Author Topic: Brown cherries, meh. (Read 16176 times)

Pixel_Outlaw · « **on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:01:40 »

So after typing for about a week on these new brown cherries I can honestly say that I am NOT a fan. To me these feel like rubber dome switches because I probably have a very hard key stroke. This is a new board but I don't feel the tactile response that all the fancy charts talk about. I've been typing on a '92 IBM model M for some time now and I will reach for it. I also will say that I like my SMK white rounds over the browns. Maybe it is the silent nature but because I have such a hard keystroke I cannot feel the bump and simply need the noise. I'm a bit dissapointed with these to be honest. They just feel the same as domes to me.

Other than having a spring inside why are browns liked so much? They feel the same as other generic boards to me. Hey to each their own, I can respect people's likes and dislikes.

Nonmouse · « **Reply #1 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:22:19 »

If you pound on your board, you're not going to like Cherry browns. They're for people with a bit of subtly and restraint.

Me, I can feel the actuation point, and I never trip a key by "resting my fingers on the board" (I hear this, but seriously can't comprehend it- it takes pretty noticeable force to push the key down.)

If they're not your thing, though, try the Blues, or even the whites. The whites are not clicky, but have a heavier key weight and more noticeable actuation point. The blues, of clourse, click.

Pixel_Outlaw · « **Reply #2 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:22:47 »

I guess, that they are labeled as tactile and it felt as through I was typing on the bosoms of ghosts. I guess I am confusing something being tactile with something that gives firm feedback such as sound when really they are two different things if you are a light typist. I don't know that I really pound on the keys but I do bottom out most of the time. I lift bricks into trucks all day long and maybe the muscles in my forearms causes my typing style. If I try to type lightly it does hurt after a while. I would not say I type like that angry German kid on Youtube however. (What board is he using I wonder?)

I don't have a keystroke quite this firm...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbcctWbC8Q0

kishy · « **Reply #3 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:29:03 »

My own experience, comparing my views on assorted keyboards against what people write on here, is that if you're primarily a buckling spring user you won't enjoy lighter keyboards (unless you find the M a bit too rough as it is).

It's probably safe to make the assumption that if you really like your Model M, you should stay away from brown Cherry MXs.

Without having (and without intending to have) such a keyboard, I can't say for sure, but this isn't the first time someone has found the tactility on browns way too light (and I think the last time I read a similar complaint it was also a Model M user...I think)

Hamburglar · « **Reply #4 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:30:29 »

If you're looking for a sound then you probably want the Blues.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoiFNqPMQxI

Pixel_Outlaw · « **Reply #5 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:41:59 »

Does anyone have data on the round SMK whites? I assume they are very close to the Cherry blues and they are on one of my other mechanical boards. I would like to see how they compare as they seem to be close from what people have said here. It is interesting that Cherry puts so much information and detail into their product research. These browns seem like a well made switch but again, I'm making many mistakes. I plan to stick to the buckling spring until I can try Cherry blues.

mrbill · « **Reply #6 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:43:21 »

Quote from: ripster;190809

Well, they're liked. But not as much as Clicky Blues or Buckling Springs.

Ever since I got my Filco Tenkeyless boards w/Browns, I've not touched my 104-key Filco w/Blues. Anybody got a "brown" filco they'll trade straight for a "blue"? :smile:

maxlugar · « **Reply #7 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:47:01 »

Quote from: Pixel_Outlaw;190813

I guess, that they are labeled as tactile and it felt as through I was typing on the bosoms of ghosts. I guess I am confusing something being tactile with something that gives firm feedback such as sound when really they are two different things if you are a light typist.

With Cherry MX Brown key switches, the tactile feel is extremely subtle. They feel almost linear to me. The tactile bump feels like a small bit of friction in the key press...like a little piece of grit got stuck in the switch.

IMO, the tactile feedback from Topre key switches ("snap of cup rubber") is much more reassuring.

I don't get people who pride themselves on learning to find the subtle point of actuation when typing. Intentionally trying not to bottom out when typing would only slow me down.

I don't hate Brown Cherries, but I personally prefer less subtle tactility.

kishy · « **Reply #8 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 01:51:05 »

Quote from: maxlugar;190827

I don't hate Brown Cherries, but I personally prefer less subtle tactility.

Click-ping!

iMav · « **Reply #9 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 02:45:39 »

I like the browns quite a bit. Feels like you just flick your fingers at the keys to get them to actuate.

