Author Topic: [feedback] Poker metal case construction  (Read 15653 times)

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Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 12:32:09 »
EDIT: autocad file http://www.mediafire.com/?8cluwi4b3nh0dwf and picture
[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 41289[/ATTACH]

This is not an interest check or group buy, that will happen later.
Some people might have seen that before I was trying to make a metal case for a Filco, but Vortex recently showed off a CNC'd one that looks better than what I could do. A lot of people were kind of dubious about the poker/pure case they had though so I thought I'd do that instead.
I finally managed to catch a time where my friend and I can get together to go to the metalworking shop his dad owns and it's going to be this Thursday, so I need to get things finalized for then.

I had already taken measurements for the Poker a long time ago but I'm going to go over them again. Some things for your consideration that I want feedback on though are:

1) Thickness of the casing. I was thinking about 1/8" or 3/16".
2) Should I even cut out a hole for the DIP switch access? Most people only touch it once, and then not having the hole in the bottom might be nicer. If you did need to change them you could remove the PCB for a second to switch it, which just involves removing 5 screws and is easy to do for something that you don't have to do often.
3) Instead of having cylinders sticking up from the bottom of the case to accept the screws, should I just cut threaded holes into the case itself? Then the PCB could sit on the bottom of the case (with a thin cushion of some fabric) and would be sturdier, since some people talk about how the Poker's PCB flexes.
4) Maybe have a mirrored top piece that could be hinged to act as a cover? Would need some latch on the front to close it as well.
5) How high up do you want the size of the case to come relative to the keys? Just to the bottom edge of the key?

Any other feedback would be appreciated! If someone is particularly good with autoCAD and wants to draw it up once I get all the dimensions that would be good too. I did it myself with the Filco blueprints but it took me forever because I'm an autoCAD noob.
« Last Edit: Tue, 21 February 2012, 14:17:19 by oneproduct »
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline mkawa

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #1 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 13:05:02 »
imo imsto had basically the ideal design for a poker case

flat tray with lip somewhere between 14-17mm tall, 3-5mm thick alu all the way around, rounded edges everywhere possible; no cylinders for board mounting, instead drill and tap holes and countersink for a standard metric nylon washer about 0.5-1mm deep. on the bottom (ie, the side that lies on one's desk), drill and tap for some standard metric machine screw(s) on left and right side, and machine your favorite standoff design.

anyway, i've started a design in sketchup, and have both a poker and a digital caliper; let me know if you need help (assuming you can actually make this happen in the next month...)
« Last Edit: Mon, 20 February 2012, 13:29:58 by mkawa »

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #2 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 14:00:02 »
Quote from: mkawa;519714
anyway, i've started a design in sketchup, and have both a poker and a digital caliper; let me know if you need help (assuming you can actually make this happen in the next month...)

Here's what I have to the nearest .5 mm just using a ruler. If you'd like to verify it that would be good. I don't think that I intend to cut out a hole to access the DIP switches because you basically only need to set them once and you will likely never change them after, so having a hole on the bottom for it just seems ugly. If you need to change the DIP switches you can get to them easily by removing 8 keycaps to get at 5 screws.

PCB
-286 mm across
-94 mm tall
-2 mm thick

HOLES (measured to center, with directions given with the switches facing up)
-side (x2)
   -37 mm from bottom
   -2.5 mm from edge
   -2 mm in diameter
-bottom (spacebar)
   -95 mm from right side
   -9 mm from bottom
   -2 mm in diameter
-top (x2)
   -25.5 mm from side
   -66 mm from bottom
   -2 mm in diameter
   
USB
-14 mm to 22 mm across, from left side (need to cut this out)
-3 mm tall (maximum clearance required of all objects sticking from bottom side of PCB)

WALLS
-10.5 mm from top of PCB to bottom of keycap
-3 mm from bottom of PCB to bottom of USB connection
-2 mm PCB thickness
-TOTAL = 15.5 mm from base of case to top of walls

