EK Leopolds up...sort of

[.XL]

I'm probably in on a cherry brown otaku, but I so wish the windows keys had no bubbles (and he only has the printed replacements, no non-printed makes me a sad panda).  I can probably live with the LED cutouts on the various applicable keys, but solid keys there would be ideal.  

The domed keycaps are a requirement of having the 'Windows' keys. The manufacturer has no say in the matter, unless they'd rather not include 'Windows' keys.

Who uses caps lock anyway.

My brother has rage issues. He uses it all the time.

[oddfuture]

where are the full size leopolds? :[

[lootbag]

awww, no MX Reds.

[keyboardlover]

Not yet at least...

[kidchunks]

the RK-9000 is an embarrassment to their business savvy.

I thought the RK-9000 was decent.

Despite my squeaky backspace key.

[reaper]

Not yet at least...

Soon I hope.  I'll be getting at least one tenkeyless from them for sure. =P

[majestouch]

how quick do you guys think they will sell out? I may not be able to order until the following week.

No idea, the newsletter will go out soon, and the list is lonnng these days.

In your opinion, is the price difference between Filcos and Leopolds warranted at all? Bad business decisions aside, is there anything in the Filco that has the Leopold beat or do you stand by your previous comments that they're on the same level of quality?

I've compared the two in detail in another post recently, to the tune that they're pretty similar on quality. The new buzz on the FILCOs is the FR-4 PCB material, but the way they're marketing it is laughable. I recommended FR-4 for several different reasons and none of them were to improve the feel of typing. Anyone telling you they can "feel" a difference while typing is probably selling snake oil. In any case, I have not evaluated the new FILCO PCB in person, so I cannot comment on what, if any, improvement it will make; as it's benefit is greatly dependent on the material quailty, circuit trace design, and metal plate/switch mounting.

I think you should send me one for testing. I'm very impartial and have never tried blacks so I'd probably write you a rave review!

Sorry, I don't send out review units very often, if at all...also, black switches won't be available in this first run; as I find them to in low demand and a bit of a mixed bag for most customers; they're better suited to be marketed strictly for FPS gamers, which isn't the target of most of our other products.

[keyboardlover]

majestouch, will you offer a board with reds in this first run or if not, eventually?

[oddfuture]

thanks for the update majes guess i'll  have to wait patiently for the full size

[majestouch]

I thought the RK-9000 was decent.

Despite my squeaky backspace key.

It is quite decent for the price. I was alluding to the fact that because it is essentially a FILCO 104 at a much better price, it shows how silly Diatec was for not having exclusive rights to the design, heck even the PCBs in an RK-9000 say FILCO on them. You can imagine how angry this made me the day it came out (I was the first customer). Hell was raised in TW the next day, but that only delayed the sale for a few weeks. Diatec was helpless; so unless they've finally come around and completely bought out rights to that design, then everyone might as well buy an RK if they're looking for a Cherry Blue full-size FILCO.

Put some silicon grease on that backspace.

[Dr.Pepper]

I already have a das. So I'm wondering if it is really what I want... Although I really need a space saving keyboard that fits in my backpack easily so I don't have to type on those awful keyboards at my school. And yeah I am a unix/Linux coder although I don't have a beard. if leopards have cherry red though forget it... Gaming board school, everything!

[theferenc]

Dr.Pepper, if you're a UNIX beard(less), and want a mobile keyboard, why not spring for the HHKB? Worth every penny if you do a lot of programming.

Likely not the best gaming keyboard, though, only having 60 keys and whatnot.

[Mr. Perfect]

Actually 99 has been the plan for many months, there were no knee jerk realizations;) In my mind that is a fair retail price point for imported "made in Taiwan" mech boards of this quality, with 1-2 middlemen, at this point in time. FILCOs are way overpriced because Diatec, quite frankly, over charges distributors.

So that price will stick? Fantastic! I think you just sunk the HMS Rosewill along with the Filcos.

Here's hoping the Geekhack MX clear version makes it to market!

[.XL]

Sorry, I don't send out review units very often, if at all...also, black switches won't be available in this first run; as I find them to in low demand and a bit of a mixed bag for most customers; they're better suited to be marketed strictly for FPS gamers, which isn't the target of most of our other products.

Well I assure you, I will get you recognition! I'll wear a t-shirt while I play, it'll get a lot of exposure.

Then again, I'm not pro and only play at my apartment. And the only person that would see the shirt while I play is my girlfriend...

...maybe not a very good idea for you then

If the only real difference is the PCB, then I doubt it will matter to anyone (definitely not me). Here's to hoping it's the same quality as Filco at $99! And a clear version would be faaaaantastic...

[Wogrim]

Any full-sized leopolds coming?

[majestouch]

Any full-sized leopolds coming?

