Author Topic: The Living Soldering Thread  (Read 1575409 times)

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Offline Pacifist

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1450 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 10:19:48 »
so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

I'm going to buy one of these  ;D

Offline dragonxx21

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1451 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 10:37:28 »

so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

IMO it is always a good idea to clean up flux even if it is not acidic and may not damage the pcb.  Maybe others have more experience with no-clean flux.
I looked up the kester 951 and it's not that it's not acidic, it's that the flux applied is all used up during soldering and leaves little to no residue.
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Offline swill

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1452 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 12:22:51 »

so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

IMO it is always a good idea to clean up flux even if it is not acidic and may not damage the pcb.  Maybe others have more experience with no-clean flux.
I looked up the kester 951 and it's not that it's not acidic, it's that the flux applied is all used up during soldering and leaves little to no residue.

Not sure how that would work.  It is a pen, so you could put flux all over the place.  Not sure how it is supposed to be 'all used up'.  I would still clean it after I finish the job...

Offline komar007

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1453 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 12:27:31 »

I might be a bit off-topic here, but...
I've wanted to buy the fx-888 for a longer time, but I couldn't find a 220V version for a reasonable price.
Now I see this: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-70W-110V-220V-HAKKO-FX-888D-fx888-888-Solder-Soldering-Iron-Station-with-Digital-Display/809293_730008721.html
Do you think it's a fake? It's just too cheap...
On the other hand there are also others in aliexpress, for example this one: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-HAKKO-FX-888D-digital-soldering-station-Solder-station-100-Genuine-HAKKO-soldering-station-Blue-colour/701136780.html
Interestingly, none of the sub-$70 says it's original, whereas some of the $100-ish do.
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Offline Pacifist

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1454 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 12:44:34 »

so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

IMO it is always a good idea to clean up flux even if it is not acidic and may not damage the pcb.  Maybe others have more experience with no-clean flux.
I looked up the kester 951 and it's not that it's not acidic, it's that the flux applied is all used up during soldering and leaves little to no residue.

Not sure how that would work.  It is a pen, so you could put flux all over the place.  Not sure how it is supposed to be 'all used up'.  I would still clean it after I finish the job...

how do you clean it up?

Offline swill

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1455 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:24:09 »

so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

IMO it is always a good idea to clean up flux even if it is not acidic and may not damage the pcb.  Maybe others have more experience with no-clean flux.
I looked up the kester 951 and it's not that it's not acidic, it's that the flux applied is all used up during soldering and leaves little to no residue.

Not sure how that would work.  It is a pen, so you could put flux all over the place.  Not sure how it is supposed to be 'all used up'.  I would still clean it after I finish the job...

how do you clean it up?

I use isopropyl alcohol and a Q-tip.  I am sure there are better tools than Q-tips, but that is what I have been using.

Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1456 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:36:36 »

I might be a bit off-topic here, but...
I've wanted to buy the fx-888 for a longer time, but I couldn't find a 220V version for a reasonable price.
Now I see this: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-70W-110V-220V-HAKKO-FX-888D-fx888-888-Solder-Soldering-Iron-Station-with-Digital-Display/809293_730008721.html
Do you think it's a fake? It's just too cheap...
On the other hand there are also others in aliexpress, for example this one: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-HAKKO-FX-888D-digital-soldering-station-Solder-station-100-Genuine-HAKKO-soldering-station-Blue-colour/701136780.html
Interestingly, none of the sub-$70 says it's original, whereas some of the $100-ish do.
it's a second shift/did not pass QC unit. they're all over taobao. unlike every other true production level station on the market (and a first for hakko as well), the 888d is made in china. this means there are units falling off of trucks all over the place. this also means that it has the lowest ultimate quality of anything with a hakko brand on it ever, unfortunately. this is how they managed to afford the very high cost ICs they put in it :(.

