New venture Group Buy services and other things

[mrbishop]

So 2017 is going to be an exciting year. helping to coordinate group buys. vendor relations, pcb designs key caps and more. helping the humble maker go from idea to group buy and beyond. before i say any more i want your feedback!

this community has given me so much support over the last year i can't thank you enough. its time for me to give back.
here's the kinds of things me and my partner want to provide.
Group Buy as a service (helping take some of the crazy that comes with running a group buy away from the content creators)
PCB design (from KLE to PCB ready for production or GB)
new products (making PCBs/kits available with lower waiting times)
more accessible products
competitive pricing

here's what i need from the community.

WHAT DO YOU WANT?
does the above sound good?
does the above sound bad?

comments
concerns
constructive criticism.

[tinyprawn]

Happy new year!

Here's the random thing that has been knocking around in my head for a few months...

Problem statement:
Mac laptops have garbage keyboards but I like them and the Apple ecosystem does well for me. How do I get portable Apple ecosystem access with comfy typing?

Solution phases:
1. Tiny keyboard + iPad + camera adapter
Only works for a little while, keyboard drains iPad battery, can't charge while using.

2. Apple released a new lightning-to-USB with a lighting charger
Additional cable management burden is unacceptable and inelegant. Now there are 3 devices (iPad, keyboard, and battery pack) and USB-a to USB-mini for keyboard, usb-a to lightning, USB-A to USB-micro to charge battery brick, usb-a/lightning-to-lightning adapter, USB wall adapter.

3. Someone builds a replacement bottom case for MacBook Pro which allows for a whole keyboard and makes the device weigh 7 lbs.

4. Someone builds a replacement MacBook bottom half that you can move the parts into with your ortholinear keyboard.

----

Right now I'm focusing on phase 2 because the components all exist in various forms and it's the inelegance that prevents me from using it.

I should probably draw some diagrams that outline the wireless options but my bottom line for now is that bluetoothing a mech board is too much additional complexity inside the device and delivers a poor user experience. Wirelessing everything may be an option once Bluetooth 4 gets a bit better but I'm not seeing it now.

So my proposal to adding elegance to this is with a wedge shaped block of wood that has a few cavities to provide space for the internal cables and a long groove that can support the iPad in a portrait or landscape format. The block would always attach to the side of the iPad that had the lightning port, but the block should have enough depth to stabilize the iPad on its side.

Again, I think more drawings are in order but I don't think I have the CAD skills necessary to create a meaningful drawing or render.

To borrow some else's product, this is kinda the base for what I'm talking about.
https://www.etsy.com/listing/177086778/mini-ipad-docking-station-stand-with

Obviously instead of a solid or empty block, the thing I am talking about needs space for an adapter, power brick, and lightning cable inside, as well as 2 ports or outbound wires for wall charging the battery pack and plugging in the keyboard. Exposing the part of the battery pack which has the power button and status LEDs also seems necessary.

Furthmore, a lot of this greatly depends on the battery pack because some are quite large and others, not so much... And disassembling them adds a risk level that I'm not ready for.

---

Let me know what you think. If there's a better place to discuss this, I'm happy to take the detiails to another medium.

[mrbishop]

Happy new year!

Here's the random thing that has been knocking around in my head for a few months...

Problem statement:
Mac laptops have garbage keyboards but I like them and the Apple ecosystem does well for me. How do I get portable Apple ecosystem access with comfy typing?

Solution phases:
1. Tiny keyboard + iPad + camera adapter
Only works for a little while, keyboard drains iPad battery, can't charge while using.

2. Apple released a new lightning-to-USB with a lighting charger
Additional cable management burden is unacceptable and inelegant. Now there are 3 devices (iPad, keyboard, and battery pack) and USB-a to USB-mini for keyboard, usb-a to lightning, USB-A to USB-micro to charge battery brick, usb-a/lightning-to-lightning adapter, USB wall adapter.

3. Someone builds a replacement bottom case for MacBook Pro which allows for a whole keyboard and makes the device weigh 7 lbs.