Not available yet...

[pm_]

This is awesome news.  I'll be pre-ordering a brown.  One question for Majestouch or anyone else, keycaps on the cherry switches are mostly interchangeable, so the lavender WASD Elite Keyboards sells fit the Leopold's too, right?

Also, I'd love to see a Leopold or other quality brand at a hopefully similar price point with a Choc Mini layout, as, you know, I'd have to buy one of those too.   So if you could pass that along...

[ZeNmAc]

Nice.  My long wait is almost over.  I came very close to buying a daskeyboard ultimate (in december) and then realized I wanted a tenkeyless after all.

I will be pre-ordering a tenkeyless w/ browns and blank keys I think.  Christmas gift to myself...seriously.  That is cheaper than I expected TBH.

That might give me a chance to rework my current keyboard.  Mods need to be re-done.  RIT dye keys fail, need to paint the rest of the keys and such .

[neo]

...the cheapest I've heard of a Leopold board being is $105 US

Archiss AS-KB87T (Leopold FC200RT) costs about US$85 in Japan:
http://kakaku.com/item/K0000163355/

Of course international shipping will be outrageously expensive, but the boards themselves are pretty cheap.

[neo]

It is quite decent for the price. I was alluding to the fact that because it is essentially a FILCO 104 at a much better price, it shows how silly Diatec was for not having exclusive rights to the design, heck even the PCBs in an RK-9000 say FILCO on them. You can imagine how angry this made me the day it came out (I was the first customer). Hell was raised in TW the next day, but that only delayed the sale for a few weeks. Diatec was helpless; so unless they've finally come around and completely bought out rights to that design, then everyone might as well buy an RK if they're looking for a Cherry Blue full-size FILCO.

So RK-9000 was the reason for divorce?

[neo]

The domed keycaps are a requirement of having the 'Windows' keys. The manufacturer has no say in the matter, unless they'd rather not include 'Windows' keys.

Only if manufacturer wants to print Windows logo. On blank keys Microsoft doesn't have any say.

[pm_]

So RK-9000 was the reason for divorce?

From what majestouch has said, it sounds like he feels Filco has been too slow to act in a changing marketplace, resulting in products that aren't really price competitive any longer. Sounds like the RK-9000 may have been the wakeup call though.

His margins are probably the same or less on the Leopold, but if they are fairly equivalent (or better) than the Filcos in terms of features and quality, he should move a lot more product.  Either way, we get (hopefully) a similar or better product at a much more competitive price.  Wins all around for Elite Keyboards and consumers.  Much happiness and celebration ensues.  Ripster will post lego pics as evidence.

[Dr.Pepper]

Just an FYI the windows key sucks. Having that little logo sucks. Call it a meta key and be done with it. And I think I might just have to end up buying a happy hacking keyboard... As I don't have $200 I think I'll be trying to find one used. I just don't want to spend a lot and then find out that they also have those in red switches a month from now. Looks like I'll just be happy with my Das and my model m for now, and wait it out.

[itlnstln]

Actually 99 has been the plan for many months, there were no knee jerk realizations;) In my mind that is a fair retail price point for imported "made in Taiwan" mech boards of this quality, with 1-2 middlemen, at this point in time. FILCOs are way overpriced because Diatec, quite frankly, over charges distributors. They buy in dollars, then resell in JPY at a very large margin, distributors are left very little room to move with the strengthening JPY and new competition. Das Keyboard retail is overpriced as well, but for the purpose of distribution and edu discounts, so they survive on their brand name it seems, for the time being.

Bottom line, anyone importing FILCOs into the US will not be able to compete on price. I told Diatec this almost a year and a half ago, this is why I filtered/tested their boards exhaustively in order to build the "value" proposition of the brand name; this is why I recommended the switch to FR-4, this is why I recommended greasing stablizers, key coating improvements, keycap changes, controller improvements, circuit improvements, eye-safe LED biasing, and many other issues which they have no taste for and resisted me on (because they have no engineers and no designers). It didn't help that they got greedy and overextended themselves internationally, but I digress...in any case it's nice they're seeing the light finally, but their margin is still a bit of an insult to distributors, and the RK-9000 is an embarrassment to their business savvy.

That's the Majestouch I like to see.  I like a good, old-fashioned (verbal) ass-whipping.  Stick it to the man, bro!

Great price point, too.  It has me chomping at the bit for a fullsize.

[keyboardlover]

Looks like your expensive Ducky will end up in the corner

[jomiyo]

Well, was gonna wait for reviews, but think I just might go ahead and pull the trigger on the 7th :smile:

[itlnstln]

Looks like your expensive Ducky will end up in the corner

Probably not.  I need a 'board at home.  That, and I am finding that I really like having the shortcut keys in the upper-right corner.  I am going to see how some of the reviews shake out on the Leopolds, too.  Looking at the product pics of the fullsize Leopolds, I'm starting to question if I should get one.  Their lock light area doesn't really jive with my aesthetics.