Also, I should mention that this is not going to be CNC'd. He has some machine to do cuts and then another to do bends, so in autoCAD I'm just making a 2D blueprint, as though the case were an unfolded cube.
« Last Edit: Mon, 20 February 2012, 14:25:38 by oneproduct »
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #3 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 16:33:57 »
Doesn't look like much, but the poker case is fairly simple. It's built to the dimensions listed above, with 1.5 mm allocated all around the PCB for a little bit of tolerance, and because you have to be able to tilt it a bit to get the USB receiving end in. The walls and USB cutout were raised 1 mm to allow for some cushioning, probably using this spongy, non-slippy material similar to what I had seen in imsto's cases.

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 41219[/ATTACH] [ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 41220[/ATTACH]

Link to the autoCAD file: http://www.mediafire.com/?glr7lnf3799sqhd (if somebody could label the dimensions that would be cool. I can't seem to remember how to do that, even though I managed to do it in my Filco blueprints. This was my second time using autoCAD. :P

So probably going to just tap the screw holes into the base of the case itself and not have a hole for the DIP switches. The machine will just cut out the + shape, bend it, then the corners will be welded together. Should be quick, easy and cheap to make. Probably going to make the walls of the case 3/16" thick, for those with a Filco, that's about the thickness of the back wall of the casing. The plastic poker case is a bit under 2/16".
« Last Edit: Mon, 20 February 2012, 16:56:10 by oneproduct »
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline Bertross

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #4 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 16:56:22 »
Can we laser engrave the Poker logo somewhere like the filco on the front right? Or even on the bottom large? Just a thought. IM highly interested in this project.
REALFORCE 86UB / FILCO MJ2 87 BROWN PBT WHITE/BLUE

Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #5 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:01:51 »
I asked about that last time and I think that what they use to cut the metal isn't fine tuned enough to do engravings as opposed to just cutting right through. I could check, but somebody would have to recreate the logo in autoCAD and I certainly wouldn't know where to begin to draw the fancy lettering in the font they use, plus if I can't do it it would be a waste of time for the person that drew it up. http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/710/kbtosellpics022.jpg/
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline lightsout714

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #6 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:03:50 »
I think the current case looks pretty good. I personally vote to just stick with that design. A lid sounds like it would jack up the price.

Offline Findecanor

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #7 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:04:26 »
Ah, so the keyboard in this case will be flat, with the bottom row higher than ordinary.
3/16" is almost 5 mm. I think that it will be difficult to bend without warping.
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Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #8 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:10:21 »
Quote from: Findecanor;519899
Ah, so the keyboard in this case will be flat, with the bottom row higher than ordinary.
3/16" is almost 5 mm. I think that it will be difficult to bend without warping.

Yea, the bottom of the case will be flat, just like the ones produced before but can be angled up by attaching some sort of feet. Not sure how I'll handle that yet or if I'll leave it to the end user to just buy some rubber feet and stick it on to the bottom.

I think that the machinery they have there can bend it without a problem, but if not I'll go down to 2/16" (seems that when I use imperial I hesitate to write it as 1/8" because I worry that some people wouldn't see the degree of change).
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline metafour

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #9 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:16:31 »
The existing cases weren't folded up were they?

Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #10 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:18:07 »
No, they were made using CNC, so they start with a solid block of metal and just hollow it out, this isn't the same. The place I'm going to usually does more heavy duty, large stuff, so they have simple but powerful machinery.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline metafour

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #11 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:20:26 »
Original materials should be cheaper then I would assume since you're going to end up with less waste?

Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #12 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:25:41 »
Ya, the material cost is almost nothing, it costs like less than $10 to buy the small sheet of metal you need to do this. It's the labor that we'll be paying for.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline metafour

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #13 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:33:19 »
Looking forward to the outcome as I really need one of these for my Poker.

