pay someone to replace one switch, or buy soldering gear?

[zombimuncha]

I've managed to break one of the switches in my Matias Quiet Pro. Contact leaf is all munged up.


http://imgur.com/sPD7T7R
(btw, how do I get the img tag to work?)(edit: NVM, I got it.)

I tried bending it back into shape but failed.
When I plug the keyboard in, it's like someone is holding that key (numpad 6) down. It repeats forever even if I dont' touch it. Then after I press some other key, the 6 stops repeating and the keyboard mostly behaves as normal, except that the numpad 6 doesn't work. So I assume it's ONLY the switch that is toasted and I just need to replace it

So I got a new switch to replace it with. I got a few spares actually, (including a couple of clicky switches incidentally, which I'm surprised how much I like - I think I need to get a keyboard with these!)

The problem is I don't have any soldering equipment, and haven't done any soldering for about 30 years, so I would need to buy all the kit, and find some junk circuit boards to practice on, the whole 9 yards. This would probably pay off eventually, as I'm moderately interested in building as custom keyboard or two in the (distant) future. But I currently don't even have a space in which to set up a soldering station, other than my desk at work, after hours. No space for it at home

I guess it mainly comes down to money.
How much should I expect to pay to get someone to replace 1 switch for me, (located in London, if it makes any difference), and how would I go about finding someone to do it?
And how much would a halfway decent soldering setup cost?

thanks for any advice you can give!

[ghostjuggernaut]

Edit: nvm Tapatalk isnt working for me.

[nubbinator]

It depends on if you plan on soldering in the future.  Think of it this way, cost of shipping will be $30+, plus materials cost, plus labor.  That's $50-60.  I picked up a solid soldering iron for $70, plus solder for $10, plus a solder sucker for $15.  So you can get a decent setup for $100 or so or you can pay $60+ for the work.  I prefer the DIY option, but it's not for everyone.

You might be able to fix it without doing either though.  You should be able to pop the affected leaf off the contact and drop on another from a new switch.  You can also do a whole switch top swap.  If that works, you saved even more money.

[zombimuncha]

It depends on if you plan on soldering in the future.  Think of it this way, cost of shipping will be $30+, plus materials cost, plus labor.  That's $50-60.  I picked up a solid soldering iron for $70, plus solder for $10, plus a solder sucker for $15.  So you can get a decent setup for $100 or so or you can pay $60+ for the work.  I prefer the DIY option, but it's not for everyone.

Thanks for the numbers!
I'm actually thinking maybe one of those local phone/laptop repair places (the ones that also sell a lot of cheap iphone cases, and USB cords) might be able to do it for fairly cheap, but no idea really if they would even be able to. But that would at least save on shipping. The MQP is pretty heavy!

You might be able to fix it without doing either though.  You should be able to pop the affected leaf off the contact and drop on another from a new switch.  You can also do a whole switch top swap.  If that works, you saved even more money.

AFAICT on Matias switches the contact leaf and the "legs" are the same 2 bits of metal, and are soldered directly to the PCB, so I don't see how I could swap the contact leaf without desoldering. I'll be happy to be proven wrong tho. Got a walkthru / guide / photos?

[exitfire401]

AFAICT on Matias switches the contact leaf and the "legs" are the same 2 bits of metal, and are soldered directly to the PCB, so I don't see how I could swap the contact leaf without desoldering. I'll be happy to be proven wrong tho. Got a walkthru / guide / photos?

This is correct. On normal alps switches, the click leaf is another piece altogether. Personally, I would suggest just purchasing soldering equipment. Decent equipment can be had for $70-$90 and it's an immensely helpful skill. Prior to taking an iron to your board though, I'd suggest getting a techkeys card and using that for soldering practice.

[Huxley2500]

Buy one.  Essential life skill.

[chyros]

Option three. Borrow one from a friend. Problem solved .

[zeroni13]

I would swap it for free if you would ship it over here, but soldering isn't that hard and if it is your first time you solder I would recommend looking up some guides on the internet or something.

[Tactile]

I'm not a brit, so I'll just use the American terms...

