[FINISHED] Faux Cherry Red ESC + RGBY modifier kit

[Atenacius]

I think the font may be a bit small. If you look at where the C ends in the originals, it just passes the halfway mark horizontally across the key surface. It may also be a tad narrow but that could be perspective.

[hashbaz]

[strike]See if we can get a better pic next week maybe.  Would be nice if the text was black instead of washed out.[/strike] Her sending it is way better.

I should have the key early next week and I'll post better pics alongside a real Cherry Escape.  The width does seem a bit small.  Is there a cutter size in between this (0.15") and the letter width of the moogle keys?

[cycloverid]

Moogle 2 was .020"
This one was .015"

Melissa said she MIGHT be able to do a .018".  It just seems awkward that Cherry would use a size like that (and yes, I have done the conversions to mm to see if it's nice and even - it isn't).  Let's wait 'til we get the key before making too many assumptions.

[shawn o]

Too late to order?

[hashbaz]

Too late to order?

Technically yes but whatevs.  PM me what you want and your address.

[infamouskid]

payment sent. thanks.

[Grond]

I think we should put the knowledge base gained with this GB and with the Moogle Kit 2 down on a dedicated wiki page. I mean infos about color codes, cutter size, stem lenght (did we even change that?), font alignement, whatever may be needed for future orders or reference.

[hashbaz]

Alas I didn't ask Melissa to shorten the stem length on the prototype.  That would have been the perfect opportunity to test it out.  In fact I was going into gmail to ask her if it was too late to shorten it when I saw her email with the prototype picture, which was already a day old.

No idea how the prototype got finished so quickly.

[hashbaz]

I think we should put the knowledge base gained with this GB and with the Moogle Kit 2 down on a dedicated wiki page. I mean infos about color codes, cutter size, stem lenght (did we even change that?), font alignement, whatever may be needed for future orders or reference.

This is a great idea.  cycloverid has a lot of knowledge and experience about cutters, etc. and how SP works.  It would be great to capture it in case he isn't the one running future moogle buys.  I can contribute the color codes from Biniaris' investigation about the various RGB sets.

[Atenacius]

That SVG archive would be great for all that info

[shawn o]

2x REDESC
1x RGBY-ANSI
USA
standard shipping

PAYMENT SENT!

[Brendan]

Hey one more thing: I just got my SP order for the two red ESC's I ordered from them and found that while the height is correct, I just wished the sides came down more, essentially making the stem recessed. As it sits right now on my Poker the sides are around 2mm shorter than the other keys.

Brendan

[Grond]

So you confirm that the stem should be shorter, as noted before?

[The_Ed]

**** yeah! Chalk another one up for shorter stems!

[tsangan]

If the stem ends up being too short I'm going to blame it on every single one of you. Longer I can fix, shorter I can't do **** about.

[demik]

If the stem ends up being too short I'm going to blame it on every single one of you. Longer I can fix, shorter I can't do **** about.

Yeah, don't screw this up with short stems.

[hashbaz]

I'm kicking myself for not remembering to ask Melissa to use a shorter stem on the prototype.  My gut is to err on the side of caution and stick with standard stems.

[hashbaz]

GLWIC!

Don't post that in here, son.  Money has been collected, and a prototype made.  This buy is bona fide.

Pic courtesy of Squarebox.   He's too polite to post it here.  Luckily I'm not.  Original pic title though.
(Attachment Link) 34883[/ATTACH]

AVERT YOUR EYES TSANGAN !!

[The_Ed]

Are you telling me Squarebox has "5" cherry red esc?!

[Brendan]

I guess what I mean is this: Will the caps be identical to other, say Filco/Cherry, row 5 profile/size? Because the keys I got from SP today are shorter than the norm.

[hashbaz]

The keys will be SP's regular DCS profile, which doesn't exactly match anything.

[Brendan]

Oh well , thanks!

[tsangan]

Are you telling me Squarebox has "5" cherry red esc?!

He had 6 before :eyebrows:

[hashbaz]

He had 6 before :eyebrows:

DUDE shut up.  Don't tease like that, did you finally get one?

[tsangan]

Something is definitely coming in the mail, that I CANNOT wait to get :dance:

No one better be camping outside my house to snipe my mail, like it happened with a EK order I had recently :rant:

[DanGWanG]

No one better be camping outside my house to snipe my mail, like it happened with a EK order I had recently :rant:

Go on...

[tsangan]

Lets just say I don't know where my Realforce uniform 45g is atm

[squarebox]

Too many people stalking me...


Oh... what the heck...

[tsangan]

Thats what happens when you have such a awesome item

[Atenacius]

Do you use any of them at all?

[squarebox]

Do you use any of them at all?

Nope. I store them in a vault.

[demik]

give me 68 life times and i think i can crack that vault

[The_Ed]

What did you pay for it?!