my long-term review of it is nowhere near as glowing as my initial review of it was. the heater, which is the most important part of a soldering iron and most expensive, has only lasted about six months in my unit. it is now starting to fail. actual temperature response is wandering literally every time i heat cycle it, the paint (yes, paint, it's not powdered) is coming off the holder, etc. i'm not a particularly happy camper with this unit. example: when i first purchased it, it took about 3-5 _seconds_ to heat to op temp. now it takes about a minute and i usually have to recalibrate it. total output has also suffered. i'm using big tips for small tip jobs to compensate, and constantly cleaning the heater, but it's clear this is not meant for high hobbyist duty cycles. i may have some interesting plans for it in the mid-term, but when i get the money i will most likely replace it with an edsyn 2020 or 971dx or some other stuff i've been told is in the works :X


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Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1457 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:39:04 »

so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

IMO it is always a good idea to clean up flux even if it is not acidic and may not damage the pcb.  Maybe others have more experience with no-clean flux.
I looked up the kester 951 and it's not that it's not acidic, it's that the flux applied is all used up during soldering and leaves little to no residue.

Not sure how that would work.  It is a pen, so you could put flux all over the place.  Not sure how it is supposed to be 'all used up'.  I would still clean it after I finish the job...

how do you clean it up?

I use isopropyl alcohol and a Q-tip.  I am sure there are better tools than Q-tips, but that is what I have been using.
if you were working on high voltage stuff, q-tips shed flammable cotton all over the place, but with low voltage stuff you're good. that said, i think it's a waste of a q-tip. pick up a nylon brush from the hardware store for a dollar and use that instead. nylon brushes with solvent on them are useful all over the workbench, even on the workbench. i keep a couple around with (progressive upward in abrasiveness) a couple brass brushes a couple steel brushes and a couple stainless steel brushes.

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline komar007

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1458 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:45:57 »

I might be a bit off-topic here, but...
I've wanted to buy the fx-888 for a longer time, but I couldn't find a 220V version for a reasonable price.
Now I see this: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-70W-110V-220V-HAKKO-FX-888D-fx888-888-Solder-Soldering-Iron-Station-with-Digital-Display/809293_730008721.html
Do you think it's a fake? It's just too cheap...
On the other hand there are also others in aliexpress, for example this one: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-HAKKO-FX-888D-digital-soldering-station-Solder-station-100-Genuine-HAKKO-soldering-station-Blue-colour/701136780.html
Interestingly, none of the sub-$70 says it's original, whereas some of the $100-ish do.
it's a second shift/did not pass QC unit. they're all over taobao. unlike every other true production level station on the market (and a first for hakko as well), the 888d is made in china. this means there are units falling off of trucks all over the place. this also means that it has the lowest ultimate quality of anything with a hakko brand on it ever, unfortunately. this is how they managed to afford the very high cost ICs they put in it :( .

my long-term review of it is nowhere near as glowing as my initial review of it was. the heater, which is the most important part of a soldering iron and most expensive, has only lasted about six months in my unit. it is now starting to fail. actual temperature response is wandering literally every time i heat cycle it, the paint (yes, paint, it's not powdered) is coming off the holder, etc. i'm not a particularly happy camper with this unit. example: when i first purchased it, it took about 3-5 _seconds_ to heat to op temp. now it takes about a minute and i usually have to recalibrate it. total output has also suffered. i'm using big tips for small tip jobs to compensate, and constantly cleaning the heater, but it's clear this is not meant for high hobbyist duty cycles. i may have some interesting plans for it in the mid-term, but when i get the money i will most likely replace it with an edsyn 2020 or 971dx or some other stuff i've been told is in the works :X

Thanks!
Are you talking about the $60 one or the hakkos for the Chinese market in general?
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Offline swill

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1459 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 14:11:37 »

so I bought one of these kester 951 flux pens and it's said to be no-clean. That being said, should I still clean after usage or is it really not necessary?
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/180889483171?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

IMO it is always a good idea to clean up flux even if it is not acidic and may not damage the pcb.  Maybe others have more experience with no-clean flux.
I looked up the kester 951 and it's not that it's not acidic, it's that the flux applied is all used up during soldering and leaves little to no residue.

Not sure how that would work.  It is a pen, so you could put flux all over the place.  Not sure how it is supposed to be 'all used up'.  I would still clean it after I finish the job...

how do you clean it up?