Offline lightsout714

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #14 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:33:38 »
Oh so there will be some sort of welds on this? Or something joining the seems? Are we still using aluminum?

Offline oneproduct

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #15 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:41:57 »
There will be welding, but I've been told that it shouldn't really be noticeable. I think that after the welding they do something to remove the signs of it, as if you were sanding metal maybe to make it smooth? I don't really know that much about it so I can't say for sure. I can do aluminum or steel and will probably try to get some of both.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline lightsout714

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 17:45:16 »
Imo aluminum looks much nicer then steel.

Offline Bertross

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #17 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 18:00:25 »
Quote from: lightsout714;519934
Imo aluminum looks much nicer then steel.

certainly when it has a brushed effect like Lian Li Cases. TO - DIE - FOR!!!
REALFORCE 86UB / FILCO MJ2 87 BROWN PBT WHITE/BLUE

Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #18 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 19:20:50 »
Actually, it occurs to me that I can't screw the PCB as directly to the bottom of the case as I wanted as the USB insert and several other things on the bottom makes the bottom of the PCB uneven, so I'll have to do like imsto's cases with cylinders that the PCB stands on that receive the screws.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline mkawa

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[feedback] Poker metal case construction
« Reply #19 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 19:35:12 »
5mm sheets won't bend to 90o. in general, i think the issue here is going to be tolerances. the machines they use probably aren't used to the kinds of tolerances we need. welds take up non-trivial amounts of space as well (and for some reason i think there are some issues with welding aluminum alloys, but i don't know enough about these things to know exactly what they might be). finally, I don't think the case will work at all without provisioning for standoffs to keep the case from lying flat.

re: board mounting: that's why i said countersink for washers. it's easier to set nylon washers into the case than to try to machine standoffs into it if you're going to try to stamp the things out of sheets.

knowing that you don't have access to multi-axis CNC, i'm not so confident in this, but i'm interested in seeing what the prototype looks like.

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #20 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 20:24:21 »
Yea, I'll have to see about the tolerances. My friend had an arcade stick made there (as in a controller for console games) which is about the same size as a keyboard and has somewhat specific tolerances for the joystick and buttons that have to be put into it.

I'm not the best when it comes to this kind of thing, what would be the purpose of countersinking washers? For the moment I was thinking of doing something similar to this http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc467/jpm804/Keyboard%20Stuff/DPP_0137.jpg where it looks like there are basically just nuts welded onto the bottom.

As for keeping the case from lying flat, I think it would be easy to simply attach rubber feet to it, and the end user could decide what size rubber feet they wanted to use to suit their desired angle of inclination. Just things like this that adhere to the bottom: http://www.westfloridacomponents.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/large-round-rubber-foot-49.jpg

Imsto's version included 3 sets of different height CNC'd feet. I could try to provide it with one standard pair and/or prepare something along the underside of the case to accept screws though. But honestly, even if it lies flat, I don't see that being a problem. It's unergonomic to use the feet provided on the underside of keyboards and all mine lie flat.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline mkawa

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« Reply #21 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 20:34:18 »
imo the advantage of washers is that they could be nylon (ie, ESD safe), and you could choose your standoff height depending on what material you used between the board and case.

i'm actually not sure how i feel about leaving the case flat. i'm not into large rubber feet though. too much movement.

god, imsto's case is so sexy.

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline alaricljs

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« Reply #22 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 20:36:31 »
The point behind the countersinking is there's this little pocket that prevents the washer from moving laterally for any reason.  Gives it the same structural effect as a threaded standoff.
Filco w/ Imsto thick PBT
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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #23 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 20:37:25 »
But don't I need a nut for its threading? Washers don't have threading and are just to leave a soft, level contact point, aren't they? Forgive me if I'm sounding silly.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline alaricljs

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« Reply #24 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 20:49:19 »
Ok, the idea is to drill and tap a hole in the plate and have a countersunk pocket around the threaded hole.  Drop the washer in the pocket place board on top screw board down.
Filco w/ Imsto thick PBT
Ducky 1087XM PCB+Plate, w/ Matias "Quiet Click" spring-swapped w/ XM Greens

