Author Topic: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread  (Read 10339 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:13:45 »
Hey Geekhack. I don't post here very often, I usually find myself on DT, or just lurking around here. Finally I think I have found something worthy of posting here, that you guys might find interesting, so here it goes.

Earlier this week I received a neat 107 key IBM 4704 Model F (PN: 6020218) . While no where near as elegant as the lovely Kishsaver or 77 key models, this is still quite an awesome keyboard. I immediately broke it open after tearing it out of the box, and began to bring it back to life. My end results are to get it looking pretty and running one of Xwhatsit's lovely converters. I figured I would make this post as something of a worklog, if anyone else was interested, and to get some answers to a few questions. As always, you can use my pictures for any purpose you see fit. Let's get started!







Out of the box, it was pretty damn dirty. Partially sticky, pen drawings on the case, peeling, chipping, and eroding paint, and grimy. Just what I expected from a bank teller's keyboard. On the back the label was still intact. It was manufactured in the Armonk, NY factory, January 1985. There is also a stamp on the inside of the top case that says January 25, 1984, as well as a stamp on the bottom half of the case that says December 8, 1984. First impressions of typing on the keyboard were good. All of the keys felt and sounded like they were buckling smoothly, with all of the stabilized keys working properly.







Soaked the keycaps in a bowl with warm water and laundry detergent for a few hours. Separated the windowed keycaps, and removed the labels. Everything looks great now, except for the tops of the windowed caps are a good deal yellowed, with some cracks in the casing.







While this is the first time I have ever cracked the case of a Model F, with the amount of reading I have been doing here on these types of boards, I felt pretty confident I could do it. And sure enough, it wasn't bad at all. The barrel plate was clearly a mess. It had corrosion and a bit of rusting, as well as crap sticking to it like crazy. The PCB is in excellent condition. All of the flippers (flippies?), barrels are also looking great.



The foam however, was not okay. It was attached fine, but it was disintegrating. Its hard to describe, but some of the sections had no foam left at all. I tried to be as careful as I possibly could when removing the foam from the barrel plate, but in the end it had turned the sheets I had been working on (weird place to work I know, but that room had some good lighting for taking pictures) black with dust and bits of foam. While its not going to be easy, I am gonna have to replace the foam.







The next steps were to find a tub large enough to submerge the entire 12 pound case to soak it in detergent for a few hours. While it was soaking, I went and sanded down the barrel plate with some 600 grit sand paper. I got it as smooth and corrosion and rust free as I could. In order to keep it rust free, I taped up all of the stabilizers, and sprayed it with a few coats of Rust-Oleum, Stops Rust paint. I sanded in between each coat with 1500 grit, and gave it plenty of drying time. I am aware that it is blue, but it was the only adequate paint I could find at the time  :lol:





Finally, this is how everything looks after being washed, and sanded/painted. As you can see the paint does not look great. Some how it looks like I might have scratched a bit of paint off of the left hand side, and there is discoloring around the top. It looks a hell of a lot better then before, but still not perfect.







That is all the work I have done so far! I am still recuperating from all the spending I did last month, so it might be another month before I am able to continue work on this. I plan to buy some of Xwhatsits controller PCBs seperately through OSHpark, and all of the components, and assemble everything myself. I need to figure out what is the best type of foam to use, and then I need to figure out what I want to do about the case.

There is already a good amount of info on replacement foam to use in these Model F's. For example:

This excellent thread

Still a lot of options to choose from. Any feedback on the foam mat, or what to do about the case... Actually, any feedback at all would be greatly appreciated. I will continue to update this, when ever I make any more progress. Feel free to post any of your 107 key Model F's, or what ever.

Deskthority Thread
Flickr Album

Offline mogo

  • Posts: 588
  • handshoes and horse grenades
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:17:00 »
She's huge! What a mighty beast of a keyboard, I'm looking forward to seeing it returned to its original glory! Thanks Pyrelink!  :thumb:

Offline The_Beast

  • * Maker
  • Posts: 3964
  • Location: Wisconsin
  • I like wood ಠ_๏
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:20:37 »
BTW, if you didn't want to use the original caps/stabilizers, you can easily install these white inserts with a new unicomp/model M set since they have the leg on all the caps that require stabilization.

Vendor Status: Sadly, not taking any orders/pre-orders at this time

Vendor Quick Links: | Vendor Forum | Hardwood Wrist Rests | Hardwood 60% Cases | Customer Gallery | Giveaway |

Offline sleepy916

  • Posts: 859
  • Location: East Bay, California
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:23:16 »
Good work so far! I'm jealous you have the original long bar foot on yours.

Offline The_Beast

  • * Maker
  • Posts: 3964
  • Location: Wisconsin
  • I like wood ಠ_๏
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:25:33 »
Good work so far! I'm jealous you have the original long bar foot on yours.

I didn't even notice that. It's pretty sweet!
Vendor Status: Sadly, not taking any orders/pre-orders at this time

Vendor Quick Links: | Vendor Forum | Hardwood Wrist Rests | Hardwood 60% Cases | Customer Gallery | Giveaway |

Offline Puddsy

  • nice
  • * Elated Elder
  • Posts: 11158
  • Location: Campaign Trail
  • "Do you shovel to survive, or survive to shovel?"
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #5 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:38:35 »
That really is a huge keyboard.
QFR | MJ2 TKL | "Bulgogiboard" (Keycon 104) | MIRA SE | TGR Alice | Daily driver: TGR Alice

Everything you have said in the past has been false so I will keep my hope.

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #6 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:43:17 »
BTW, if you didn't want to use the original caps/stabilizers, you can easily install these white inserts with a new unicomp/model M set since they have the leg on all the caps that require stabilization.

