Author Topic: Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11  (Read 5359 times)

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Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 12:35:35 »
Was mostly just a request to confirm your shipping address, but there is a little tidbit of information in it as well:

Quote
Manufacturing
 
We are pleased to confirm the schedule to assemble your Truly Ergonomic Keyboard in accordance with your specifications continues to be the third week of November.
 
We will then transport by Air to our warehouse in Vancouver during the fourth week of November, allowing us to deliver your Truly Ergonomic Keyboard afterwards.


That sort of tells me that they have NOT EVEN STARTED ASSEMBLING YET.  I'm getting pretty fed up with these guys, lies, lies, lies.  After all of this they had better deliver and it better be the next best thing around.  They are trying to build high-end boutique keyboards but they are doing it with a super-cheap OEM type approach.  Truly Ergonomics:  Why was there a 6+ week wait between when you claim to have all the bits completed and when you are going to start assembling.  Either these people are that naive or they are deliberately leading everyone around by the nose.  I think it's a bit of both at this point personally.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Input Nirvana

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #1 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 12:57:43 »
THEORY:
Once a weenie, always a weenie.

I'm not joking.
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Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #2 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 13:02:38 »
Well I'm sure the next communication will be something like:
Quote
We have identified an issue with the assembly process.  Unfortunately it has pointed out an issue with some of the parts manufacture and we have to go back to the design phase.  We will ship your keyboards as soon as we get this resolved (meaning another year).
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

fossala

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 13:05:34 »
I think there reply will be.
Quote
Thank you for all your money, we have spent it all and still not finished production. Production has stalled until we can con more poor souls out of their hard earned cash so we can carry on production.
Thanks for the lulz
Truly Ergonomics.

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 13:12:23 »
Quote from: fossala;450596
I think there reply will be.


Yes but they have now even stopped taking pre-orders so no more income stream.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Jim66

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 13:17:18 »
I couldn't agree more fossala. The way that this company conduct business is a total and utter joke. If I had placed an order for this board I would have cancelled it long ago. Not because I would have thought it was a scam, but because their lies are just disrespectful.

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 13:19:53 »
Quote from: ripster;450594
11-11-11 means it will be shipping in 63 days.

At this point I'm honestly not sure they speak binary ;)
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Keymonger

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #7 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 16:07:22 »
Damn, this sucks. I don't really want this keyboard that badly anymore because I'm working on my own... but I still feel like having it. Might as well use and it later sell it, no? I don't know.

Offline sordna

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 12 November 2011, 18:05:14 »
Why don't you ask them on their facebook page? Just look for Truly Ergonomic Ltd.
People have been putting comments there, and TE seem to respond, public forums like their facebook page are a good place get their attention.
« Last Edit: Sat, 12 November 2011, 18:07:23 by sordna »
Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline Input Nirvana

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 13 November 2011, 15:04:04 »
It has the potential to be a pretty neat board, if it is made. Even better, would be a TE-2 in a year or two with user refinements. But the circus is intolerable, and I doubt there will be any form of support or anything else.

Probably the good news (if they deliver at least one) is Geekhacks ability to re-work the keyboard and make a version of it. Who needs China clones?
Kinesis Advantage | RollerMouse Free 2 | Apple Magic Trackpad | Alphagrip | Colemak | all on Mac
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Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 13 November 2011, 19:13:42 »
Quote from: sordna;450738
Why don't you ask them on their facebook page? Just look for Truly Ergonomic Ltd.
People have been putting comments there, and TE seem to respond, public forums like their facebook page are a good place get their attention.

Too much work ... I figure either they will ship or it won't and at this point nothing I can say or do is going to change anything and I'd rather spend my time on a forum that I'm interested in.  I deal with enough braindead companies and support staffs for clients :)
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline shrap

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #11 on: Mon, 14 November 2011, 19:07:45 »
They will probably remove anything negative from their Facebook page, so complaining there is useless. They even have a Twitter.

I wish they spent a bit more time figuring out how to manufacture their keyboard on time instead of marketing on social media.

Offline Lanx

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #12 on: Mon, 14 November 2011, 20:01:54 »
you know, i really hope the keyboard logic works out, be a shame ppl finally get the keyboard and like the firmware is in beta or something.

