From mx Red to mx Blue

[Norz]

So I own a K90 with MX Red and decided I wanted to get a custom keyboard from WASD. I didn't get the opportunity to really test MX blue, only through the sample kit but really liked it, so i ordered it with MX Blue.

The clicky feeling of the MX blue is awesome, but i'm afraid the need for more pressure compared to mx reds make my fingers hurt in the long run. I only received the keyboard today and have been using it for a few hours, but it feels pretty "heavy".

Is there any chance the keys gets a bit less heavy once ive used the keyboard for a few days ? Is it a standard feeling that should disappear after a few days ? Anyone experienced the switch from red to blue before and has any thoughts in that regard ?

Thanks !

[lcs]

Perhaps it is just a matter of you getting used to the blues.

If you don't, you can always swap the springs, if you don't mind desoldering the switches.

[ianxblog]

When you come from a light switch like reds, you got to stay at it 1 week as much and you will be like home, as far as actuation force goes.
MX Blues aren't even a heavy switch. Blacks or buckling springs are.

[IvanIvanovich]

Red and blue have almost same actuation force. They use the same springs. Blue need more preload though, due to the click mechanism... you may find yourself bottoming more hard due to more preload and then it collapsing. Probably just take a little to get used to it.

[Candyflip]

Perhaps it is just a matter of you getting used to the blues.

If you don't, you can always swap the springs, if you don't mind desoldering the switches.

Yes I think its just getting used to blues. Swapping springs I would not recommend since I believe they use the same springs, the stem is what makes the weight difference (correct me if I am wrong).
To OP: I think blues will eventually break down and lose slightly of the click they have but I am not sure about the pressure needed to actuate, I am quite used to them even tho I like the lightness of the reds too.

[Norz]

Alright, thanks for all the quick posts so far

you guys are awesome

[1pq]

They will also lighten up a good deal with usage.

[Norz]

Oh i forgot to mention

My keyboard came with the thinner version of o-rings. 0.2mm, red.

Do those help ? make no difference, or in the contrary require a bigger pressure for the key to activate ?

Might as well ask, in case..

[ianxblog]

I don't really know, but maybe they're forcing you to bottom out, or almost do it, and therefore you would need more force.

It's matter of trying. Remove one keycap and take off the o-ring. Put it back in. compare.
If you're not sure, take some letters like QWERTY and try with more than 1 finger.

[Norz]

I don't really know, but maybe they're forcing you to bottom out, or almost do it, and therefore you would need more force.

It's matter of trying. Remove one keycap and take off the o-ring. Put it back in. compare.
If you're not sure, take some letters like QWERTY and try with more than 1 finger.

yeah maybe.

Ill try that thx !

[varslot]

I also recieved my Ducky Shine 3 today with MX blue, comming from SS 7G MX black. I can't really compare myself to others, because I have really strong fingers since I've played guitar for almost 12 years. MX Blue feels really nice, even though they are light to press compared to the MX back, the bump makes it perfect.

[aref]

Cherry MX Blue switches require very little down force, just a tad more than MX Red switches, and are supposed to peak at 60 grams; where a Red switch is a constant 45 grams. You may prefer a Realforce variable key-weight keyboard. I don't know of any switch between Reds and Blues; there's only a 5-gram increase when actuating an MX Blue, compared with an MX Red. But, the Blue switch does have an increase in gram-weight when actuated, if you take the switch through its entire 4mm travel. Perhaps you should try some soft o-rings or soft landing pads (Elite Keyboards) on your MX Blue keyboard.

[Norz]

Well I do have soft o-rings

When I compare my mx red keyboard with the new mx blue i feel like the blue switches are easily twice as hard. So maybe the keyboard just need some using for the switches to settle and soften a little ?

[Polymer]

Just remember that actuation force is only where pressure needed at actuation.  It doesn't take into any bump you have to overcome to get there.

Which is why both MX brown and MX blue take more force than MX red to get to actuation.

With MX Brown, you need to overcome the bump which is about 55g but a short bump..it then actuates at 45g.  That little bump is why it takes slightly more force.