I use isopropyl alcohol and a Q-tip.  I am sure there are better tools than Q-tips, but that is what I have been using.
if you were working on high voltage stuff, q-tips shed flammable cotton all over the place, but with low voltage stuff you're good. that said, i think it's a waste of a q-tip. pick up a nylon brush from the hardware store for a dollar and use that instead. nylon brushes with solvent on them are useful all over the workbench, even on the workbench. i keep a couple around with (progressive upward in abrasiveness) a couple brass brushes a couple steel brushes and a couple stainless steel brushes.

+1  I need to go buy some of those...

Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1460 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 14:14:33 »

I might be a bit off-topic here, but...
I've wanted to buy the fx-888 for a longer time, but I couldn't find a 220V version for a reasonable price.
Now I see this: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-70W-110V-220V-HAKKO-FX-888D-fx888-888-Solder-Soldering-Iron-Station-with-Digital-Display/809293_730008721.html
Do you think it's a fake? It's just too cheap...
On the other hand there are also others in aliexpress, for example this one: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-HAKKO-FX-888D-digital-soldering-station-Solder-station-100-Genuine-HAKKO-soldering-station-Blue-colour/701136780.html
Interestingly, none of the sub-$70 says it's original, whereas some of the $100-ish do.
it's a second shift/did not pass QC unit. they're all over taobao. unlike every other true production level station on the market (and a first for hakko as well), the 888d is made in china. this means there are units falling off of trucks all over the place. this also means that it has the lowest ultimate quality of anything with a hakko brand on it ever, unfortunately. this is how they managed to afford the very high cost ICs they put in it :( .

my long-term review of it is nowhere near as glowing as my initial review of it was. the heater, which is the most important part of a soldering iron and most expensive, has only lasted about six months in my unit. it is now starting to fail. actual temperature response is wandering literally every time i heat cycle it, the paint (yes, paint, it's not powdered) is coming off the holder, etc. i'm not a particularly happy camper with this unit. example: when i first purchased it, it took about 3-5 _seconds_ to heat to op temp. now it takes about a minute and i usually have to recalibrate it. total output has also suffered. i'm using big tips for small tip jobs to compensate, and constantly cleaning the heater, but it's clear this is not meant for high hobbyist duty cycles. i may have some interesting plans for it in the mid-term, but when i get the money i will most likely replace it with an edsyn 2020 or 971dx or some other stuff i've been told is in the works :X

Thanks!
Are you talking about the $60 one or the hakkos for the Chinese market in general?

both. anyway komar, you need a quality station.

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Offline komar007

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1461 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 14:16:53 »

both. anyway komar, you need a quality station.
Well, I already have a decent one, but it has the cord on the right side which makes me mad;P
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Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1462 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 14:17:38 »
wat

flip it over? ;)

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Offline komar007

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1463 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 14:18:32 »
wat

flip it over? ;)

Nah, I want it on the front;)
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Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1464 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 15:06:18 »
TOO BAD FOR YOU

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Offline oTurtlez

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1465 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 10:17:10 »

I might be a bit off-topic here, but...
I've wanted to buy the fx-888 for a longer time, but I couldn't find a 220V version for a reasonable price.
Now I see this: http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-70W-110V-220V-HAKKO-FX-888D-fx888-888-Solder-Soldering-Iron-Station-with-Digital-Display/809293_730008721.html
Do you think it's a fake? It's just too cheap...
On the other hand there are also others in aliexpress, for example this one: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Original-HAKKO-FX-888D-digital-soldering-station-Solder-station-100-Genuine-HAKKO-soldering-station-Blue-colour/701136780.html
Interestingly, none of the sub-$70 says it's original, whereas some of the $100-ish do.
it's a second shift/did not pass QC unit. they're all over taobao. unlike every other true production level station on the market (and a first for hakko as well), the 888d is made in china. this means there are units falling off of trucks all over the place. this also means that it has the lowest ultimate quality of anything with a hakko brand on it ever, unfortunately. this is how they managed to afford the very high cost ICs they put in it :(.

