Thinking about buying an Unicomp

[lcs]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

[The_Beast]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

Yes, they are quite a bit heavier than browns.


You might want to look at a Model M if you want an old "old" look.

[samwisekoi]

Go for it!  Heavier, sure.  Louder, absolutely.

I use Brown MX when I can't get buckling spring, and I like both.  At work I use a Model M or a Unicomp, and at home the Browns so people can sleep.  If you like MX Browns, I predict you will like the Unicomp.

The Unicomp 101 is indistinguishable from my Model M in normal use.  And you can get custom PBT Keycaps direct from Unicomp.

Go for it!

 - Ron I samwisekoi

[___q]

If you like or can get used to the sound, they're fun keyboards to type on.  Much different from cherry switches, there's no explicit "bump" before the switch actuates.

I have one, but wouldn't want it to be my only keyboard (it's loud enough that the sound bothers me through headphones sometimes).

[lcs]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

Yes, they are quite a bit heavier than browns.


You might want to look at a Model M if you want an old "old" look.

I see. I was trying to find a Model M, but I found it to be quite complicated to actually find one in a decent price range and then shipping it to Brazil =\

I really like their look, though =P

Go for it!  Heavier, sure.  Louder, absolutely.

I use Brown MX when I can't get buckling spring, and I like both.  At work I use a Model M or a Unicomp, and at home the Browns so people can sleep.  If you like MX Browns, I predict you will like the Unicomp.

The Unicomp 101 is indistinguishable from my Model M in normal use.  And you can get custom PBT Keycaps direct from Unicomp.

Go for it!

 - Ron I samwisekoi

That's good =) The problem with the 101 is the lack of the super key, which I use a lot to control the WM. I think I'll wait for the 104 or Ultra Classic, assuming they are going to sell them again!

[1391406]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

Yes, much, and I can't emphasize that enough.

[insilica]

The super key is super important for me as well. It is my i3 modifier on gentoo and arch at home and at work.

 Think 45g is my limit, cherry browns and topre sub 45g max is what I've been happy with so far.

[rootwyrm]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

Yes, much, and I can't emphasize that enough.

Ayup.

MX Brown: 45cN
Buckling Spring: >75cN typical (new)

So about twice as much.

[fohat.digs]

So about twice as much.

You can't argue with science, but perception does not always follow reality.

The fact is that buckling springs "feel" much lighter than the instrument indicates, for real but hard-to-describe reasons. (especially the F)

Perhaps the solidity and bulk of a Model M/F gives it a very secure resistance to your strokes, so that you can "fly" over without concern.

But there is no doubt that browns and reds require the smallest amount of effort on your part.

[czarek]

Stop thinking and buy it. You can't be keyboard enthusiast without trying out Buckling Spring. If you're bored with MX Brown it's quite likely you will fall in love with BS, at least for a while

[lcs]

Stop thinking and buy it. You can't be keyboard enthusiast without trying out Buckling Spring. If you're bored with MX Brown it's quite likely you will fall in love with BS, at least for a while

Just waiting for them to start selling the one I want again! 

[1391406]

You can't argue with science, but perception does not always follow reality.

My perception is that Buckling Springs don't just require a little more force than MX Browns. They feel like they require a lot more, at least to me. I tend to think most people would agree, regardless of the facts.

[Techno Trousers]

To me BS feels quite heavy,  at least when I'm using my early 1390131. I've read anecdotal posts that later model Ms and Unicomps feel lighter,  but I'm also waiting for Unicomp to restock so I can get a Model My with Win keys to check out.

I recently got a keyboard with MX greens,  and to me that feels much closer to the weight of my Model M than the blues I was previously using.

All that said,  I do think that all keyboard enthusiasts should try a buckling spring keyboard for a month or so,  just to see if you like it.

[BucklingSpring]

As everybody says... Heavier - But it should not stop you to get one. It's an awesome keyboard for the price.

And if it ever fails you after the warranty is over, they will refurbish it for 30$ (as long as the company is still in business)
http://pckeyboard.com/page/category/Repair

[BucklingSpring]

-delete-

[Endzone]

Attn:  All you guys on Ebay or this site or where ever in the world you are who think your 25- year-old IBM Model M is worth between $60 and $200:

Screw you!  I'm going to buy a brand new Unicomp--OK?  I used to buy Model M's for $15 on Ebay all the time.