I'd suggest going to a local community college or even a local high school & asking the electronics class to solder it for you. I'm sure they'd have an interest in the keyboard & would probably be delighted to help you out.

[FrostyToast]

Are you not planning on putting together boards in the future?
If you aren't then there isn't much stopping you from going to a friend's house to use their gear.

[Defect]

My vote is for soldering yourself (practice first!)

You can always sell used soldering iron, and shipping would be cheaper than mailing a keyboard back and forth

BTW
I would be willing to fix it for you if you cover the cost of switches + shipping (both ways).

Good luck.

[zombimuncha]

AFAIK I don't know anybody here in the UK who owns a soldering iron. I have a friend in Australia who probably has one but that's not much use to me here.

Is anyone on here in London (or short train ride from) and could let me use theirs?

[KHAANNN]

AFAIK I don't know anybody here in the UK who owns a soldering iron. I have a friend in Australia who probably has one but that's not much use to me here.

Is anyone on here in London (or short train ride from) and could let me use theirs?

Soldering is very very very very very simple, consider learning it yourself, buy the cheapest soldering set you can find, you might even be able to find a $30 set with a variable temperature soldering stand, desoldering pump, solder, soldering tools, I have one, I also bought more decent versions lately, yet It's good to have the old set too as a fallback set

It's like you are looking to dig a small hole in your garden to put a sapling in, and considering whether you should find a local gardener, or import a gardener
Just buy a $5 shovel and do it yourself

You could even use a lighter to melt the solder, remove the switch, put a new one, and re-heat the soldering point, if you have mcgywer genes or sth

It's really a very simple thing to do, hard to mess up

Test it on an unused toy or something, you will see how simple it is

I write this as a motivational post, hope you get motivated

[DrHubblePhD]

Its never to early do invest in a soldering iron! That said if you are really prohibited by cost there are plenty of people who would be willing to swap out a single switch for you without charge.

[tjcaustin]

AFAIK I don't know anybody here in the UK who owns a soldering iron. I have a friend in Australia who probably has one but that's not much use to me here.

Is anyone on here in London (or short train ride from) and could let me use theirs?

Talk to margo or pexon?

[zombimuncha]

Oh, it just occurred to me that I could ask the IT guys at work. I'm sure we don't have soldering kit at work, but they might have their personal one that they could bring in. Call that Plan A.

Plan B will be to inquire at some of the high street laptop repair type places.

Plan C = buy soldering iron etc.

Thanks for all the help, guys!

[random_rockets]

It depends on if you plan on soldering in the future.  Think of it this way, cost of shipping will be $30+, plus materials cost, plus labor.  That's $50-60.  I picked up a solid soldering iron for $70, plus solder for $10, plus a solder sucker for $15.  So you can get a decent setup for $100 or so or you can pay $60+ for the work.  I prefer the DIY option, but it's not for everyone.

You might be able to fix it without doing either though.  You should be able to pop the affected leaf off the contact and drop on another from a new switch.  You can also do a whole switch top swap.  If that works, you saved even more money.

For PCB desoldering for a novice is wick or pump better?

[KHAANNN]

It depends on if you plan on soldering in the future.  Think of it this way, cost of shipping will be $30+, plus materials cost, plus labor.  That's $50-60.  I picked up a solid soldering iron for $70, plus solder for $10, plus a solder sucker for $15.  So you can get a decent setup for $100 or so or you can pay $60+ for the work.  I prefer the DIY option, but it's not for everyone.

You might be able to fix it without doing either though.  You should be able to pop the affected leaf off the contact and drop on another from a new switch.  You can also do a whole switch top swap.  If that works, you saved even more money.

For PCB desoldering for a novice is wick or pump better?

pump for everyone

[jacobolus]

For PCB desoldering for a novice is wick or pump better?

Get a Soldapullt. Many of the other solder suckers are terrible.

[fknraiden]

it'd probably be best to get your own equipment and DIY, but if you end up sending it to someone i'd do it for free, it just would be a decent amount of shipping to US.