That's good to know. I haven't put much thought into eventual layouts yet, but I imagine this will come in handy.

Good work so far! I'm jealous you have the original long bar foot on yours.

When I was first taking it apart I didn't realize that it was a separate piece, and I could not seem to figure out where that last screw was hiding.  :))

Offline Hypersphere

  • Posts: 1856
  • Location: USA
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #7 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 19:50:18 »
Thanks for posting this. It will be a worthy addition to the restoration threads for other Model F keyboards, such as the AT, XT, F122, and Kishsaver. There are bound to be unique features to the F107 making this thread useful and interesting to others. I have recently received an F107, but I will not have time to start my restoration for quite a while. I look forward to following your progress here on GH and/or over on DT.

Offline fohat.digs

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 5619
  • Location: 34.04 N 84.47 W
  • weird funny old guy
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #8 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 20:36:07 »
A few comments about stabilizers.

BTW, if you didn't want to use the original caps/stabilizers, you can easily install these white inserts with a new unicomp/model M set since they have the leg on all the caps that require stabilization.

Show Image


Unless you can verify that this is correct, I think that you are recommending the wrong barrel insert. There are "on-center" inserts for the horizontal keys and "off-centered" inserts for the vertical keys. On all the Model M/Fs that I have repaired, the numpad Enter and plus required an "off-center" insert as shown.

As for the small plastic tabs, they can be removed and replaced, with a "casualty rate" of 10%-30%. You simply push them out with a small flat-head screwdriver from the back to the front. This makes the sanding and painting much easier and more satisfying. And, the paint in the holes improves the force fit which might otherwise have been degraded somewhat.
« Last Edit: Fri, 26 September 2014, 20:38:10 by fohat.digs »
What the researchers found is that after controlling for gender, age, education level, and ideology, NFC [Need for Chaos] was strongly correlated with a willingness to spread hostile rumors online. Younger, less educated men were more likely to have a strong NFC, as were people who were lonely and perceived themselves as lacking social status. NFC is associated with support for Donald Trump, which makes sense. Both Trump and to a lesser, and in a qualitatively different way, Sanders offered the 2016 electorate — including all the susceptible, alienated and disenchanted folks who comprise it — a radical departure from the norm, giving voice to sentiments that had probably been bubbling in their followers’ heads for quite a long time.

The responses to three of the statements in particular were “staggering,” the paper says: 24 percent agreed that society should be burned to the ground; 40 percent concurred with the thought that “When it comes to our political and social institutions, I cannot help thinking ‘just let them all burn’ ”; and 40 percent also agreed that “we cannot fix the problems in our social institutions, we need to tear them down and start over.”

A “Need for Chaos” and the Sharing of Hostile Political Rumors in Advanced Democracies - Petersen - Osmundsen - Arceneaux 2019

Offline The_Beast

  • * Maker
  • Posts: 3964
  • Location: Wisconsin
  • I like wood ಠ_๏
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #9 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 20:46:33 »
A few comments about stabilizers.

BTW, if you didn't want to use the original caps/stabilizers, you can easily install these white inserts with a new unicomp/model M set since they have the leg on all the caps that require stabilization.

Show Image


Unless you can verify that this is correct, I think that you are recommending the wrong barrel insert. There are "on-center" inserts for the horizontal keys and "off-centered" inserts for the vertical keys. On all the Model M/Fs that I have repaired, the numpad Enter and plus required an "off-center" insert as shown.

As for the small plastic tabs, they can be removed and replaced, with a "casualty rate" of 10%-30%. You simply push them out with a small flat-head screwdriver from the back to the front. This makes the sanding and painting much easier and more satisfying. And, the paint in the holes improves the force fit which might otherwise have been degraded somewhat.

I haven't ever noticed that! Thanks for the tip.
Vendor Status: Sadly, not taking any orders/pre-orders at this time

Vendor Quick Links: | Vendor Forum | Hardwood Wrist Rests | Hardwood 60% Cases | Customer Gallery | Giveaway |

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 21:01:10 »
As for the small plastic tabs, they can be removed and replaced, with a "casualty rate" of 10%-30%. You simply push them out with a small flat-head screwdriver from the back to the front. This makes the sanding and painting much easier and more satisfying. And, the paint in the holes improves the force fit which might otherwise have been degraded somewhat.

That's really good to know. I might see about popping a few of them out, and re sanding.

Offline fohat.digs

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 5619
  • Location: 34.04 N 84.47 W
  • weird funny old guy
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 26 September 2014, 21:53:35 »
popping a few of them out,

Be prepared to lose a few. There is a "foot" like flange that flares out on the back and holds it in place.

Try to find a small flat-head screwdriver with a blade that fits the depression in the plastic, and, obviously, is smaller than the hole in the metal plate. Try to be gentle, but it will take some force. If you use both hands and are careful, you can get pretty good at it. A sharp screwdriver tip will do more damage than a blunt one.

To re-install them, I can usually succeed by placing the flat of the screwdriver in the "mouth" of the tab and pressing it in with the blade parallel to the surface of the plate.

If you are modernizing the key set, you can forget the wire stabilizers altogether, except for the space bar. They have not been used at all on Model M/Fs since about 1989.
What the researchers found is that after controlling for gender, age, education level, and ideology, NFC [Need for Chaos] was strongly correlated with a willingness to spread hostile rumors online. Younger, less educated men were more likely to have a strong NFC, as were people who were lonely and perceived themselves as lacking social status. NFC is associated with support for Donald Trump, which makes sense. Both Trump and to a lesser, and in a qualitatively different way, Sanders offered the 2016 electorate — including all the susceptible, alienated and disenchanted folks who comprise it — a radical departure from the norm, giving voice to sentiments that had probably been bubbling in their followers’ heads for quite a long time.