Hopefully a "reasonable" christmas fortune.

Haven't bought myself my christmas present yet so it can't hurt to ask, but it would also take up next years birthday money too I suspect...

Edit:

Damnit, I just had to find taobaoFOCUS... There goes my money on what is "hopefully" the WNV...

If it is and I get it who will buy the board minus the red 4 from me? It's got new doubleshots...

Edit2:

****!, now I'm gonna turn into a prick like ripster if I do actually get the WNV!

And why is it now 3:38 am on a school day, and why isn't my homework done!

[Grond]

I tried to put down a draft for the wiki. Please excuse my lame english! I hope you guys can help me to correct and improve this draft.

---

Cherry replica keycaps

Overview

Cherry replica keycaps are costum keycaps produced by Signature Plastics and intended to match or re-create as close as possible the looks of original Cherry Keycaps. Several group buys where dedicated to this purpose. This wiki takes account of those attempts in order to create a knowledge base for future orders.

History

Cherry Corporation ceased the production of their double shot ABS keycaps in 2010. However, Cherry double shots are still appreciated and sought after by keyboard enthusiasts. It has become common to harvest Cherry doubleshots from donor keyboards and put them on modern keyboards. Due to differencese in layout and stemming, some keycaps usually prove incompatible. In particular:
- space bar;
- control;
- alt;
- right shift;
- caps lock.

Also, Cherry did not produce double shot Windows and Menu keys. Those caps were pad printed.

In order to solve this issue, GH user Moogle Stiltzkin proposed to order a dedicated kit from Signature Plastics.

The Moogle Kit

Orders for the original Moogle Kits started on January 25, 2011. The kit included:
- 2x 1.25 Alt;
- 2x 1.25 Control;
- 2x 1.25 Windows;
- 2x 1.25 Blank (Windows alternatives);
- 1x spacebar;
- 1x 1.25 Menu key;
- 1x Caps Lock, centered stem, unstepped;
- 1x 2.75 Right shift.

The supplement kit came in white on black or black on beige/grey. Arial font from Signature Plastics was used for legends.

[Color codes???]

Moogle Kit 2

Orders for an improved supplement kit started on August 23, 2011. For this order, GH user cycloverid designed costum SVGs in order to match the original Cherry font. This kit included:
- 2x 1.25 Alt;
- 2x 1.25 Control;
- 2x 1.25 Windows;
- 1x spacebar;
- 1x 1.25 Menu key;
- 1x Caps Lock, centered stem, unstepped;
- 1x 2.75 Right shift.

The supplement kit came in white on black or black on beige/grey. The legends proved to be slightly bolder than the original Cherry keycaps.

[Color codes???]

RGB kits

Cherry produced colorful modifiers that can be found on vintage Desko keyboards. The legends come in black and are dye sublimated. The original RGB is winkkeyless and includes green shifts, red controls and blue alts. The closest SP colors codes are: RA, BFP, VCS.

http://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=263&hilit=rebel+rgb

The original RGB kit has been widely imitated and has become a popular style for costum keycaps.

Sixty’s Rebel RGBY

DT administratoy Sixty started a group buy for a replica RGB kit on March 2, 2011. The kit, known as “Rebel RGBY”, included:
- 1x 2.75 green right Shift;
- 1x 2.25 green left Shift (Ansi);
- 2x 1.5 red Control;
- 2x 1.5 yellow Control.
- 2x 1.5 blue Alt;
- 2x 1.0 row 4 yellow “star” keycap.

White Arial font was used for legends.

[Color codes???]

Aggiejy’s RGB

GH user Aggiejy started a group buy for another RGB kit on July 19, 2011. This kit included:
- 1x 2.75 green right Shift;
- 1x 2.25 green left Shift (Ansi);
- 2x 1.25 red Control;
- 2x 1.25 blue Alt.

White Arial legends on RA, VCM, BNF keycaps.

Hashbaz's Red Esc and RGBY Kit

GH user Hashbaz's started a group buy on November 12, 2011. The orderd used costum legends based on SVGs made by cycloverid for his Moogle Kit 2, and further refined. This was also the first RGB group buy to feature an optional left shift for Iso keyboards. The RGBY kit included:
- 1x 2.75 green right Shift;
- 1x 2.25 green left Shift (Ansi);
- 1x 1.25 green left Shift (Iso);
- 2x 1.25 red Control;
- 2x 1.25 blue Alt.
2x 1.25 yellow “diamond” key (neutral Super key).

White (WA) costum legends on RA, VCM, BNF, YY keycaps.

Hashbaz's group buy also featured a Cherry Red Esc replica. The keycap takes inspiration from the rare costum escape key Cherry produced in 2008 for the Teamwork programmer keyboard designed by the Chinese wNv e-sports team. Costum white (WA) legend on RA keycap.

