Author Topic: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020 - officially canceled, int'l orders refunded  (Read 27977 times)

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Offline tex_live_utility

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:( Sadly this project has been canceled. See here for the latest update. :(
DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
Don't throw out those vintage Wyse keycaps!

Buy this adapter kit and use them on a modern keyboard instead!

 ;D Available worldwide, April 1 - April 30 May 16 ;D

Brought to you by Salt Rock Lamp and Luffy

After a long interest check with a few twists and turns, it's finally here! In the time-honored Geekhack/Deskthority/KBDLab tradition now spanning a decade, I am proud to present the DCS Wyse Compatibility Kit 2020.

In the early 1990s, Wyse Technology made computer terminals with extremely handsome keyboards. These boards featured DCS-profile doubleshot ABS keycaps made by Comptec, the predecessor to Signature Plastics. While DCS remains available to this day, the old gray-and-blue Wyse colorscheme is uniquely beautiful and classy. Unfortunately, these old keyboards featured layouts that today are considered bizarre and nonstandard, and you typically can't use their keycaps on a modern keyboard. With so many of these boards being harvested for ultra-smooth vintage Cherry MX switches, there are hundreds of these beautiful keysets sitting in bags and boxes around the world. The purpose of this group buy is to put those old keycaps to good use, adorning the high-end custom keyboards we have all come to love.

This is not the first Wyse compatibility group buy, but I want to make it the biggest and most accessible yet. With our international proxies, anybody anywhere in the world should be able to get access to these keycaps. And with modular kit design, basic compatibility should remain affordable while making advanced legend compatibility available to those who want it.

This set will be manufactured by Signature Plastics, in their DCS profile, made from ABS plastic with doubleshot legends.

Where to buy

Orders are now open for the Americas and South Korea! Proxy links will be announced when they are available.
Prices and MOQs
KitPrice (USD)Minimum Order Quantity (MOQ)
PC Enhanced$35.5075
ASCII$29.0050
Numpad / 1800$17.0025
Small Form Factor$29.5025
Blue Accent$11.5025

Note that proxy prices are subject to variation due to local taxes and exchange rates.

Kits


The Shift and Menu icons will be standard SP legends, as shown here:
More



The PC Enhanced kit is to use caps from a Wyse PC Enhanced (aka PCE) keyboard.

The ASCII kit is enough to use caps from an ASCII layout keyboard, such as the WY60. It also works on the ubiquitous DEC-layout "Gate Array" keyboards. You will usually need to buy both the PCE and ASCII kits.

ASCII and Gate Array keycaps have text-only modifier legends in a nonstandard top-left position, while the PC Enhanced keycaps have text+icon modifiers in standard center-left position. Signature Plastics DCS legends are positioned center-left, so I am choosing legends to match the PC Enhanced design. The ASCII and Gate Array modifiers will still look good with this kit, but it won't be a perfect 1:1 match.

Colors
This set uses Signature Plastics stock ABS colors.
  • Dark gray: GTD
  • Light gray: GSX
  • Blue legends: BBI
  • Yellow legends: YY


Several color schemes were used on these keyboards under different brand names. This keyset is designed to match the standard blue-and-gray Wyse color scheme. But it should also look good alongside any other neutral-colored DCS keycaps.

Note that ASCII-layout keycaps tend to be in worse condition (i.e. more yellow) than others. It is typically easy to restore them by ultrasonic cleaning followed by "retrobrighting" (see here for more information).

Fun stuff

Here's some code to embed the logo in your forum signature :-*

Code: [Select]
[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=105438.0][img]https://i.imgur.com/RX8ZTrf.png[/img][/url]

And to whet your appetite, here is the result of an older run of this group buy:



And some original Wyse keyboards to finish things off:



« Last Edit: Tue, 27 October 2020, 16:08:01 by tex_live_utility »
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
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Offline Shadohhh

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 01 April 2020, 20:08:21 »
Excited to see this finally made it to GB!

Offline Chimera

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 01 April 2020, 20:26:05 »
Looks good. My only critique is the Windows Key. The older kits Winkey looks really good.

I guess the counter argument to that is why would need the WK when everything you use is WKL? I have no answer to that question.

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 01 April 2020, 20:45:18 »
Dailyclack link added!

Looks good. My only critique is the Windows Key. The older kits Winkey looks really good.

I guess the counter argument to that is why would need the WK when everything you use is WKL? I have no answer to that question.