In the case of MX blues, it has a slightly longer bump and you need 60g.

With MX Reds it starts off at 30g and then goes up in linear fashion to get to actuation at 45g.  At bottom out you're approaching 60g. 

Same spring but the slider will change how it feels and how much force it takes to press down.  Blues are definitely heavier than reds....

But that said, you'll get used to it..they're not that much heavier...reds are just, imo, rather light..

[exitfire401]

When I went from red to blue, it took me about 2 weeks to get used to the difference in both sound and pressure. I'd suggest giving it about the same window of time before you decide if you really like them or not. The switch from linear to tactile is massive, but well worth it imho.

[Linkbane]

I started Red and went to Blue as well. I love Blues now, but it did feel slightly heavier at first. The switches definitely do 'break in', though, and I feel like old Blues are better than the heavy, fresh ones. One important point is that if you use Blues and want to type, it's important to learn not to bottom out, or the point of tactility is lost. It'll make you much faster and it's a lot better for your fingers.

[aref]

Just remember that actuation force is only where pressure needed at actuation.  It doesn't take into any bump you have to overcome to get there.

Which is why both MX brown and MX blue take more force than MX red to get to actuation.

With MX Brown, you need to overcome the bump which is about 55g but a short bump..it then actuates at 45g.  That little bump is why it takes slightly more force.

In the case of MX blues, it has a slightly longer bump and you need 60g.

With MX Reds it starts off at 30g and then goes up in linear fashion to get to actuation at 45g.  At bottom out you're approaching 60g. 

Same spring but the slider will change how it feels and how much force it takes to press down.  Blues are definitely heavier than reds....

But that said, you'll get used to it..they're not that much heavier...reds are just, imo, rather light..

This is an interesting post. I didn't know MX Red switches were initiated with 30 grams. I was, wrongly, under the impression the switch was 45g from the onset. Thanks for the clarification.

[paldepind]

This is an interesting post. I didn't know MX Red switches were initiated with 30 grams. I was, wrongly, under the impression the switch was 45g from the onset. Thanks for the clarification.

And that is why it's called a linear switch and not constant like you said. The force linearly increased with the travel distance as shown in this diagram. Had it been constant the diagram would have shown a straight horizontal line.

[Linkbane]

This is an interesting post. I didn't know MX Red switches were initiated with 30 grams. I was, wrongly, under the impression the switch was 45g from the onset. Thanks for the clarification.

And that is why it's called a linear switch and not constant like you said. The force linearly increased with the travel distance as shown in this diagram. Had it been constant the diagram would have shown a straight horizontal line.

He said that he thought it was 45g from the initial press, not that it required uniform force. In that case it would be a rubber dome, collapsing at the same time.

[Norz]

I started Red and went to Blue as well. I love Blues now, but it did feel slightly heavier at first. The switches definitely do 'break in', though, and I feel like old Blues are better than the heavy, fresh ones. One important point is that if you use Blues and want to type, it's important to learn not to bottom out, or the point of tactility is lost. It'll make you much faster and it's a lot better for your fingers.

You guys can think of any artificial, efficient way to "break in" the keys ? I mean something faster than typing a whole book

Also I wonder if i'm not too easily bottoming out due to the 0.2 red and if that's not something that makes my finger hurt a bit, more than the pressure required to activate the click..

Then again, i shouldnt bottom out too easily on mx blue if i'm used to mx red right ?

[Linkbane]

I wouldn't necessarily say that. I still bottomed out all the time after switching from my Reds because I was used to bottoming out (or I couldn't be sure of the key registering), and it took me a lot of conscious practice to almost always not bottom out. I couldn't say if there are any ways to break in the keys, but I actually do like the Blues on my cheap TK more than I do those on the Ducky because they feel a lot lighter. I got used to it, but it took over a week.

