Feedback on personal custom design

[jaymack]

Hey, I am looking for feedback on my next design. Its like 90% done but I'm sure there are small things I can change to make it a bit better. It takes design ideas from Mysterium, Satisfaction75 and Alice. I haven't seen anything like this before but if there are similar ones, send them over and I will look at them.
Here are some Blender Renders I made with simple Blue and White keys:





Its an Aluminum case designed to be Top mounted, burger or solid, with Brass plate right now but it can also be cut out of stainless.


This is the PCB from KiCad. Could be a bit cleaner spacing for the traces but relocating the diodes was harder than I thought it would be.


Biggest thing I'm not sure on is how the bottom of the board should be. Below are two designs that I like but can't decide between.
: Shelf
: Bevel

Anything you guys would want to change on this, let me know. I am completely open to feedback and possible references for changes.

Thanks!

[misononyan]

Jesus man. I don't have much to say other than you have some godlike routing skills. Looks very very interesting though. Definitely the first of its kind.

[Leslieann]

Looks really good.

For the bottom, render it with feet, they will change how you perceive it and may help you better make a choice. I like that bevelled look but once you put feet on there it may look bad. The shelf isn't as nice, but once you add feet it might make more sense.


(warning I'm going to get hyper critical here, it's meant to be constructive, it's a cool design).
While I suspect you're going for a gasket mount, it creates visible gap between the pcb and top plate inside the wrist rest pockets (it may be fine to you but triggering to me). You could get this down to pretty much nothing with tolerances however unless you've got a bottomless wallet and infinite time that's not reasonable. Plus the closer it is the more likely it is to rub, rubbing here would cut your traces. You are going to either have to accept that there is a gap or route the traces to them underneath. If you try closing that gap I would consider ditching gasket mount and/or finding something to eliminate chaffing and closing the gap. It also looks like you can see the pcb edges along the side, no one wants to see that, not all pcb edges look nice.

Chaffing is movement and that brings us to another issue, what holds up the front half of the pcb? Your switches hold it under the keys, but there's nothing along the front edge to hold it. Every keystroke is going to make it flap like wings, it may not be visible bit could cause long term issues with traces. The sides not tucking under the top at the front sides only makes this worse.

Speaking of triggering, your resister layout is cool, but could trigger trypophobia in some, the Apple Mac Pro has the same issue for some people, if nothing else it looks busy compared to the left. Also the two palm rest halves while centered on the keyboard itself, they aren't balanced in any remote way and due to the design is going to be difficult to make it look centered. I'm not sure of an easy way to deal with it, try in an image editor first where you can quickly move it around before committing to doing it in CAD or Blender.

Blender is not CAD, what works in Blender does not always work in in CAD and what works in CAD doesn't always work in real life. You also may have to redo all your work into CAD. It looks like your base has no depth, just a flat plate, it needs some recess for pins and such. Something i repeatedly tell people, RENDER EVERYTHING. Screws, cables, switches, pins, sometimes even tools. They don't need to be perfect, you don't need to render small bits, just a representation of the space required by the object, swicthes can be cubes with pins, but they need proper physical dimensions to make sure things like pin clearance is ensured. Missing something like this can cost you hundreds or even thousands ofd dollars in revisions depending on how much you miss and a perfectionist you are.

Lastly, I hope you have some deep pockets, this won't be cheap by any means.
You have a LOT of carving on both sides of each half, it's large, and thick. That means an expensive chunk of material with LOTS to be removed.

[hvontres]

Looking at this from a machining perspective, I think your upper frame might have some warping issues. When you cut that much material out of a chunk of metal, you can have residual stresses warp the part on you. Not saying it's going to happen, but who ever makes that part for you will probably need to make this in one or two passes to control the warpage and get you a good part. One more thing to watch out for is very sharp corners on the inside of your parts. The smaller the corner, the smaller the cutter used will need to be and that will not save you any money either.

The overall layout looks interesting, I hope you have luck getting it made.

[jaymack]

Thank you all for the comments and feedback. This is why I posted it here. Hyper critical helps cause it give me more things to look into.

Looking at this from a machining perspective, I think your upper frame might have some warping issues. When you cut that much material out of a chunk of metal, you can have residual stresses warp the part on you.

I have seen this happen. It very much depends on the material if its billet or if its tempered.  7075 is much worse for this than 6061 is. i can try and beef up the sides where possible to add stiffness to help with that. Also reduces the machining time.

One more thing to watch out for is very sharp corners on the inside of your parts. The smaller the corner, the smaller the cutter used will need to be and that will not save you any money either.

I made sure the smallest inner corner would be with a 1/8" endmill so that would be for the finishing path. Kind of harder to go larger since the radius could touch the keycap.

