of the last post: as a new owner of a Zealio V2 67g keeb I built myself, i'd like to respectfully disagree and state that
it doesn't really...

What you must understand that this is how the V2 is different. Truth be told, I was also (unpleasantly) surprised how the new Zealio isn't an Ergo Clear variant anymore. Which is what I originally expected.

Maybe I'm just new to the world of very tactile switches, but the V2 is in fact so tactile that I think it would be unusable for anything else than typing text if it weren't for the lower actuation point. Imagine having to overcome that (otherwise very nice and rounded) bump each and every time you press an arrow key for browsing a webpage. Your fingers would get sore after hours of that.
But if you first overcome that bump, then you can repeatedly activate the switch by utilizing the lower actuation point without having to fully release the key.

Sadly, the actuation is so low, that there's hardly any travel left before bottoming out. So if I try to touch type like on my MX Clears or spring-modded Browns, a lot of keys don't even register! This switch forces you to bottom out. Which feels great because of the satisfying clack, but I wouldn't consider Zealio V2 any good for gaming because of this. MX Browns are much better for that in my opinion.
« Last Edit: Wed, 09 January 2019, 06:17:28 by Blasku »

Online Gati

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #26 on: Fri, 11 January 2019, 07:52:03 »
After spending not a whole lot of time with them, I can say that I prefer zealios v1 over the v2. I like the gradual lead up to the somewhat snappy experience of the v1, and in comparison the v2 feels like ‘if a zealio grew a tumor’. The experience takes away from actual typing and instead focuses on extreme tactility.

To me, it’s not pleasant and almost the entirety of the key press is just overcoming the bump, even at the lightest weighting (62g), it feels more fatiguing to type on than 67g v1s (maybe I have some nerve damage, but it’s more fatiguing than an 80g linear). I want to think that this is the result of the Holy Panda mania, that Zeal fell into the hype of ‘more tactility=better’ and that he didn’t consider the ‘why?’ of it

Personally, I hope he offers the v1s again; I’d certainly buy some.
« Last Edit: Fri, 11 January 2019, 08:29:12 by Gati »

Online pixelpusher

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #27 on: Fri, 11 January 2019, 08:38:24 »
After spending not a whole lot of time with them, I can say that I prefer zealios v1 over the v2. I like the gradual lead up to the somewhat snappy experience of the v1, and in comparison the v2 feels like ‘if a zealio grew a tumor’. The experience takes away from actual typing and instead focuses on extreme tactility.

To me, it’s not pleasant and almost the entirety of the key press is just overcoming the bump, even at the lightest weighting (62g), it feels more fatiguing to type on than 67g v1s (maybe I have some nerve damage, but it’s more fatiguing than an 80g linear). I want to think that this is the result of the Holy Panda mania, that Zeal fell into the hype of ‘more tactility=better’ and that he didn’t consider the ‘why?’ of it

Personally, I hope he offers the v1s again; I’d certainly buy some.

I agree.  I hope v1 makes a comeback at some point.  My 67g v1s are still my favorite switch to this day.  I do think lubing the v2 (67g) with tribosys 3204 makes it better.  Sill a bit too snappy, but it takes some of the harshness out of the bump.  I think this design is probably better on the zilents b/c the harsh bump is cushioned on the bottoming out. 
:)

Offline Hypersphere

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Re: Zealios V2 - opinions
« Reply #28 on: Wed, 23 January 2019, 08:31:33 »
I ordered a sample pack of Zeal switches to compare various v2 models with the v1 67g Zilents in my Tokyo60. The tactility in the v2 switches is certainly more pronounced than in the v1 switches, but I cannot decide which I prefer. Both types of switch could benefit from additional lubing.

However, at $1.00 per switch for v2 Zilents, I would prefer to buy a silenced Topre-switch keyboard, which provides silent operation and good tactility without spring/slider noise/friction.