The Living Soldering Thread

[oTurtlez]

Got any experience with the Weller WLC100? That one can be had for $40 shipped off Amazon.

You will note that I deliberately excluded the WLC100 from my recommendations above. I personally wish the WLC100 would go off in a corner somewhere and die. The WLC100 has no real temperature control, only a variable setting of 1-5. There is no way to know what temp your iron is set at, unless you have an expensive thermal meter, which I'm assuming buyers of a $40 soldering station won't have.

I don't have any hesitation recommending the Yihua over the Weller WLC-100, though.

If you are thinking that the WLC100 must be better because it is $40, over the Yihua 936 which is $15, you are mistaken. The Yihua is almost identical to the Hakko 936 (discontinued), which was a $100 station.

Here is a teardown video comparing the Yihua to the Hakko:

Looks like the Yihua it is Sorry for bringing up "it-which-shalt-not-be-named".

[mkawa]

the wlc100 is a piece of crap. the yihua hakko 936 clones are 100x better.

[mkawa]

want to build your own wlc100? buy a light switch dimmer and connected it via twist-on joints to the AC in of the cheapest 55w weller fixed wattage iron. costs less, same damn thing

[Photoelectric]

It seems like this thread goes to extremes sometimes.  WLC100 goes from being a recommended soldering iron for beginners to "a piece of crap".  I'd certainly not call it a piece of crap, as it does the job fine.  If the goal is to educate people about various options they have, it's best to not box them in with THE product to get, then just changing opinion a bit later and call that product a piece of crap and start recommending another.

[mkawa]

i don't think i ever commented on the wlc100 positively in the past. ask alaric. my opinion has been quite uniform on this one. THAT SAID, it's an iron, it gets hot (EVENTUALLY..... ... ..... no keep waiting ... .... .... .. ok let's try DAMNIT ... ... ..) and you can solder with it.

if you're really budget limited and want a brand name iron (many many years ago i heard a few bad stories about qc on the 936 clones, but they've been in continuous production for 20 years now, so i doubt they have any significant issues anymore..

ok, so if you want to get a brand name iron, go with samwisekoi's advice and get a high wattage weller or hakko fixed wattage, maybe 65w, break it out for big joints, and get a small pencil style 35w iron and use it for more sensitive gear. you will have to learn how to not overheat joints the old way, by trial and error, but you will become a better solderer for it.

i think what you may be thinking of is when i mentioned that alaric put together half the custom boards on this forum using a wlc100. he was just patient and used it expertly. so it's really up to you. knowing what i know now, i would go directly for a hakko 888d. it's a HUGE leap forward in hobbyist irons. a fantastic pencil, super precise regulator, comes with an incredibly useful and just plain nice stand.. it's really really amazing for the price.

that said, ymmv. some people like starting on fundamentals and are insistent on it. the wlc100 gives you the basic idea: it's basically a variable wattage iron. there's a light switch dimmer unit to get you the variable wattage, and it's attached to your basic weller workhorse 55w iron. people have been learning to solder on these things for 50 years and no one died because of it. that said, there are much better options now.

[Glissant]

This doesn't have a lot to do with what was just talked about in the thread already, but I wanted to say a couple of things.

If you are a beginner and you are worried about having to pay a lot to get something nice; I have something to tell you. You don't have to spend an arm and a leg. Just get the Weller WLC100 because it's a great iron, and with a smaller tip you can even do SMD work pretty easily.
So consider this when you want to get a new iron from that old radioshack/$5 soldering iron.

I also want to want to hype the Edsyn Soldapullt (solder sucker) because it's a great product. It works awesomely well and is sturdy. It is a bit expensive getting it directly for edsyn because of the shipping, but if you can get a buddy to buy one too and combine your shipping that might help.
You could also order a bunch of wick from Edsyn.

After using lead free solder and a horribly cheap iron in Norway, I can't even express how awesome it is using Kester 44 solder and the WLC100 from Weller.