Thank you, thank you very much.  I feel better now. 

[smknjoe]

The price has really gone up on those. Used to be 20-40 used and 130 tops for new. When did the prices go up?

[Endzone]

The price has really gone up on those. Used to be 20-40 used and 130 tops for new. When did the prices go up?

I know I was buying them on Ebay in 2002/2003 for $15 or $20 each. 

[smknjoe]

Yeah, but prices I'm talking about are from less than a year ago. WTF?

[Endzone]

How about MX Dark Grey's vs. IBM Model M?  Anybody?

[___q]

Does anyone actually have an entire keyboard of dark greys? I think they're quite uncommon and hard to get in any significant quantity.

[lcs]

Does anyone actually have an entire keyboard of dark greys? I think they're quite uncommon and hard to get in any significant quantity.

I didn't even know there were dark greys!

[___q]

Does anyone actually have an entire keyboard of dark greys? I think they're quite uncommon and hard to get in any significant quantity.

I didn't even know there were dark greys!

They're heavier blacks (I think? maybe they're heavier clears). I think some keyboards with MX blacks use a dark grey as the spacebar.

[smknjoe]

They were used for spacebars and enter keys (etc.) if I remember correctly.

[rootwyrm]

I don't know either. I used to snap up M's and M5's for <$50 regularly. And believe me, none of the ones on eBay are in anything RESEMBLING good condition. Destroyed cables, decades of burnt in grime, half the time they've got operational problems that the seller's lied about. They're good rebuild / restoration candidates sometimes, but there is NO way they're worth more than they cost new.

It's one thing when I put one of mine on the market - I expect to get $200 for a Model M because I very carefully RESTORED it. There's a ton of time invested in it, 1-2 bottles of isopropyl alcohol, often miscellaneous parts like a new window and it has been carefully checked to make sure it is at minimum entirely consistent. These idiots are demanding $150+ for one they found in a barn and can't be bothered to test.

[rootwyrm]

Does anyone actually have an entire keyboard of dark greys? I think they're quite uncommon and hard to get in any significant quantity.

I didn't even know there were dark greys!

They're heavier blacks (I think? maybe they're heavier clears). I think some keyboards with MX blacks use a dark grey as the spacebar.

Yes. It's $142 new.

[___q]

Oooooo, has anyone used one of those? Is it fun to type on? I can imagine it being pretty intense.

I'm honestly a little tempted to pick one up (I'll be placing an order with them in the next couple of days...)

[Hypersphere]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

I have long experience using genuine IBM Model M keyboards, and they remain my favorite by a wide margin. Thinking I could get a "new" Model M, I tried a Unicomp. It was sad -- a pale imitation at best. The build quality was extremely poor. Unfortunately, as I understand it, the rights to the IBM buckling spring switch design were acquired by Unicomp when IBM (and later Lexmark under contract from IBM) stopped making them, but it seems that Unicomp never produced a keyboard anywhere near the quality of the original IBM. Therefore, if you can find a real Model M instead, go for it. Otherwise, although it would not be a buckling spring, I would recommend going with one of the better mechanical keyboards that are being produced today that use Topre (a hybrid individual rubber dome, conical spring, and capacitative switch) or Cherry mechanical switches. Another alternative would be Alps switches, which are used by Matias, but I am very familiar with these products. Cherry now has a Green switch, which has heavier springs than Blues or Browns, but even with a heavier spring, a keyboard with Cherry Green switches would not yield the same typing experience as afforded by a genuine IBM buckling spring keyboard.

[Endzone]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

I have long experience using genuine IBM Model M keyboards, and they remain my favorite by a wide margin. Thinking I could get a "new" Model M, I tried a Unicomp. It was sad -- a pale imitation at best. The build quality was extremely poor. Unfortunately, as I understand it, the rights to the IBM buckling spring switch design were acquired by Unicomp when IBM (and later Lexmark under contract from IBM) stopped making them, but it seems that Unicomp never produced a keyboard anywhere near the quality of the original IBM. Therefore, if you can find a real Model M instead, go for it. Otherwise, although it would not be a buckling spring, I would recommend going with one of the better mechanical keyboards that are being produced today that use Topre (a hybrid individual rubber dome, conical spring, and capacitative switch) or Cherry mechanical switches. Another alternative would be Alps switches, which are used by Matias, but I am very familiar with these products. Cherry now has a Green switch, which has heavier springs than Blues or Browns, but even with a heavier spring, a keyboard with Cherry Green switches would not yield the same typing experience as afforded by a genuine IBM buckling spring keyboard.