Regarding bottoming out...if you are hitting bottom, full force, then the tactility is doing nothing for you. At the very least, the tactile feedback should allow you to start easing up once you actuate the key...

hyperlinked · « **Reply #10 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 03:06:42 »

As a few people have already mentioned, it's just very hard to feel the tactile point of Browns and like maxlugar, I find it pointless to try and feel it. I type on Browns for their light resistance though I do occasionally have a problem with accidentally actuating the switches with my fingers resting on them (which I try not to do because that creates tension that hurts my hands).

I haven't tried Topres yet, but so far Browns are my favorites by a significant margin, but then again the only problem I have with domes is that they stiffen, catch, and begin performing erratically once you start pounding on them otherwise I probably wouldn't care.

Nonmouse, I actually do pound on my board when I really need to type full speed and maybe that's why I like having a light switch because otherwise I'd be pounding a lot harder. It might be that I'm subconsciously adjusting to the actuation point though.

Rusty Rat · « **Reply #11 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 03:25:52 »

I am 48 hours into a Filco with Blue cherries after coming from a Model M. Cherry Blacks feel like a BS keyboard filled with toothpaste instead of springs. Apart from half the number of clicks I am surprised at just how quickly I have adjusted to this new board. Less pressure to actuate sure but after years of proper keyboards and rubber domes and related nonsense this keyboard is a real pleasure to type on.

The cherry blues may be the closest thing to a BS keyboard?

clickclack · « **Reply #12 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 05:08:51 »

Quote from: iMav;190838

I like the browns quite a bit. Feels like you just flick your fingers at the keys to get them to actuate.

Regarding bottoming out...if you are hitting bottom, full force, then the tactility is doing nothing for you. At the very least, the tactile feedback should allow you to start easing up once you actuate the key...

I pretty much agree with this. I find the brown cherries really relaxing but if you want strong feed back and resistance then probably it's not the board for you. Although the sound is addicting bottoming out or not =)

I don't avoid bottoming out but I do find it comes somewhat naturally when using this type of switch.

Perhaps the cherry clears would be a better fit it the OP wanted to stay with cherry switches. I have noticed that with browns or clears when the spring is stronger it feels much, MUCH more tactile. I figure it's worth mentioning since it's an option often overlooked.

=)

low-fi · « **Reply #13 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 06:05:21 »

I had a Filco with brown cherries, gave it a couple of months and ended up hating it a lot. Brown cherries just suck. Yes, you'll eventually learn how to type on them without bottoming out, but then you'll have to be kinda careful with your fingers which results in slower typing. I never felt totally comfortable typing on the browns, I always had accidential keypresses at totally random situations and the overall key feel isn't all that great to begin with. I actually prefer almost all rubber domes over browns. I might give PCB-mounted browns a shot someday, though..

low-fi · « **Reply #14 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 06:09:56 »

Quote from: Rusty Rat;190844

The cherry blues may be the closest thing to a BS keyboard?

Not really, but I liked the blues instantly after using BS 'boards for a long time. They are somewhat similiar.

kishy · « **Reply #15 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 11:37:39 »

What a Keytronics might feel like?

Company name is Key Tronic...so...a Keytronics is something we've never heard of.

In my opinion the SmarTrex does feel similar to that '97 Key Tronic I sold for 5 bucks.

SpatiallyAware · « **Reply #16 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 11:41:51 »

FWIW.. I sorta suspect that the way Filco coats the keys (while on the board) creates the need for a bit of break-in. It took a good 2-3 hours of typing (plus I actually unplugged it and repeatedly pressed the keys while watching a movie) before the tactile'ness' seemed to be noticeable.

I also noticed that some keys felt different for awhile.. One in particular seemed to have no 'bump' at all until broken in.

I've typed on blues, browns, and blacks. I like the blues the best, but I think the browns are a bit better for FPS gaming (for me)

It's all highly personal.. some people hate the blues and love the browns and vice versa.

audioave10 · « **Reply #17 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 11:42:22 »

I am a hard typist (not a good one) and I like the Deck cherry blacks I have. After getting the G80 with Cherry Blues however, its much more comfortable for typing. The Deck will stay as my gaming board. How these feel to me, and the good info here has convinced me to get a tenkeyless with Blues and avoid the Browns. I am glad for the difference in tactility, which allows alot of different choices.

kishy · « **Reply #18 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 11:51:59 »

Quote from: ripster;190929

I was gonna put in a plug for your SmarTrex listing but since you're so picky I won't bother.

And to think I was going to mail you a special gift...

itlnstln · « **Reply #19 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 11:54:40 »

Quote from: kishy;190939

And to think I was going to mail you a special gift...

I have a special gift for you guys...

Just in time for the World Cup, too.

kishy · « **Reply #20 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 12:04:17 »

Unless I'm mistaken, that kid's Dutch (Feyenoord Rotterdam?).

Is there something you'd like to tell us itlnstln?