[Photoelectric]

Yes, and I'm not trying to catch you on your words, but WFD uses WLC100 in his ergo-Clear mod video, and a lot of people refer to that video for information, myself included.  WLC100 was listed in the recommended irons section in the first post here as well.  It's worked very well for me so far, I've done a full board with it.  It did not cost $15, but I got it for $36, which wasn't too bad.

But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).

In general, it's less helpful to throw around extreme opinions than to constructively compare and say that THIS iron could do more (or less) than THAT iron for this much dollar difference for THESE different uses.

P.S.: I'd like to recommend this solder: very cheap for good-size cuts and worked really well.  After a full keyboard, I'm not through with one of these by far... I got 2 extra rolls, which turned out to be entirely unnecessary.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

That's if you can't find Kester 44 cheaply.  Can get different diameters (thinner and thicker) but that's the one I got.  Their desoldering braid with flux is also useful and comes in cheap small sections.

(edited: thanks, fixed the link.  Had multiple pages opened)

[tgujay]

Yes, and I'm not trying to catch you on your words, but WFD uses WLC100 in his ergo-Clear mod video, and a lot of people refer to that video for information, myself included.  WLC100 was listed in the recommended irons section in the first post here as well.  It's worked very well for me so far, I've done a full board with it.  It did not cost $15, but I got it for $36, which wasn't too bad.

But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).

In general, it's less helpful to throw around extreme opinions than to constructively compare and say that THIS iron could do more (or less) than THAT iron for this much dollar difference for THESE different uses.

P.S.: I'd like to recommend this solder: very cheap for good-size cuts and worked really well.  After a full keyboard, I'm not through with one of these by far... I got 2 extra rolls, which turned out to be entirely unnecessary.
www.cnn.com/2013/07/17/tech/paypal-error/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

That's if you can't find Kester 44 cheaply.  Can get different diameters (thinner and thicker) but that's the one I got.  Their desoldering braid with flux is also useful and comes in cheap small sections.

Uh... that link is not what you think it is.

[Dubsgalore]

I also want to want to hype the Edsyn Soldapullt (solder sucker) because it's a great product. It works awesomely well and is sturdy. It is a bit expensive getting it directly for edsyn because of the shipping, but if you can get a buddy to buy one too and combine your shipping that might help.
You could also order a bunch of wick from Edsyn.

I ordered straight from Edsyn, and shipping wasn't too horrible. i did call in about thte $25 order minimum and that helped the cost i think, but i got an extra tip and the soldapullt shipped to NJ for a total of $29

I love the thing though. It's so satisfying and fun to pump every single time....while being a bit tiring too  )

[Photekq]

But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).

Yeah but the Yihua is cheaper and, according to what others have said, is better too. So because of those two things the Yihua might be a better purchase for newbies looking to get a new iron.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the weller. I'm sure it is, as you've said, good enough, but if you can get a better iron for cheaper.. Why not?

[tgujay]

But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).

Yeah but the Yihua is cheaper and, according to what others have said, is better too. So because of those two things the Yihua might be a better purchase for newbies looking to get a new iron.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the weller. I'm sure it is, as you've said, good enough, but if you can get a better iron for cheaper.. Why not?

So get the Yihua?

[Photekq]

So get the Yihua?

This seems to be what everyone has been saying. I haven't used mine as I don't have solder yet, but this thing does not have the feel of a budget iron, and I think it's well worth the $15+shipping.

[CPTBadAss]

The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now.

[jdcarpe]

The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now.

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

[tjcaustin]

The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now.

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

It was expensive and I don't use it often, but GD, I love my fx-808

[nubbinator]

If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped.

[actionbastard]

If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped.

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  

[YoungMichael88]

The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now.