(warning I'm going to get hyper critical here, it's meant to be constructive, it's a cool design).
While I suspect you're going for a gasket mount, it creates visible gap between the pcb and top plate inside the wrist rest pockets (it may be fine to you but triggering to me). You could get this down to pretty much nothing with tolerances however unless you've got a bottomless wallet and infinite time that's not reasonable. Plus the closer it is the more likely it is to rub, rubbing here would cut your traces. You are going to either have to accept that there is a gap or route the traces to them underneath. If you try closing that gap I would consider ditching gasket mount and/or finding something to eliminate chaffing and closing the gap. It also looks like you can see the pcb edges along the side, no one wants to see that, not all pcb edges look nice.

Chaffing is movement and that brings us to another issue, what holds up the front half of the pcb? Your switches hold it under the keys, but there's nothing along the front edge to hold it. Every keystroke is going to make it flap like wings, it may not be visible bit could cause long term issues with traces. The sides not tucking under the top at the front sides only makes this worse.

For gasket mounting, it was going to be O-rings under the plate. that makes it so you can change between the two without a different plate needed. I have never used a gasket board so I wanted to be able to try without jumping in fully.  I will see if i can come up with a PCB mount system as well. That will be a fun project as well without having to do a full PCB tear up.

I was going for an 0.1" gap between the pcb and the top plate. you can see it in the image below. that way variances would be hidden well and with that large, it wont look like I am trying to hide the gap and failing. I can see how people dont like that design. I will take your advice and hide the sides of the PCB by making the bevels of the opening larger. This will also help with the stiffness to stop warping.

Speaking of triggering, your resister layout is cool, but could trigger trypophobia in some, the Apple Mac Pro has the same issue for some people, if nothing else it looks busy compared to the left. Also the two palm rest halves while centered on the keyboard itself, they aren't balanced in any remote way and due to the design is going to be difficult to make it look centered. I'm not sure of an easy way to deal with it, try in an image editor first where you can quickly move it around before committing to doing it in CAD or Blender.

The trypophobia is not something I thought of at all. Interesting thing to think of. I will see if i can come up with a redesign to help with that. The fact the two sides are different and the split isnt centered has been something I was having issues with in the initial design. I couldnt come up with something that was even and also not terrible placements for the function keys or arrows. If you have any ideas, I am completely open.

The fact the holes are very different sizes I think is better than both of them being almost even but a bit off. The left and right are different in terms of busyness was an issue i had so i made the SMD parts larger to help with that. i cant think of anything else to put there lol. maybe change from SMD parts to THT to make similar to the diodes. that might help with spacing out more.

Blender is not CAD, what works in Blender does not always work in in CAD and what works in CAD doesn't always work in real life. You also may have to redo all your work into CAD. It looks like your base has no depth, just a flat plate, it needs some recess for pins and such. Something i repeatedly tell people, RENDER EVERYTHING. Screws, cables, switches, pins, sometimes even tools. They don't need to be perfect, you don't need to render small bits, just a representation of the space required by the object, swicthes can be cubes with pins, but they need proper physical dimensions to make sure things like pin clearance is ensured. Missing something like this can cost you hundreds or even thousands ofd dollars in revisions depending on how much you miss and a perfectionist you are.

Yeah, i designed this in Inventor then exported to blender. I didnt think of making the switches but I have added the screws to make sure they are mountable. making the feet is a good shout tho. i will do that and see how it looks.


Thank you for all of the replies. I will take a look at all them and make some changes. I love getting feedback so anymore that you guys have, let me know. Like a couple people said, it will be a pretty penny to make so I want it to be right.

[ddrfraser1]

Wow. Kick ass dude!

[Leslieann]

For gasket mounting, it was going to be O-rings under the plate. that makes it so you can change between the two without a different plate needed. I have never used a gasket board so I wanted to be able to try without jumping in fully.  I will see if i can come up with a PCB mount system as well. That will be a fun project as well without having to do a full PCB tear up.

Why would you need to change to different o-rings?
Gasket mount should not feel much if ANY different than top or bottom mount regardless of the o-rings used. They are not there for suspension, only sound/vibration isolation.

I was going for an 0.1" gap between the pcb and the top plate. you can see it in the image below. that way variances would be hidden well and with that large, it wont look like I am trying to hide the gap and failing. I can see how people dont like that design. I will take your advice and hide the sides of the PCB by making the bevels of the opening larger. This will also help with the stiffness to stop warping.

What I said above goes double here.
Either clamp it or give it a wide berth, not both. If you expect movement (as it sounds above), 0.1mm is not enough.

You can't have it both ways, you have to commit to a lot of movement and give it room to move or clamp it down (which won't work the way you want, it's not a trampoline). There is no dipping your toe in on this, either do or do not, you either commit to one or the other. If you want it to work both ways you have to design it to work both ways or it will not work in either.  Ultimately though, understand, gasket mount is not a dampening system for bottoming out.

As for liking it, I like it, but I can see some people being a bit weirded out by it. If it's only for you, you're the only one that matters.