Pixel_Outlaw · « **Reply #21 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 14:26:31 »

ripster, in all your chart posting wisdom, where is the info on my white SMK switches? Am I the only one to have these things? I want to know how close these are to Cherry blues. As I said with the browns I can't feel the bump so it becomes more about the click and the SMK whites are the loudest I have they feel pretty linear.

AvengeR · « **Reply #22 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 14:38:41 »

Quote from: ripster;190918

Technically probably no - maybe Montereys. In terms of popularity I'd say yes.

I think when picking a softer switch when you are used to Buckling Springs can get you into trouble. I dub this..

The Valley Of Switch Death
Show Image

Notice it works both ways. I don't think Buckling Springs on a Model M is necessarily the best keyboard any more to advocate to Mechanical Keyboard Noobies if they have been raised on rubber domes. Model Ms in good shape are getting spendy and they have always been a bit more tiring.

I'm pretty comfortable changing it up. For the last couple of days I've been typing on a Unicomp Rubber Dome Model M just to try out what a Keytronics might feel like.

I have always wondered what force would have an "average" (if possible) rubber dome kb (too lazy to do the ripometer test)

hyperlinked · « **Reply #23 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 15:11:08 »

Quote from: AvengeR;190986

I have always wondered what force would have an "average" (if possible) rubber dome kb (too lazy to do the ripometer test)

Most of my rubber domes that I've tested are in the 55g neighborhood... but I don't go around testing every board I see.

Rajagra · « **Reply #24 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 15:21:06 »

I agree that brown Cherries have very, very subtle tactile feel - almost subliminal you might say. (That's what makes them so sublime, :lol:.)

But that doesn't mean they feel like rubber domes. That's just crazy talk, I've never tried a rubber dome board that felt anything like Cherry browns. Some shared attributes, maybe. But not enough to say they are alike.

washuai · « **Reply #25 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 15:56:19 »

Cherry browns definitely don't feel like rubber domes. That's like saying scissor switches, cherry blacks and cherry reds feel like rubber domes. The brown cherries are consistent and lighter.
I know browns aren't for everyone, especially not someone who prefers a higher resistance clicky board.
Just like clicky isn't for me, although the Geek Hack space saver is tempting.

hyperlinked · « **Reply #26 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 16:47:15 »

Quote from: ripster;191001

Walk around with a 50 g weight and a bunch of American nickels. If the cops stop you show them your Geekhack key.

Oh great, one more thing to lug around. I'll never remember to carry it. I'll have to find a 50g wrist watch or maybe I'll steal a hood ornament, shave it down to 50g, glue the GeekHack key to it and be tha Keyboard Thug.

Anyway, as to the Browns feel like domes comment. I suppose pixel was just shouting out in frustration, but to be fair, some domes don't feel too far off from a Brown. They don't sound anything like a Brown, but any of the domes that I'd consider using are probably feel more like a Brown than not.

Pixel_Outlaw · « **Reply #27 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 18:51:31 »

My last dome board was a Key Tronic (IBM case clone) from the mid 90's. Oddly enough it provided a bit more resistance than the browns I believe.

spolia optima · « **Reply #28 on:** Tue, 08 June 2010, 21:19:39 »

Brown cherries FTMFW
I prefer them over blues because, as iMav pointed out, a light tap is all that's required for actuation. they're quite smooth, fast, and no thinking or listening is needed. just let your fingers fly!

Rusty Rat · « **Reply #29 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 00:30:43 »

Quote from: ripster;190949

Did you know that the US is the largest group of foreigners visiting South Africa for the games. You europeans should be ashamed. First we obliterate your culture and then we steal your favorite game.

Cor Bloody Blimey with a population many times larger larger than most European Countries you might even have a tiny chance. How about Australia vs USA in Cricket - our 22 million vs your 310 million pool of potential players?
(Cricket - game of skill and intricate planning played by gentlemen)

platon · « **Reply #30 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 05:00:16 »

Quote from: spolia optima;191122

Brown cherries FTMFW
I prefer them over blues because, as iMav pointed out, a light tap is all that's required for actuation. they're quite smooth, fast, and no thinking or listening is needed. just let your fingers fly!

Browniez are for people who acknowledge the fact that there is no need to physically punish their keyboard and their fingers in order to register a keystroke.

Guardian · « **Reply #31 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 05:27:15 »

Quote from: ripster;191193

Cricket.
Show Image

Grasshopper.

Cricket:

kriminal · « **Reply #32 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 05:28:05 »

comparing cherry browns to rubberdomes..... ppffftt what nonsense....

Rusty Rat · « **Reply #33 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 05:58:09 »

Quote from: Guardian;191218

Grasshopper.