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

It was expensive and I don't use it often, but GD, I love my fx-808

I would love an fx-808. I just HATE desoldering. I hope I never have to do it again (but I will)

[mashby]

Didn't see anyone mention this product, but I thought it would be worth adding to the OP for magnification.

SE MH1047L Illuminated Multipower LED Binohead Magnifier is a magnifier headset. It's inexpensive and works well. We use it here at the office and for $7 it's pretty hard to beat. It's cheaply made, but it works.

[mkawa]

i did in fact mention it earlier, but it can't be given enough kudos. it's awesome. for 7 bucks it's completely unbeatable.

also, interesting fact i learned about kester solders from poking around some datasheets: kester solder actually has a shelf life. 2-3 years for thin rosin cores. for serious. so get the newest run of 44 that you can find.

[Photoelectric]

If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped.

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

[tgujay]

If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped.

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

What makes this stuff so good?  I mean I'm looking to get it since it's a damn pound of solder for only $16.  But whats so good about Kester 44?

[CPTBadAss]

The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now.

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

That's how it's going to be JD?? Damnit! Now I have to get one to live up to my motto

[mkawa]

If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped.

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

What makes this stuff so good?  I mean I'm looking to get it since it's a damn pound of solder for only $16.  But whats so good about Kester 44?

 the kester 44 rosin flux is quite nice. flows well and is _really_ corrosive, especially compared to today's no-clean crap. that means the solder flows a bit easier and at lower temperature than most rosin solders. that said, it's not magic, and if you need more corrosion you can always just apply more rosin flux

personally, i have a squeeze bottle of mg chemicals generic rosin flux and an old roll of alpha metals 0.026" rosin core solder (the 1lb roll i was referring to earlier) and it works fine, even at ridic low temps (like 200C, 10C over the melting point of the metal itself )

[actionbastard]

If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped.

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

Yeah I got one from him a couple weeks ago, ships flat rate.
Price is too good to pass up.

[kaiserreich]

I bought a roll of some MBO (METAUX BLANCS OUVRES) made solder.
SN62 PB AG2

The thing flows well, and I can see why eutectic solder is preferred.
But the choice of flux used is awful. It seems that the flux spits when the iron touches it, and it form very hard droplets on the PCB. They had to be scrubbed off using IPA.

Anyone knows whether there is a better solution to clean the flux, or whether the flux is fault?

[SpAmRaY]

i did in fact mention it earlier, but it can't be given enough kudos. it's awesome. for 7 bucks it's completely unbeatable.

also, interesting fact i learned about kester solders from poking around some datasheets: kester solder actually has a shelf life. 2-3 years for thin rosin cores. for serious. so get the newest run of 44 that you can find.

I asked one of the ebay sellers about how old their solder was and if they ever had issues with it going bad and the impression I got was the 'vintage' new old stock is from circa 2002 but is sealed and has never been opened. The guy says he has never had a problem with any of it going bad. Of course YMMV.

But if it does half a shelf life of 2-3 years once opened then wouldn't most people's go bad? I mean for us regular guys a 1lb of solder should last a while.

[mkawa]

mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

[Photoelectric]

I've had very nice experience with MG Chemicals' rosin-core solder.  Did my first Filco with it, and it's great, flows really well.  Going to try Kester 44 when it arrives.  So storing in a tightly closed zip lock bag is a good idea then, I see.
----
I couldn't quite master using Soldapult over small solder-filled pools in which Filco PCBs suspend switch pins.  So I ended up using the Radioshack iron again.  Went much easier second time around, but the new RadioShack tip ended up decaying 2/3rds of the way through desoldering the PCB... so I barely finished.  Basically you're safe buying 2 of those tips per keyboard project   Pretty sad.

[SpAmRaY]

mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

So the idea of a 2-3 year shelf life only applies to the kester 44? OR all solder?

Is it a better idea to buy solder in small amounts then? I don't see myself using much at all.

[gnubag]

mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

So the idea of a 2-3 year shelf life only applies to the kester 44? OR all solder?

