Author Topic: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards  (Read 541865 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2650 on: Tue, 22 September 2020, 18:50:17 »
Dye sublimation update - the trial of the dye sublimation jig is set to be completed this week. 

Second container shipment update - the factory is wrapping up the repairs and expects the shipment to go out before the end of October.  In order to continue mailing out keyboards upon request, they will not be holding up the second container shipment for the dye sublimation to finish.

This is the first test of a full jig as opposed to previous tests of small jigs to work out how to achieve the tolerances, so it took a few weeks longer than previous test jigs.

Also I wanted to share (with permission) a great photo from a customer matching his True Red F77 with an SGI (Silicon Graphics) Fuel computer.  A great setup!

« Last Edit: Tue, 22 September 2020, 21:07:35 by Ellipse »

Offline mode

  • Posts: 295
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2651 on: Wed, 23 September 2020, 01:26:46 »
Dye sublimation update - the trial of the dye sublimation jig is set to be completed this week. 

Second container shipment update - the factory is wrapping up the repairs and expects the shipment to go out before the end of October.  In order to continue mailing out keyboards upon request, they will not be holding up the second container shipment for the dye sublimation to finish.

This is the first test of a full jig as opposed to previous tests of small jigs to work out how to achieve the tolerances, so it took a few weeks longer than previous test jigs.

Also I wanted to share (with permission) a great photo from a customer matching his True Red F77 with an SGI (Silicon Graphics) Fuel computer.  A great setup!

(Attachment Link)


Damn thatís a good look, red is the best colour imo. They sure donít make computers like SGI used to.

Iím still a bit tempted!

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2652 on: Wed, 23 September 2020, 15:26:07 »
Solenoid Installation Guide and Sound Test video:


Offline pixelpusher

  • Posts: 3559
  • Location: Tennessee - USA
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2653 on: Fri, 25 September 2020, 08:12:20 »
Thanks for the installation and demo video.  I placed an order for a driver and solenoid.  I put a reference to my original order in the notes.   :thumb:

Offline Pete

  • Posts: 46
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2654 on: Sat, 26 September 2020, 06:41:03 »
I wonder if anyone has thought about installing multiple solenoids? I'm only half joking because I'd love to hear it in action :)




Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2655 on: Sun, 27 September 2020, 22:43:29 »
Could the xwhatsit solenoid driver handle two new solenoids safely?

My solenoids are specced (at 6V) for 0.15a, 0.9w

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2656 on: Wed, 30 September 2020, 20:47:55 »
Here is the Brand New Model F September Update Ė shipping milestone, dye sub success, next container shipment, solenoid installation video, firmware:

https://www.modelfkeyboards.com/blog/

This month the 500th Brand New Model F Keyboard shipped! This is a major milestone for the project.

It is a great summary of the happenings of the project since the prior update last month.  Great summary for those who have not been following the project threads too closely in recent weeks.

Over on Deskthority there has been a discussion on potential third party logos and renderings which all look nice.  It would be cool if everyone who wanted to could put their own initials on their new Model F keyboards!

People may like a buckling spring patent type like the one posted on the project web site, though with a square silver logo badge like the old IBM keyboards.  Below is the artwork created for the project by a forum member.

The final round will continue to have no visible branding on the product itself.

252810-0
252812-1

Offline dc_in_sf

  • Posts: 93
  • Location: San Francisco
  • Old Bastard
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2657 on: Mon, 12 October 2020, 13:29:40 »
OK love love loving my F77



I started working in 1990 at a hospital that was an IBM shop, so PS/2's and model M's everywhere (and lots of 3192 terminals). Loved those Model M's and kept using them over the next ten or so years, only stopping when I started needing a windows key (and having a brief flirtation with MS Natural keyboards).

When I got sucked into this hobby a few years ago I investigated Cherry MX green hoping to get some of that same tactile clickiness that I remembered from the Model M's but was disappointed. This board finally brings me back to the joy I remember of IBM keyboards of my youth (and now I have my own office so no one can complain about the noise).