Offline mkawa

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« Reply #25 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 20:51:06 »
thanks for clarifying for me, alaricljs

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #26 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:00:16 »
Right, but the problem here was that since the USB receiver sticks out 3 mm from the bottom of the PCB, there has to be something to fill that space over the rest of the board. I can't just fill it with whatever I use to cushion it, because the material compresses somewhat and it would be hard to ensure that the screws would keep the board level, because there wouldn't be a hard limit where you couldn't tighten them anymore. So instead, 3 mm tall nuts welded to the bottom of the case come up to meet the PCB. You could then place a washer between the nut and the PCB if you prefer to not have metal contacting the PCB.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline Elrobo

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« Reply #27 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:16:40 »
I have nothing useful to contribute design wise, but I am currently waiting to get my hands on my own poker and am very interested in how this case turns out. Can't wait to see a sample or refined design.

Offline turbocharged

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« Reply #28 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:19:10 »
Raw stainless would look great if that is an option at all.
| Deck Legend Fire (MX Blacks) | KBC Poker X (MX Reds) | Cherry G80-11900LTMUS (MX Clears) |  Cherry G80-11900HRMUS (MX "Ghetto Reds")
| IBM Model M 1391401 (BS) | Goldtouch GTC-0033 Keypad (MX Browns) |

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Offline mkawa

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« Reply #29 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:19:45 »
Quote from: oneproduct;520098
Right, but the problem here was that since the USB receiver sticks out 3 mm from the bottom of the PCB, there has to be something to fill that space over the rest of the board. I can't just fill it with whatever I use to cushion it, because the material compresses somewhat and it would be hard to ensure that the screws would keep the board level, because there wouldn't be a hard limit where you couldn't tighten them anymore. So instead, 3 mm tall nuts welded to the bottom of the case come up to meet the PCB. You could then place a washer between the nut and the PCB if you prefer to not have metal contacting the PCB.
stamp a hole in the bottom plate under the usb jack. this kills several birds with one stone actually, since if your pcb standoff height is 3mm you're never going to get the board to stop flexing anyway.

ps, you can get nylon washers that are 3mm tall.

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline Elrick

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« Reply #30 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:27:33 »
Quote from: oneproduct;519932
There will be welding, but I've been told that it shouldn't really be noticeable. I think that after the welding they do something to remove the signs of it, as if you were sanding metal maybe to make it smooth? I don't really know that much about it so I can't say for sure. I can do aluminum or steel and will probably try to get some of both.

PLEASE include the welding part, it helps to signify that there is a serious man-made keyboard at work.

I've always loved weld marks.  It shows who's the BOSS, no smoothing to look like a babies arse, but a no nonsense casing built to take a pounding.

Do not start to spend time sanding and smoothing it, it'll be basically for soft btches[/I] rather than built for men to use.
« Last Edit: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:30:31 by Elrick »

Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #31 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:29:49 »
There are two other things on the bottom of the PCB that I'd also have to stamp a hole in for before the bottom would be relatively flat (the dipswitch box and something I don't know how to refer to), but assuming I did then a tiny bit of cushioning would leave the rest of the board relatively flat and this would be good. I'll consider this idea because it would be pretty awesome to have the PCB attached directly to the bottom of the case.

If I didn't do this, 3mm tall washers wouldn't be all that great though because the screw would have to be that much longer to reach down to the threaded part in the body of the case.
Layout: Colemak
Fastest typing speed: 131 WPM on typeracer, 136 WPM on 10fastfingers.
Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
Ergo keyboards: Truly Ergonomic, Kinesis Advantage, Ergodox

Offline lightsout714

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« Reply #32 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 21:33:27 »
Quote from: Elrick;520119
PLEASE include the welding part, it helps to signify that there is a serious man-made keyboard at work.