Is it a better idea to buy solder in small amounts then? I don't see myself using much at all.

it's all solder and especially solder with flux in them.

[tjcaustin]

mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

Why are you saying was, did I miss the production stop?  Or just referring to it being non-US made

[MOZ]

Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0

[actionbastard]

Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0

Looks dangerous lol.

[Melvang]

Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0

Looks dangerous lol.

just from my quick look it appears to be only 220VAC not 120 for US use

[Kayliss]

Does anyone here use a Aoyue all in one? I'd love to hear from someone who does.

I'm looking for a 2nd iron, I already have a Hakko 888 and i'd rather not get anything worse than that, I also have a cheap hot air station which has been used alot more than I was expecting, I assume it will go up in smoke sooner rather than later.  A Hakko 888D is around $200 USD here, I can spend an extra $150 and get something like this http://tinyurl.com/knj7632 (sra solder).
I'd rather avoid all in ones but i'm on a limited budget.

[MOZ]

Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0

Looks dangerous lol.

just from my quick look it appears to be only 220VAC not 120 for US use

I'm in India.

Anywho, the query was had anyone used something like that?

[mkawa]

mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

So the idea of a 2-3 year shelf life only applies to the kester 44? OR all solder?

Is it a better idea to buy solder in small amounts then? I don't see myself using much at all.

it's all solder and especially solder with flux in them.

all electronics solder has flux in it. the shelf life is due to the flux not the metal alloy. the metal alloy can oxidize, but an external source of flux can make short work of the oxidization on the solder as well as the oxidization on the joint.

the shelf life of the solder is afaik related to how corrosive the flux is. less corrosive flux like today's no-clean crap has a ridiculously long shelf life.

ps, a sealed bag going to do absolutely zilch to extend the life of your solder, sorry .

[mkawa]

also this hand vacuum pump with a heater at the end looks completely insane and awesome. you should definitely try it out mohit

i suspect it will have a useful service life in the 1s of hours; the fatal flaw seems to be that the iron heats up the entire hand-pump device as well as the solder. also, if you imagine how it's internally constructed, the solder has to run through a huge amount of tube before it makes it to the chamber. all of that tube is space that is ready t be occupied by junk, either solder or plastic or whatever that will refuse to melt and clog the whole device.

the basic idea is solid though. a desoldering pump is just an iron with a tubular opening connected to a source of vacuum. the 808 is just a very cool self-contained vacuum pump attached to the back of a high quality high powered hakko iron. however, look through the documentation for that device and you'll see how tricky it is to get this right. there are lots of considerations for clogging, separation of cold solder from hot, etc. it is a device with many many service parts that need to be replaced regularly.

frankly, the best solution in your part of the world, mohit, is a cheap compressor connects to a clone of an external compressor-driven desoldering station. i believe aoyue makes a clone of the canonical hakko shop air station. that would be the one to get.

[MOZ]

Thanks mkawa.

The one that I linked can be found here for $3. Will get that and try it out.

Are you referring to the Aoyue 474? If yes, I have found a couple f dealers, but all have been above $100. Looking for something cheaper.

Picked up a 936 clone for $12. Working well. Got a 2.4mm chisel tip as well for $.150.

It is hard to find 63/37 solder here as well as brass wool tip cleaner, thus ordered these from ebay global.