The responses to three of the statements in particular were “staggering,” the paper says: 24 percent agreed that society should be burned to the ground; 40 percent concurred with the thought that “When it comes to our political and social institutions, I cannot help thinking ‘just let them all burn’ ”; and 40 percent also agreed that “we cannot fix the problems in our social institutions, we need to tear them down and start over.”

A “Need for Chaos” and the Sharing of Hostile Political Rumors in Advanced Democracies - Petersen - Osmundsen - Arceneaux 2019

Offline Hypersphere

  • Posts: 1856
  • Location: USA
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #12 on: Sat, 27 September 2014, 08:09:29 »
@fohat.digs: Thanks for the tips about the spacebar stabilizer mounts. Does anyone have extras of these for sale?

Offline Touch_It

  • Posts: 703
IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #13 on: Sat, 27 September 2014, 11:39:36 »
Awesome. Very interested as I plan to start work on mine at some point.  I'm super jealous that yours has a metal leg running the length on the bottom.  I think I will need to find two large tall rubber feet to simulate that.

Ps do you plan to modernize the layout and what color do you plan painting the case.


Visit the Typing Test and try!

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #14 on: Tue, 30 September 2014, 13:56:55 »
Just a quick update here. I decided to take Fohat.digs advice. Seeing as I plan to update the layout of the board, there are quite a few extra stabs on the plate, and there is super heavy corrosion and rusting near each stab, I decided to pop them all out.









As you can see, it turned out nicely. I was super careful with everything, and in the end I only slightly "lost" 1/14 stabs. The one that lost its bottom flange plastic, still fits snugly into the plate though. I imagine a small dab of hot glue, and the stab will work just fine.

Because I am updating the layout, and there are a bunch of extras already on the board, I would be up to giving some away if anyone needs a couple. Sadly I need the space bar stabs though, as I only have 2, and according to fohat.digs, wire stabs haven't been used since 1989...

I have decided that I will eventually be getting the case painted locally in (roughly) IBM Industrial: RAL 7030, as Andrewjoy suggested.

Offline fohat.digs

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 5619
  • Location: 34.04 N 84.47 W
  • weird funny old guy
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #15 on: Tue, 30 September 2014, 19:01:29 »

Sadly I need the space bar stabs though, as I only have 2, and according to fohat.digs, wire stabs haven't been used since 1989...


The spacebar is the only key that still DOES employ wire stabilizers.

The Model F-122 has a spacebar of the same configuration as the standard M and M-122, however, the wire stabilizer of the F-122 is much smaller gauge. You can see where it attaches on the underside of the space bar - the F style has little tabs with circular holes for the wire, while the M has "C"-shaped clip-like mouths for the wire.

You can use the F-style spacebar in the M-style chassis, it will just rattle around a bit. But, of course, the F spacebars and wires are rare and hard to find while the Ms are cheap and plentiful (and available in many colors from Unicomp, too!).

The easy solution is to make new M-sized clips and epoxy them down (as I showed in my guide) which will allow you considerable flexibility.

If you re-install the F-sized wire tab clips, you will need an F spacebar and wire, or one of wcass's elegant sleeved replacements.
What the researchers found is that after controlling for gender, age, education level, and ideology, NFC [Need for Chaos] was strongly correlated with a willingness to spread hostile rumors online. Younger, less educated men were more likely to have a strong NFC, as were people who were lonely and perceived themselves as lacking social status. NFC is associated with support for Donald Trump, which makes sense. Both Trump and to a lesser, and in a qualitatively different way, Sanders offered the 2016 electorate — including all the susceptible, alienated and disenchanted folks who comprise it — a radical departure from the norm, giving voice to sentiments that had probably been bubbling in their followers’ heads for quite a long time.

The responses to three of the statements in particular were “staggering,” the paper says: 24 percent agreed that society should be burned to the ground; 40 percent concurred with the thought that “When it comes to our political and social institutions, I cannot help thinking ‘just let them all burn’ ”; and 40 percent also agreed that “we cannot fix the problems in our social institutions, we need to tear them down and start over.”

A “Need for Chaos” and the Sharing of Hostile Political Rumors in Advanced Democracies - Petersen - Osmundsen - Arceneaux 2019

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 03 October 2014, 16:32:35 »
I realize that this thread has a ton of photos in it already, but I will show no mercy. I will continue to fill this thread with pictures, mobile users and capped bandwidth users be damned   ;D

I made great progress the past couple days. I managed to quite easily tackle the replacement foam issue. Based on reading a bunch of threads, I chose what was not only recommended, but would be the cheapest and easiest to obtain. That would be .49 cent sheets of craft foam from the local craft store. I picked up $7 worth, and only used 2 sheets. Overkill at its finest.







I want to start by saying that I did everything manually, with scissors. I have the proper tools somewhere buried in the mess of my workshop, but due to impatience, I did just about this entire process using scissors and a razor blade.

Cutting  the foam horizontally was the first step. Getting it to fit into the edges of the barrel plate, was easy. The first thing that I noticed was that being such a huge ass keyboard, the foam that I bought would not reach the last (technically first if looking at it right side up) column of 10 barrels. So I had to cut out a separate block. I taped the felt down to the plate with what I thought would be safe, blue tape. Then I did a coat or 2 of paint onto the plate, leaving wonderful outlines on the foam.