Alright, so the build of a Unicomp was poor compared to a Model M.  You didn't say what the typing experience was like though.  Another poster already said they are very similar.

[lcs]

Are they much heavier than MX browns? I really like the 'old' aspect of them 

I have long experience using genuine IBM Model M keyboards, and they remain my favorite by a wide margin. Thinking I could get a "new" Model M, I tried a Unicomp. It was sad -- a pale imitation at best. The build quality was extremely poor. Unfortunately, as I understand it, the rights to the IBM buckling spring switch design were acquired by Unicomp when IBM (and later Lexmark under contract from IBM) stopped making them, but it seems that Unicomp never produced a keyboard anywhere near the quality of the original IBM. Therefore, if you can find a real Model M instead, go for it. Otherwise, although it would not be a buckling spring, I would recommend going with one of the better mechanical keyboards that are being produced today that use Topre (a hybrid individual rubber dome, conical spring, and capacitative switch) or Cherry mechanical switches. Another alternative would be Alps switches, which are used by Matias, but I am very familiar with these products. Cherry now has a Green switch, which has heavier springs than Blues or Browns, but even with a heavier spring, a keyboard with Cherry Green switches would not yield the same typing experience as afforded by a genuine IBM buckling spring keyboard.

The problem remains that the Model M is terribly expensive

[1391406]

The problem remains that the Model M is terribly expensive

Compared to what? It's common for a lot of keyboard enthusiasts to spend over $100+ on a mechanical keyboard.

[lcs]

The problem remains that the Model M is terribly expensive

Compared to what? It's common for a lot of keyboard enthusiasts to spend over $100+ on a mechanical keyboard.

It seems hard to find one in decent shape for a good price that can be sent to Brazil. But I definitely want one.

[mapple]

The problem remains that the Model M is terribly expensive

Compared to what? It's common for a lot of keyboard enthusiasts to spend over $100+ on a mechanical keyboard.

It seems hard to find one in decent shape for a good price that can be sent to Brazil. But I definitely want one.

well it's all realtive. but main point do you really wanna get it or not. At this time there's no way to get working/perfect condition below 200$ (maybe new somewhere in the world).

someone previously wrote that unicomp made poor copy. he was 100% right, quality of keycaps even springs react differently. In my case it's even harder to write on unicomp than on ibm model m -> maybe cause of usage (many years passed with ibm:)).

for all those years thanks to god or maybe other power i was able to buy lot of different keyboards. Currently at work i'm using razer with cherry blue. They feel good but for some it might be too light in touch, but what makes them good for me is sound -> this way i'm sure that i pressed key:D. Cherry brown & blacks they are just too damn light (and non click made me furry due to lack of "feedback" even though i saw letter on screen no "confirmation" was making me angry). At home i use cherry green mx cause they are most close to ibm. For lab environment i'm using ibm. Truth is that i would have in all those places ibm but availability in good conditions isn't that easy especially in europe.... and last of all i rarely use it because I hope that she will end her life near mine, I do respect her too much to destroy:D:D:D --->>> maybe this sentence will give you better look if she's worth any money..... like seriously....

[tgujay]

Does anyone actually have an entire keyboard of dark greys? I think they're quite uncommon and hard to get in any significant quantity.

I didn't even know there were dark greys!

They're heavier blacks (I think? maybe they're heavier clears). I think some keyboards with MX blacks use a dark grey as the spacebar.

Yes. It's $142 new.

That would be... awesome!

[fohat.digs]

I don't know what you folks are smoking.

Unicomp may have allowed quality control to slip from IBM standards of 2 decades ago, but it is still the same keyboard made in the same factory on the same equipment.

The differences between original IBM and contemporary Unicomp are small, and if you want a buckling spring keyboard the Unicomp is a bargain. Brand new, the price is near the bottom of the range of any other mechanical keyboard. Also, some people prefer the Unicomp because they consider it "lighter" in feel.

If you want a true top-shelf buckling spring experience, you must go to the Model F and endure considerable nuisance.

Otherwise, you can purchase a good-quality used IBM Model M for roughly the same price as a new Unicomp (true, last year it was half, and some people are annoyed) but you might have to clean it up.