This was a tough call to be sure. I love the old logo too. On the bright side if there's a lot of demand we can always do a small run of winkeys in the future. SP pricing for 1u keys is very good.
« Last Edit: Wed, 01 April 2020, 20:47:52 by tex_live_utility »
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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 01 April 2020, 20:59:01 »
looks amazing!!!

Offline catamscott

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 01 April 2020, 23:55:03 »
nice! been looking forward to this for a long time  :D

Offline The Equals D

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 02 April 2020, 00:45:31 »
Well damn, really wish I didn't throw away my Wyse keycaps last week.

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 02 April 2020, 07:10:02 »
iLumKB store page is now available!

Well damn, really wish I didn't throw away my Wyse keycaps last week.

This is what I get for not promoting the IC more :'(
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
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Offline AuDiTH

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #8 on: Fri, 03 April 2020, 03:20:48 »
Huge thanks for this gb, just joined all kits ;D
SSK | AEK64 | TX-CP | Yoda 2 | HHKB | Model F AT | Realforce 55g | Acrylic Pearl | Duck Orion V3 | LZ MP | Kyuu Sakura
Currently joined GBs:
DCS WYSE Moogle kit
DCS Red Alert R3
GMK Black Modi

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #9 on: Fri, 03 April 2020, 10:08:17 »
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
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Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #10 on: Sat, 04 April 2020, 11:17:16 »
iLumKB now has a Taobao link as well for our friends im China: https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=614755192638

Thanks iLouis!
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
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Offline derzemel

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #11 on: Tue, 07 April 2020, 04:41:18 »
Hey, any news on the MyKeyboard GB link?

Also, maybe you should update the thread on Deskthority as well as there are users there that do not look at GH or r/mk

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #12 on: Tue, 07 April 2020, 11:17:07 »
Hey, any news on the MyKeyboard GB link?

Also, maybe you should update the thread on Deskthority as well as there are users there that do not look at GH or r/mk

Still waiting on Mykeyboard...

And yes, Deskthority, Keebtalk, and possibly even Zfrontier posts will be going up this week.
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Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 08 April 2020, 11:12:57 »
Finally got a Mykeyboard store page. We're really truly now live in all regions :eek:
Discord: salt rock lamp#0679 | Reddit: /u/nerdponx | Deskthority: autoload -Uz | Keebtalk: salt_rock_lamp
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Offline gnhuy91

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #14 on: Sun, 12 April 2020, 01:56:47 »
just curious, how can I make use of that R3 Func key?

Offline delet_d

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #15 on: Wed, 15 April 2020, 23:56:39 »
Any word on numbers so far?

Online LightningXI

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #16 on: Sat, 25 April 2020, 11:58:10 »
just curious, how can I make use of that R3 Func key?

It might be of use in boards < 60%.

Offline Shadohhh

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #17 on: Sun, 26 April 2020, 14:06:28 »
Any updates on numbers?

Offline derzemel

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #18 on: Thu, 30 April 2020, 04:36:47 »
Should we be worried that the GB runner has not been on GH since the 23rd, with the GB ending today, the 30th?

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #19 on: Sat, 02 May 2020, 20:09:24 »
Hi everyone,

I know that I've been absent from Geekhack (and the Internet at large) over the last two weeks. I had some unexpected family problems arise, and I let it take me too far away from my responsibilities, including posting updates and marketing this group buy.

As for the numbers: I do not have official tallies from vendors yet, but it looks like we are between 1/2 and 3/4 of the way to MOQ on all kits.

With that in mind, we have agreed to extend the group buy period until May 16. I will be putting in maximum effort this week in order to get the GB on track and make sure we can hit MOQ at least on the PCE and ASCII kits.

I am personally planning to commit extra funds if needed to cross the MOQ line, and Luffy might be able to commit some as well.

Regarding North American orders through the. Google form: you will receive a confirmation email after the GB period ends. You will have a pre-determined window to change your order. You will then receive an invoice with a pre-determined payment deadline.

Finally, I was also working on several mini-collaboration projects in April, which I will try to kickstart before the 15th:

  • A small GB for the ISO kit which was dropped from this GB, likely facilitated by Jae of Top Clack and distributed through the UK.
  • A small GB for the vintage-style Windows logo keys, likely NA-only due to logistics constraints.
  • One or two deskmat designs: a neutral-colored minimalist design in Wyse colors, and a "Wyse Waifu" -- I leave that to your imagination as to what it might be.
  • Sourcing and selling vintage Wyse keycaps, including some thick-walled Comptec DCS. I was trying for a long time to find a good source of NOS caps, but it seems the classic blue-gray colorway is becoming harder to find in large quantity, now that the major harvesters have recycled or sold their stocks. I will have NOS caps available, but in slightly different colorways, and therefore will sell at a significant discount.

