Author Topic: [IC] DCS Wyse Compatibility Kit 2020 - awaiting GB thread approval...  (Read 14120 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
DCS Wyse Compatibility Kit 2020, aka Moogle kit 2020

This is a compatibility kit for Comptec DCS keycaps from vintage Wyse keyboards. These are gorgeous doubleshot ABS keycaps with a classy and subtly colorful aesthetic. The new kits will be produced by Signature Plastics. I am hoping to continue the long tradition of Moogle kits with a modern group buy at accessible prices, but with higher quantities than in the past. Let's save vintage keycaps from the garbage dump!

For a "beginner introduction" to what this is all about, refer to my post on Reddit.

See here for the latest update, and please fill out the interest check survey!



Note that the ISO Enter legend is a bit weird in KLE. Here is what it will look like:
More


The Shift and Menu icons will be standard SP legends, as shown here:
More



Pricing & MOQs
  • PCE @ 75 MOQ: $35.50
  • ASCII @ 50 MOQ: $29
  • Numpad / 1800 @ 25 MOQ: $17
  • Blue Accent @ 25 MOQ: $11.50
  • Small Form Factor @ 25 MOQ: $29.50

GB dates: April 1 - April 30

USA: Me, aka Salt Rock Lamp
Korean: Luffy_Kr
Europe: MyKeyboard
Australia: Dailyclack
Singapore: iLumKB

The PCE kit is sufficient for using keycaps from keyboards with the "PC Enhanced" (aka "PCE") layout. The ASCII kit provides additional compatibility for "ASCII" layout keyboards such as from the WY60 and WY30 terminals. The Future kit is for additional compatibility with various modern keyboard layouts.

ASCII and Gate Array keycaps also have text-only modifier legends in a nonstandard top-left position, while the PC Enhanced keycaps have text+icon modifiers in standard center-left position. Signature Plastics DCS legends are positioned center-left, so I am choosing legends to match the PC Enhanced design. The ASCII and Gate Array modifiers will still look good with this kit, but it won't be a perfect 1:1 match.

Note that ASCII-layout keycaps tend to be in worse condition than others. I will do my best to color match across Wyse variants, but brand-new ABS will never match the appearance of well-worn and sun-yellowed ABS.

Signature Plastics stock colors (see here for official color samples)
More

  • Dark gray: GTD
  • Light gray: GSX
  • Blue legends: BBI
  • Yellow legends: YY

There is a similar interest check by Luffy on KBDLab. We have combined our projects, so he will be the Korean vendor for this kit.

If you have any questions, please PM me here or contact me on Discord at salt rock lamp#0679.

If you want to share the logo in your forum signature, please use the following code:

Code: [Select]
[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=100969.0][img]https://i.imgur.com/RX8ZTrf.png[/img][/url]
Thank you to everyone who has helped with this project so far!
« Last Edit: Wed, 01 April 2020, 19:22:29 by tex_live_utility »
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline merlin64

  • Posts: 1262
  • Location: Seattle, WA
    • MechMerlin
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 10:43:59 »
Consider me interested!!! Been waiting for this for a loong time.

Offline CommonCurt

  • One of the cool kids
  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 4614
  • Location: WPB, FL
  • 🍒 Beige or Bust
    • My Flickr Page
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 10:48:35 »
Keeping an eye on this.
Some of my Keyboards -->
More
OTD Koala:  lubed 62g Old MX-Blacks   |   LZ-GH V2   |   KMAC2:  lubed 62g Tactile MX-Greys   |   LZ CLS s   |   X60:  lubed 62g Vintage MX-Blacks   |   GON NerD 60:  lubed 62g Old MX-Clears   |   Filco MJ2 (Beige) TKL's:  lubed 62g MX-Clears  &  lubed  62g Vintage MX-Blacks   |   IBM '91 SSK
                                
       
WTB/WTS/WTT ---->
More

Offline Oblotzky

  • Posts: 1857
  • Location: Cologne, Germany
  • Backspace is for people that make mistakes.
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 11:03:12 »
Fair warning: Signature Plastics has quite some variance between resin batches, so the keys from the new kit can very possibly be of a different shade.

Example: SP ran out of yellow during production for SA Strong Spirit, they ordered more resin and you can see how this affected the final set. And this was from the same production run, now consider ordering a kit for a set that is multiple decades old.


Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 11:40:19 »
Fair warning: Signature Plastics has quite some variance between resin batches, so the keys from the new kit can very possibly be of a different shade.

Example: SP ran out of yellow during production for SA Strong Spirit, they ordered more resin and you can see how this affected the final set. And this was from the same production run, now consider ordering a kit for a set that is multiple decades old.

That's a great point. Not to mention all of these caps were made by Comptec, not SP.

IMO that kind of color variance within a single kit would be unacceptable; between kits, maybe I could live with it. Hopefully that was a one-time thing, but I'll have to bring it up with SP if this ever goes to production.

I fortunately have several Wyse boards from various years, in various models, and in various states of "decay". I'll have to order some color chips and compare under various light conditions.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Online LightningXI

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3352
  • Location: New York
  • PPD
    • ArtisanMacro
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #5 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 11:40:31 »
A new Moogle kit? Mmm I'm interested. As for color-matching wouldn't it be best if an OG DCS set is sent to them as a sample for them to color-match it?

Offline Myoth

  • Posts: 83
  • Location: France
  • vintage/kustom
    • my deskthority profile
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #6 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 11:54:54 »
I have tons of DCS, please make this happen !! I'd be in on this !

Offline mrkevint

  • Posts: 73
  • Location: Canada
  • OK.
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #7 on: Fri, 31 May 2019, 14:14:56 »
I'm definitely in! DCS Wyse is a classic set that I'd love to put on my keyboard. The moogle kits are so rare now.

I actually have DSA Wyse and DCS SoWaRe, but they're not the same lol.
« Last Edit: Fri, 31 May 2019, 14:26:23 by mrkevint »

Offline catamscott

  • Posts: 176
  • Location: Oregon
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 01 June 2019, 10:40:47 »
i'd be 100% in, might even buy a couple to help make moq. hopefully this can attract enough attention to end up happening, those wyse keysets look too damn good to not use.

Offline jrs

  • Posts: 67
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #9 on: Sat, 01 June 2019, 10:42:06 »
I hope the group buy is successful, I have always likes the old Wyse keysets.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 07:06:35 »
A new Moogle kit? Mmm I'm interested. As for color-matching wouldn't it be best if an OG DCS set is sent to them as a sample for them to color-match it?

Good point on this as well. Will gather some keycap samples and ask about custom color pricing from SP.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline fer.real

  • Posts: 123
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #11 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 08:03:40 »
Going beyond color, aren't modern DCS keycaps much thinner than the WYSE ones?  The caps on my WYSE keyboard are much thicker than DCS caps I have from grab bags.  Wouldn't the sound and feel be very different between the OG caps and this kit?

Offline catamscott

  • Posts: 176
  • Location: Oregon
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #12 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 11:25:53 »
Going beyond color, aren't modern DCS keycaps much thinner than the WYSE ones?  The caps on my WYSE keyboard are much thicker than DCS caps I have from grab bags.  Wouldn't the sound and feel be very different between the OG caps and this kit?

i think the majority of wyse keycaps are thin, though there are some that have thick keycaps. i don't have any modern dcs keycaps for comparison, but the wyse keycaps i've got (from two wy-50s and one wy-85) are all quite thin. would you mind sharing some pics of your keycaps?

Offline stevesie

  • Posts: 9
  • Location: US-Fl
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #13 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 11:29:41 »
I think this looks great! I'd be down for one, I think.

As for the color variation, as long as it doesn't change within the same set, it would work for me. For a 60%, the mods would all be from this set, so it would be all new caps except the spacebar, which I can deal with.

Either way, from the 3-5 wyse sets I have, if you're looking for color matching, it's going to be difficult unless you have pristine, NOS caps from a board sitting around. Most of mine have been yellowed.

Also, as for the thickness of the caps, there seems to be variance in thickness depending on the era of the caps that you have. I have 3-4 different types of caps in my sets. One that is the super thick doubleshots, one doubleshots that aren't as thick, and one (mostly) set of thin that I can't remember if it's doubleshot. There are also color variants as well. Some of what I have are actually black doubleshot instead of the blue.


Offline stevesie

  • Posts: 9
  • Location: US-Fl
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #14 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 11:48:53 »

i think the majority of wyse keycaps are thin, though there are some that have thick keycaps. i don't have any modern dcs keycaps for comparison, but the wyse keycaps i've got (from two wy-50s and one wy-85) are all quite thin. would you mind sharing some pics of your keycaps?

