Vintage Thinkpad Lust

[Arexxk]

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 52740[/ATTACH]

Not really vintage, but im upgrading (?) from my macbook pro to a 2006 Thinkpad x41. It was probably a bad idea, but I have this nostalgia for Thinkpads, being that my first laptop was a P3 Thinkpad. Bought it two days ago for like $55, I was hoping that I could use this thing to replace this GOD AWFUL apple product I've been using. Considering that the x41 is probably slower than the modern netbooks now-a-days, I was thinking that I'd do most of my work via ssh and use compile code on ecplise on a remote-server as well. I mean, all I really do now is code for my classes and surf the web. I am a bit worried that it won't be able to handle the 2012 internet requirements (rendering videos from Hulu, loading flash sites, I'm not even sure how efficient HTML 2 is).

So, I was wondering if there are any other vintage laptop fan-boys on the board that could put in their two-cents. And, I dunno, let me know if I'm gonna crash and burn LUL.

[TexasFlood]

Hell I even have a T23 and T30, the T41/T42 are still good for a lot of uses. That T23 is marginal at best.

[snoopy]

Nice thread!

I also got a X41 ( put a fast compact flash instead of the crappy hdd in it and it runs like hell and is completely silent)
I also have a X61s (planning to do the sxga+ mod.. Got all the parts but no time)
Aaaand I have two ThinkPad 240 and two 240X. These are really classic ultra subnotebooks. I'm running Unix on all my ThinkPads.
For my daily use I have a TP X220 with Ubuntu

In the past I had a lot of different ThinkPads. I remember: T20, T21, T22, X20, X23, X30, many X40 and X41, X60s, X61Tablet sxga+, X41Tablet, R61i... Maybe more

[Internetlad]

(Attachment Link) 52740[/ATTACH]
 I was hoping that I could use this thing to replace this GOD AWFUL apple product I've been using.

COME BACK TO US
COME BACK TO THE WINDOWS USERS

Can't stand apple or their products TBH. Overhyped, underutilized, overpriced trash in my professional opinion

/rant

Anyways, it's probably a good idea to outsource the bulk of your work, I can't see that laptop being snappy enough for somebody with even moderate-high standards. That being said I love IBM/Lenovo laptops, I see very few of them fail, and they do what they do and do it well, unlike some others that work more on fancy jargon, bottom-basement prices and colourful lids to move product (*cough* *DELL* *hack* *HP* *snort*)

[1391401]

Not really vintage, but I got an R61 I really love.  Core 2 Duo, 4 GB Memory, 1400 x 1050 TFT, of course the thinkpad keyboard, SSD, Linux.

[Daniel Beaver]

I've never owned a Thinkpad, but I have always lusted over them.

[The_Beast]

I think I have a T60, P4, 512 Mg RAM.....


Makes a good server, kinda. I did decide to buy my Sony because it has a metal top just like the T60

[postlapsaetia]

I have a T60. I actually just put a new hard drive in it today, haha. I love it.

[Findecanor]

I used to have a T61 at work. The best laptop I have ever used. I wore out a key on the keyboard, and got a replacement keyboard from Lenovo the next day. The next week, there was a break-in and my beloved Thinkpad was gone ...: (

[ricercar]

Not really vintage, but im upgrading (?) from my macbook pro to a 2006 Thinkpad x41.

What happens to the MacBook Pro and which model is it?

[RickyJ]

My T23 was great until it stopped powering up on AC power (battery dead???). Ran all of my engineering programs, tuned the Megasquirt EFI system in my car, etc.  It's still on my shelf, and I miss using it.

[davkol]

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[älg]

I also have a X61s (planning to do the sxga+ mod.. Got all the parts but no time)
[...] I'm running Unix on all my ThinkPads.

I just swapped my Asus Eeepc 1000he for a used X61s and don't regret it at all. I'm running archlinux which is reasonable fast even with the 5400rpm HDD.
How expensive were the parts fort the sxga+ mod? I searched for that kind of display just recently and only found some for 200+€...

[wiredPANDA]

ThinkPads are solid.  I loved having  them at work, and I died a little inside when they were replaced by HP laptops that would fail immediately after unboxing them.

I've seen few issues with IBM/ThinkPads, unless they are truly just abused.

[FoxWolf1]

You'll be fine. I'm typing this message on an R32 ThinkPad, circa 2002, and one that has seen a heck of a lot of abuse at that. It's still perfectly fine for everyday use.

[TexasFlood]

I've seen few issues with IBM/ThinkPads, unless they are truly just abused.

Yes, can take substantial abuse to break them...