my long-term review of it is nowhere near as glowing as my initial review of it was. the heater, which is the most important part of a soldering iron and most expensive, has only lasted about six months in my unit. it is now starting to fail. actual temperature response is wandering literally every time i heat cycle it, the paint (yes, paint, it's not powdered) is coming off the holder, etc. i'm not a particularly happy camper with this unit. example: when i first purchased it, it took about 3-5 _seconds_ to heat to op temp. now it takes about a minute and i usually have to recalibrate it. total output has also suffered. i'm using big tips for small tip jobs to compensate, and constantly cleaning the heater, but it's clear this is not meant for high hobbyist duty cycles. i may have some interesting plans for it in the mid-term, but when i get the money i will most likely replace it with an edsyn 2020 or 971dx or some other stuff i've been told is in the works :X



Hey Kawa, you said the 888D's are made in China with the lesser QC and everything, what about the analog FX-888's? The ones with the dial in the front?
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Offline yasuo

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1466 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 10:26:51 »
how to make more sticky desoldering tool? :)
i often fail when desoldering switch :confused:

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Offline dragonxx21

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1467 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 10:35:26 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.
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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1468 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 10:37:18 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


how to make more sticky desoldering tool? :)
i often fail when desoldering switch :confused:

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Offline dragonxx21

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1469 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 10:54:51 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.
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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1470 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 11:35:40 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.

What do you mean by wiping off the tip?  Do you mean you stick it into some bronze wool?  Or actually wipe off the solder with a wet sponge?  If you're cleaning the solder off the tip thoroughly, then you're not really "tinning" it--there needs to remain a layer of solder over the tip--that's what will give it that shiny silver finish too.
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Offline jthomas

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1471 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 12:07:35 »
how to make more sticky desoldering tool? :)
i often fail when desoldering switch :confused:

I was taught a desoldering trick by a lady who does production soldering her whole career and relayed to me by my current professor. I'm studying industrial electronics and this was in a class on professional fabrication.

What you do is cut/melt a small "mousehole" notch right on the tip of your soldapullt, if you hold the soldapullt vertical it'll look like a little cartoon mouse door or something on the end/side of the tip.

Now you can place the soldapullt directly over the pin you want to desolder and still get the iron into the correct spot to melt the solder, WITHOUT having to try to melt it and then rapidly position the soldapullt as normal. That tricky timing part is completely eliminated with her "mousehole" method and the soldapullt still makes plenty of suction to clear the joint.

I sacrificed a tip (they are cheap) to try it out and it works wonders for my desoldering abilities.  Before I was sometimes too slow to move the pump into position and hit the button before the solder rehardened. Now I get it right every time because the soldapullt is already in the perfect position before I even melt the solder :) Again there is still plenty of suction to completely clear the joint. (Some may think it won't "seal" right, but it is never really "sealed" against the board anyway.)

This has sped up my workflow and made the process much easier. I can post a pic if it doesn't make sense, but it's really simple, just put a notch on the tip that lets me put the iron tip in from the side.

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1472 on: Fri, 06 December 2013, 13:27:46 »
how to make more sticky desoldering tool? :)
i often fail when desoldering switch :confused:

I was taught a desoldering trick by a lady who does production soldering her whole career and relayed to me by my current professor. I'm studying industrial electronics and this was in a class on professional fabrication.

What you do is cut/melt a small "mousehole" notch right on the tip of your soldapullt, if you hold the soldapullt vertical it'll look like a little cartoon mouse door or something on the end/side of the tip.

Now you can place the soldapullt directly over the pin you want to desolder and still get the iron into the correct spot to melt the solder, WITHOUT having to try to melt it and then rapidly position the soldapullt as normal. That tricky timing part is completely eliminated with her "mousehole" method and the soldapullt still makes plenty of suction to clear the joint.

I sacrificed a tip (they are cheap) to try it out and it works wonders for my desoldering abilities.  Before I was sometimes too slow to move the pump into position and hit the button before the solder rehardened. Now I get it right every time because the soldapullt is already in the perfect position before I even melt the solder :) Again there is still plenty of suction to completely clear the joint. (Some may think it won't "seal" right, but it is never really "sealed" against the board anyway.)