I'm not the OP you replied to, but I have a pic of my cap variance, as best I can. I got all mine from a guy who harvested all the blacks from a few boards or sold them without caps and didn't want the caps, so there's a ton of various sets in there. I have 1.75 sets of the thick doubleshots and various amounts of mostly complete different thinner ones. I suspect no one wanted them because they were incomplete, but now I am overflowing with wyse caps of various sizes. I should one day sort them into sets of approximate time period and doubleshot styles...

The leftmost cap in the pic is: .08" thick and the rest are: ~.04" There is a lip on the inside of the edge, so an accurate measurement with my calipers is difficult.


Offline fer.real

  • Posts: 123
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #15 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 12:35:39 »
Going beyond color, aren't modern DCS keycaps much thinner than the WYSE ones?  The caps on my WYSE keyboard are much thicker than DCS caps I have from grab bags.  Wouldn't the sound and feel be very different between the OG caps and this kit?

i think the majority of wyse keycaps are thin, though there are some that have thick keycaps. i don't have any modern dcs keycaps for comparison, but the wyse keycaps i've got (from two wy-50s and one wy-85) are all quite thin. would you mind sharing some pics of your keycaps?


i think the majority of wyse keycaps are thin, though there are some that have thick keycaps. i don't have any modern dcs keycaps for comparison, but the wyse keycaps i've got (from two wy-50s and one wy-85) are all quite thin. would you mind sharing some pics of your keycaps?

I'm not the OP you replied to, but I have a pic of my cap variance, as best I can. I got all mine from a guy who harvested all the blacks from a few boards or sold them without caps and didn't want the caps, so there's a ton of various sets in there. I have 1.75 sets of the thick doubleshots and various amounts of mostly complete different thinner ones. I suspect no one wanted them because they were incomplete, but now I am overflowing with wyse caps of various sizes. I should one day sort them into sets of approximate time period and doubleshot styles...

The leftmost cap in the pic is: .08" thick and the rest are: ~.04" There is a lip on the inside of the edge, so an accurate measurement with my calipers is difficult.

Show Image


My results are similar.  Original caps come in at a whopping 1.85mm - 1.92mm.  So thick I had to double-check my calipers.  New ones were a wimpy .9mm - .95mm.

220323-0

Edit: punctuation.
« Last Edit: Sun, 02 June 2019, 12:38:26 by fer.real »

Offline catamscott

  • Posts: 176
  • Location: Oregon
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #16 on: Sun, 02 June 2019, 13:04:50 »

i think the majority of wyse keycaps are thin, though there are some that have thick keycaps. i don't have any modern dcs keycaps for comparison, but the wyse keycaps i've got (from two wy-50s and one wy-85) are all quite thin. would you mind sharing some pics of your keycaps?

I'm not the OP you replied to, but I have a pic of my cap variance, as best I can. I got all mine from a guy who harvested all the blacks from a few boards or sold them without caps and didn't want the caps, so there's a ton of various sets in there. I have 1.75 sets of the thick doubleshots and various amounts of mostly complete different thinner ones. I suspect no one wanted them because they were incomplete, but now I am overflowing with wyse caps of various sizes. I should one day sort them into sets of approximate time period and doubleshot styles...

The leftmost cap in the pic is: .08" thick and the rest are: ~.04" There is a lip on the inside of the edge, so an accurate measurement with my calipers is difficult.

Show Image


very cool! i was mostly curious as to what the thicker caps looked like, i've read that they exist but haven't seen them. i love how much mystery there is surrounding a lot of vintage keyboards, with these keycap thickness disparities being a prime example.

Offline merlin64

  • Posts: 1262
  • Location: Seattle, WA
    • MechMerlin
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #17 on: Mon, 03 June 2019, 09:24:11 »
Signature plastics also never made the Wyse caps.

Offline HungerMechanic

  • Posts: 480
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #18 on: Tue, 04 June 2019, 11:21:24 »
I pretty much have to be interested in these. I have two sets of original Wyse keycaps, and two Moogle kits. [But more is always good].

There is indeed variance in the Wyse keycap thickness. I have some very classic Wyse keycaps from the COMPTEC era. And they are reasonably thick.

Maybe I should post photos, if I get a chance. They aren't the .9mm you see in the 'modern' DCS keycaps, when they went to thinner molds.