I proceeded to cut out each individual circle. At this point, I was planning on using my drill press to cut out each individual circle. I tried on the first hole, and it tore up the edges of the foam pretty bad, and it also meant I would need to cut out the small notch manually, anyway. The only x-acto knife I had was super dull, so that meant, and like I mentioned, my leather punches were buried, and I had no desire to go dig for them. In the end it took me about an hour exactly to cut out all of those holes. While they don't look pretty, they hold the barrels perfectly, and I didn't manage to screw any of them up.







This part was the most tricky to figure out. I still don't know whether I did this appropriately, but I do know that it works. After installing all the stabilizers in backwards (minus the spacebar) and popping in all of the flippies (including some in the wrong barrels), I needed to find a way to get the PCB onto the plate. The same thread that was fohat mentioned using craft foam, there was also discussion about using clamps for something. To be honest I did not read that entire thread, as carefully as I should. When I got to this step, I knew exactly what they were talking about with the clamps. These are the steps I used to very easily get the plates back together. I don't have any more pictures of this process sadly:

    1. Lined up the PCB and the barrel plate, and hooked in the side of the barrel plate/PCB with the longer fatter metal tabs.
    2. On the side with the smaller thinner metal tabs, I took a pair of needle nose pliers and bent them back from the plate.
    3. Using clamps I tightened the PCB and plate together, until the PCB passed the edge of the tab.
    4. Then I bend the tab back into place over the PCB using pliers, and do that for all the tabs. 





As you can see, the plate looks like crap. The paint got torn up for a couple reasons. The primary being the fact that I did not really give the plate time to cure. This probably only had 6 hours at most to cure from the last coat, to trying to assemble everything. The clamps, the blue tape, and a screw driver (inserting stabs) all proved to destroy the paint. For this reason, I highly recommend allowing any paint 3 days to fully cure (yes 3 whole days), as well as using heat shrink (or duct tape etc.) on the edges of the clamps. This should help to reduce the destruction of your beautiful paint.

I was impatient with assembly because I was already pretty sure I wanted to repaint the plate with a more drab color, and I wanted to test to see if that foam worked at all, or if I needed to get to work on something totally different.

After assembling all of the keycaps, I noticed that the top and bottom row keys felt insanely sturdy and were surprisingly not all that pingy. The center 3 rows on the other hand felt very "light", they pinged like a piano, and if you wiggled around the "F" key, R, D, G, C, V, R, and T all moved around with it. I also found out that I put a few flippers in the wrong spots for the stabilized keys, and some how I have managed to lose a single barrel+flipper, with no freaking idea where it went!







Opening everything back up, I found exactly what I suspected. There was not enough foam on the middle rows. You can see by the marks left in the top and bottom row, with hardly anything on the middle 3 rows! I have remedied this by cutting out a second piece of foam for the middle 3 rows.



I have also decided to repaint the plate with a nice Walnut color. I am also clear coating the plate, and it is currently drying in a nice spot, and will be curing for 3 days. I will not be reassembling everything until Monday.

I will close this project update with a question. I want to update my key layout on this board. Specifically I would like to lengthen the left shift, possibly do a HHKB style right shift, and extend the enter key. I would also like to replace all of the windowed keys. I want nav keys in the first block of 15, and then turn the block of 20 into a numpad, with something like F1-10 in the block to the far left.

What would be the best way to do that? I was originally thinking about just buying a Unicomp keyset for $30, but there is that whole quality issue there. Would it make sense to just buy and strip a Model M, or does Unicomp have decent enough quality? And what about the special size keys. To do the layout changes I am considering, are there any specific keys, not included in a stock layout that I would have to separately source?

And finally, thanks Fohat.digs, again for the spacebar info. I got that info backwards. Luckily my spacebar is in spectacular condition, so I won't be needing that replaced.

Offline fohat.digs

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 5619
  • Location: 34.04 N 84.47 W
  • weird funny old guy
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #17 on: Sat, 04 October 2014, 13:22:56 »

I want to start by saying that I did everything manually, with scissors. I have the proper tools somewhere buried in the mess of my workshop, but due to impatience, I did just about this entire process using scissors and a razor blade.

I proceeded to cut out each individual circle. At this point, I was planning on using my drill press to cut out each individual circle. I tried on the first hole, and it tore up the edges of the foam pretty bad, and it also meant I would need to cut out the small notch manually, anyway. The only x-acto knife I had was super dull, so that meant, and like I mentioned, my leather punches were buried, and I had no desire to go dig for them. In the end it took me about an hour exactly to cut out all of those holes. While they don't look pretty, they hold the barrels perfectly, and I didn't manage to screw any of them up.


Whoa! That is a lot of work for those holes! You could have found your 5/8" punch in an hour.


This part was the most tricky to figure out. I still don't know whether I did this appropriately, but I do know that it works. After installing all the stabilizers in backwards (minus the spacebar) and popping in all of the flippies (including some in the wrong barrels), I needed to find a way to get the PCB onto the plate. The same thread that was fohat mentioned using craft foam, there was also discussion about using clamps for something. To be honest I did not read that entire thread, as carefully as I should. When I got to this step, I knew exactly what they were talking about with the clamps.


The spring clamps in my guide have rubber ends that really help, although they are not as strong as screw clamps. I also use cut squares of old terry-cloth washcloths to pad all the "mouths" of tools.


After assembling all of the keycaps, I noticed that the top and bottom row keys felt insanely sturdy and were surprisingly not all that pingy. The center 3 rows on the other hand felt very "light", they pinged like a piano, and if you wiggled around the "F" key, R, D, G, C, V, R, and T all moved around with it. I also found out that I put a few flippers in the wrong spots for the stabilized keys, and some how I have managed to lose a single barrel+flipper, with no freaking idea where it went!