Offline BartVB

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #13 on: Tue, 15 November 2011, 14:04:35 »
Regarding the firmware:

http://www.trulyergonomic.com/blog.html -> "DIP or double DIP; the technical side of the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard"

I.e. you'll be able to reprogram the board but that means that you'll have to reprogram it with entirely new firmware.

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #14 on: Mon, 21 November 2011, 12:37:25 »
Well it's now officially the fourth week of November ... does anyone want to start a pool on what the next excuse will be?  According to their last correspondence the keyboards should now be assembled (or still in process of assembly) and will be shipped via air this week to their warehouse.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline sordna

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #15 on: Mon, 21 November 2011, 13:39:53 »
May be ask them on facebook where things stand, they'll be forced to quickly answer something :-)
Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 21 November 2011, 13:51:43 »
You can't send them messages and you can't post on their page wall ... all you can do is comment on an existing post.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline sordna

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #17 on: Mon, 21 November 2011, 13:56:51 »
yes, and I do see them answering on several of post comments
Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #18 on: Mon, 21 November 2011, 14:38:27 »
Meh ... I don't think asking questions is going to change anything anyway.  We'll wait and see, have been waiting this long already ...
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Lanx

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #19 on: Mon, 21 November 2011, 16:04:17 »
lol they suck at social marketing if they can only muster 84 likes.

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #20 on: Tue, 22 November 2011, 18:29:30 »
Quote from: Lanx;456936
lol they suck at social marketing if they can only muster 84 likes.

They don't even have a like button on their site, I think only people that have searched and found them via Facebook directly have "liked" them ... they have made a lot more pre-sales than likes I'm sure.  Now if they would just deliver the damned boards ...
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline laffindude

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #21 on: Fri, 25 November 2011, 03:31:50 »
So it is the end of the 4th week of November. Lets see what excuse they'll come up with.

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #22 on: Fri, 25 November 2011, 04:52:34 »
Quote from: laffindude;458830
So it is the end of the 4th week of November. Lets see what excuse they'll come up with.

Ya, that's where my mind is at on it now ... hopefully we're both wrong and they actually have them in hand or at least that they have actually been manufactured now ...
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline DaemonRaccoon

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 26 November 2011, 14:22:42 »
Has hell frozen over? http://www.trulyergonomic.com/preorder.html

Quote
We are pleased to announce that we have finished manufacturing our initial limited production of the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard. We are also able to confirm we are going to have a very limited quantity of Truly Ergonomic Keyboards available for immediate purchase. These will be delivered within a few days of placing an order.
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Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #24 on: Sat, 26 November 2011, 14:27:04 »
And they even announced it on the blog page too ... no emails from them as of yet though ...

http://www.trulyergonomic.com/blog.html

Quote
The Ticking of the Clock

We are pleased to announce that we have finished manufacturing our initial limited production of the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard. We are also able to confirm we received the keyboards at our warehouse in Vancouver during the fourth week of November, allowing us to deliver all pre-orders soon thereafter.

We are going to have a very limited quantity of Truly Ergonomic Keyboards available for immediate purchase. These will be delivered within a few days of placing an order; if you purchase immediately, you may receive it before Xmas.

The Truly Ergonomic Keyboard is manufactured using gold-plated Cherry MX mechanical keyswitches, either Silent, with a Light-click-sound, or with a Soft linear response.

We offer three main models which differ by the number of keys required for various Languages/Layouts. Customers have the option to order their keyboards with printed letters/symbols on the keycaps or they can have blank keycaps. (learn more)

There is no need to install any software to fully use and enjoy the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard, simply plug–in, as it's Windows, Mac, and Linux compatible.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 26 November 2011, 14:36:19 »
I wonder if they will have any "extras" with cherry mx reds for sale ... especially considering that they are now listing them as an option but didn't give the pre-order people the option to change to that.  I'm going to have to send them an email ... which will probably take a week to get answered :(
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline sordna

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #26 on: Sun, 27 November 2011, 01:24:05 »
I see Cherry-style stabilizers. Also, it's interesting that the oversized PCB edges will be cut after the installing the switches, not before, if this photo is indeed showing the regular assembly process:

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 33043[/ATTACH]
Kinesis Contoured Advantage LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Contoured Model 110, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, KBC Poker (Cherry MX Red), IBM Space Saving keyboard (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #27 on: Sun, 27 November 2011, 01:39:29 »
Quote from: sordna;459483
I see Cherry-style stabilizers. Also, it's interesting that the oversized PCB edges will be cut after the installing the switches, not before, if this photo is indeed showing the regular assembly process:

Yes, I'd think that's a bit of an odd way to do things too, but at this point I don't care what steps they use as long as it works properly and they finally deliver them :)  

They seem to have added cherry reds to the main lineup as well from what I see on the other pages, which is great.  It's been 2 days for me so far with this Rosewill with reds and I have to say I'm still totally loving these switches, they feel fantastic and it's really easy for me to type on them without bottoming out much.  Did the o-ring mod as well with the 40A rings.  They are just so smooooooth.  I'm hoping that TE will let me change my order to a board with reds (if they have enough) before they ship.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Online iMav

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #28 on: Wed, 30 November 2011, 20:40:21 »
Has anyone received a shipping notice yet?

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #29 on: Wed, 30 November 2011, 21:20:15 »
Nothing here yet.  I did ask them directly when exchanging emails with their support if they had shipping dates since the keyboards were confirmed in their warehouse but I never got a response.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Online hashbaz

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #30 on: Wed, 30 November 2011, 22:45:23 »
Do we know what these things cost yet?

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #31 on: Thu, 01 December 2011, 10:51:54 »
Nope.  The order page is still a form to send an email and any textual stuff just says it's "priced competitively" with other boards with a similar feature set (there are other split + matrix mech keyboards? LOL)
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Online hashbaz

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #32 on: Thu, 01 December 2011, 10:53:54 »
That sounds like we're looking at Kinesis territory.  $300ish.

Offline Gerk

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #33 on: Thu, 01 December 2011, 10:57:25 »
Who knows.  I think first things first they need to actually deliver the first round.  Can you imagine if this was a group buy?  How the people would be freaking over the amount of time it's taking ... it also seems like they did a "first run" and after that they won't have any stock again.  I thought I remembered the price being around $200 before they took down the preorder stuff .. but it's possible they could jack it up higher too.  I think they are waiting to see how things work out here before they set a final price.

I'm just concerned as to why we are still waiting if they boards have been sitting in the warehouse for a week already as they stated ... maybe they are trying to scrimp and save by doing some final assembly bits themselves (like boxing?) -- doesn't make a lot of sense, but who knows what is going on there.  I just want my board that I "bought" a long long time ago.
Rosewill RK-9000RE (reds) | Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent (browns) | Leopold TKL (browns) | F21-7D "Mechanical Keyboard" (Blue Alps) | Filco Majestouch TKL (blues) | Goldtouch V2 x 2 | Matias Ergo Pro

Offline Sam

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #34 on: Thu, 01 December 2011, 23:25:27 »
Quote from: Gerk;461999
I'm just concerned as to why we are still waiting if they boards have been sitting in the warehouse for a week already as they stated

I wouldn't be surprised if they sent out some sort of email saying "We're very sorry, but the order received wasn't up to our high standards.  We will need to redesign and find another manufacturer to build the keyboard which will meet our high specifications.  Rest assured you will receive your keyboard as soon as we are able to produce it and get it right.  Expect it to be no later than 2015.  Thank you again for your patience."

For a laugh, have a look at this post from December, 2009. They then were expecting to have a product by 2nd quarter, 2010.  And nearly two years later, still no keyboard.
« Last Edit: Thu, 01 December 2011, 23:41:12 by Sam »

Offline Input Nirvana

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #35 on: Fri, 02 December 2011, 11:07:33 »
The moment these keyboards are delivered (**IF**), I get the feeling 99% of everything will be forgiven, especially if the keyboard is overall decent. So I look forward to a resolution: A) deliver the damn things so I can get some feedback on a few features that I may want to incorporate into other mods, B) have the two 17 year olds go belly up officially, C) for lulz, start taking additional pre-orders for the "keyboard that shall not be had".