Key caps are from Unicomp, have a couple more inbound to match my layout, but they are a pretty cheap option for anyone looking to fill their board while waiting for the GB printed keys to ship.

Offline darkcruix

  • Posts: 47
  • Location: Germany
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2658 on: Tue, 13 October 2020, 10:15:09 »
I wanted to share my current status of the Technical Manual for Model F keyboards.

Currently it is still work in progress and open topics to be filled. Nevertheless, we have over 170 pages so far and things are moving forward. As long as I still correct things, move things around, and replace photos etc, I wanted to ask for some help about / around:
  • Photos of original IBM Model F Keyboards not yet shown
  • Topics that can't be found in the Table of Contents so far
  • Obvious corrections or mistakes I made
  • Illustrations, like exploded drawing of the keyboard, etc.

Updates are more frequent in Deskthority at: https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24416
The download of the PDF (full size / compressed pictures) at: https://www.bucklingspring.com

Offline Shikada

  • Posts: 32
  • Location: Serbia
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2659 on: Fri, 16 October 2020, 06:07:09 »
Hi, I've been considering this keyboard for a while now and I see that orders are accepted until Oktober? Is that the end of the early bid round? If so, what happens to orders after that?

Also if I ordered today, what's the rough estimate for it being shipped to me? Next year? 2022?

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2660 on: Fri, 16 October 2020, 10:32:15 »
darkcruix great progress on the definitive Model F Manual!

Hello Shikada - please do check out the project web site blog for details on the shipping timeline and status.  Last month we passed 500 Brand New Model F Keyboards that have shipped so far!  In summary:

With the separate shipping option (pay 10 units of $1 increments, more for shipping outside the US - PM or email me to confirm), all classic case keyboards, except True Red and Black, are in stock and can likely ship in 3-6 weeks without the low serial selection (2-3 weeks if you check the low serial/priority check box on the keyboard product page).  Same for black case ultra compact F77, ANSI layout only, and regular gray case ultra compact F62, ANSI enter or HHKB split shift with 2U backspace.  Unprinted pearl/pebble keys are also in stock, though all other unprinted keys and printed keys will be shipping separately, expected later this year.

For all other options, if you order now it will take several months for delivery.  The second container shipment is expected to arrive later this year, by year end.

If you wait a few months until it is in stock, it will take a few months from that point for delivery because of the new orders increasing the backlog between now and then.

Offline dc_in_sf

  • Posts: 93
  • Location: San Francisco
  • Old Bastard
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2661 on: Fri, 16 October 2020, 11:18:17 »
Hi, I've been considering this keyboard for a while now and I see that orders are accepted until Oktober? Is that the end of the early bid round? If so, what happens to orders after that?

Also if I ordered today, what's the rough estimate for it being shipped to me? Next year? 2022?

I loved my F77 so much, I'm in the progress of figuring out whether I want to buy a F62 as well. These are seriously nice pieces of kit, so I'd say hop in sooner rather than later.

Offline raptorzoz

  • Posts: 95
  • Location: Germany
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2662 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 06:24:26 »
Hi, I've been considering this keyboard for a while now and I see that orders are accepted until Oktober? Is that the end of the early bid round? If so, what happens to orders after that?

Also if I ordered today, what's the rough estimate for it being shipped to me? Next year? 2022?

where did you see that it would only be accepted until october?

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2663 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 09:36:58 »
Hi, I've been considering this keyboard for a while now and I see that orders are accepted until Oktober? Is that the end of the early bid round? If so, what happens to orders after that?

Also if I ordered today, what's the rough estimate for it being shipped to me? Next year? 2022?

I loved my F77 so much, I'm in the progress of figuring out whether I want to buy a F62 as well. These are seriously nice pieces of kit, so I'd say hop in sooner rather than later.

Has anyone customized their new Model F F62 / F77 layouts beyond the standard offerings?  I'd be interested in seeing what people do to optimize their keyboards.