[rowdy]

AFAIK I don't know anybody here in the UK who owns a soldering iron. I have a friend in Australia who probably has one but that's not much use to me here.

Is anyone on here in London (or short train ride from) and could let me use theirs?

Talk to margo or pexon?

+1

Not worth learning to solder on your one and only valuable keyboard.

margo baggins

Pexon PCs

[Bucake]

any suggestions for soldering equipment for up to $300?
right now there are no plans to solder anything but keyboards..
i prefer good quality and useful options, over a cheap price

[Fire Brand]

Just my thoughts I personally do my own soldering I would say do it your self but like others said margin or pexon might be something good option as for irons honestly I use a Weller BP860 battery powered iron which is pretty awesome and cost around £25 just finished replacing a poker switches with it might be worth looking at

[jamster]

any suggestions for soldering equipment for up to $300?
right now there are no plans to solder anything but keyboards..
i prefer good quality and useful options, over a cheap price

This thread is great:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42824.0

[Bucake]

thanks alot jamster, that Edsyn 951SX looks great

[antCB]

i also busted a switch on my keyboard last year (cherry mx), and went ahead and DYI'd with it, no point in paying someone for something so easy to do (with cherry mx it is fairly easy tbh). and, even if i'm not the greatest one handling the soldering iron, I did a pretty good job with it

[zombimuncha]

Since it's just for the one switch (for now), is there any reason not to get something super cheap n (presumably) nasty, like this:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/CostMad-Soldering-Starter-Station-Desoldering/dp/B004MZYQZ4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1427648079&sr=8-1&keywords=soldering

[KHAANNN]

You still haven't fixed your board? omg :)

That one looks good actually, 4.2/5 is pretty good, it should serve you well

[tjcaustin]

Since it's just for the one switch (for now), is there any reason not to get something super cheap n (presumably) nasty, like this:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/CostMad-Soldering-Starter-Station-Desoldering/dp/B004MZYQZ4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1427648079&sr=8-1&keywords=soldering

If you're only ever going to do the one job?  Or a smaller than hobbiest amount of odds/ends?  I dunno if I'd spend the money on tools, you know.

[zombimuncha]

You still haven't fixed your board? omg

That one looks good actually, 4.2/5 is pretty good, it should serve you well

I waited a while for a response from the contracted contingent of the IT dept, who aren't in the office every week. In the meantime I've been enjoying the MX Clears and compact layout of my FC660m.

Since it's just for the one switch (for now), is there any reason not to get something super cheap n (presumably) nasty, like this:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/CostMad-Soldering-Starter-Station-Desoldering/dp/B004MZYQZ4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1427648079&sr=8-1&keywords=soldering

If you're only ever going to do the one job?  Or a smaller than hobbiest amount of odds/ends?  I dunno if I'd spend the money on tools, you know.

Well.... I might be up for building my own board at some point in the distant future. Don't really know yet. For now, this seems like the only sensible option for fixing the QuietPro. Cheaper than shipping it anywhere. Probably easier than shipping too 

[zombimuncha]

oops! double post. Sorry. Mods please feel free to delete.

[livingspeedbump]

Honestly, some basic electronics equipment like soldering gear is good to have around. Even without any electronics knowledge you'd be surprised how much you can do and fix on your own with it. On the side, its a very addicting hobby, and with all these keyboard kits around you could easily save some money by building your next keyboard instead of buying a completed one.

[zombimuncha]

Honestly, some basic electronics equipment like soldering gear is good to have around. Even without any electronics knowledge you'd be surprised how much you can do and fix on your own with it. On the side, its a very addicting hobby, and with all these keyboard kits around you could easily save some money by building your next keyboard instead of buying a completed one.

the question now is "how basic is too basic?"
If I get that £10 set will I end up cursing the gods or burning my house down if I ever get around to building my own lightsaber keyboard? From what I've read, it seems like the fancy variable temp irons are mainly useful for more complicated tasks than a simple handwired, or thru-pcb keyboard.
Are there quirks or gotchas common to cheap-ass soldering irons that I might find annoying?