[Wildcard]

COME BACK TO US
COME BACK TO THE WINDOWS USERS

Can't stand apple or their products TBH. Overhyped, underutilized, overpriced trash in my professional opinion

LOL, I'm hoping there's at least some satire here. Over priced trash, really? Great features, relatively stable OS, *nix utilities galore. Expensive, yes.. yes it is. Most recent reviews of the new 15" MBP are all positive with the exception of price. You really do get what you pay for though, even with those high margins. Sony VAIOs use to be the kings of ultraportable/performance/design but that time has passed.

Thinkpads are and will always be awesome for their simple yet efficient design. Those hinges, that trackpoint, just brilliant.

I do think all OS's have their own place, but it really depends on the use or user. Windows 7 really is a great OS for the most part. However, I don't want to draw people back to Windows without them trying Windows 8 and seeing where Microsoft is really headed.

[Wildcard]

ThinkPads are solid.  I loved having  them at work, and I died a little inside when they were replaced by HP laptops that would fail immediately after unboxing them.

I've seen few issues with IBM/ThinkPads, unless they are truly just abused.

I worked for a company that switched from IBM/Thinkpads to HP as well and the failure rate was so high they ended up working a way to cancel the contract and ended up switching to Dell for some reason.

[Trent]

All of the lust you feel with vintage thinkpads, is hatred for me.  I couldn't stand my vintage thinkpad for the life of me.  Slow, had to do some dumb BIOS change just to reinstall my operating system.  The added security features and build are nice, but they are prices like macs, over priced and under powered.  Loving the new Dell 17z now!

[sth]

I love my x40 but the screen blows (resolution and brightness), it maxes out at 1.5 GB of RAM and the HD is buttslow. You can get overpriced SSDs but the drive has a dumb form factor that really limits your choices.

I haven't tried it in a while but my results with streaming video were pretty awful. You can get super-low res stuff to play in youtube. I didn't run windows for very long so I can't tell you if Netflix is much better but with the overhead of Silverlight I really doubt it.

X4x machines are my favorite laptops but their useful life is mostly over. I'd rather use my x40 than a netbook but that's really all it's good for these days.

[Hak Foo]

I spent $300 on a used 385XD in 2003 for college.  Took years of Zangband abuse.  Put Slackware linux, the full compliment of 96M memory, and an 802.11b card.

I ended up putting it into service as late as 2006 (employer didn't have a spare PC)

[cheynestoking]

I've had a few X40s in the past and still have an X200 with an upgraded (matte AFFS) screen that I refuse to part with.  It's a great little machine and runs OpenBSD like a champ.  However, my MacBook Air is superior in almost every way - you'd have to be deluded to think otherwise.  Definitely have a soft-spot for the classic Thinkpad industrial design though.

[microsoft windows]

COME BACK TO US
COME BACK TO THE WINDOWS USERS

Can't stand apple or their products TBH. Overhyped, underutilized, overpriced trash in my professional opinion

LOL, I'm hoping there's at least some satire here. Over priced trash, really? Great features, relatively stable OS, *nix utilities galore. Expensive, yes.. yes it is. Most recent reviews of the new 15" MBP are all positive with the exception of price. You really do get what you pay for though, even with those high margins. Sony VAIOs use to be the kings of ultraportable/performance/design but that time has passed.

Thinkpads are and will always be awesome for their simple yet efficient design. Those hinges, that trackpoint, just brilliant.

I do think all OS's have their own place, but it really depends on the use or user. Windows 7 really is a great OS for the most part. However, I don't want to draw people back to Windows without them trying Windows 8 and seeing where Microsoft is really headed.

Apple's Mac computers aren't trash unless you view Dells, HP's, Lenovo's, and Acers as trash. Why? Because they're all made of the EXACT SAME STUFF! It's just that Crapple charges ridiculous prices for their PC's and ships them with a stupid, locked down OS. Mac OS X is so locked down you can't even change the window color, let alone develop much in the way of software for it. Get what you pay for? I don't understand. I'm paying a few hundred extra just to get the same old crap out of a Chinese sweatshop Acer sells for cheap, just with a lousy OS. There is no difference in quality or workmanship.

Now classic Mac OS was good (OS 9.2 and earlier). That's what I started out using when I began working on computers. But OS X is a joke. If you want something different than Windows that can actually be made into a reasonable and respectable OS, Linux would be a much better choice.

[Hak Foo]

I think the most amazing thing of a Thinkpad is the constancy of their design language.  You roll out a pre-2000, 486-100 Thinkpad, and it still bears a family resemblance to Lenovo's current models.

Can any other manufacturer say that?  Does a MacBook remind you at all of an old Powerbook?

[sth]

forgot this thread. eagerly awaiting a thinkpad x61, scored a good deal on ebay that includes a battery, HD, ram, charger and the docking station

[inlikeflynn]

I think the most amazing thing of a Thinkpad is the constancy of their design language.  You roll out a pre-2000, 486-100 Thinkpad, and it still bears a family resemblance to Lenovo's current models.