This has sped up my workflow and made the process much easier. I can post a pic if it doesn't make sense, but it's really simple, just put a notch on the tip that lets me put the iron tip in from the side.


Wow, I never thought of doing that, but it makes sense. I will try it!
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Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1473 on: Sat, 07 December 2013, 10:07:52 »
how to make more sticky desoldering tool? :)
i often fail when desoldering switch :confused:

I was taught a desoldering trick by a lady who does production soldering her whole career and relayed to me by my current professor. I'm studying industrial electronics and this was in a class on professional fabrication.

What you do is cut/melt a small "mousehole" notch right on the tip of your soldapullt, if you hold the soldapullt vertical it'll look like a little cartoon mouse door or something on the end/side of the tip.

Now you can place the soldapullt directly over the pin you want to desolder and still get the iron into the correct spot to melt the solder, WITHOUT having to try to melt it and then rapidly position the soldapullt as normal. That tricky timing part is completely eliminated with her "mousehole" method and the soldapullt still makes plenty of suction to clear the joint.

I sacrificed a tip (they are cheap) to try it out and it works wonders for my desoldering abilities.  Before I was sometimes too slow to move the pump into position and hit the button before the solder rehardened. Now I get it right every time because the soldapullt is already in the perfect position before I even melt the solder :) Again there is still plenty of suction to completely clear the joint. (Some may think it won't "seal" right, but it is never really "sealed" against the board anyway.)

This has sped up my workflow and made the process much easier. I can post a pic if it doesn't make sense, but it's really simple, just put a notch on the tip that lets me put the iron tip in from the side.

cool!

i have been doing something like that but without the notch. the krytox augmented soldapullts i build can handle more heat flux vapor than a standard soldapullt, so i just tilt the soldapullt a little off axis right over the joint, slip my chisel tip into the gap, then let 'er rip as soon as the solder goes molten


to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline balanar

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1474 on: Sat, 07 December 2013, 21:11:03 »
how to make more sticky desoldering tool? :)
i often fail when desoldering switch ???

I was taught a desoldering trick by a lady who does production soldering her whole career and relayed to me by my current professor. I'm studying industrial electronics and this was in a class on professional fabrication.

What you do is cut/melt a small "mousehole" notch right on the tip of your soldapullt, if you hold the soldapullt vertical it'll look like a little cartoon mouse door or something on the end/side of the tip.

Now you can place the soldapullt directly over the pin you want to desolder and still get the iron into the correct spot to melt the solder, WITHOUT having to try to melt it and then rapidly position the soldapullt as normal. That tricky timing part is completely eliminated with her "mousehole" method and the soldapullt still makes plenty of suction to clear the joint.

I sacrificed a tip (they are cheap) to try it out and it works wonders for my desoldering abilities.  Before I was sometimes too slow to move the pump into position and hit the button before the solder rehardened. Now I get it right every time because the soldapullt is already in the perfect position before I even melt the solder :) Again there is still plenty of suction to completely clear the joint. (Some may think it won't "seal" right, but it is never really "sealed" against the board anyway.)

This has sped up my workflow and made the process much easier. I can post a pic if it doesn't make sense, but it's really simple, just put a notch on the tip that lets me put the iron tip in from the side.


This sounds really interesting. Could you kindly post a picture illustrating the position of the notch?

Offline dragonxx21

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1475 on: Sun, 08 December 2013, 10:44:54 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.

What do you mean by wiping off the tip?  Do you mean you stick it into some bronze wool?  Or actually wipe off the solder with a wet sponge?  If you're cleaning the solder off the tip thoroughly, then you're not really "tinning" it--there needs to remain a layer of solder over the tip--that's what will give it that shiny silver finish too.
By wiping off the tip I mean just wiping off the excess solder on a wet sponge. I'm kind of confused as I put the solder onto the tip and it tends to glob up and when I wipe it off there isn't that shiny silver finish.
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell

Offline TheSoulhunter

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1476 on: Sun, 08 December 2013, 11:58:45 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.