They are about as thick as GMK, I reckon, and lower-pitched in sound.

The only thing I might request for the Moogle kit is a blue spacebar, same shade as the text. The white spacebars can be a bit plain.

But I'm going to use a Cherry-profile spacebar anyway, DCS spacebar is borderline unusable on a modern board.

Offline HungerMechanic

  • Posts: 480
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #19 on: Tue, 04 June 2019, 12:19:31 »
Okay, here are the Wyse DCS keycaps that I am using right now:



The blue/gray keycaps in the centre are the Wyse terminal DCS alphas. The gray/black keycaps at the top left and right edges are modifiers from a Wyse Moogle Kit, and the bottom red keycaps are GMK alpha keys.

You can see that the Wyse keycaps are similar in thickness to the GMK keycaps. Both sets are alphas, and are in fact the WASD keys of both sets.

The Moogle kit is clearly made from a thinner variant of DCS.

Offline jrs

  • Posts: 67
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #20 on: Wed, 18 September 2019, 20:05:01 »
Are you still planning this group buy?

Offline zqs1qiwan

  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Gainesville
  • Dreams need money
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #21 on: Fri, 20 September 2019, 17:06:12 »
Count me interested, a good news for OG keyboard lovers

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #22 on: Thu, 24 October 2019, 23:18:46 »
Are you still planning this group buy?

Apologies for the long absence. Yes, I would still like to run this group buy. :thumb:
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit
« Reply #23 on: Thu, 24 October 2019, 23:21:59 »
I'd be all over this.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit - survey added!
« Reply #24 on: Fri, 25 October 2019, 11:50:29 »
Interest check survey added :eek:

Link is in OP.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit - survey added!
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 26 October 2019, 12:07:21 »


 :p

Help preserve vintage keysets! Fill out the form :-*
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline catamscott

  • Posts: 176
  • Location: Oregon
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit - survey added!
« Reply #26 on: Sat, 26 October 2019, 13:06:28 »
Show Image


 :p

Help preserve vintage keysets! Fill out the form :-*

lol
still super interested in this, even with all the nice keysets that have been running i would hop on this in a heartbeat

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit - survey added!
« Reply #27 on: Wed, 30 October 2019, 20:28:32 »
Project update: trying to work out a different kit design that could make things significantly cheaper. Specifically I am going to try and splitting up the kits so that the most popular keys will be available at a lower price. I've reached out to SP for a new round of quotes and I will update if there is any good news.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline zqs1qiwan

  • Posts: 22
  • Location: Gainesville
  • Dreams need money
Re: [IC] SP DCS Wyse compatibility kit - survey added! Updates coming soon...
« Reply #28 on: Tue, 05 November 2019, 20:25:16 »
I harvested a few kinda NIB esprit/unitek/g80-0472 keyboards these days, got some impressive DCS doubleshot OG keycaps, I'll put my purchase willing to '5 or more', pls gib OP!

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #29 on: Wed, 06 November 2019, 11:27:43 »
New kits and new pricing posted! Please read and fill out the new IC form :cool:
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #30 on: Mon, 11 November 2019, 01:37:06 »
Thanks for the survey feedback so far. Keep it coming!

I got a request for a 6u spacebar. I like 6u myself but it's very uncommon (other than the glorious "true HHKB" layout on the IDB60). Is this something other people might want?
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline HWHobby

  • Posts: 9
  • Location: Los Angeles, California
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #31 on: Wed, 13 November 2019, 17:37:37 »
Would love to see this go through, I have a set I would love to complete and be able to use. If you could split the spacebar kit or make one large kit with everything and bring the whole price down, I think it would make sense.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 13 November 2019, 23:33:12 »
Would love to see this go through, I have a set I would love to complete and be able to use. If you could split the spacebar kit or make one large kit with everything and bring the whole price down, I think it would make sense.

Signature Plastics told me that combining my kits will not reduce the price. Therefore this seems like the most reasonable balance of convenience and price per each kit.