Your long skinny board does not have the center row of tabs like the F-122.

That center-line flex is why I added the center bolts. They were an attempt to pull the front plate back into the deepest curvature of the back plate.


Opening everything back up, I found exactly what I suspected. There was not enough foam on the middle rows. You can see by the marks left in the top and bottom row, with hardly anything on the middle 3 rows! I have remedied this by cutting out a second piece of foam for the middle 3 rows.


I hope that all the people who have wailed about how hard it is to compress the art foam are seeing this.


I will close this project update with a question. I want to update my key layout on this board. Specifically I would like to lengthen the left shift, possibly do a HHKB style right shift, and extend the enter key. I would also like to replace all of the windowed keys. I want nav keys in the first block of 15, and then turn the block of 20 into a numpad, with something like F1-10 in the block to the far left.

What would be the best way to do that? I was originally thinking about just buying a Unicomp keyset for $30, but there is that whole quality issue there. Would it make sense to just buy and strip a Model M, or does Unicomp have decent enough quality? And what about the special size keys. To do the layout changes I am considering, are there any specific keys, not included in a stock layout that I would have to separately source?


Buying a full set of M keys or a junk M is the easiest and cheapest way to get what you need. If you like the RGB set from Unicomp, that is about half of the replacement keys that you need.

The long left shift key needs a stabilizer insert (and, obviously, no spring in that hole). You will need some of those inserts for all the long keys that you are adding.

Most of this is in my guide, somewhere, but I know that it can get to be a big pile of TL;DR
What the researchers found is that after controlling for gender, age, education level, and ideology, NFC [Need for Chaos] was strongly correlated with a willingness to spread hostile rumors online. Younger, less educated men were more likely to have a strong NFC, as were people who were lonely and perceived themselves as lacking social status. NFC is associated with support for Donald Trump, which makes sense. Both Trump and to a lesser, and in a qualitatively different way, Sanders offered the 2016 electorate — including all the susceptible, alienated and disenchanted folks who comprise it — a radical departure from the norm, giving voice to sentiments that had probably been bubbling in their followers’ heads for quite a long time.

The responses to three of the statements in particular were “staggering,” the paper says: 24 percent agreed that society should be burned to the ground; 40 percent concurred with the thought that “When it comes to our political and social institutions, I cannot help thinking ‘just let them all burn’ ”; and 40 percent also agreed that “we cannot fix the problems in our social institutions, we need to tear them down and start over.”

A “Need for Chaos” and the Sharing of Hostile Political Rumors in Advanced Democracies - Petersen - Osmundsen - Arceneaux 2019

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #18 on: Sat, 04 October 2014, 14:34:14 »
Yeah it was a hell of a lot of work to do all those holes. And even worse, when I realized I needed to do it all over again, for the middle rows! Ironically I found both my leather punches, and an old caliper, this morning in a toolbox on a shelf... I also finally found the guides you kept mentioning, and read through both your original and your updated guide. Somehow I managed to read everything BUT those threads  :D. I seem to have progressed in pretty much the same way that you went through.

One thing I was curious about was, whether or not I should use your clamp method to slide the plates back together? I found what I did, bending back the tabs, clamping, and bending back worked perfectly (especially since I don't have tabs in the center). But would you worry about weakening those tabs too much? This will only be my second time bending the tabs, but what would you say the balance of metal fatigue vs. effort of trying to slide the plates back together is? I do have a whole huge set of Jorgensen clamps, and those spring clamps to use, if need be.

I am still working through what I want the layout to be, but I have decided to go with old M/XT caps instead of Unicomp. I think I will really just be going for extending the ANSI Return, and the Left Shift. Leaving everything else as is. I am getting a good deal on a Great White, and possibly an M, so I will use the Great White for spare parts and the keys, and fill up the rest of the blocks on the 107 with the M keys. I will say after working on this Model F, I am finding it very hard to appreciate the Model M, in the same way. I know many people feel like that, but its really crazy to actually experience the construction of the F, and then compare it to an M. They just don't compare - at all.

When the paint is fully done curing, Monday night, I will put everything back together. Hopefully the extra layer of foam will fix the issue with the center rows. Otherwise, I will have to consider attempting your revised bolt mod method (of only using 2 bolts by enter and F5).

Offline fohat.digs

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 5619
  • Location: 34.04 N 84.47 W
  • weird funny old guy
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #19 on: Sat, 04 October 2014, 21:24:31 »

One thing I was curious about was, whether or not I should use your clamp method to slide the plates back together? I found what I did, bending back the tabs, clamping, and bending back worked perfectly


I might submit that your experience might be pointing otherwise.

The assembly is put together by "sliding force fit" where the rectangular tabs are inserted into the "mouths" of the upside-down "L"-shaped tabs, and then the whole thing is forced in as a unit, all at once.

Each Model F I have taken apart has one tab that was bent over by hand (probably) usually the one near the top of the numpad. I assumed that this was to keep the whole thing from shifting.

If you are just splaying the tabs off the side and then bending them back into place, you are missing the opportunity to achieve the delicate tension/compression balance between the plates.

That is why I deprecated and abandoned the original "Model F bolt mod" scheme even though I had gotten it to work a couple of times. My current center bolts are strengthening the original method rather than replacing it.


I am still working through what I want the layout to be, but I have decided to go with old M/XT caps instead of Unicomp. I think I will really just be going for extending the ANSI Return, and the Left Shift. Leaving everything else as is. I am getting a good deal on a Great White, and possibly an M, so I will use the Great White for spare parts and the keys,



You might get enough barrel inserts that way, too, without having to order them.