[mkawa]

quite hard to tell which hakko units have internal pumps and which ones rely on external pumps

474 - unclear. there is a nozzle, but i don't know whether that nozzle is an air intake or source of vacuum (NOW CLEAR -- this has an internal pump)
475 - very clear. the nozzle is for connection to a vacuum source
484 - internal vacuum pump. not a bellows unit, just a very compact compressor. looks nice.
808 - workhouse integrated vacuum pump unit with pistol grip that we all know and love.

the modern hakko stations are all designated FM-XXXX

FM-204 - modern version of 474. has an internal pump.
FM-203/206 - superpowered versions of the 204. COMPLETELY non-obvious from all the poorly translated product pages, but i believe both stations require an external compressor.

i think aoyue has only cloned the 474 and possible the 475 at this point. from all reports, the clones are close enough in construction that you can use the far superior hakko filters and tubes in these units - just the electronics and pump (if applicable have been cloned), as well as the pencil.

you may think these are expensive at 100$, but the hakko price is 1000$, so think on that for a bit

note that the FM series tends to have full rework capability. that is, it can switch between soldering, desoldering and hot air (suck, blow, just temperator regulation mode). that and the improved analog section indicated by the insane thermal accuracy and recovery of the 888d are basically what differentiate the new models from the old.

(by the way, for those looking at the aoyue 474, check out the 474a++, it seems to obselete the 474. the basic design is the same but it looks like the A++ achieves better parity with the hakko 474. eg, the aoyue 474 cheaps out on the vacuum pump by using a dual chamber unit vs the single large chamber unit in the 474, etc..)

[MOZ]

Thanks for the elaborate explanation mkawa!

Really helpful.

[MOZ]

Got this station.

[tjcaustin]

Got this station.

Solid set up, yo.

That's our budget recommendation in the soldering thread.

[MOZ]

Got it for $12. I tried my hand at making some cables earlier with an iron without temperature control, I sucked. With this, I feel like a pro, got the job done in no time.

[Xenderwind]

I actually read through all 24 pages last night and it seems that people didn't have too many problems picking up soldering, more of the desoldering that was the problem.  Makes me kinda confident in trying to pick it up and try to make my own 62g clears board.  Lubing looks a bit tedious though;  I'll have to look more into that later.

[MOZ]

Soldering is easy, desoldering is hard as solder tends to "stick" to the cables and other components, so you need to use something of higher affinity (Like copper braid) or a suction mechanism (Such as manual pump, bulb pump, electrical sucker).

Lubing doesn't look hard/require practice, more to do with time consuming.

[vun]

I actually read through all 24 pages last night and it seems that people didn't have too many problems picking up soldering, more of the desoldering that was the problem.  Makes me kinda confident in trying to pick it up and try to make my own 62g clears board.  Lubing looks a bit tedious though;  I'll have to look more into that later.

I found desoldering to be quite easy, the only trouble I had was when using the wick didn't work properly and I had to use a sucker, which ended up spewing bits solder everywhere.

Just repaired a pair of headphones that broke on me recently, one of the wires hadn't been properly soldered so I had to solder it back on. Went fairly smooth, the biggest problem was that I had to do it with the can pretty much assembled, so I had to open the can as much as I could and get the iron and solder in the crack. I did nick the plastic a bit, but it's barely noticeable so I'm not too fussed, specially since I'm going to replace them soon-ish anyway.

[nubbinator]

I found desoldering to be quite easy, the only trouble I had was when using the wick didn't work properly and I had to use a sucker, which ended up spewing bits solder everywhere.

Just repaired a pair of headphones that broke on me recently, one of the wires hadn't been properly soldered so I had to solder it back on. Went fairly smooth, the biggest problem was that I had to do it with the can pretty much assembled, so I had to open the can as much as I could and get the iron and solder in the crack. I did nick the plastic a bit, but it's barely noticeable so I'm not too fussed, specially since I'm going to replace them soon-ish anyway.

Are you religiously clearing the pump?  If you don't and don't take it apart every now and then and wash it out, it can start to do that.  I desoldered my entire RK9000 without issues like that though.

[mkawa]

ok now i'm super curious. someone buy one of these and report back!

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374592266&sr=8-1&keywords=aoyue+474a%2B%2B

looks like it's basically a hakko 474, with all the extra suction that implies. replace the tip, chamber and all the filters with the hakko parts. it should come in at about the same price as an 808 but have about 2-3x more suction