OP, don't listen to this whining. Buy the Unicomp.

[jkercado]

My personal experience with Unicomp has been great. The Ultra Classic I got is a handsome, solid unit. And yes, it's definitely a tad lighter than the Model M (might be the fresher springs?), and the sound is a bit more high-pitched. But it's definitely a pleasure to type on.

Go for it! Here's mine...

[0100010]

I agree.  Unicomp FTW.  (Although for some strange reason I find myself wanting to get a Model F and mod it to work.)  But my daily driver Unicomp is serving me very well.

[Techno Trousers]

I agree.  Unicomp FTW.  (Although for some strange reason I find myself wanting to get a Model F and mod it to work.)  But my daily driver Unicomp is serving me very well.

That strange reason is named fohat.digs... At least it is in my case (as an excited buyer of a soon-to-be-arriving, soon-to-be-cleaned, soon-to-be-soarer-adapter-ed Model F 122).

I love seeing the modded Unicomps!

[smknjoe]

I don't know what you folks are smoking.

Unicomp may have allowed quality control to slip from IBM standards of 2 decades ago, but it is still the same keyboard made in the same factory on the same equipment.

The differences between original IBM and contemporary Unicomp are small, and if you want a buckling spring keyboard the Unicomp is a bargain. Brand new, the price is near the bottom of the range of any other mechanical keyboard. Also, some people prefer the Unicomp because they consider it "lighter" in feel.

If you want a true top-shelf buckling spring experience, you must go to the Model F and endure considerable nuisance.

Otherwise, you can purchase a good-quality used IBM Model M for roughly the same price as a new Unicomp (true, last year it was half, and some people are annoyed) but you might have to clean it up.

OP, don't listen to this whining. Buy the Unicomp.

This guy knows his buckling springs. I would take heed.

[1391406]

I don't know what you folks are smoking.

Unicomp may have allowed quality control to slip from IBM standards of 2 decades ago, but it is still the same keyboard made in the same factory on the same equipment.

The differences between original IBM and contemporary Unicomp are small, and if you want a buckling spring keyboard the Unicomp is a bargain. Brand new, the price is near the bottom of the range of any other mechanical keyboard. Also, some people prefer the Unicomp because they consider it "lighter" in feel.

If you want a true top-shelf buckling spring experience, you must go to the Model F and endure considerable nuisance.

Otherwise, you can purchase a good-quality used IBM Model M for roughly the same price as a new Unicomp (true, last year it was half, and some people are annoyed) but you might have to clean it up.

OP, don't listen to this whining. Buy the Unicomp.

A Unicomp is a fairly decent clone of a Model M, but I don't equate cosmetic imperfections on the surface of the case, creaking, flashing around some of the key caps, and case flex with whining. They're real, qualitative differences that have been noticed by numerous owners. Are they critical or substantial? Not when each issue is considered separately, but collectively it adds up to a real, qualitative difference, in my opinion. Does it affect the typing experience? Not much, but then neither does the case of a Chicony KB-5181, yet people consider it inferior regardless of the quality of Monterey Blue switches.

[lcs]

Thank you all for your replies.

I now believe the biggest problem with the original Model M would be the lack of super key, which some Unicomp models have.

And as I have never used an original one, I won't notice all those differences!

[Bencze]

At some point I wanted a model M, bought one off ebay for like 40 euros and a couple keys don't work, a key cap missing and it generally looks to be in quite bad shape. I don't use it.
So despite the fact a Unicomp costs pretty much double in Europe (little more I think) I might just buy one, one of these days. At least it's a somewhat sure thing rather than spending 150 euro to buy 3-4 model Ms to make one and maybe that one will have problems too...

Actually I'd like a model m SSK for birthday or something but unless I win the lottery it's not going to happen so trying to set realistic goals for now.

So, with old model Ms there is some risk as well...

[fohat.digs]

At some point I wanted a model M, bought one off ebay for like 40 euros and a couple keys don't work, a key cap missing and it generally looks to be in quite bad shape. I don't use it.

You had a stroke of bad luck. I have bought perhaps a dozen Model Ms on ebay and 2 or 3 did not work, but the seller usually said so up front.

Try re-setting the keys that "don't work". Pull the key (cap and stem) off, then push it back on. Try standing the keyboard upright (spacebar edge at bottom) to make the springs flop forward as you re-insert the key. This can be a simple problem and simple solution. If they are not "clicking" properly that is an indication that they are not seated correctly.