Not all of these projects will coincide with the extended GB dates. But they will all be at least announced before then, and I will attempt to ensure that they all ship together to the extent that is possible.
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Offline catamscott

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 02 May 2020, 20:44:45 »
really hope all is well with regards to your family. glad this is getting extended, fingers crossed that it does end up hitting MOQ. very interested in see the deskmats, i'm not a big deskmat guy but i'd happily buy one in the classic wyse colorway  :thumb:

Offline HungerMechanic

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #21 on: Sat, 02 May 2020, 21:33:21 »
I'm with Catamscott on this. Really grateful that you were able to update us on this GB, and hope you can address your family difficulties. It can be troubling to hear about the problems that people are going through right now, and I hope that the Covid situation can eventually ease up.

It's looking like this GB has more rto offer, so I am interested in these tie-ins, especially the Wyse deskmat, which is crazy. So thanks tex_live_utility for keeping this going, and we can get the awesome caps to improve our WYSE.

Offline Shadohhh

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #22 on: Thu, 07 May 2020, 07:25:14 »
Thanks for the update, I hope you and your family are doing okay.

Offline yaya

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #23 on: Thu, 07 May 2020, 10:53:37 »
Any way to confirm our orders through your form?

Pretty sure I joined early, but I don't have any confirmation or copy of my responses, don't want to miss out.

Offline tex_live_utility

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #24 on: Sun, 10 May 2020, 09:00:47 »
Update on order totals - we are close to MOQ on base kits, and we have reached MOQ on child kits!!

Note that we do not yet have numbers from proxies. The numbers below only reflect North America and Korea orders

  • PCE: 45
  • ASCII: 31
  • Numpad: 16
  • SFF: 21
  • Blue: 32

PCE and ASCII are a little far from MOQ still, but with proxies hopefully we will get closer. I will also start discussing with proxies what a buyout to MOQ will look like. I really really really want this set to get made! Now is your last chance to help make history, at least before you're stuck buying at extras pricing :D



I have also decided that, yes, I am going to run an additional buy for the OG vintage windows keys. I will make a separate GB thread for it, and it will run during May. Orders will be through me solely, and shipping will be worldwide (but potentially expensive). I will combine shipping with this GB when possible. The reason this will be possible is that the main GB will depend on color sampling, while the add-on GB will use the same colors. So once colors are approved, I will ask SP manufacture everything at the same time.

The kits will just be 1u and 1.25u keys using the windows logo in this photo: https://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=100969.0;attach=234429;image So if the Windows keys were holding you back, rest assured that if we manage to hit MOQs here then I will definitely go ahead with the Winkeys GB.



Still working on deskmat designs! Like the Winkeys, running this will be dependent on the outcome of the current GB.



As I said in my previous post, you will get an order confirmation before the GB ends. If you really are paranoid, send an email to the address in the Google form and I can confirm for you.
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Offline dvorcol

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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020
« Reply #25 on: Sun, 10 May 2020, 17:40:20 »
More
Update on order totals - we are close to MOQ on base kits, and we have reached MOQ on child kits!!

Note that we do not yet have numbers from proxies. The numbers below only reflect North America and Korea orders

  • PCE: 45
  • ASCII: 31
  • Numpad: 16
  • SFF: 21
  • Blue: 32

PCE and ASCII are a little far from MOQ still, but with proxies hopefully we will get closer. I will also start discussing with proxies what a buyout to MOQ will look like. I really really really want this set to get made! Now is your last chance to help make history, at least before you're stuck buying at extras pricing :D



I have also decided that, yes, I am going to run an additional buy for the OG vintage windows keys. I will make a separate GB thread for it, and it will run during May. Orders will be through me solely, and shipping will be worldwide (but potentially expensive). I will combine shipping with this GB when possible. The reason this will be possible is that the main GB will depend on color sampling, while the add-on GB will use the same colors. So once colors are approved, I will ask SP manufacture everything at the same time.

The kits will just be 1u and 1.25u keys using the windows logo in this photo: https://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=100969.0;attach=234429;image So if the Windows keys were holding you back, rest assured that if we manage to hit MOQs here then I will definitely go ahead with the Winkeys GB.