Known issues

Signature Plastics keycaps from DCS family are the closest to original Cherry keycaps. However, their profile, texture, thickness and stem length do not match exactly.

References

Moogle Kit: http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?14698-Cherry-vintage-beige-white-101-us-ansi-Kit

Moogle Kit 2: http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?20435-Interest-Check-Moogle-Kit-2-Supplement-Cherry-Double-Shots

Rebel Rgb: http://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=263&hilit=rebel+rgb

Aggiejy’s RGB: http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?20058-FINAL-Doubleshot-RGB-Set-from-SP-(Orders-Payments-Deadline)

Hashbaz's Red esc and RGBY: http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?23865-PROTOTYPE-DONE-Faux-Cherry-Red-ESC-RGBY-modifier-kit

[Grond]

The purpose of the quest is not the holy grail, it's the quest itself!

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 34943[/ATTACH]

[Grond]

Right, I'll add a note about color matching under "known issues".

[Brendan]

Posting this here as well, for comparison purposes, this is the SP Red ESC keycap that they sell currently.

...On my Poker, enjoy:















Brendan

[squarebox]

[Brendan]

SP caps right?

[squarebox]

Yup

[shawn o]

Damn, just found out they stock the red esc key in two colors.....

http://keycapsdirect.com/redesc.php

[hashbaz]

I tried to put down a draft for the wiki. Please excuse my lame english! I hope you guys can help me to correct and improve this draft.
...

Wow, thanks Grond!  I'll fill in the color info I know tonight.

[hashbaz]

You guys DO realize Signature Plastics keys are SMALLER than Cherry Corp keys.  I don't mean the sideways profile.  I mean the surface area on top.  The quest to EXACTLY clone a rare AUTHENTIC Cherry Corp Red is futile.

Yes yes, I know.  Matching the real keys perfectly in every respect has never been my quest.  The main goal is to match the font as closely as possible.  The regular SP red Escape stands out like a sore thumb when paired with Cherry 2-shots.  Thus, I chose the colors I liked best and not those that best match authentic Cherry red Escapes and RGB sets.

[Atenacius]

Doesn't anyone think the font is a tad bit too small? The centerline for 'c' should fall within the center of the key, the prototype 'c' falls short. I guess if you're still waiting to receive the prototype I'll just curb my concerns for the time being

EDIT: Yes, like AlleyViper stated, I was referring to the horizontal midpoint/center. But that overlay is perfect, you can pretty much work that out visually

[cycloverid]

Atenacius: You're right about the c falling short of the center line.  My mistake?  I naturally centered the E (the largest letter).

Here's a screen-cap of the Illustrator document (Note: text has a .1mm stroke applied):

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 35026[/ATTACH]

EDIT: Overlay of original cherry:

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 35028[/ATTACH]

Centering looks correct - text a bit small.  Will be good to confirm this in the photos of the prototype once it arrives.  It's important to also note that I have moved the text to the left since I last gave it to hashbaz (according to  comments).

[AlleyViper]

I guess the previous comment was about the c centering on the horizontal, not vertical as you pointed (which seems correct on your svg). On the original key, the letter c seems to be almost perfectly centered on the horizontal (6mm vertical line).
I mean, a kerning issue pointing to not enough letterspace. But this is really awful to fine tune if you haven't access to the prototype key to compare your results, as it's impossible to judge the result solely based on the svg. Not to mention the probably different cherry vs sp surface area/slope.

[hashbaz]

Melissa sent out the prototype on Monday, so I'm expecting it today or tomorrow.  We'll be able to tell then how serious these discrepancies are.

[cycloverid]

AlleyViper:  Doh! Yeah, the c is perfectly centered horizontally.  All that talk of vertical centered got me focused on that.

Moving letters around isn't a huge issue in my mind and is fairly easy.  The bigger concern for me is that SP only has a couple different cutters to choose from around the size we need.  Seeing the prototype will show us whether or not this cutter size is correct.

[hashbaz]

Okay, so the stem length debate seems like it is probably moot.  From my emailings with Melissa:

Quick question.  Is the stem length on SP keys variable?  Could I
choose to make the stems, say, 1 mm shorter if I wanted to?

The length of the mount depends on the type of the keycap. We generally
designate the mount length from the skirt of the keycap - for example: our
4U mount in the DCS family is recessed 0.005" from the bottom skirt of the
keycap.
In order to shorten the mount, we would need to build new core pins - this
would be an added cost of around $400 per pin - can only be used for one
row, so we need at least 4 pins, unless you want to keep the same unit
pricing in which case we would need 8 pins (at $400 each). This would also
extend your lead time substantially...

Ripster, what is the source of your statement that SP can change its stem length at will?

[Atenacius]

That overlay pretty much says it all. The font might need to be scaled up a bit but I think the spacing will be fine. If I learned anything at architecture school, it was to nitpick and scrutinize every line.