What do you mean by wiping off the tip?  Do you mean you stick it into some bronze wool?  Or actually wipe off the solder with a wet sponge?  If you're cleaning the solder off the tip thoroughly, then you're not really "tinning" it--there needs to remain a layer of solder over the tip--that's what will give it that shiny silver finish too.
By wiping off the tip I mean just wiping off the excess solder on a wet sponge. I'm kind of confused as I put the solder onto the tip and it tends to glob up and when I wipe it off there isn't that shiny silver finish.

Perhaps the tip is done...
Overheating and "aggressive" flux can kill the plating.

Offline dragonxx21

  • Posts: 471
Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1477 on: Sun, 08 December 2013, 12:27:04 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.

What do you mean by wiping off the tip?  Do you mean you stick it into some bronze wool?  Or actually wipe off the solder with a wet sponge?  If you're cleaning the solder off the tip thoroughly, then you're not really "tinning" it--there needs to remain a layer of solder over the tip--that's what will give it that shiny silver finish too.
By wiping off the tip I mean just wiping off the excess solder on a wet sponge. I'm kind of confused as I put the solder onto the tip and it tends to glob up and when I wipe it off there isn't that shiny silver finish.

Perhaps the tip is done...
Overheating and "aggressive" flux can kill the plating.

Kind of odd since this happened the first time I actually used the iron and the tip and iron were brand new.
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell

Offline TheSoulhunter

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1478 on: Sun, 08 December 2013, 13:48:07 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.

What do you mean by wiping off the tip?  Do you mean you stick it into some bronze wool?  Or actually wipe off the solder with a wet sponge?  If you're cleaning the solder off the tip thoroughly, then you're not really "tinning" it--there needs to remain a layer of solder over the tip--that's what will give it that shiny silver finish too.
By wiping off the tip I mean just wiping off the excess solder on a wet sponge. I'm kind of confused as I put the solder onto the tip and it tends to glob up and when I wipe it off there isn't that shiny silver finish.

Perhaps the tip is done...
Overheating and "aggressive" flux can kill the plating.

Kind of odd since this happened the first time I actually used the iron and the tip and iron were brand new.

Weird! Whats your exact setup? (solder, tip, temperature...)

Offline dragonxx21

  • Posts: 471
Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1479 on: Sun, 08 December 2013, 13:50:58 »
Guys, when I'm tinning my tip with solder, I notice it turns into a bronze color when I wipe the solder off the iron.

What turns a bronze color, the tip? What solder are you using? It should be a nice silver color.


the tip turns a bronze color when I wipe the solder off. I'm using the Kester solder recommend in the thread. Basically when I'm applying it it begins to glob up on the tip. When I wipe it off the tip has the bronze look to it and when I turn it off after and the tip looks greyish with a slight blue to it. I kind of feel as if the solder isn't adhering to the tip.

What do you mean by wiping off the tip?  Do you mean you stick it into some bronze wool?  Or actually wipe off the solder with a wet sponge?  If you're cleaning the solder off the tip thoroughly, then you're not really "tinning" it--there needs to remain a layer of solder over the tip--that's what will give it that shiny silver finish too.
By wiping off the tip I mean just wiping off the excess solder on a wet sponge. I'm kind of confused as I put the solder onto the tip and it tends to glob up and when I wipe it off there isn't that shiny silver finish.

Perhaps the tip is done...
Overheating and "aggressive" flux can kill the plating.

Kind of odd since this happened the first time I actually used the iron and the tip and iron were brand new.

Weird! Whats your exact setup? (solder, tip, temperature...)
It is Mkawa's beta kit. Comes with the edsyn cl1481 and the temp is set to the kester melting point. Unsure on the exact tip model but it's a small chisel tip.
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell

Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1480 on: Sun, 08 December 2013, 13:59:41 »
hit the tip with a brass brush, scrub it down and then try tinning it again. repeat until you get a nice shiny tip. there's probably tons of oxidization on there, so much that the flux can't dissolve all of it in one go.

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline jthomas

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1481 on: Mon, 09 December 2013, 14:46:57 »
This sounds really interesting. Could you kindly post a picture illustrating the position of the notch?