Still working on deskmat designs! Like the Winkeys, running this will be dependent on the outcome of the current GB.



As I said in my previous post, you will get an order confirmation before the GB ends. If you really are paranoid, send an email to the address in the Google form and I can confirm for you.



Offline Ywg

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Did we reach MOQ?

Offline tex_live_utility

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Hi all.

GB orders are now closed.

I am still gathering final numbers. But I do not think we have reached MOQ on the PCE and ASCII kits. These are the two most important kits, and without them it would be difficult to use Wyse caps on a modern board.

I am still considering how to proceed from here.

Sourcing vintage keycaps in the right condition and color scheme went from "very easy" to "extremely hard", as at least two major Wyse harvesters discarded all of their keycaps in the last few months. That is 100+ sets completely removed from circulation, likely crushed into a cube somewhere in a landfill. We are also still in the midst of a the Coronavirus pandemic. These two factors have completely warped the economics of this project.

I will continue to post updates here, but it is possible that the project might just be canceled.
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Offline Ensaum

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Just a quick thought. Since we didn't make moq and vintage sets are harder to find now. Why not just turn this project into "DCS Wyse" and make a full set in the old Wyse colorway?
« Last Edit: Wed, 20 May 2020, 14:33:03 by Ensaum »

Offline catamscott

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i'd be interested in knowing how far off we are from moq. i know i'd be willing to buy a few extra sets of both the pce and ascii to help meet moq, but i'm not sure if we're a bit too far from moq to make individuals buying extras a feasible path for hitting moq though.

Just a quick thought. Since we didn't make moq and vintage sets are harder to find now. Why not just turn this project into "DCS Wyse" and make a full set in the Old Wyse colorway?

i wouldn't mind this either. hell, even a gmk wyse would be neat (i know there's been soware, but not a straight wyse themed set right?)

Offline Ensaum

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i wouldn't mind this either. hell, even a gmk wyse would be neat (i know there's been soware, but not a straight wyse themed set right?)

I'm not aware of any GMK Wyse sets. I'd much rather have a DCS set though. I've been wanting a good thin doubleshot set for a while (Great for clickies. And topre theoretically) and GMK has been having.. issues lately.

Offline Ywg

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Another alternative would be to contact the buyers (not really hard we're obviously less than 100), and send them a poll:

How much markup are we willing to accept to make that happen? None, 5$, 10$, 15$.

With this info you could either do a buyout if we're not too far MOQ, or get a quote for a lower MOQ.

Offline aspenc4

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I'm willing to do what I can to help bring this to fruition, so let's see what we can do folks

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


Offline tex_live_utility

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Quick update - with vendor totals we are closer to MOQ than I thought. A buyout is in fact possible. Thank you for your patience :thumb:

Just a quick thought. Since we didn't make moq and vintage sets are harder to find now. Why not just turn this project into "DCS Wyse" and make a full set in the old Wyse colorway?

That's definitely been suggested in the past, and it's a good idea. It's possible that something like this might happen anyway in the future.

Another alternative would be to contact the buyers (not really hard we're obviously less than 100), and send them a poll:

How much markup are we willing to accept to make that happen? None, 5$, 10$, 15$.

With this info you could either do a buyout if we're not too far MOQ, or get a quote for a lower MOQ.

This is a good idea too. I'm not sure how easy it would be for the international vendors to apply this. Which means my orders (Americas) would end up subsidizing the GB. Logistically it might be too difficult. But I will raise it as an option with the vendors.
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Offline Ywg

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Quote
This is a good idea too. I'm not sure how easy it would be for the international vendors to apply this. Which means my orders (Americas) would end up subsidizing the GB. Logistically it might be too difficult. But I will raise it as an option with the vendors.

I don't think the vendors can do anything like that. Changing the price after the transaction... I'm pretty sure that's not legal.

Maybe use a crowdfunding platform to help finance the buyout of the last dozen kits? I don't know it really depends on how far we are from MOQ ? how the resellers feels about that ? are people willing to participate ?

Offline Shadohhh

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 :blank:

Offline Ywg

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Any news? Did it make the cut?

Offline PantoneC

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Same here it has been a month would really like to know as well.

Offline heavyheaded

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I would be for a full DCS WYSE set if it had decent compatibility (like a normal GMK set ala classic red). Not sure if dixiemech fulfillment services would be right for int'l orders though.