I've always loved weld marks.  It shows who's the BOSS, no smoothing to look like a babies arse, but a no nonsense casing built to take a pounding.

Do not start to spend time sanding and smoothing it, it'll be basically for soft btches[/I] rather than built for men to use.

Especially on aluminum welds look *****in.

Offline h2oxide

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« Reply #33 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 22:13:01 »
Subscribed, look forward to this

Offline mkawa

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« Reply #34 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 22:29:10 »
Quote from: oneproduct;520120
There are two other things on the bottom of the PCB that I'd also have to stamp a hole in for before the bottom would be relatively flat (the dipswitch box and something I don't know how to refer to), but assuming I did then a tiny bit of cushioning would leave the rest of the board relatively flat and this would be good. I'll consider this idea because it would be pretty awesome to have the PCB attached directly to the bottom of the case.
actually i totally think this is the way to go now. also, thinking more about the stamping thing, it's not even clear to me that one needs to do any welding. let's say that you bent up a 3-5mm high lip only on the front and back of the plate. with a 5mm thick sheet that would be enough rigidity for the hulk to type on the thing.

the only potential downside would be no lip on the short ends of the keyboard. but, a) the bend would look awesome in profile and b) we could have colored insulating layers cut for the space between the pcb and case, which would look awesome+ in profile. also, because all you need to construct one is a sheet metal bender and a drill press, i imagine this would be very cheap.

finally, stamping out holes in the bottom of the plate could potentially solve some standing problems with the dox design..

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline metafour

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« Reply #35 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 22:31:59 »
Quote from: Elrick;520119
PLEASE include the welding part, it helps to signify that there is a serious man-made keyboard at work.

I've always loved weld marks.  It shows who's the BOSS, no smoothing to look like a babies arse, but a no nonsense casing built to take a pounding.

Do not start to spend time sanding and smoothing it, it'll be basically for soft btches[/I] rather than built for men to use.

I disagree with this.

Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #36 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 22:57:19 »
Quote from: mkawa;520197
let's say that you bent up a 3-5mm high lip only on the front and back of the plate. with a 5mm thick sheet that would be enough rigidity for the hulk to type on the thing.

the only potential downside would be no lip on the short ends of the keyboard

This is the reason that a lot of people were not too happy with Vortex's design for a poker case, which had low walls all the way around. They didn't seem to like the switches/pcb being that exposed. I could go either way really, but I think to make most people happy I have to do all four walls, and pretty much the reason I am trying this, since otherwise they could just get CNC'd cases from Vortex in the near future (thought at a much higher cost than what I am expecting this to be).

Definitely going to follow up on this stamping thing. The case will definitely have to be 3/16" thick at least to be able to accommodate 3mm for the usb jack to fit down into.
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Offline ekw808

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« Reply #37 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 23:00:45 »
If all goes well, any hope for a race run???
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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #38 on: Mon, 20 February 2012, 23:21:42 »
I don't own a race, so probably not.
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Offline duncan

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« Reply #39 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 05:31:24 »
Really interested in this idea.

Are you still thinking of doing both alu and steel prototypes?

A steel option would set yours well apart from the Vortex alu ones.

In steel I could see mkawa's idea of a simple u bend with the relevant punch outs and open sides being quite an appealing 'skeleton' option that would be simpler to make and still meet some of Elrick's macho needs.

Because of the weight etc of the steel it would be a different thing to the same thing in alu which, I agree with you, might not have enough interest to be worth developing.

Anyway very interested in seeing how this goes forward and thanks for sharing.

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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #40 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 06:28:04 »
Hmm, okay. If I do this skeleton case, do you think I should bend just the front and back sides or just the left and right sides? Things to consider are:

1) The usb jack is in the back, so if there was no back bend I wouldn't have to cut a hole into it, which is easier. If there was a back piece the little hole in it may be a bit ugly.
2) There's LEDs on four keys in the front row, so if there's no front bend you can see them very easily. Cool to show off, but maybe too bright?
3) If there's no front, then the person sitting at the keyboard gets to look at it's insides. If there's no sides, then the people around you get to look at it's insides.