[Norz]

I wouldn't necessarily say that. I still bottomed out all the time after switching from my Reds because I was used to bottoming out (or I couldn't be sure of the key registering), and it took me a lot of conscious practice to almost always not bottom out. I couldn't say if there are any ways to break in the keys, but I actually do like the Blues on my cheap TK more than I do those on the Ducky because they feel a lot lighter. I got used to it, but it took over a week.

I'm gonna give it a full week starting from this week end, and if i don't get used to it i guess ill try to trade it for a MX Red of similar quality (WASD, Filco, Ducky etc) on this forum. Really sucks because with the shipping fees US > Switzerland, the custom fees etc it really costed me quite a bit.

[1pq]

Welcome to WalletHack!

[paldepind]

He said that he thought it was 45g from the initial press, not that it required uniform force. In that case it would be a rubber dome, collapsing at the same time.

No, that is not what he said.

a Red switch is a constant 45 grams.

Which is the same as saying it requires a uniform force which was what I was correction. A red switch has a linear increase in force, not a constant/uniform force.

[Wildcard]

Why switch from Red's to Blue's, just use them both

[Norz]

Why switch from Red's to Blue's, just use them both

Sadly I can't use the Blues. If my hands are well rested I start typing and zomg, feels so good. It lasts a few minutes and then I very quickly can feel how tiring it is for my fingers.

I can't start a thread in the marketplace section yet, but yeah, i'm gonna have to sell my WASD ISO 88 keys (TKL) board. Or trade it for some similar quality board, with MX Red. Has to be ISO 88 keys.

If anyone's interested, can always shout me a pm !

[Tony]

I have both red and blue. To switch between them requires conscious change in typing force (blue is considerably 10g heavier). Plus you have to get used to the knuckle sound and bump of blue.

[Norz]

I have both red and blue. To switch between them requires conscious change in typing force (blue is considerably 10g heavier). Plus you have to get used to the knuckle sound and bump of blue.

You're right, but as far as im concerned it's mostly a weight concern really. Rest I can adapt to.

Ironically I can totally see how MX Blue are so SO good because that's how I feel for a couple minutes once I start typing. Sadly, it doesn't last..

[Norz]

... fast forward a few days later

I ended up removing the sound dampeners because why not. Well, i don't know if they were not correctly installed (received keyboard with o-rings already attached to key caps) but my god, such a difference. It's like the keys are 3x lighter. Never suspected it could really make a difference.

That's all i needed to really start liking MX Blue. It's definitely awesome to type, now i'm just not sure i wont prefer gaming on MX red. And since i do a lot of both it's gonna be a tough choice..

[lonedruid]

OMG OP norz, you are ****ing just like me.

Even though i enjoy typing on my reds, blues, and hhkb topre,_now i am gonna say something sacrilegious in the holy keyboard land that is geekhack_i always find myself finding relief in going back to enjoying myself a day or two of light typing with my good old rubberdome keyboards.

WHen i use my ducky blues, after a day or two i find it too heavy then, find myself switching back to my steelseries reds just because the blues proved to be too heavy despite me liking the whole blue-clicky thing.

I must say, i am now quite used to the hhkb topre ald, i dont find them heavy anymore, especially when i am typing really fast: the whole keyboard seems to come together and molds itself responsively to my flow of typing and become one with my hand.

But blues man, still heavy.At first, i thought, it is the ducky shine 3's double pcb metal plate thing , that makes it more sturdy and make the keys heavy. After i saw your post, i guess blues are indeed heavy, regardless of brand or board.
Yea, to answer op's question, i dont think you will get used to the whole heavy-switch thing. I have been typing awhile on my blues now(gaming_which means i type alot:i play dota 2 invoker alot which means i even type more keys than average dota player)and i still find them heavy to my taste.

Norz , may be it is just that our fingers are slender and not enough strength when we type. Or may be we wank too much, Who knows? 

[Norz]

@lonedruid

If you read my last post you'll see that removing o-rings to use "naked" blue switches made a BIG difference though ! They're much much lighter now, to a point i really started to like them. Since its probably inferior for gaming tho, it's now all about whether i want my keyboard to be more gaming or typing oriented. Tough choice..