Key Tronic - NEARLY as good as Topre/HHKB

[ch_123]

All this over a Keytronic...

Then again, we're all biased =P

[wellington1869]

All this over a Keytronic...

lol!

So the question is, who is blanket bombing us with dodgy info? Although the ripometer test is based on static force, I'm sure we can agree that the force that allows the switch to rise back above the actuation point should be lower than the manufacturer's claimed actuation force. If it is higher, then the manufacturer's claim must be inaccurate.

yes but for all we know keytronic measured downstroke force not notch-force. Their low numbers seem to suggest that anyway.
Or they simply f*cked up, who knows.

(*tho for $3, i wouldnt hold their feet to the fire. A $250 topre on the other hand, really shouldnt f*ck up publishing their figures, as they did f*ck up on the realforce 87U box

[wellington1869]

"Blanket bombing"?  I just think the Keytronics Marketing Manager thought it made for a pretty chart.  After the ABS M1, Logitech M15, Das Original, Clicky Ebay Specials you guys still trust the Marketing departments to "Do The Right Thing"?

I'm such a cynic.

you forgot to include topre and filco in that list ;-P

Then again, we're all biased =P

what ch said ;-P

[wellington1869]

my keytronic shipped! 2 days ahead of schedule. (actually 4 days behind the normal schedule, lol).  I wonder if they'll send it by pony.

[ch_123]

I am just jealous of this marvelous troll thread and want some of that action.

At the end of the day it may be a perfectly acceptable keyboard, but there's no way in hell that it's going to beat an IBM or even Cherry for ... anything?

It's like the Dell AT101W. It's a reasonably good keyboard, but it's so mediocre compared with alternatives on the market that no one around here bothers using one as their daily driver (or very few at least). The difference is that no one accuses us of being biased and having an agenda for calling it for what it is.

[wellington1869]

The keytronic 3600 has arrived -- and holy ****, it not half bad!!!!  From the first click (yea, it kinda clicks!) I was so impressed that I had to come straight to GH... and now that i've typed a few sentences on it, holy ****, its topre-like.  Honest. Holy ****.

its also I think the neatest rubber dome board i've ever used.  I've never used a keytronic ever before.

Let me digest these feelings for a bit, will post a real and more measured review soon as I can. But those are my initial impressions and I'm -- holy **** -- genuinely impressed -- and I have to say keytronics at least deserves this kind of attention and I understand why so many former keytronics users have chimed in on this thread.

Holy ****, guys, its different for sure.

[wellington1869]

in brief:  Is it "topre-like"? Holy ****, i fear that it may be!

-its 'thocky'. (wasnt the topre thocky? yes, it was!).
-incredibly smooth and tight downstroke (like the, er, topre)
-velvet landing. (er, like the topre).
-crisp as a potato chip (like the topre).

differences:
-$25 (vs $250). Yikes.
-keyTOPS slightly rattle (which I love; one thing i hated about topre was that it was so totally silent)
-tactile point is slightly more noticeable (which i love)
-key resistance is normal (which i love), and not ultra-lite like on topre
-keys are printed (for $25, is fine)
-casing is like at101w, slightly creaky but deifnitely serviceable, i'm sure we wont see topre-style solid circuit board inside either, which is to be expected.

In short, at first glance you appear to get a topre that has been working out a bit and hanging out in the hood.  For a lot of us, that sounds pretty ideal!

[wellington1869]

ghetto topre!

[handyrandyrc]

Still love mine!

Now guys, remember, the KT800 and KT400 series are not built like these E036xx series keyboards.  The KT400, for comparison, seems to be their soopah budget model -- MSRP is $9.75 on the Key Tronic website.

E036xx series has an MSRP of $28.50

[kishy]

E036xx series

Can anyone confirm if these are still done the same way as the mid-90s versions?

If they are, then I know what they feel like and can comment...if not, then I don't.

[wellington1869]

E036xx series has an MSRP of $28.50

$25 with free shipping at amazon. Normal backspace and enter keys, usb connection. They shipped me the white one (didnt see a choice for color tho it appears to come in black too).
[Update: it appears i got the last one at amazon! however newegg had them too, and so did ebay, in same price range. Just have to be careful that you get the normal enter/backspace if thats what you want; also there are ps2 versions floating around.
The other keytronic model that has been praised nearly universally is the 6000 series, but I could not find that one with normal enter/backspace keys. The more recent 'lifetime' models seem to have more mixed reviews, and the keytronic rep does seem to have confirmed (in the conversation handy had, linked below) that the lifetime series does use different switch technology from the 3600/6000 series. (For that matter, I believe the 3600 and 6000 also used slightly different switches, based on handy's conversation with the rep, tho the 6000 seems to be popular anyway)]

Can anyone confirm if these are still done the same way as the mid-90s versions?

If they are, then I know what they feel like and can comment...if not, then I don't.

handy had a conversation with a helpful keytronic representative, maybe you can ask her?

[handyrandyrc]

My Key Tronic E03601 is from the mid 90s.

Wellington's E03600 is new manufacture.