BTW, the Ducky's were only $110.  The extra $30 was for the wrist rest.  The prices are about in-line with the Leopolds.

The 9008 is every bit as good, if not better, than either of the Filcos I had.

You know... you're starting to sound a lot like Welly these days.

[keyboardlover]

You know... you're starting to sound a lot like Welly these days.

Pot. Kettle.

Black.

[itlnstln]

See?

[RiGS]

It is always nice when emotions are involved.

[RiGS]

You guys should go fight at KBDAuthority.not.

We all get along at Geekhack.org.

It is kinda ironic that you are the one who started trolling KL.

[itlnstln]

It is always nice when emotions are involved.

Absolutely.  You need to feel the love.

[itlnstln]

Lmnop nicknamed me "Spock".  I have no emotions.

Same here.  At least that's what Jung and Keirsey say.  My ex-GFs would have to agree, too.

[RiGS]

Absolutely.  You need to feel the love.

Lol I keep a cat for that.

Actually my friends consider me a sociopath.

[itlnstln]

They're just clearing inventory; bankruptcy sale.  The Majestouch 2s were a bunch of prototypes, and they figured they could make a few bucks selling them off.

[RiGS]

This is probably because Japanese people don't have souls and neither taste.

[itlnstln]

The blue model would have been hot with cream keys.  As feminine as it is, I actually like the new pink model.  At the very least, it shows a little creativity in design.  Black gets boring after awhile.

[woody]

Filco has some new ones in black too.  Last gasps from a dying company.

And then I will sell my Filcos at a high collector price!

[itlnstln]

The gray Filco logo is hot.  They should have used the same printing on the caps.  That would have been a beast.

I really need to do my own group buy. I might do one on my next vacation.

Probably not.  I would rather do cool ****.

[RiGS]

As feminine as it is, I actually like the new pink model. At the very least, it shows a little creativity in design

It could blend into any Hello Kitty collection unnoticeably.

[itlnstln]

In the meantime..

How's last year Ducky - the iRocks keyboards doing?

iRocks?  I think all of 2 people bought that one.  The layout was horrible (among other things).  With the lack of G80-1800-type layouts in the US, they really ****ed up the opportunity to do something awesome there.

[vun]

So does this mean Filco might be going out of business? Considered getting one because they seem to be popular and, from what I've read, pretty good. Not so sure anymore.
Should I pick one up in case Filco dies, or will they be "replaced"?

[woody]

Should I pick one up in case Filco dies, or will they be "replaced"?

I keep a NIB one, which I will sell to you (for ridiculous amount of money) after they close. Soon.

[keyboardlover]

If someone could explain how Filco will be able to compete with Leopold, I'd love to hear it. They aren't going out of business of course, but I doubt they'll survive for long.

[noodles256]

EK has leopolds up $99.

They say it is preorder price.

[RiGS]

Filco already has its reputation. 139$ free shipped is not bad in the US.
Also Filco aesthetically is much better than the gayish Leopold.
Filco will eventually has dual layered pcb.
Also there are a lot of people who prefer costar stabilizers.
Oh, I have almost forgot that the Leopold spacebar is a pain in the ass.

[Armando Penblade]

Noodles: I think Majestouch just said in this thread that the $99 is the permanent price for the tenkeyless boards.

RiGS: I think Ripster just said elsewhere that the Leopolds will also feature a dual-layered pcb.

Person who will inevitably respond while I'm typing this: you suck!

[itlnstln]

I bet Filco will drop their price, or in other words, they should drop their price.  It just depends on how arrogant they are.  Soulhunter was quoted from Costar that their full-size (unbranded) keyboards are $50 for some MOQ.  If that's the case, Diatec's raking in a pretty decent profit from the Filco line once you factor in other expenses.  They probably have room to drop their price some and still profit.  Beyond that, I think there will be a marketing campaign to show Filco as a higher-quality alternative to explain a higher retail price.  Coming from a retail background, I can tell you that customers typically see right through that bull****.  Then again, never underestimate the power of



Just ask Toyota.

[noodles256]

Noodles: I think Majestouch just said in this thread that the $99 is the permanent price for the tenkeyless boards.

RiGS: I think Ripster just said elsewhere that the Leopolds will also feature a dual-layered pcb.

Person who will inevitably respond while I'm typing this: you suck!

$99 is such a competitive price. That is smexy

[Dr.Pepper]

At $99 If they come in red ( switches ), I will get one, but otherwise I'll be happy with my Das. Although that blue Filco is kinda sweet. ( My mother would like the pink one as well )

edit reason: Forgot to add switches