Do note that the PCE kit is exclusively spacebars and bottom-row modifiers. If you only need a spacebar, I suggest contacting SP directly and ordering a single keycap, I think it's around $10. However I'm not aware of any Wyse keyboard where only a spacebar is required for compatibility.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #33 on: Thu, 14 November 2019, 00:19:57 »
Would it be possible to add in r1 del, r2 page up, and r3 page down to the future kit? Adding these 3 keys would add support for 65% layouts. I'd really like to fill out my discipline65 with a pce set.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #34 on: Thu, 14 November 2019, 02:15:32 »
Would it be possible to add in r1 del, r2 page up, and r3 page down to the future kit? Adding these 3 keys would add support for 65% layouts. I'd really like to fill out my discipline65 with a pce set.

That's a good idea, since it also covers 75%. Please do fill out the interest check form and mention 65% legend support in the comments field.

I'll ask SP for a quote. But I can't guarantee that they'll be added. With respect to kit pricing, we are already at the high end of what it seems the market (and my Korean counterpart) will bear.

My objective here is to make it physically possible to use DCS Wyse keycaps on modern keyboards. Those 1u keys aren't strictly needed since you can put numpad keys (or other extra caps) there instead. So it's a tradeoff between "possibly increased appeal" and "keeping the price low for everyone". I'll update on this when I can.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #35 on: Thu, 14 November 2019, 12:32:50 »
Would it be possible to add in r1 del, r2 page up, and r3 page down to the future kit? Adding these 3 keys would add support for 65% layouts. I'd really like to fill out my discipline65 with a pce set.

That's a good idea, since it also covers 75%. Please do fill out the interest check form and mention 65% legend support in the comments field.

I'll ask SP for a quote. But I can't guarantee that they'll be added. With respect to kit pricing, we are already at the high end of what it seems the market (and my Korean counterpart) will bear.

My objective here is to make it physically possible to use DCS Wyse keycaps on modern keyboards. Those 1u keys aren't strictly needed since you can put numpad keys (or other extra caps) there instead. So it's a tradeoff between "possibly increased appeal" and "keeping the price low for everyone". I'll update on this when I can.

Alright, filled out. I figured it would fit well in the future kit since it's goal is to increase compatibility with modern layouts. I personally wouldn't mind paying $5-$10 more for those keys.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #36 on: Fri, 15 November 2019, 10:40:27 »
Would it be possible to add in r1 del, r2 page up, and r3 page down to the future kit? Adding these 3 keys would add support for 65% layouts. I'd really like to fill out my discipline65 with a pce set.

That's a good idea, since it also covers 75%. Please do fill out the interest check form and mention 65% legend support in the comments field.

I'll ask SP for a quote. But I can't guarantee that they'll be added. With respect to kit pricing, we are already at the high end of what it seems the market (and my Korean counterpart) will bear.

My objective here is to make it physically possible to use DCS Wyse keycaps on modern keyboards. Those 1u keys aren't strictly needed since you can put numpad keys (or other extra caps) there instead. So it's a tradeoff between "possibly increased appeal" and "keeping the price low for everyone". I'll update on this when I can.

Alright, filled out. I figured it would fit well in the future kit since it's goal is to increase compatibility with modern layouts. I personally wouldn't mind paying $5-$10 more for those keys.

Thanks!

Just keep in mind that I now have to juggle: full 1800 support (R1 Del, End, PgDn), HHKB support (R2 backspace, R4 Fn, and 65/75 support (various 1u R2 and R3 keys). Adding all of them would be prohibitively expensive, and splitting them into separate kits could lead to higher prices and lower order quantities. I'm open to suggestions on how to handle this.

In any case I appreciate the continued interest and hopefully we can get this to market early next year.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #37 on: Fri, 15 November 2019, 18:38:21 »
Would it be possible to add in r1 del, r2 page up, and r3 page down to the future kit? Adding these 3 keys would add support for 65% layouts. I'd really like to fill out my discipline65 with a pce set.

That's a good idea, since it also covers 75%. Please do fill out the interest check form and mention 65% legend support in the comments field.

I'll ask SP for a quote. But I can't guarantee that they'll be added. With respect to kit pricing, we are already at the high end of what it seems the market (and my Korean counterpart) will bear.

My objective here is to make it physically possible to use DCS Wyse keycaps on modern keyboards. Those 1u keys aren't strictly needed since you can put numpad keys (or other extra caps) there instead. So it's a tradeoff between "possibly increased appeal" and "keeping the price low for everyone". I'll update on this when I can.

Alright, filled out. I figured it would fit well in the future kit since it's goal is to increase compatibility with modern layouts. I personally wouldn't mind paying $5-$10 more for those keys.