The fact the holes are very different sizes I think is better than both of them being almost even but a bit off. The left and right are different in terms of busyness was an issue i had so i made the SMD parts larger to help with that. i cant think of anything else to put there lol. maybe change from SMD parts to THT to make similar to the diodes. that might help with spacing out more.

One idea I had was 2 or 3 rows of resistors per side, then scatter the other parts, or run the controller down the right side to offset the resistors, maybe a third window. Another option is further offset the size to give the resistors more room.

Yeah, i designed this in Inventor then exported to blender. I didnt think of making the switches but I have added the screws to make sure they are mountable. making the feet is a good shout tho. i will do that and see how it looks.

This goes back to what works in one but not another...

You drew it up without concern for those parts, while you think it's not an issue here, what if you sent this to manufacturing and had no room for the pins?
DRAW EVERYTHING, because even missing one single hole could cost you hundreds of dollars in do-overs.

Ever work on a car and wonder why it was made like that, nearly impossible to work on? It's because someone had their head so far up in a they couldn't tell  how close it was to something else not being shown while they worked (REALLY, REALLY easy to do) . It's very easy to put a screw in a place you can't actually reach. Or end up with two heads facing each other, making one or the other impossible to use.

It sounds like I'm over emphasizing this but if you haven't designed in cad and sent something out to be made or 3d printed, you really can't grasp how different evaluating something on a screen is compared to holding it in your hand and evaluating it. Ask people doing 3d printing how many revisions they end up making even on simple parts, you would probably be shocked at how many, very simple mistakes happen and are not caught until it's finished. Draw the o-rings, draw the screws, draw the switch pins otherwise you may forget about them and once you send off the plans each mistake costs you money.

You might not like it, but you will feel real stupid if you get the whole thing back from anodizing and realize some tiny part means a complete do-over. Shops generally don't give a discount unless they are all done at the same time.

[TalkingTree]

I do like the display case idea, though 0,1 uF capacitors should be placed as close as possible to the MCU.
I'd also consider replacing TH diodes with SMD ones.

[jaymack]

What I said above goes double here.
Either clamp it or give it a wide berth, not both. If you expect movement (as it sounds above), 0.1mm is not enough.

I mean it will be 0.1 inches. so 2.54mm of gap. pretty wide berth. Sorry, i am using american units. Guess thats not common here.

Ever work on a car and wonder why it was made like that, nearly impossible to work on? It's because someone had their head so far up in a they couldn't tell  how close it was to something else not being shown while they worked (REALLY, REALLY easy to do) . It's very easy to put a screw in a place you can't actually reach. Or end up with two heads facing each other, making one or the other impossible to use.

Its funny you mention that cause I actually do that for a living. I am the guy who looks to make sure the parts have clearance when servicing. I am planning on adding every little thing i can to this.

It sounds like I'm over emphasizing this but if you haven't designed in cad and sent something out to be made or 3d printed, you really can't grasp how different evaluating something on a screen is compared to holding it in your hand and evaluating it. Ask people doing 3d printing how many revisions they end up making even on simple parts, you would probably be shocked at how many, very simple mistakes happen and are not caught until it's finished. Draw the o-rings, draw the screws, draw the switch pins otherwise you may forget about them and once you send off the plans each mistake costs you money.

I know this feeling a bit. Made a mold for a part and didnt take in account thermal expansion during cure and the part was oversized and it cost me another 12hrs my life of machining the thing again to make a new mold. I am planning on adding all the parts in and quadruple checking everything. All the parts you mentioned will be and even the USB cable to make sure there is room and it is centered. Your point wasn't overemphasized.

I do like the display case idea, though 0,1 uF capacitors should be placed as close as possible to the MCU.
I'd also consider replacing TH diodes with SMD ones.

I wasnt aware of the 0,1uF needing to be close. I only knew the 22pF needed to be close to the crystal. I will make that change.
I like the look of TH diodes over smd but if during the reorganizing, if there is less space I will switch to smd. I do think if I do some SMD, tall parts should be and same with TH. maybe not the main chip if its TH tho.

[treeleaf64]

It's asymmetrical.

I don't like the wrist rest thing.

But I can see some people liking the design.

[Leslieann]

I mean it will be 0.1 inches. so 2.54mm of gap. pretty wide berth. Sorry, i am using american units. Guess thats not common here.

Ahh okay.
Standard is still used in construction and things including machine shops, but quiet a bit of the US has gone metric (medical included).
3d printers have exacerbated this and schools have had to embrace it as a result.

I know this feeling a bit. Made a mold for a part and didnt take in account thermal expansion during cure and the part was oversized and it cost me another 12hrs my life of machining the thing again to make a new mold. I am planning on adding all the parts in and quadruple checking everything. All the parts you mentioned will be and even the USB cable to make sure there is room and it is centered. Your point wasn't overemphasized.

Awesome.

Good luck!