4. Someone builds a replacement MacBook bottom half that you can move the parts into with your ortholinear keyboard.

----

Right now I'm focusing on phase 2 because the components all exist in various forms and it's the inelegance that prevents me from using it.

I should probably draw some diagrams that outline the wireless options but my bottom line for now is that bluetoothing a mech board is too much additional complexity inside the device and delivers a poor user experience. Wirelessing everything may be an option once Bluetooth 4 gets a bit better but I'm not seeing it now.

So my proposal to adding elegance to this is with a wedge shaped block of wood that has a few cavities to provide space for the internal cables and a long groove that can support the iPad in a portrait or landscape format. The block would always attach to the side of the iPad that had the lightning port, but the block should have enough depth to stabilize the iPad on its side.

Again, I think more drawings are in order but I don't think I have the CAD skills necessary to create a meaningful drawing or render.

To borrow some else's product, this is kinda the base for what I'm talking about.
https://www.etsy.com/listing/177086778/mini-ipad-docking-station-stand-with

Obviously instead of a solid or empty block, the thing I am talking about needs space for an adapter, power brick, and lightning cable inside, as well as 2 ports or outbound wires for wall charging the battery pack and plugging in the keyboard. Exposing the part of the battery pack which has the power button and status LEDs also seems necessary.

Furthmore, a lot of this greatly depends on the battery pack because some are quite large and others, not so much... And disassembling them adds a risk level that I'm not ready for.

---

Let me know what you think. If there's a better place to discuss this, I'm happy to take the detiails to another medium.

all of this is rather interesting. i'm a windows/linux/android guy but i see where this could be an improvement overall.

[trenzafeeds]

Running groupbuys as a service isn't totally a new idea, but it's pretty cool, especially if you're aimed towards community benefit rather than non-profit. Only one concern, have you ever run anything other than the Pawn? I don't want to sound combative, but I'm not sure I'd trust someone with only one groupbuy under his belt to run whatever product I wanted to market.

[mrbishop]

I totally get that and understand your concerns. I am working closely with switchtop.com in this endeavor. It's a team effort. Helping me leverage an infrastructure already in place. Yes it's new but that's not always bad.

sent from my chess board

[derezzed]

It sounds good.  This idea has been floated around before.  It never develops, I suspect, due to the legal/financial/time commitments required to execute this properly.  Do you have a business plan?  Even if you aren't in this to make a profit, do you plan to incorporate this venture?  Will you have contracts?  It might be necessary to transfer legal control of a group buy in the event that a designer "flakes out" after financial resources have already been committed.  Have you considered how to determine legal ownership of concepts that you help people develop?  If a customer decides not to follow through with a project, will you be free to develop the concept into product or develop a similar product?  Have you considered a plan for how to complete an in-process group buy in the event of a severe illness or other catastrophic life event? 

I'm not trying to discourage you.  Maybe I'm overthinking this.  I hope you succeed because it would create more opportunities to acquire a greater variety of interesting and useful stuff.  Rapid turn around is definitely very appealing.  I'm sure that there are several "next great things" that haven't been developed because people don't have access to the skills and services that you intend to provide.

[xondat]

I mean if there was someone I can go "hey can you make this PCB, this many will be made, with these features" with a quick turnaround then I'll pay. I should probably learn myself, but I prefer to spend my time playing OSRS jumping from building to building watching Netflix.

[zslane]

How will group buys be curated? Who will pass judgment on proposed projects, and how will production runs be awarded? Will that process be transparent?

[mrbishop]

there is still alot we are working out. we will have to determine interest from the community as minimum orders would be required. there would be minimum warehouse and manufacturing fees etc. prototypes would have to be made and proofed before any pcb's are manufactured in mass to avoid issues. all that said there would be a team effort screening process from both our side and the other parties in involved. our goal is to make having a group buy as smooth of an operation as possible. especially for someone who hasn't done it before or someone who has but has had issues. also aide someone who has an amazing idea and concept but doesn't have all the skills to make it a reality. from pcb design to case design to GB.