Otherwise, I will have to consider attempting your revised bolt mod method (of only using 2 bolts by enter and F5).


Actually, there are 3, with another one between 0) and upper F10. On your mile-long board, you might try to find a place for 4 or even 5. Just look at the PCB and don't drill any traces.
What the researchers found is that after controlling for gender, age, education level, and ideology, NFC [Need for Chaos] was strongly correlated with a willingness to spread hostile rumors online. Younger, less educated men were more likely to have a strong NFC, as were people who were lonely and perceived themselves as lacking social status. NFC is associated with support for Donald Trump, which makes sense. Both Trump and to a lesser, and in a qualitatively different way, Sanders offered the 2016 electorate — including all the susceptible, alienated and disenchanted folks who comprise it — a radical departure from the norm, giving voice to sentiments that had probably been bubbling in their followers’ heads for quite a long time.

The responses to three of the statements in particular were “staggering,” the paper says: 24 percent agreed that society should be burned to the ground; 40 percent concurred with the thought that “When it comes to our political and social institutions, I cannot help thinking ‘just let them all burn’ ”; and 40 percent also agreed that “we cannot fix the problems in our social institutions, we need to tear them down and start over.”

A “Need for Chaos” and the Sharing of Hostile Political Rumors in Advanced Democracies - Petersen - Osmundsen - Arceneaux 2019

Offline 0100010

  • Posts: 1123
  • Location: DFW, TX, US
  • Not Sure
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #20 on: Mon, 13 October 2014, 13:23:11 »
Question about the need to add more foam to the center rows; could it be that the top plate is just not as curved as it was originally?
  Quoting me causes a posting error that you need to ignore.

Offline Touch_It

  • Posts: 703
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #21 on: Mon, 20 October 2014, 12:42:35 »
Hmm, any updates on this?


Visit the Typing Test and try!

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #22 on: Mon, 20 October 2014, 14:21:51 »
Well currently my limiting factor is money. I actually just got a new job that starts soon. As soon as I get some spare cash I will be continuing this project. I need a new type of replacement mat, and a Xwhatsit's board. I plan to update this as soon as I make progress. Hopefully no more then a couple weeks!

Offline Touch_It

  • Posts: 703
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #23 on: Mon, 20 October 2014, 14:28:05 »
Ahh cool.  Just curious because I was hoping to start mine soon and was curious how your restoration was going.


Visit the Typing Test and try!

Offline pr0ximity

  • Posts: 2424
  • Location: Vacationland
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #24 on: Tue, 21 October 2014, 19:15:32 »
Just got my 107-key in as well, it's got that same great metal foot running the (long) length of the board.

Great thread, I'm really looking forward to how your board progresses in the future. Restoring these is certainly a daunting task. I'll be taking mine slow as well likely over a few months time. I just got done bolt-modding my M so I'm a bit IBM'd out at the moment. One thing I'm very concerned about is not ruining the feel of the board with the trickiness of the foam replacement. It feels great as it is, so I'll be going slow if I replace that foam to make sure it only gets better and not worse.

On a side note, these things are goddamned heavy. I couldn't believe it when I pulled it out of the box, it felt heavier than it did in the box.
| Flickr | Current: Whale/Pro1/356mini/1390120/F107/3101

Offline dorkvader

  • Posts: 6282
  • Location: Boston area
  • all about the "hack" in "geekhack"
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #25 on: Tue, 28 October 2014, 17:18:20 »
Just got my 107-key in as well, it's got that same great metal foot running the (long) length of the board.

Great thread, I'm really looking forward to how your board progresses in the future. Restoring these is certainly a daunting task. I'll be taking mine slow as well likely over a few months time. I just got done bolt-modding my M so I'm a bit IBM'd out at the moment. One thing I'm very concerned about is not ruining the feel of the board with the trickiness of the foam replacement. It feels great as it is, so I'll be going slow if I replace that foam to make sure it only gets better and not worse.

On a side note, these things are goddamned heavy. I couldn't believe it when I pulled it out of the box, it felt heavier than it did in the box.

is the foot on yours metal? all the 4704 feet I know of are plastic.

Offline pr0ximity

  • Posts: 2424
  • Location: Vacationland
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #26 on: Tue, 28 October 2014, 17:59:37 »
is the foot on yours metal? all the 4704 feet I know of are plastic.

I thought it was at first, but on closer inspection it is indeed plastic. How strange everything else is metal but that.
| Flickr | Current: Whale/Pro1/356mini/1390120/F107/3101

Offline Touch_It

  • Posts: 703
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #27 on: Tue, 28 October 2014, 18:01:02 »
Ehh well if it's jus plastic I'm not near as sad that mine didn't come with one.


Visit the Typing Test and try!

Offline fohat.digs

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 5619
  • Location: 34.04 N 84.47 W
  • weird funny old guy
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #28 on: Tue, 28 October 2014, 18:35:57 »
One thing I'm very concerned about is not ruining the feel of the board with the trickiness of the foam replacement.

There are differences of opinion about where the Model F "feel" really comes from.

Personally, (based on having completely dis-assembled these beasts dozens of times (usually multiple times per each)) I have come to believe that it is the intricate web of tension and compression gradients amongst the various plates that instills the resonance of "life" into the keyboard. (Hence all the anguish with the clamps and trying to slide-fit it all back together.)

Having something that feels and sounds as "alive" as a Model F (and, of course, a Model M is all but lifeless and devoid of springiness in this sense) you have quite a bit of flexibility in what you do with it. For one thing, that is why I floss mod all my Fs, they can take it and still feel exquisite while losing many of those annoying high-end resonances.