Can any other manufacturer say that?  Does a MacBook remind you at all of an old Powerbook?

a year ago i'd agree with you. Today hell no, Almost everything good about the thinkpad is now gone

-best laptop keyboard available. not anymore as it replaced with chicklet $hit like the other manufactures
-highest quality and resolution displays available. nope just widescreen crapola like everyone else these days. No more beloved 1920x1200
-T-series is what you always hoped for a work laptop. also no more, today's T-series is a low end laptop and you have to get a W-series instead
-built like a tank and practically unbreakable. Failure rate on even the W-series is no better than anyone else. Back when I was at big blue, my T42a was beat to hell including 5000+ miles of bike commuting without skipping a beat.

I will keep my current T61p (1920x1200, 256GB SSD, aftermarket 8GB RAM upgrade) pretty much forever its looking like. The CPU isn't the fastest, but if I need to-do something intensive, that just gets sent of to the cluster to run anyways.
If it dies someday, I will make our IT people get me another one from ebay and fix it. They tried giving me a new W-series, but they just suck compared to the previous ThinkPads and I gave it back and kept the T61p

Its sad really, as the ThinkPad T-series used to be the best thing out there for work laptops.....

[sth]

IBM displays have never really been known for all-around quality. High pixel count doesnt matter as much to me when the screen is so dang dim.

[isp]

I'm still in love with the idea of thinkpads but they've definitely lost their way and the brand is just being milked for all it's worth.  There's really nothing that sets them apart from any other cheap crap now.  I think the x220 would have done us justice if they managed to source a nice 1600x900 IPS panel for it, but now they're throwing away the classic keyboard which many still prefer...should have atleast made it an option.

[TheProfosist]

Have a T420 and love the thing to death I dont know what i would do if I had to have a day without it.

[dorkvader]

They are godawful to take apart and repair though. The X220's and X230's aren't bad, but they've been plagued with difficulties (X220 has >3% failure rate on the displays, Lenovo just shipped 650 or so X230's as part of a recall for multiple issues). I just assumed that the X220's had a bad crop of panels from their supplier, and the X230 was brought to market too quickly (they should have caught all the obvious problems that affected 90+% of their laptops before production. In our test sample, 2 or 64 were okay)

There's really no reason to use that may different types of screw in a laptop ever. It may add stability, but the routing of cards and cables in the magnesium inner frame just begs for failure. I've replaced too many where the cable has been severed internally because the edge wasn't beveled enough, or where the WIFI card standoff has broken, and has damaged other components. It can get ugly. Some of the internal connectors are really trustworthy, and excellent, some rely on tape to maintain the connection, and those can fail to frequently.

Thinkpads have always been a mixed bag for me. Like apple, there are some things that are implemented really well, and some things that are poorly done, and some things that aren't bad per se, but are dealbreakers for me.

[Pretendo]

Bit of a resurrect, but...

I think the most amazing thing of a Thinkpad is the constancy of their design language.  You roll out a pre-2000, 486-100 Thinkpad, and it still bears a family resemblance to Lenovo's current models.

Can any other manufacturer say that?  Does a MacBook remind you at all of an old Powerbook?

a year ago i'd agree with you. Today hell no, Almost everything good about the thinkpad is now gone

-best laptop keyboard available. not anymore as it replaced with chicklet $hit like the other manufactures
-highest quality and resolution displays available. nope just widescreen crapola like everyone else these days. No more beloved 1920x1200
-T-series is what you always hoped for a work laptop. also no more, today's T-series is a low end laptop and you have to get a W-series instead
-built like a tank and practically unbreakable. Failure rate on even the W-series is no better than anyone else. Back when I was at big blue, my T42a was beat to hell including 5000+ miles of bike commuting without skipping a beat.

I will keep my current T61p (1920x1200, 256GB SSD, aftermarket 8GB RAM upgrade) pretty much forever its looking like. The CPU isn't the fastest, but if I need to-do something intensive, that just gets sent of to the cluster to run anyways.
If it dies someday, I will make our IT people get me another one from ebay and fix it. They tried giving me a new W-series, but they just suck compared to the previous ThinkPads and I gave it back and kept the T61p

Its sad really, as the ThinkPad T-series used to be the best thing out there for work laptops.....

I agree that the Thinkpad has slipped a bit in build quality, but more blame should go to the decreasing cost of components than Lenovo.  Back in the early 2000's, it cost twice as much to build a machine with 1/8th of the processing power.  Spending extra money on a titanium alloy body (T2x series) made sense to protect thousands of dollars worth of components.  No business would still buy Thinkpads at the price point that they were at 10+ years ago, and Lenovo does a damn good job with the budget that these machines are built on now.

My father also works at IBM, and has been issued Thinkpads since the 600 series back in the 90s.  He's told me that, despite the expensive components and chassis, many of the IBM built machines had major issues that required repair and replacement.  The T30 comes to mind as having motherboard issues.