Thanks!

Just keep in mind that I now have to juggle: full 1800 support (R1 Del, End, PgDn), HHKB support (R2 backspace, R4 Fn, and 65/75 support (various 1u R2 and R3 keys). Adding all of them would be prohibitively expensive, and splitting them into separate kits could lead to higher prices and lower order quantities. I'm open to suggestions on how to handle this.

In any case I appreciate the continued interest and hopefully we can get this to market early next year.

Maybe offer a blanks pack? Or does SP offer relegendables?

Edit: They do indeed offer relegendables in row 1, 2, and 3 on pmk. Not in GTD currently though.
« Last Edit: Fri, 15 November 2019, 18:45:30 by Ensaum »

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #38 on: Sat, 16 November 2019, 02:41:57 »
What do you all think of these kits?



The Future kit now has better compatibility with 1800. And the newly separate ISO and Anachronism (accents) should be pretty cheap even at very low MOQ. SP pricing makes it much easier to separate kits compared to GMK.

I haven't gotten a quote for these yet... I will try with and without 65% keys to see how expensive it will get.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #39 on: Sat, 16 November 2019, 12:03:02 »
What do you all think of these kits?

Show Image


The Future kit now has better compatibility with 1800. And the newly separate ISO and Anachronism (accents) should be pretty cheap even at very low MOQ. SP pricing makes it much easier to separate kits compared to GMK.

I haven't gotten a quote for these yet... I will try with and without 65% keys to see how expensive it will get.

Look's great. I like the accent pack. Just need a couple more keys for 65%/75% compatibility now. Quick question though. What is the R3 Fn key for? I'm scratching my head trying to figure out a layout that would go with.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #40 on: Sat, 16 November 2019, 12:16:35 »
What do you all think of these kits?

Show Image


The Future kit now has better compatibility with 1800. And the newly separate ISO and Anachronism (accents) should be pretty cheap even at very low MOQ. SP pricing makes it much easier to separate kits compared to GMK.

I haven't gotten a quote for these yet... I will try with and without 65% keys to see how expensive it will get.

Look's great. I like the accent pack. Just need a couple more keys for 65%/75% compatibility now. Quick question though. What is the R3 Fn key for? I'm scratching my head trying to figure out a layout that would go with.

40%. It can be dropped if necessary to keep price low, or we can split it off into yet another kit for e.g. Minivan, JD40, Pearl owners.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #41 on: Sat, 16 November 2019, 12:37:25 »
What do you all think of these kits?

Show Image


The Future kit now has better compatibility with 1800. And the newly separate ISO and Anachronism (accents) should be pretty cheap even at very low MOQ. SP pricing makes it much easier to separate kits compared to GMK.

I haven't gotten a quote for these yet... I will try with and without 65% keys to see how expensive it will get.

Look's great. I like the accent pack. Just need a couple more keys for 65%/75% compatibility now. Quick question though. What is the R3 Fn key for? I'm scratching my head trying to figure out a layout that would go with.

40%. It can be dropped if necessary to keep price low, or we can split it off into yet another kit for e.g. Minivan, JD40, Pearl owners.

Ah, okay. Just asking because I noticed there also needs to be a R3 Control for HHKB campat and thought maybe it could take the place of that Function key.

Edit: Honestly, don't know much about 40%, but it looks like a few more keys would need to be added for proper 40s support anyways. Like a r2 Esc, a short Enter, a r3 tab, and probably some others too depending on layout.
« Last Edit: Sat, 16 November 2019, 12:51:04 by Ensaum »

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #42 on: Sat, 16 November 2019, 19:29:16 »
What do you all think of these kits?

Show Image


The Future kit now has better compatibility with 1800. And the newly separate ISO and Anachronism (accents) should be pretty cheap even at very low MOQ. SP pricing makes it much easier to separate kits compared to GMK.

I haven't gotten a quote for these yet... I will try with and without 65% keys to see how expensive it will get.

Look's great. I like the accent pack. Just need a couple more keys for 65%/75% compatibility now. Quick question though. What is the R3 Fn key for? I'm scratching my head trying to figure out a layout that would go with.

40%. It can be dropped if necessary to keep price low, or we can split it off into yet another kit for e.g. Minivan, JD40, Pearl owners.

Ah, okay. Just asking because I noticed there also needs to be a R3 Control for HHKB campat and thought maybe it could take the place of that Function key.