His description seems similar to how mine sounds/feels.  I have taken mine apart, and can post pictures.  I imagine his is the same type of construction.

Wellington, take care if taking these apart!  No screws, and lots of pry tabs that like to break!  I know I broke a few...

[wellington1869]

hitting the spacebar reminds me of the slick gear shifter on my old honda. it goes kachunk! in a really satisfyingly solid and smooth way.

[wellington1869]

Wellington, take care if taking these apart!  No screws, and lots of pry tabs that like to break!  I know I broke a few...

thanks for the warning! I might be interested in seeing pics if you can put them up, just out of curiosity, but no worries if its too much trouble.  I'm not planning on opening mine tho, i'm done modding boards for a while (and going with cheaper dome boards was one way to avoid the modding addiction!

[kishy]

Yup, sounds the same then...good enough for me.

Definitely a decent rubber dome. Arguably still not a good keyboard, just good for its type...

[itlnstln]

Yup, sounds the same then...good enough for me.

Definitely a decent rubber dome. Arguably still not a good keyboard, just good for its type...

Ah yes, taking a page out of Welly's book - The Critique Sandwich.

[wellington1869]

Ah yes, taking a page out of Welly's book - The Critique Sandwich.

hahahaha hey i'm sure the keytronic isnt for everyone (any more than the topre is ;-)

[wellington1869]

speaking of ghetto and sandwiches, I'm off to try this new burger joint in harlem.

[itlnstln]

Oh dear, we better not bump into each other. Oh wait Harlem. Not as good as the real thing.

I laughed.  I thought I was sending a Northgate to the 'hood.  It went into a black hole instead.

[itlnstln]

Maybe I'll come visit you next Summer.  I would love to try some fine "coffee" in your local shops.

[itlnstln]

I thought we had this discussion before.

July 2009 post.

Hey, that was back when you used to make relevant, on-topic posts.  Going back through that thread, not much has changed on my part.

[wellington1869]

Nah, I was just too polite back then.

Now we know Keytronics keyboards are NOT really ergonomic and they lie through their teeth.  I'd call that On Topic.

pretty sure the claim of being ergonomic here refers to the different weighting on the different sets of keys (which even the nickel test confirmed).

[wellington1869]

Nah, I was just too polite back then.

Now we know Keytronics keyboards are NOT really ergonomic and they lie through their teeth.  I'd call that On Topic.

I thought we already agreed that the nickel test sucks balls?

They do appear to be differently weighted keys (in more or less 'sets') which is all the ergo claim is referring to, i'm sure.

[handyrandyrc]

E03601 Disassembled

[wellington1869]

E03601 Disassembled

awesome, thanks

So apparently having now tried both a topre and a keytronic put me down as  basically agreeing with the OP in the OP and with the title of the OP

its not a topre -- but its topre-ish in certain ways, (a ghetto topre is the best way i can describe it), and for the price is a steal.

[handyrandyrc]

I tried the 'beard, but alas, was TOO ITCHY for me.

Was it someone here who posted the "Our IT Fathers" video/pictures?  Had all of the 'greats'.

I work in IT, and know the beard is sort of a pre-requisite.  I'm shaving-adverse, so only do it about once a week, on the weekend.  My beard 2010 folder was from January 4th through the 31st.  I think I made it a week past that and had to shave.

31 Jan pic

[sixty]

Just figured I would post here too now. I just got my first Topre after having tried a HHKB Pro at a friends place around 3 or 4 years ago. The keyboard cost me a bit over $400 including tax and I am not overwhelmed yet. However, I can safely assure you now that it feels nothing even close to a Key Tronic board. The Topre feels way better and I kinda like it. Still not convinced though. Giving it about a month to judge it properly.

PS: I got the manly all-55g version since the the weighted version is definitely too girly for my German, Cherry Black MX trained fingers of steel.

[washuai]

Curry FTW.  Curry, now I'm hungry, damn it.  Cherry MX Black fingers of steel, must still find an all 55g girly.

[kishy]

Thanks

It's really not a bad keyboard...I'd hang onto it or use the case for mods myself but I'm low on space and trying to 'thin the herd'.

Based on my experience with a '97 Key Tronic, the feel is highly similar, but I think slightly better on the Unicomp. Those are some pretty snappy domes.

[aegrotatio]

Thanks

It's really not a bad keyboard...I'd hang onto it or use the case for mods myself but I'm low on space and trying to 'thin the herd'.

Based on my experience with a '97 Key Tronic, the feel is highly similar, but I think slightly better on the Unicomp. Those are some pretty snappy domes.

I'm taking it!!
Nothing I like better than snappy domes, like old Key Tronics when they used to make mad money selling un-branded OEM keyboards for white box computer shops.  Especially that left Shift key... SNAP!!

[typo]

keytronic might be the best membrane keyboard but it is no clicky board imo. to the op, have you ever used a topre and can you appreciate the difference even? you do not have to go as far as a topre to get a much nicer experience than a keytronic. there are $70 boards that feel much nicer imo. i hear in japan topre is taken for granted. many buildings are full of them i have been told.