Going with a thick firm foam plays into that tension/compression mix in interesting ways. While it adds even more stress to the system by trying to "burst out of" the center layer, it simultaneously has a dampening effect on the vibrations. Best of both worlds, in my opinion. However, if you like it loud and singing, use a very thin foam and skip the floss mod.
What the researchers found is that after controlling for gender, age, education level, and ideology, NFC [Need for Chaos] was strongly correlated with a willingness to spread hostile rumors online. Younger, less educated men were more likely to have a strong NFC, as were people who were lonely and perceived themselves as lacking social status. NFC is associated with support for Donald Trump, which makes sense. Both Trump and to a lesser, and in a qualitatively different way, Sanders offered the 2016 electorate — including all the susceptible, alienated and disenchanted folks who comprise it — a radical departure from the norm, giving voice to sentiments that had probably been bubbling in their followers’ heads for quite a long time.

The responses to three of the statements in particular were “staggering,” the paper says: 24 percent agreed that society should be burned to the ground; 40 percent concurred with the thought that “When it comes to our political and social institutions, I cannot help thinking ‘just let them all burn’ ”; and 40 percent also agreed that “we cannot fix the problems in our social institutions, we need to tear them down and start over.”

A “Need for Chaos” and the Sharing of Hostile Political Rumors in Advanced Democracies - Petersen - Osmundsen - Arceneaux 2019

Offline 0100010

  • Posts: 1123
  • Location: DFW, TX, US
  • Not Sure
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #29 on: Tue, 28 October 2014, 20:48:47 »
I tried three different kinds of foam on my Model F rebuild; 2mm craft foam, 3mm craft foam, a combination of those two and 1/4" 'automotive headliner' foam.  I think I like the feel the best with the soft headliner foam.
  Quoting me causes a posting error that you need to ignore.

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #30 on: Wed, 05 November 2014, 21:14:44 »
As some have probably read, I have successfully gotten my 107 key up and running with one of Xwhatsit's controllers! Even though it worked, I am still a good ways from finished with it. Since starting this work log, I have realized the truly vast amount of content surrounding Model F restoration out here already. When I started, the photo aspect of this project was at the front of my mind, and recently I have been making progress, forgetting to take pictures. As the board nears completion, I will try and take more pictures. Anyway, here is what I have done and what I have learned:



If I haven't already stated it enough, I was very wrong about bending the metal tabs, in order to put the barrel plate and PCB back together. As Fohat pointed out, the PCB and barrel plate need to be force fit into place. As others have suggested, the best method is to use a really long clamp to hold the PCB. Then use a rubber/plastic mallet/hammer to smack the plate into place, and then bend the top left tab back over (the large tab is the only one that should/needs to be bent.



I have since realized that Hypersphere is right. When it comes to painting these damn barrel plates, you have to rigorously follow the directions on the spray can. He recommends doing 1 coat per 24 hours, with light sanding (1500 grit or so) in between each coat. Stick to general painting guidelines (you put on too much paint if it looks wet) and don't put on too many coats. Then let the plate cure for a good 3 days before trying to reassemble it.

In addition, I found that wash cloths were ineffective for protecting the back PCB plate and the barrel plate from marks when clamping down the board for reassembly. This could be for an assortment of different reasons (types of clamps, binder clips, amount of clamping force, etc) but something I picked up from Quantalume was to use spare bits of foam on either side of the clips. I can confirm that foam works quite well.





Don't be an idiot like me. Use a leather punch for your foam layer. 5/8" worked perfectly for each of the holes, and only took me 20 mins to punch out all the barrels. Just make sure you have a softer piece of wood under the foam, and that you are not punching directly into a preexisting hole. Foam can tear easily.



While I was waiting for my Xwhatsit controller I baked an Apple pie in a cast iron pan, from some left over apples we got from a local orchard. I didn't really spend much time making the crust look nice, but it was damn tasty. And yes, I did eat close to the entire pie, myself, in the matter of 2 days (I know that's what everyone was thinking   :)) )



It didn't turn out... too badly. The heating element in my soldering pencil in my soldering station is still damaged. So until I order a new one, I had to use a Weller, "plug in the wall" iron, with no temperature control  :eek: Reckless I know...
 


I have since cleaned up the excess flux, clipped the ends, and replaced the red jumper with a shorter one. I had a pretty difficult time lining up the controller, and once I had finished soldering everything, I realized that it wasn't able to bolt into one of the tabs on the PCB - hence the jumpers on either side, to make sure it was grounded. It does fit into the case safely, with no strain, and everything functions properly. I may or may not try and make it look prettier, but it is a lesson for future boards. Make sure you get that ribbon cable safely de-soldered, and stripped, and ensure the controller bolts into a tab, before soldering.

Just some final comments on this update. I know the issue of foam has been beaten to death, but I will say that I have not had much of any luck using art foam. I believe it is just too stiff to work properly. I have tried art foam from both Michaels and A.C. Moore (a craft store on the East Coast) to minimal avail. 1 sheet of foam was just not enough. Middle barrels wiggled and pinged like crazy. 2 Sheets was way too much material, and using 1 sheet with a single strip of extra foam in the center row - worked, but still doesn't compare to how perfectly this 1/16" Super Soft Weather and Fire Resistant Neoprene Foam worked. That's the same foam that has been recommended plenty of times, by plenty of people.