Next, you can do a bolt-modification. That might well fix a mechanical problem.

A missing key cap does not matter, except that it irritates you when you look at it.

[Techno Trousers]

A missing key cap does not matter, except that it irritates you when you look at it.

And you can always buy a replacement from Unicomp!

[Hypersphere]

Alright, so the build of a Unicomp was poor compared to a Model M.  You didn't say what the typing experience was like though.  Another poster already said they are very similar.
[/quote]

The typing experience is inextricably mixed with the build quality. Accordingly, the typing experience with the Unicomp was not pleasurable as it was with the IBM Model M. I gave the Unicomp away, but I kept the Model M (and I am typing on it now).

[Endzone]

Alright, so the build of a Unicomp was poor compared to a Model M.  You didn't say what the typing experience was like though.  Another poster already said they are very similar.

The typing experience is inextricably mixed with the build quality. Accordingly, the typing experience with the Unicomp was not pleasurable as it was with the IBM Model M. I gave the Unicomp away, but I kept the Model M (and I am typing on it now).
[/quote]

So I take that to mean that because the Unicomp wasn't built as strong as the IBM Model M, that it couldn't possibly be as good to type on.   Do you make more errors using the Unicomp?  Do you type slower using the Unicomp?  Do your fingers get fatigued more quickly on the Unicomp?

Can anyone tell me the difference between MX greens and a Unicomp?  Which has firmer keys?  Thanks. 

[fohat.digs]

What this silly thread is really like:

A new auto driver says: "I want to get a car, and I really like the Ford Mustang."

Friend: "You should talk to Mr Jones. He has been a Mustang expert for decades."

Mr Jones: "New Mustangs are crap. The real true Mustang was the one that Steve McQueen drove in Bullitt."

New driver: "I would have gotten a 2013 Mustang, but I heard that they were crap. What should I buy, now?"

[1391406]

What this silly thread is really like:

A new auto driver says: "I want to get a car, and I really like the Ford Mustang."

Friend: "You should talk to Mr Jones. He has been a Mustang expert for decades."

Mr Jones: "New Mustangs are crap. The real true Mustang was the one that Steve McQueen drove in Bullitt."

New driver: "I would have gotten a 2013 Mustang, but I heard that they were crap. What should I buy, now?"

Who called Unicomp's crap? Secondly, if there are real, qualitative differences between two products, why is it silly to point it out? When taken collectively, they're not negligible differences, in my opinion.

Using your analogy, if:

1: The chassis of the new Mustang rattles
2: The paint job was shoddy
3: Some of the plastic molding on interior panels had jagged edges
4: Ford incorporated a cheap aluminum body

Then labeling the build quality poor in comparison to early models is sufficiently justified.

[fohat.digs]

What this silly thread is really like:

A new auto driver says: "I want to get a car, and I really like the Ford Mustang."

Friend: "You should talk to Mr Jones. He has been a Mustang expert for decades."

Mr Jones: "New Mustangs are crap. The real true Mustang was the one that Steve McQueen drove in Bullitt."

New driver: "I would have gotten a 2013 Mustang, but I heard that they were crap. What should I buy, now?"

Who called Unicomp's crap? Secondly, if there are real, qualitative differences between two products, why is it silly to point it out? When taken collectively, they're not negligible differences, in my opinion.

Using your analogy, if:

1: The chassis of the new Mustang rattles
2: The paint job was shoddy
3: Some of the plastic molding on interior panels had jagged edges
4: Ford incorporated a cheap aluminum body

Then labeling the build quality poor in comparison to early models is sufficiently justified.

I agree 100% and also stand by what I said earlier.

If I were buying Mustangs, I would buy the new one for my teenage daughter, and the 1968 for myself.

[1391406]

The typing experience is inextricably mixed with the build quality.

How so? I don't understand how the build quality necessarily effects the typing experience in this case. Granted, there's not as much ping when typing on a Unicomp, but I'd say any differences in the actual typing experience are somewhat negligible. For instance, the plastic of Unicomp key caps feels slightly thinner to me, but that doesn't necessarily effect the typing experience for me, either. In my opinion, the Unicomp feels a tad grittier to type on to me, but it's a very subtle difference, in my opinion.