I own a T430, and have to say that it feels much more stable than the HP that I jumped from.  I've also compared it to a friend's Macbok Air, and though the aluminum unibody feels more sturdy, it's pretty clear which machine would survive a drop from a table.  The chicklet keyboard is just about the best I've felt on a laptop, and the trackpoint has basically made it impossible to switch back to my Rosewill RK-9000.  T series still has carbon fiber reinforced casing and a magnesuim roll cage.  For the price, these are still well built machines.

EDIT: I do agree with the screen quality issue though.  They should step that up on the T series.

[Exoverture]

I ordered an X230 after much decision - a lot actually prefer the new keyboard, surprisingly. The old one had some negatives as well.

Most people don't realize that the non-backlit keyboard type (have to pay extra for it), actually has a slightly better keyboard (textured keycaps), which feels exactly like the old one.

I'll post some pictures and review (I'm very picky on build quality) if it's wanted.

[sth]

if it doesn't have a thinklight it's not a thinkpad.


YES I KNOW IBM AND LENOVO PUT OUT THINKPADS WITHOUT THEM. THEY ARE TERRIBLE.

[davkol]

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[tipo33]

I'm typing this on my 15" 4:3 T60,  I'm currently gathering parts for a Frankenpad T61 motherboard swap for it.  I also own a T41 as a backup.

[Burz]

Currently using an Apple Macbook here.

I've had to travel with some circa-2000 Thinkpads and was not terribly impressed by the look or the feel or the performance of them. Back then, putting your apps on just about any laptop was a compromise, and if I was gonna compromise it was for something truly portable like a Psion Series 5 (one of the first 32-bit pocket computers)--Not for a big hunk of magnesium.

Fast forward to 2012 and I just about fell in love with my friend's Thinkpad T420s: Light, stiff/rugged, thin (partial) carbon fiber, no 'steal me' looks, and runs quickly with quiet grace. It's look, feel and speed are better than any Thinkpad I've used in the past.

Now I've been researching laptops in the T430s class for weeks and I can't find anything else that has the same combination of milspec testing, low weight, speed, security, expansion and price. The "comparable" Dell is a pound heavier and the HP at least $250 more (and I hate HP). The Sony also costs more. It has better graphics, but like the other alternatives durability is questionable and the extended warranty costs a fortune compared to Lenovo's. Oh yeah--I also hate Sony, but the rootkit thing was a long time ago.

As for the new keyboards--are we on the right site for this discussion?--all of the professional reviews I've read loved them and they sound like they're the same keyswitches underneath, only with a layout change and flatter/wider keycaps. The user reviews also heavily favor the feel of the new keyboard.

[davkol]

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[Burz]

As for the new keyboards--are we on the right site for this discussion?--all of the professional reviews I've read loved them and they sound like they're the same keyswitches underneath, only with a layout change and flatter/wider keycaps. The user reviews also heavily favor the feel of the new keyboard.

Keycaps aren't flatter, but quite the contrary, or at least they feel that way; different shape affects their width as well, of course. I think the feel is a bit closer to tactile, almost crisp — unlike on the previous generation, which felt a bit mushy to me at times. However, the overall impression is nowhere near the late-IBM/early-Lenovo era (T43, T60, T400), those were the best IMHO. I'm also a bit worried that the rubber dome will eventually become too stiff, because I've experienced it on thinkpad edge keyboards. (Don't let me even start on the new layout... PrintScreen on bottom row? Ugh!)

The keycaps do seem flatter in the sense that they are not as tall, though they are still sculpted (might have been a deal breaker if they weren't). PrintScreen--yeah that made me do a double-take. I wonder if you can remap it to a modifier in the BIOS. BTW, the T420/430/s trackpad is highly accurate; better than the trackpoints on the same machines and quite a bit better than the trackpad on my Macbook.

I thought about getting a used T410, but the specs just weren't there and an incremental improvement over my Macbook would have been anticlimactic. Also learned Lenovo are coming out with a T431s in March along with a thinner version of the X230 Tablet (another model that got my attention while comparison shopping).

Problems with the current crop of T series seem to be limited to the dull 14" screen and a rash of random system resets caused by a CPU voltage problem. The latter cropped up and seems to have been addressed over about a 3 month period last year. The good news is that Thinkpads/Thinkstations are being spun off into a separate division without the Lenovo moniker; hopefully this will keep more of the consumer-oriented tendency to cut corners at bay.

[davkol]

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[TAdams]

Have a T42p. Love it and have been in the market for a newer model

[Markell1991]

Last year I got myself an x41t. It is an absolute beauty to type on, and to write on the tablet screen. The design and build quality are professional and sturdy. It's a real headturner when i twist the screen around and fold it over, everything about it is just slick.