Sure, here you go:
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Offline hasu

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1482 on: Mon, 09 December 2013, 18:24:05 »
Thanks for pics!
It makes sense clearly for me now :) I'll try this, for sure.
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Offline Pacifist

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1483 on: Mon, 09 December 2013, 20:09:21 »
would it be easier and/or cheaper to do this and buy a soldapult and a new tip or spend $15 for the radioshack desolder iron with pump?

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1484 on: Mon, 09 December 2013, 20:14:22 »
would it be easier and/or cheaper to do this and buy a soldapult and a new tip or spend $15 for the radioshack desolder iron with pump?

Cheaper, no.

Easier, you bet your ass. I just desoldered two full size keyboards with a Soldapullt. When I used to use the RS iron w/bulb, I would get hand cramps and have to change tips every 100 switches or less.
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Offline Pacifist

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1485 on: Mon, 09 December 2013, 20:16:02 »
would it be easier and/or cheaper to do this and buy a soldapult and a new tip or spend $15 for the radioshack desolder iron with pump?

Cheaper, no.

Easier, you bet your ass. I just desoldered two full size keyboards with a Soldapullt. When I used to use the RS iron w/bulb, I would get hand cramps and have to change tips every 100 switches or less.

Ah I see, thanks for the help. Will probably get both, and use the RS for one or two switches at a time, and the tip with soldapollt when doing full boards

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1486 on: Mon, 09 December 2013, 20:21:42 »
I've used the RS iron for 2 full Filco TKL desoldering projects.  Had to replace the tip a few times.  After I got the hang of it, the 2nd PCB went much faster than the first one.  Overall, it's not a bad tool--it certainly works fine.  Just the suction could be better, and you should have some spare replacement tools ready.  I do love my new Soldapullt.

With both the Soldapullt and the RS iron, you may still have small solder filaments remaining in the holes around pins (have yet to try this new "notch" method described above).  So in that respect, you'll still have to tinker with a desoldering braid a bit or I prefer to just pull on the switches from one side and simultaneously heat their pins with a soldering iron from the other in those situations.
« Last Edit: Mon, 09 December 2013, 20:23:20 by Photoelectric »
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Offline mkawa

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1487 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 10:42:48 »
if you get an unclear desolder in any situation, the best trick is actually the least intuitive. ADD solder to the joint, a whole bunch, then melt and use your solder sucker tool again. do this enough times and you will get a really clean desolder for mechanical and metallurgic reasons i won't go into.

to all the brilliant friends who have left us, and all the students who climb on their shoulders.

Offline oTurtlez

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1488 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 10:56:01 »
if you get an unclear desolder in any situation, the best trick is actually the least intuitive. ADD solder to the joint, a whole bunch, then melt and use your solder sucker tool again. do this enough times and you will get a really clean desolder for mechanical and metallurgic reasons i won't go into.

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Offline yasuo

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1489 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 10:58:28 »
This sounds really interesting. Could you kindly post a picture illustrating the position of the notch?

Sure, here you go:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
Thanks for your pict sir,i understand now :D
EDIT:really thanks i've try and succeed :)) really easy desoldering now :p
« Last Edit: Thu, 26 December 2013, 06:37:46 by yasuo »
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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1490 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 10:58:35 »
if you get an unclear desolder in any situation, the best trick is actually the least intuitive. ADD solder to the joint, a whole bunch, then melt and use your solder sucker tool again. do this enough times and you will get a really clean desolder for mechanical and metallurgic reasons i won't go into.

Sadly that's still not quite going to get all the solder out for complete through-hole copper inserts in double-sided PCBs like Filcos.  I did that initially with my first Filco PCB and spent forever adding solder, sucking it out, adding more, using a braid, etc.  Tiny filaments remained deep inside the holes, and Filco even advertises that their solder goes all the way to the other side of the PCB.  It might be easier to get it all out with better tools.  My TRiK PCB was VERY easy to desolder (switches and LEDs) compared to Filco.
- Keyboards: LZ-GH (Jailhouse Blues)M65-a  ||  To be built: MIRA SE, E8-V1, MOON TKL
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Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1491 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 11:02:01 »
if you get an unclear desolder in any situation, the best trick is actually the least intuitive. ADD solder to the joint, a whole bunch, then melt and use your solder sucker tool again. do this enough times and you will get a really clean desolder for mechanical and metallurgic reasons i won't go into.