Edit: Honestly, don't know much about 40%, but it looks like a few more keys would need to be added for proper 40s support anyways. Like a r2 Esc, a short Enter, a r3 tab, and probably some others too depending on layout.

Indeed.

However my concern with this kit first and foremost is making sure keys in the correct size and row exist at all. This is why I'm hesitant at all to include any legend compatibility; it's really not necessary, and just for aesthetics.

That is, on a 65%, you can always just use extra number pad keys or something like that.  On a 40%, you actually cannot have the correct profile keys in the correct position without adding this 1.25u R3 key.
This is something that GMK group buy runners consistently fail to recognize.

Basically, we will have to see what the quotes are like from SP. I don't exactly want to do another round of formal interest check surveys, but once I have a sense of pricing for a bigger kit, I will start being able to make decisions about what can stay and what needs to go.

In my opinion, having slightly mismatched keys is part of the fun love using vintage key caps. I care much more about having the right shape in the right size than having the right legends and colors. That of course is just my preference, and even though this is my project I don't want it to only appeal to my taste.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #43 on: Mon, 18 November 2019, 16:22:41 »
Hopefully that last post didn't sound dismissive. Keep the suggestions coming, please!

Don't forget, at the end of the day we just want to keep these nice keysets out of the trash:



Picture credit due to TheInverseKey.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #44 on: Mon, 18 November 2019, 20:35:29 »
Hopefully that last post didn't sound dismissive. Keep the suggestions coming, please!

Don't forget, at the end of the day we just want to keep these nice keysets out of the trash:

Show Image


Picture credit due to TheInverseKey.

Not dismissive at all. Just don't really have any more suggestions, haha. I also don't want my voice to be the only one here. Still super excited for this set and I'd like to try and find a NOS PCE after this runs. (also r3 control pls)

Edit: Hopefully I'm not overstepping, but here's a brainstorm of the changes that I personally would like to see.
« Last Edit: Mon, 18 November 2019, 23:04:29 by Ensaum »

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #45 on: Mon, 18 November 2019, 23:24:38 »
I don't think we can add more keys to the PCE kit. There will be sticker shock if it's over $40. So R3 Ctrl would probably have to be part of the Future kit.

Alt Gr isn't a bad idea, although I'm not sure how faithful it is to the original.

Let me run this by SP and see how expensive the Future kit gets. Then depending on that outcome we can decide. Maybe it needs to be broken into more kits or something, as long as price at 25 MOQ isn't too egregious.
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Ensaum

  • Posts: 287
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #46 on: Mon, 18 November 2019, 23:30:37 »
I don't think we can add more keys to the PCE kit. There will be sticker shock if it's over $40. So R3 Ctrl would probably have to be part of the Future kit.

Alt Gr isn't a bad idea, although I'm not sure how faithful it is to the original.

Let me run this by SP and see how expensive the Future kit gets. Then depending on that outcome we can decide. Maybe it needs to be broken into more kits or something, as long as price at 25 MOQ isn't too egregious.

My thinking with R3 Control in the PCE kit is that it would give physical non-stepped caps lock support to pce sets for those who want it. (although I use stepped so I couldn't care less what kit it's in)

I just though Alt Gr was a "cool retro" touch. I'm not attached to it in any way if you don't like it.

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] DCS Wyse compatibiilty kit: new kits and pricing as of November 6!
« Reply #47 on: Tue, 19 November 2019, 20:32:57 »
Noted. Again the feedback is appreciated.

By the way, I'm looking for a proxy in Europe. If you are interested, please PM me here or on Discord at salt rock lamp#0679. If all goes according to plan, we already have a Korean proxy established for Asia.

Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 925
  • MX brown apologist
    • twitch.tv/salt_rock_lamp
Re: [IC] Compatibility kits for vintage Wyse keycaps
« Reply #48 on: Tue, 19 November 2019, 22:50:40 »
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
Twitch: salt_rock_lamp | YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd7YXZjilUutJ6ShZWrvQtg | Instagram: @salt_rock_keyboards


Offline Chimera

  • Posts: 150
  • Location: North Bay
Re: [IC] Compatibility kits for vintage Wyse keycaps
« Reply #49 on: Wed, 20 November 2019, 00:47:33 »
Yeah. I've been trying to track down a lot anyways