Please do feel free to share layout screenshots / QMK JSON files / xwhatsit firmware .l files - for the latter two I think they should be compressed to ZIP format before they can be uploaded on the forum.

Offline euphxenos

  • Posts: 312
  • Location: Fremont, CA, USA
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2664 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 15:27:38 »
Hi, I've been considering this keyboard for a while now and I see that orders are accepted until Oktober? Is that the end of the early bid round? If so, what happens to orders after that?

Also if I ordered today, what's the rough estimate for it being shipped to me? Next year? 2022?

where did you see that it would only be accepted until october?

If you look at modelfkeyboards.com, there's a note that says:

"10/31/20
please have your orders in by then!"

That's probably what Shikada was asking about.  That note has been there for several years.  Every month, that date gets pushed out another month.

Offline BlissOnTap

  • Posts: 11
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2665 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 19:58:46 »
I have a question about the barrels. Were the barrels in the original Model Fs very different from XTs? Most Model F barrels I have seen are so smooth they have a glossy, near polish look to them. The ones on my F77 have a very coarse feel and look and it seems like it affects the feel of the keyboard.
« Last Edit: Sat, 17 October 2020, 20:42:02 by BlissOnTap »

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2666 on: Sat, 17 October 2020, 20:16:43 »
Bliss the new barrels are as smooth as, or in some cases smoother than the old barrels.  This reviewer confirms the opposite of your experience and notes the new barrels are actually smoother than their original IBM XT keyboard: 

https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?p=461064#p461064

Some individual examples of the old Model F Keyboards I am sure have been smoothed down even more than others over time after years of use and your XT barrel may be one of them.  Like with the new springs, I expect the Brand New Model F Keyboard components including barrels to change with age over time.

The new barrels just have less black color added to the plastic compared to the originals, so the deep black color is less uniform and it may look a little different when photographed but the feel is smooth. 

Are you using the Brand New Model F keys or other keys by the way?  My one piece keys in my experience are better than the Model M style two piece keys in terms of key feel.

« Last Edit: Sat, 17 October 2020, 20:53:00 by Ellipse »

Offline Ellipse

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 1155
  • Location: New York
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2667 on: Mon, 19 October 2020, 23:46:01 »
The first trial of the full key set dye sublimation was just completed. The keys were sublimated but the results were not on par with previous tests, so they will be doing further testing before mass sublimation can start.

The legend alignment is improved from prior tests but is still not within my tolerances.

Below is the same scan posted earlier of the newly sublimated keys compared with original IBM keys. I have also added scans from many years ago of the same physical keys so everyone can see what four years of typing does to wear down the key top surfaces. As the textured surface wears down, the keys can become more smooth/slippery.

I expect the same to occur with the new production keys as they are the exact same material that IBM used for keys as per the IBM Model F Keyboard production engineer who has been a big help to the project. This is why I am hoping to be able to make as many spare key sets as possible so people can order them with their keyboards and have for future decades.

To see the texture it is best to save the photo or open the image in a new window to zoom in.

254087-0
254089-1
254091-2

Offline Havattack

  • Posts: 49
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2668 on: Tue, 20 October 2020, 21:24:13 »
there has to be a way to make an adapter so i can use my MX keycaps on these things.. I want a solenoid pretty bad.

Offline mode

  • Posts: 295
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2669 on: Thu, 22 October 2020, 01:00:44 »
there has to be a way to make an adapter so i can use my MX keycaps on these things.. I want a solenoid pretty bad.

No way, the shape is the total opposite of mx, the only way to do it would be to add an insane amount of height.

Offline Kavik

  • Posts: 726
Re: [GB] F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
« Reply #2670 on: Fri, 23 October 2020, 19:28:56 »
there has to be a way to make an adapter so i can use my MX keycaps on these things.. I want a solenoid pretty bad.

No way, the shape is the total opposite of mx, the only way to do it would be to add an insane amount of height.

If you got it to work, you'd have to use a uniform profile because of the plate curve.
Maybe they're waiting for gasmasks and latex to get sexy again.

The world has become a weird place.