[heedpantsnow]

Honestly, some basic electronics equipment like soldering gear is good to have around. Even without any electronics knowledge you'd be surprised how much you can do and fix on your own with it. On the side, its a very addicting hobby, and with all these keyboard kits around you could easily save some money by building your next keyboard instead of buying a completed one.

the question now is "how basic is too basic?"
If I get that £10 set will I end up cursing the gods or burning my house down if I ever get around to building my own lightsaber keyboard? From what I've read, it seems like the fancy variable temp irons are mainly useful for more complicated tasks than a simple handwired, or thru-pcb keyboard.
Are there quirks or gotchas common to cheap-ass soldering irons that I might find annoying?

I've been using a cheap soldering iron for years. The noname ones with the little dial. I've always felt soldering was really hard and error-prone, and tried to do it as little as possible.

Recently I bought a Hakko. 888d I think. Now soldering is easy and relaxing. Not stressful like before.

I know it sounds like hype but that's my experience. The hakko's tips are better quality and transfer heat better and more precisely. The temp has much better control, so no more lifted pads or waiting for forever for solder to melt. And you can do one joint one right after another. Not so with the cheaper ones.

So I know before when people said stuff like this I thought "what a solder geek" and "mine works just fine" but now I know the difference and I won't go back. $90 is not that much for a quality tool.

[bcredbottle]

.

[Skechup]

I recommend that you should just get a soldering iron.

A tip for you would be to keep cleaning the tip of the soldering iron with a rough cloth or something to clean the oxide layer which forms on the soldering iron. If you don't clean the soldering iron tip, the transfer will become less efficient and really messes up the soldering iron. I also recommend that you get a good solder and considering that this is an electrical sort of job, I recommend that you get flux-core solder which reduces metal oxides forming (meaning more electrical conductivity). You can get a good flux-core solder for around £2 (http://www.banggood.com/HX-T100-0_5mm-6337-Tin-Lead-Rosin-Core-Solder-Soldering-Wire-Reel-p-949337.html)

[smknjoe]

Oh, it just occurred to me that I could ask the IT guys at work. I'm sure we don't have soldering kit at work, but they might have their personal one that they could bring in. Call that Plan A.

Plan B will be to inquire at some of the high street laptop repair type places.

Plan C = buy soldering iron etc.

Thanks for all the help, guys!

Did you ever get this fixed? If not, any laptop repair shop that can replace a broken "charging plug/jack" on a laptop should be able to take care of it for you. It should be around $65-$85 for a one hour minimum charge if you were in a major US city. Good luck!

Cool avatar. What is it exactly?

[zombimuncha]

Oh, it just occurred to me that I could ask the IT guys at work. I'm sure we don't have soldering kit at work, but they might have their personal one that they could bring in. Call that Plan A.

Plan B will be to inquire at some of the high street laptop repair type places.

Plan C = buy soldering iron etc.

Thanks for all the help, guys!

Did you ever get this fixed? If not, any laptop repair shop that can replace a broken "charging plug/jack" on a laptop should be able to take care of it for you. It should be around $65-$85 for a one hour minimum charge if you were in a major US city. Good luck!

Not yet. A colleague said he'd let me borrow his soldering gear, but he didn't bring it in to the office yet. I'm in no hurry, but I might pick up this instead of waiting. I asked a couple of laptop repair places but they weren't interested.

[Skechup]

Mmm, that soldering iron seems solid.

Just remember to be SUPER careful when repairing. Never trust a cheap soldering iron 

[zombimuncha]

HOLY **** I FIXED IT!!!!!!

I almost failed. I realized halfway thru that if I wanted to take the whole switch out I would need to first desolder all of the switches, and I had really only psyched myself up for desoldering one of them. So I left the switch base in there and desoldered the contact leaves, which were the root of the problem anyway, and soldered in the contact leaves from a fresh switch. That took some finagling to get them aligned correctly so I desoldered them again and assembled them into the top half of the switch to guide them into place, clicked the top o the switch back on, then resoldered them in again. And it only bleeding well went and worked, dinnit

Here's a photo of the munted contact leaves
?