[FLOCKA]

WHAT DO YOU WANT?

CALM DEPTHS SA 2017!

[clappingcactus]

WHAT DO YOU WANT?

A readily available 1800 layout or 96 layout kit.

[kawasaki161]

WHAT DO YOU WANT?

A readily available 1800 layout or 96 layout kit.

Like this ( https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/96-DIY-Kit-Mechanical-Keyboard-Customized-Set-PCB-Case-Plate-Stabilizers-Underglow-RGB-Free-shipping/429151_32733608635.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.H0Nwk9 ) but without the strange FN?

[clappingcactus]

WHAT DO YOU WANT?

A readily available 1800 layout or 96 layout kit.

Like this ( https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/96-DIY-Kit-Mechanical-Keyboard-Customized-Set-PCB-Case-Plate-Stabilizers-Underglow-RGB-Free-shipping/429151_32733608635.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.H0Nwk9 ) but without the strange FN?

Yeah, and hopefully with no empty space between the F-row and the rest of the keyboard. The 96-layout is great because of how compact it is.

[funderburker]

I mean if there was someone I can go "hey can you make this PCB, this many will be made, with these features" with a quick turnaround then I'll pay. I should probably learn myself, but I prefer to spend my time playing OSRS jumping from building to building watching Netflix.

Haha, this is what I've been thinking recently. Have a layout stuck on my mind and don't want to hand-wire but too lazy (playing OSRS and just chilling) to learn PCB designing.

To mrbishop - I'd totally be down to use any service willing to help with PCB designs. Only - if it's for a custom project and not necessarily a GB, would be an "affordable" expense? Just a thought - how much would a client need to do and how much would your service do? Like, someone gives a link to KLE and you do the rest and just send them the PCB when it's made or you'd work with the client every step of the way?

Sorry if there's a lot of gibberish, just wanted to write before I forget.

[Oblotzky]

WHAT DO YOU WANT?

A readily available 1800 layout or 96 layout kit.

Like this ( https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/96-DIY-Kit-Mechanical-Keyboard-Customized-Set-PCB-Case-Plate-Stabilizers-Underglow-RGB-Free-shipping/429151_32733608635.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.H0Nwk9 ) but without the strange FN?

I too am looking to buy two 96 PCB's with plates and stabilizers! Someone please make a GB for a case-less 96?

[Jedi]

This proposal has been brought up here before and merits consideration.  There are lots of young talented GHers around these parts and making a simple process form that the community could review and provide input on, might help both your venture group and the individuals looking for a avenue to run their GB for payment and everything else.

Would be worth it for a few interested in this if you took a few minutes to talk about your foundation, your backing, your risk commitment level, the team of people that you have access to that have signed a business partner agreement with you to provide for the foundation.  There's a lot of risk on both fronts so helping to ease the GB designers and engineers could help you build this into a business model that works for both.

Just my .02 cent

[trenzafeeds]

signed

+1
things need to be signed all around
the more people involved in a groupbuy the greater chance it ****s out and a bunch of people get ripped off. if you're planning to do something like this make sure you get signatures

[redbanshee]

PCB design services are badly needed, that would be a great service to offer! 

[JDragon]

I had an IC going for a keyset but haven't made much headway into finding a GB partner - would be really excited if GB as a service was available.

[mrbishop]

you guys all rock. and your comments and suggestions are epic as usual. i'm working with my partners to get more of a definitive service plan and road map.

[trenzafeeds]

you guys all rock. and your comments and suggestions are epic as usual. i'm working with my partners to get more of a definitive service plan and road map.

I can't wait to see it!

[zslane]

Yeah, I'm very curious how buyer interest/demand is going to be measured for any given group buy submission.

As it stands it is mostly like reading tea leaves, where the leaves in this analogy are forum posts of people saying, "Yeah I'd be totally in for a set!" That's not very reliable because when it comes time to actually part with money and place an order, a lot of so-called interested buyers turn out to not be so interested. Even genuinely interested buyers can find their financial circumstances changed in the very long time between IC and actual GB.