I am going to be getting a Model M + an XT from Cindy soon. In addition to insert stabilizers from Unicomp. Next update will be final assembly. Long term update will be getting the case powder coated.  :D

Offline mogo

  • Posts: 588
  • handshoes and horse grenades
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #31 on: Wed, 05 November 2014, 21:34:19 »
Great info, very explicit tips and valuable advice! And of course, as many will comment, that's a delicious looking pie.  :thumb:

Offline 0100010

  • Posts: 1123
  • Location: DFW, TX, US
  • Not Sure
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 05 November 2014, 22:04:09 »
Looks like a Griswold #8 skillet?

Looks like you soldered the new controller on from the other side of the board (nothing wrong with that) - and it looks like doing so bought you easy clearance from the expansion header compared to that nearby barrel frame tab.
  Quoting me causes a posting error that you need to ignore.

Offline orihalcon

  • Posts: 95
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #33 on: Sat, 08 November 2014, 18:12:00 »
Couldn't it be possible to just add some curvature of the center of the top plate so that it matches the bottom plate so that a uniform thickness foam would compress more evenly?  We'd only be adding like an extra 1/16 to 1/8 inch of depth which shouldn't really change how it fits to the bottom plate from a width standpoint.  Problem is that it would be hard to create a consistent smooth bend across the entire plate since it is kind of long. 

Probably could be done with some sort of jig that stabilizes the top and bottom edges and clamps that depresses a long heavy steel rod down the center (pulled from the sides with either C-Clamps or pressed from above with a hydraulic press).
 
Any thoughts on such a jig, or does it sound too risky?
« Last Edit: Sat, 08 November 2014, 18:20:34 by orihalcon »

Offline Hypersphere

  • Posts: 1856
  • Location: USA
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #34 on: Sat, 29 November 2014, 16:56:24 »
Regarding foam, I used rather thick (1/8-iinch) silicone sponge in my XT renovation. It was very difficult to get the plates to slide into position, even using a long bar clamp, but I am pleased with the result.

However, for future projects, especially with larger Model F boards such as the F107 and F122, I think I will use thinner sponge or foam, such as 3/32-inch silicone or even 1/16-inch soft neoprene.

On a different aspect of Model F renovation, I am thinking of installing a panel-mount micro-USB connector in my F107. Ideas on this would be most welcome.

Offline Pyrelink

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 23
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #35 on: Sat, 29 November 2014, 17:08:57 »
I love the idea of a panel mount Micro USB. I have since gotten my 107 all back together (typing on it now), and all I did was loosely secure the USB cable inside the case. I am however finding that I don't have as much cable length as I would like to have and I would not like to see what happens if this cable were to get caught or yanked, or something crazy  :eek:

Where were you thinking of adding the connector? Something like drilling out the existing cable "hole" and mounting it somehow right there?

Offline Hypersphere

  • Posts: 1856
  • Location: USA
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #36 on: Sat, 29 November 2014, 17:54:15 »
I love the idea of a panel mount Micro USB. I have since gotten my 107 all back together (typing on it now), and all I did was loosely secure the USB cable inside the case. I am however finding that I don't have as much cable length as I would like to have and I would not like to see what happens if this cable were to get caught or yanked, or something crazy  :eek:

Where were you thinking of adding the connector? Something like drilling out the existing cable "hole" and mounting it somehow right there?
It seems strange, given the large overall size of the F107, but the quarters are actually rather cramped when it comes to installing a panel-mount micro-USB or mini-USB connector. There are also some technical difficulties. For example, I thought of putting the connector near the existing cable outlet, but there is actually not an abundance of space in this area. In addition, I would want it to be mounted in the bottom of the case, but the top part houses the controller. This presents some difficulties if you ever intend to open the case again after installing everything. You would need to provide ample strain relief and cable length to keep from pulling things apart when opening the case.

I thought of using one of the Mouser panel-mount connectors, but these are actually designed for installation on a circuit board with through-hole soldering. The pins are very small and close together, making it a challenge to connect wires.

I am leaning in the direction of using a panel-mount micro-USB that is attached to a micro-USB cable. These are actually rather bulky, but at least the wires are already attached. To enable sufficient flexibility inside the case, I think I will cut the cable and use jumper-header connectors and jumper wires to span the distance between the panel-mount connector (sited near the existing cable exit hole) and the micro-USB connector on the controller board.

When I get this all sorted out, I will probably start a new thread and post some diagrams and photos.


Offline 0100010

  • Posts: 1123
  • Location: DFW, TX, US
  • Not Sure
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #37 on: Sat, 29 November 2014, 20:05:24 »
I used two USB cables on my 4704 107 rebuild.  The cable connected directly to the controller was a micro USB right angle down cable.  The second was a normal USB A male to USB B male cable, 6ft.  Clipped the B end of the 6', and clipped the female end of the micro USB cable and soldered / heatshrinked the individual leads together.  Also used the original grounding strap to secure the grounding braid of the 6ft cable, that way it can't be pulled out of the case; also did not have to modify the  cable exit hole in the case at all.
  Quoting me causes a posting error that you need to ignore.

Offline dotcom

  • Posts: 7
  • Location: MO
Re: IBM 107 Key Model F 6020218 Restoration Work Thread
« Reply #38 on: Wed, 07 June 2017, 22:10:57 »
A bit late to the party here, but I'm currently in the middle of restoring an F107. This guide and several others floating around GH and DT have been invaluable. Thanks to everyone who has contributed to these logs.

In terms of removing the plastic stabilizers, I followed fohat.digs's advice, but in addition to using a flathead screwdriver with a head approximately the size of the depression of the stabilizer, I also placed a cloth in between the screwdriver and the stab whenever I applied force. This worked quite well for me, and in doing this, I was able to remove all stabs without damaging any of them and even kept them from getting scuffed or scraped up by the screwdriver in the process.