[jacobolus]

Great to hear!

I realized halfway thru that if I wanted to take the whole switch out I would need to first desolder all of the switches,

That’s not true. You can desolder just the one switch and then yank it out. If you do it carelessly, you might end up breaking a couple of the little plastic clips that hold the switch in, but that’s no big deal if it’s a dead switch anyway.

[bcredbottle]

Memories. I made the same mistake with my first mech (a MEP) and I didn't know how to solder so I paid some guy $80 to solder two switches, and he ****ed up four other switches in the process. It's funny how daunting any electronic work seemed at that time.

[njbair]

Wow, you're a better man than I. I've tried and failed several times to repair the leaf in Matias switches. Ended up replacing the entire switch.

I'm curious, though, why would you have had to desolder more than just the one switch?

[bcredbottle]

Wow, you're a better man than I. I've tried and failed several times to repair the leaf in Matias switches. Ended up replacing the entire switch.

I'm curious, though, why would you have had to desolder more than just the one switch?

I told him I don't use the cut/copy/paste keys so he took the leafs from there.

This was at an electronics store near my house. I do my own soldering now.

[zombimuncha]

Wow, you're a better man than I. I've tried and failed several times to repair the leaf in Matias switches. Ended up replacing the entire switch.

I'm curious, though, why would you have had to desolder more than just the one switch?

At first I tried to repair the leaf by bending it with tweezers. Failed miserably.
As far as I can tell, there are little plastic tabs on the base housing of the switch that keep it trapped in between the plate and the PCB. It looked like I would need to desolder all the switches and remove the PCB so that I could pull the broken switch out from the bottom side of the plate.

Great to hear!

I realized halfway thru that if I wanted to take the whole switch out I would need to first desolder all of the switches,

That’s not true. You can desolder just the one switch and then yank it out. If you do it carelessly, you might end up breaking a couple of the little plastic clips that hold the switch in, but that’s no big deal if it’s a dead switch anyway.

Do you mean the little triangular bits, that look like they're designed to let you push the switch down into the plate and then prevent you from pulling it back up out of the plate? Is it really possible to pull a switch up out of the plate without breaking those tabs? If so, that's cool! Is there some kind of trick to it? Got video?

I guess you're right about it not mattering if you break a switch that's already broken - I didn't think of that!
The remaining tiny bits of loose plastic from the tabs should just fall right out if you turn the whole thing upside down and shake it a bit. TIL.

[njbair]

Wow, you're a better man than I. I've tried and failed several times to repair the leaf in Matias switches. Ended up replacing the entire switch.

I'm curious, though, why would you have had to desolder more than just the one switch?

At first I tried to repair the leaf by bending it with tweezers. Failed miserably.
As far as I can tell, there are little plastic tabs on the base housing of the switch that keep it trapped in between the plate and the PCB. It looked like I would need to desolder all the switches and remove the PCB so that I could pull the broken switch out from the bottom side of the plate.

Great to hear!

I realized halfway thru that if I wanted to take the whole switch out I would need to first desolder all of the switches,

That’s not true. You can desolder just the one switch and then yank it out. If you do it carelessly, you might end up breaking a couple of the little plastic clips that hold the switch in, but that’s no big deal if it’s a dead switch anyway.

Do you mean the little triangular bits, that look like they're designed to let you push the switch down into the plate and then prevent you from pulling it back up out of the plate? Is it really possible to pull a switch up out of the plate without breaking those tabs? If so, that's cool! Is there some kind of trick to it? Got video?

I guess you're right about it not mattering if you break a switch that's already broken - I didn't think of that!
The remaining tiny bits of loose plastic from the tabs should just fall right out if you turn the whole thing upside down and shake it a bit. TIL.

Ah, so you thought the switches clipped into the plate from the bottom...I can see how you would think that if you haven't assembled your own board.

Really, though, I'm extremely impressed that you managed to do microsurgery on the switch internals. Matias switches are very nice but not very serviceable.

[sheinow]

If there is a makerspace in your area, take it there most will let you use their tools for free if you have a small project and pay for consumables.