Cricket:
Show Image

Did anybody notice that Ponting's cricket bat is actually a highly modified Model M with a handle. Now you know the secret of why Aussies win at cricket.

kriminal · « **Reply #34 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 07:08:10 »

the fact that you guys know what cricket is.. means you are not americans...

washuai · « **Reply #35 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 13:34:15 »

This is what American's think cricket is. I have to admit, I've never actually seen cricket equipment or people playing it. I think it is a hoax.

lmnop · « **Reply #36 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 13:47:34 »

Rajagra · « **Reply #37 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 18:11:40 »

Quote from: washuai;191317

This is what American's think cricket is.

This is what Americans think football is.

The clue is in the name, but they won't take the hint. :smile:

washuai · « **Reply #38 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 18:25:52 »

We use our feet:

Seriously, even though I'm American, it has always bothered me that nancy rugby is called football, even as a kid, if only because I liked playing soccer.

More foot use (Picture is on the topic of brown cherries, right?):

Rajagra · « **Reply #39 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 18:36:24 »

The original shock and awe. Those few seconds before the pain sets in - and you know it will - are the most psychologically damaging.

Rusty Rat · « **Reply #40 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 18:39:19 »

Quote from: washuai;191317

This is what American's think cricket is. I have to admit, I've never actually seen cricket equipment or people playing it. I think it is a hoax.

****e , you may know about keyboards but cricket – wah! But then again it’s a game played by gentlemen with an added advantage of ‘sledging’ (another Australian sport). Aussies have always been very inventive and you must admit that a model M can serve two purposes, typing on and winning cricket matches.
Sledging – how about the US sends a senior cricket team here and we will choose a junior school side to give you an even chance? We will even let you bring your old Model M’s to play with. (Cricket rules specify Model Ms only – see Aussies are civilised)

Mental Hobbit · « **Reply #41 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 18:45:35 »

Quote from: Rajagra;191408

This is what Americans think football is.

The clue is in the name, but they won't take the hint. :smile:

Actually there are two clues in the name, but they won't take either.

TexasFlood · « **Reply #42 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 19:52:13 »

Quote from: Mental Hobbit;191429

Actually there are two clues in the name, but they won't take either.

I grew up in a small town in South Texas, so clearly football means only one thing, :wink:.

My neighbor was a kicker, which involves kicking a BALL with your FOOT, :smile:. I used to chase his kicks down the street. Clearly he got the better part of that deal.

He was a local star, went on to be a college star, set the still unbroken NCAA record for the longest field goal, was drafted in the first round in what is still the highest selection of a kicker in the NFL draft, was convicted of securities fraud and sentenced to 7 years in federal prison. Clearly he took a wrong turn later in his career but had that FOOT-BALL part down pretty well for quite a while, :biggrin:

Pixel_Outlaw · « **Reply #43 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 20:11:29 »

TexasFlood · « **Reply #44 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 20:39:58 »

Mea culpa

Mea lika

Mea needa CS5

hyperlinked · « **Reply #45 on:** Wed, 09 June 2010, 22:37:49 »

Quote from: Rajagra;191421

The original shock and awe. Those few seconds before the pain sets in - and you know it will - are the most psychologically damaging.

Oooooohh.... definitely not worth saving 3 pts... even with a cup.

A friend of mine was a lacrosse goalie. He couldn't find his cup one day before a game and just decided he'd take his chances.

That is a very very brave man.

Rusty Rat · « **Reply #46 on:** Thu, 10 June 2010, 00:32:29 »

Quote from: ripster;191486

Good point. Those guys keep going OT.

Here is a summary of this thread for late comers.
Show Image

The new CS5 "refine extraction" tool is slick as snot.

Hey ripster there is mention of keyboards in there somewhere and then you put in a picture of Kirstie Alley to really take it OT.

aegrotatio · « **Reply #47 on:** Thu, 10 June 2010, 11:12:13 »

Bumping back to topic at hand...

I'm having a hard time feeling the tactile bump of my ABS M1 keyboard. I still feel like it actuates when the keys bottom out but I know it doesn't.

Which would this ALPS-clone keyboard compare to: Cherry Brown or Black?

ricercar · « **Reply #48 on:** Thu, 10 June 2010, 17:49:56 »

What ripster REALLY meant was this:

Hey I have a kimono just like Benny's. Move over L Ron, I'm gonna be a star.

washuai · « **Reply #49 on:** Thu, 10 June 2010, 21:40:33 »

Dang it, and I thought black Alps might be the one I would like best, since they're supposed to be the least clicky. Why do all the clicky switches get the best tactility? (Ignoring the clicky switches that are linear.)

News:

Author Topic: Brown cherries, meh. (Read 16176 times)