I'm thinking that covering the left and right is a bit better, and easier because of the USB jack. But again, not sure if I really want to do this because then the Vortex case would probably be a better option. Maybe I'll make one to see.
Layout: Colemak
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Offline tsangan

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« Reply #41 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 09:26:21 »
Hoping you complete this :thumb:

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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #42 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 10:03:30 »
It probably won't be as professional as imsto's cases, assuming it works at all, but if it does work it should be cheaper and hopefully more than just 12 of them.

I talked to my friend again and he said that the machine he has can bend 1" of steel without a problem, so the 3/16" I had in mind should be a breeze. He did say that the piece you are trying to bend can't be too small, which could be a problem, but if that's an issue, I could make the walls big just for the sake of bending them then cut the metal walls down to size probably.
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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #43 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 11:24:19 »
Apparently the 15.5 mm bends for the walls are fine. From email convos:

Me:
Quote
Oh, are cuts a problem if they are too small? Or we can use a much smaller machine to do small cuts, right? Basically there is just one small cut which is like 3mm x 8mm for a USB jack. Other than that the only small things would be making holes with a drill bit, but I imagine that should be fine.

For bends, the smallest bend would be perhaps 15.5 mm, which is quite small still. That's the side edge of the keyboard case that goes halfway up the height of a key. If that's too small, then I could do another case design where the side edges of the keyboard case go up a bit higher and there just wouldn't be any front or back edge. Without a back edge I wouldn't need the USB jack hole either.

Anyways, if you're busy with your trip I can wait to discuss this later.

Him:
Quote
It's ok. I check my phone for emails when I'm chillin' in the car. We can do any cuts. And that bend is fine.
Layout: Colemak
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Offline mkawa

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« Reply #44 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 12:20:51 »
i think the advantage of this design over the vortex case is a) it'll be < 25% of the cost, b) it will be possible to get one. i'm not all that hopeful of more than a handful of vortex al cases making it out of china, and each one will be on the order of 160-170$.

also honestly if you don't make these i'm probably going to have the campus machine shop make a couple for me...

argument for front to back U: rigidity. argument against: simplicity. you might want to prototype both and try them out.

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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #45 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 13:50:42 »
New blueprints, both screenshot and autoCAD file. The red part is the body, the white part are places that need to sink in 2.5mm, the clear part needs to be cut all the way through. All the measurements are labelled now.

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 41287[/ATTACH]

http://www.mediafire.com/?8cluwi4b3nh0dwf

Going to try for the four wall design first, because that's what most people want. If not I'll fall back to a U.

Don't think I'll be able to sink things in in rectangular shapes though, so will probably have to make the sinks circular so that it can be done with a drill press.
« Last Edit: Tue, 21 February 2012, 14:06:49 by oneproduct »
Layout: Colemak
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Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
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Offline mkawa

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« Reply #46 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 14:08:44 »
your leaves need to be at least 5mm longer. the bend is going to take at least 5mm of material away from each leaf

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Offline oneproduct

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« Reply #47 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 14:12:30 »
Yup, will add the actual thickness of the sheet of metal we use to the length of the leaves when that gets finalized, but pretty sure it's going to be 3/16" (~4.7625mm).
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Daily driver: Filco Tenkeyless MX Brown with ergonomically weighted, lubed springs.
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Offline alaricljs

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« Reply #48 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 14:21:49 »
Also need to add the bend radius to the length of the leaves... whoever handles the shop should know the formula for your thickness and material type.  Just make sure they know you need it ;)
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Offline h2oxide

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« Reply #49 on: Tue, 21 February 2012, 16:41:09 »
How will it work if its a U shape? Won't that completely expose the keyboard pcb?