Offline Mikhail

  • Posts: 43
Hi everyone!
I want to learn more about DCS caps.
I have old Qume keyboard, and caps are like on some WYSE keyboards:



But I buy modern DCS Midnight set and caps more like on some other WYSE:



So, does this mean that there were two types of DCS molding tools? And which one is used now?

« Last Edit: Wed, 15 July 2020, 06:26:18 by Mikhail »

Offline ideus

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Hi everyone!
I want to learn more about DCS caps.
I have old Qume keyboard, and caps are like on some WYSE keyboards:

Show Image


But I buy modern DCS Midnight set and caps more like on some other WYSE:

Show Image


So, does this mean that there were two types of DCS molding tools? And which one is used now?




The one at the bottom is the cheaper modern version. All the cavities were reworked to hold less plastic. You can see that the excess legend material underneat the key cap is far less than the first. The reinforcement cross is thinner and even the keycap wall and stem are also much thinner. It should be the result of a cost saving project at SP. I have had some DCS and all were of the second cheaper type. I'm sure the thicker version has been discontinued eons ago.



Offline Mikhail

  • Posts: 43
Hi everyone!
I want to learn more about DCS caps.
I have old Qume keyboard, and caps are like on some WYSE keyboards:

Show Image


But I buy modern DCS Midnight set and caps more like on some other WYSE:

Show Image


So, does this mean that there were two types of DCS molding tools? And which one is used now?

The one at the bottom is the cheaper modern version. All the cavities were reworked to hold less plastic. You can see that the excess legend material underneat the key cap is far less than the first. The reinforcement cross is thinner and even the keycap wall and stem are also much thinner. It should be the result of a cost saving project at SP. I have had some DCS and all were of the second cheaper type. I'm sure the thicker version has been discontinued eons ago.

Oh, it sad. Considering a price comparable to GMK, I would like to get the best quality. Maybe it's better to revive the Space Invaders Dye Subs with cherry mount?

Offline HungerMechanic

  • Posts: 577
The old super-thick WYSE DCS keycaps were awesome. I would say they sound better than GMK. It's too bad only the thin DCS is available now, the thick DCS was a world-beater.

Offline Mikhail

  • Posts: 43
Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020 - extended until May 16 and close to MOQ!
« Reply #43 on: Thu, 06 August 2020, 05:44:51 »
The old super-thick WYSE DCS keycaps were awesome. I would say they sound better than GMK. It's too bad only the thin DCS is available now, the thick DCS was a world-beater.

What keyboards did these thick caps have and how can they be identified when looking on top?

Offline tex_live_utility

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 924
  • MX brown apologist
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Re: [GB] DCS Wyse Compatibility 2020 - extended until May 16 and close to MOQ!
« Reply #44 on: Tue, 27 October 2020, 16:06:23 »
As I'm sure some of you have guessed, I have had to cancel this GB  :'(

All international orders should be refunded by now. No money was collected for NA orders.

My life simply took too many weird and difficult turns over the past year for me to feel comfortable collecting and handling other people's money. I was not confident in my ability to manage and fulfill orders. In hindsight, I should have turned over control of the GB to a different community member, but the decision was made and there's no going back.

Moreover, my plans to source a large quantity of NOS Wyse caps ended in failure as 2 large vint black harvesters threw out literally dozens of NOS sets in the weeks leading up to my GB, because they couldn't find buyers and didn't know about this project. This somewhat ruined the value proposition for the project, and the pricing structure & kit design suddenly no longer made sense.

I still want this to exist, but I don't think I can be the one to run it. I am very much open to turning over the project to someone else, including the logos and photo albums of Wyse sets that I collected + whatever notes I had + some additional assets that I had not revealed to the public. I also recommend that the vintage-style Windows key + ISO compatibility be added back to the GB, since there was much more demand for those than I anticipated.

If you are interested in picking up this project, please email me at keyboard@me.gregwerbin.com or message me on Discord at "salt rock lamp#0679".

I have received some messages from people who said they went to nontrivial trouble and expense to acquire Wyse sets in anticipation of this GB. I'm sorry. Please don't throw them out, I will do my best to find someone to adopt this project so that we can finally get our damn compatibility kits.

I'm sorry this didn't work out, but I like to think that I laid some kind of rough foundation for other people to build on.

Thank you to the vendors for taking on this project somewhat last-minute and putting up with my bull****: MyKeyboard, Daily Clack, and iLumKB. Thanks to everyone who provided assistance, advice, and encouragement.
« Last Edit: Tue, 27 October 2020, 16:12:08 by tex_live_utility »
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