Sadly that's still not quite going to get all the solder out for complete through-hole copper inserts in double-sided PCBs like Filcos.  I did that initially with my first Filco PCB and spent forever adding solder, sucking it out, adding more, using a braid, etc.  Tiny filaments remained deep inside the holes, and Filco even advertises that their solder goes all the way to the other side of the PCB.  It might be easier to get it all out with better tools.  My TRiK PCB was VERY easy to desolder (switches and LEDs) compared to Filco.

I think that also has a good bit to due with the type of solder Filco's use in manufacturing.

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1492 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 11:03:02 »
if you get an unclear desolder in any situation, the best trick is actually the least intuitive. ADD solder to the joint, a whole bunch, then melt and use your solder sucker tool again. do this enough times and you will get a really clean desolder for mechanical and metallurgic reasons i won't go into.

Sadly that's still not quite going to get all the solder out for complete through-hole copper inserts in double-sided PCBs like Filcos.  I did that initially with my first Filco PCB and spent forever adding solder, sucking it out, adding more, using a braid, etc.  Tiny filaments remained deep inside the holes, and Filco even advertises that their solder goes all the way to the other side of the PCB.  It might be easier to get it all out with better tools.  My TRiK PCB was VERY easy to desolder (switches and LEDs) compared to Filco.

Yeah, those Filco PCBs are a real pain to desolder. You're bound to lose a couple pads in the process.
KMAC :: LZ-GH :: WASD CODE :: WASD v2 :: GH60 :: Alps64 :: JD45 :: IBM Model M :: IBM 4704 "Pingmaster"

http://jd40.info :: http://jd45.info


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Offline swill

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1493 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 12:39:10 »
if you get an unclear desolder in any situation, the best trick is actually the least intuitive. ADD solder to the joint, a whole bunch, then melt and use your solder sucker tool again. do this enough times and you will get a really clean desolder for mechanical and metallurgic reasons i won't go into.

Sadly that's still not quite going to get all the solder out for complete through-hole copper inserts in double-sided PCBs like Filcos.  I did that initially with my first Filco PCB and spent forever adding solder, sucking it out, adding more, using a braid, etc.  Tiny filaments remained deep inside the holes, and Filco even advertises that their solder goes all the way to the other side of the PCB.  It might be easier to get it all out with better tools.  My TRiK PCB was VERY easy to desolder (switches and LEDs) compared to Filco.

Yeah, those Filco PCBs are a real pain to desolder. You're bound to lose a couple pads in the process.

Uggg...  I have a filco that I want to replace the plate on.  Not looking forward to this now...  :(  Any tips will be much appreciated. 

Offline bpiphany

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1494 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 14:51:18 »
I got one of these cheap from Poland some time ago. I haven't had a reason to try it on switches yet, but it sure gets stuff de-soldered properly =D

Offline Stevenator21

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1495 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 15:06:32 »
What is the recommended method of desoldering? Braid? Sucker?
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Offline nubbinator

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1496 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 15:14:00 »
What is the recommended method of desoldering? Braid? Sucker?

Everyone will give you a different answer.  I prefer a solder sucker.  Some prefer braid. Use what works best for you.

Offline PointyFox

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1497 on: Tue, 10 December 2013, 15:30:31 »
Both braids and solder suckers are poor for desoldering double layer PCBs.  A better choice would be a powered vacuum pump desolderer.

Offline balanar

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1498 on: Wed, 11 December 2013, 03:30:40 »
This sounds really interesting. Could you kindly post a picture illustrating the position of the notch?

Sure, here you go:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)

Wow that makes it alot clearer, thanks!

Offline Mackem

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Re: The Living Soldering Thread
« Reply #1499 on: Wed, 11 December 2013, 11:02:05 »
I'm in the UK and need recommendations on a soldering iron / soldering station plus anything I'd need for desoldering switches on a keyboard. The cheaper the better really since it's not going to be used like every day but don't want horrible tat at the same time. Got 35 Amazon.co.uk credit as well if anything on there is good.