[kishy]

*sigh*

There are clicky membrane keyboards...the Model M is a wonderful example...

You mean rubber dome.

[aegrotatio]

Typo, I'm talking about the snap when I release the key, not a click when I press it.  Key Tronic keyboards are unique in this respect.  It's very satisfying.

I just checked my keyboard collection and I'm horrified I do not have a Key Tronic anymore.  I keep trawling for a single-row enter key Key Tronic board for cheap but there are way more L-shaped Enter key boards out there, sigh.

[typo]

sorry, i did mean rubber dome. keytronic boards are fine. i just prefer a board that makes a click sound way before you bottom out. i think a $10 keytronic is a great value. better than a lot of $40 rubber dome boards i think. i have a e06101. it is built pretty solid. the action is good. i know what you mean. it is not like most rubber dome boards. better.

[wellington1869]

I just checked my keyboard collection and I'm horrified I do not have a Key Tronic anymore.  I keep trawling for a single-row enter key Key Tronic board for cheap but there are way more L-shaped Enter key boards out there, sigh.

aeg -- if you want you can have the keytronic i just bought (usb, with normal enter/backspace keys) for $20 shipped (if you live in lower 48 US). I like it a lot but i'm too wedded to my MS keyboard at the moment. lmk via pm.

[typo]

something very strange. i found a old mitsumi in my garage. as far as i know it is a rubber dome. it clicks though! not nearly as loud as cherry or ibm but it does click and it has a snap to it! plus it registers before i bottom out. did mitsumi make a mechanical board i don't know about? i don't want to put a picture because it is gross filthy and i am embarrassed

[kishy]

Post a picture, I have a Mitsumi with weird rubber domes. Wouldn't say it clicks but I wanna see if it's the same case.

[wellington1869]

aekii had mitsumis at one point, search forum for mitsumi it should show up with pics. IIRC we had several discussions about aekII with mitsumis.

[ch_123]

Those were Mitsumi mechanical switches as opposed to Mitsumi rubber domes.

IIRC, Mitsumi made rubber sleeve keyboards.

[itlnstln]

I remember those Mitsumi switches being fairly nice, too.  They were a little smoother than ALPS.

[aegrotatio]

Thanks to Wellington for sending me the most perfect, full-sized rubber-dome keyboard ever made!!
Devastating snap-back just as it should always be.  Love this keyboard.

[aegrotatio]

I will tell you soon!! I will be getting a Smartrex Unicomp Rubber Domey thinger shortly.

[EverythingIBM]

Best keys in the biz (assuming you have good eyesight and bright lights).  Feel like velvet.

That's worth sumpthin.

Show Image

I thought the cat's tongue model M keys were the best in the biz... the internation biz machines biz.

[typo]

i popped a key on that mitsumi. it appears to have white alps or something. they do not click nearly as loud as cherry blues.

i just cannot take a pic of that thing the condition it is in. it looks like barf.

since keys were mentioned, how does the topre dye sub hold up? i'd think you could blend that in kinda easily. the mitsumi legends and the keytronic seem to be the same process. it does not seem to be pad printing. it wears very good on both of them. i am surprised the topre does not have double shots. i am thinking i'll have to get the white one. even though i can touch i like to see the legends clearly.

the keytronic is probably the best currently made rubber dome imo and a fine keyboard. i just prefer something loud!

[EverythingIBM]

i popped a key on that mitsumi. it appears to have white alps or something. they do not click nearly as loud as cherry blues.

i just cannot take a pic of that thing the condition it is in. it looks like barf.

since keys were mentioned, how does the topre dye sub hold up? i'd think you could blend that in kinda easily. the mitsumi legends and the keytronic seem to be the same process. it does not seem to be pad printing. it wears very good on both of them. i am surprised the topre does not have double shots. i am thinking i'll have to get the white one. even though i can touch i like to see the legends clearly.

the keytronic is probably the best currently made rubber dome imo and a fine keyboard. i just prefer something loud!

I think chicony made the best rubber domes... particularly my favourite KB8923s.

[typo]

this is not my picture but it is the same model.

http://image.blog.livedoor.jp/cynic/imgs/3/5/3594465e.jpg

seems to be going for $140. i remember paying less than $10usd. can anyone tell if this is indeed a mechanical board?

[typo]

the switches do not look like yours. must be rubber dome then. strange, it clicks.

[microsoft windows]

I thought the cat's tongue model M keys were the best in the biz... the internation biz machines biz.

As long as the keys are there (And the mechanisms click of course), I don't really care too much about their texture.

[Computer-Lab in Basement]

I agree, except I would prefer the texture to not be sticky or greasy.

On a somewhat related note, the other day there was a big fly in the lab, so I smashed it into a rubber dome keyboard.  Fly guts everywhere... oh well, it was only a rubber dome.

[typo]

i am sure i am wrong about this. keytronic an mitsumi seem to have the same type of legend application as a white/grey topre? dye sub on these? they do not look like pad printed.