I will be curious to see what "high standards" means in their eyes, since they are using that as a primary excuse.

And I still believe (since they downgraded their high standards to dip switches) that we could have made one of these in 90 days. (See Phantom for a great example).
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Online hoggy

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #36 on: Sat, 03 December 2011, 09:18:12 »
I asked a question on their facebook page and they deleted the entire entry!

I only asked if their keyboard was adjustable.  Okay, it was a little bit mean, but they were suggesting it.
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http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=54680.0

Offline biochem

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #37 on: Sat, 03 December 2011, 10:06:44 »
Quote from: sordna;459483
I see Cherry-style stabilizers. Also, it's interesting that the oversized PCB edges will be cut after the installing the switches, not before, if this photo is indeed showing the regular assembly process:

(Attachment Link) 33043[/ATTACH]


Could the oversized PCB indicate that this is just a test assembly of a prototype?
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Offline Input Nirvana

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #38 on: Sat, 03 December 2011, 10:07:05 »
Damn you hoggy! You got a Datahand and now you are getting too big for your britches! Now those clowns will never deliver that stupid keyboard! LOL

How's that dvorak on your Datahand coming along?
Kinesis Advantage | RollerMouse Free 2 | Apple Magic Trackpad | Alphagrip | Colemak | all on Mac
Evil Screaming Flying Door Monkeys From Hell           Proudly GeekWhacking since 2009
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I AM THE REAPER . . . BECAUSE I KILL IT
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Offline Input Nirvana

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #39 on: Sat, 03 December 2011, 10:09:44 »
Quote from: hoggy;463325
I asked a question on their facebook page and they deleted the entire entry!

I only asked if their keyboard was adjustable.  Okay, it was a little bit mean, but they were suggesting it.

Darn you hoggy! You get a Datahand  and you start pushing all the old style keyboards around! Now those weak bastards will never deliver that stupid board! LOL

How's that dvorak on your Datahand coming along?
Kinesis Advantage | RollerMouse Free 2 | Apple Magic Trackpad | Alphagrip | Colemak | all on Mac
Evil Screaming Flying Door Monkeys From Hell           Proudly GeekWhacking since 2009
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Online hoggy

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #40 on: Sat, 03 December 2011, 12:43:42 »
I love the datahand.  I must confess that it's been sitting in a cupboard for a while now.  Got to 20wpm on it quite quickly, but had to put it away for a couple of weeks.  Slap wrists...
GH Ergonomic Guide (in progress)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=54680.0

Offline Input Nirvana

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #41 on: Sat, 03 December 2011, 14:21:49 »
Quote from: hoggy;463429
I love the datahand.  I must confess that it's been sitting in a cupboard for a while now.  Got to 20wpm on it quite quickly, but had to put it away for a couple of weeks.  Slap wrists...

YIKES! Don't let Webwit know it's there, I'd hate to hear that some guy dressed in black with a dagger in his mouth burst through your window and beelined it for the cupboard then left "The Duck was here" calling card!!!!
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Online hoggy

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #42 on: Sun, 04 December 2011, 00:10:28 »
"All because the Duck loves Datahands..."
GH Ergonomic Guide (in progress)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=54680.0

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Truly Ergonomic Communication 11-11-11
« Reply #43 on: Sun, 04 December 2011, 01:50:47 »
- DataDuck -

A recurring thought I've had for a few years was to create a supplemental Datahand website (with Datahands blessing) for user group information, support, FS/WTB, mods/repairs, gallery, links to anything Datahand on the web, blah blah blah. It would be the 'go to' place for everything Datahand, and possibly would be able to also keep it 'out there' a bit more which might be good overall.

Just blabbing.
Kinesis Advantage | RollerMouse Free 2 | Apple Magic Trackpad | Alphagrip | Colemak | all on Mac
Evil Screaming Flying Door Monkeys From Hell           Proudly GeekWhacking since 2009
Staying in touch with Tapatalk Pro                               Thanks much, Smallfry  
I AM THE REAPER . . . BECAUSE I KILL IT
~retired from forum activities 2015~