Author Topic: [IC] KAT Refined - GB starts tomorrow!  (Read 114182 times)

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Offline digid3ar

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #100 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 13:38:28 »
im in! love concept and execution.

Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #101 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 15:48:17 »
- R2 \| is missing in the alphas kits (disregarding the HHKB ones); R3 #~ should be in NorDeUK instead.
- R3 1.5U \| is in the mods kits instead of the alphas kits for no apparent reason.
- Is the NorDeUk list of supported national layouts the usual band of five? (Danish, English (UK), German, Norwegian, Swedish/Finnish) And... why? This is KAT, so it should be feasible to break this up into, at the very least, NorDe and UK.
- The NorDeUk kits are missing the numpad comma (although I'd put it in the numpad kits). I'll check in detail later, but so far there seem to be no other obvious errors or omissions there.
- The F row kits seem to be the only ones with R5 keys. If keeping with that, they need to add keys like Insert and Delete (for 75% keyboards) and move the R4 End and PgDn there (for 1800 and 1800-like layouts).

Thank you for your feedback. It looks like I will do revisions to R5. The rest I will have to think about some more.


One question- will other, future KAT sets be able to use the legends you develop for Refined? I'd really like to see more sets on KAT and I think that these legends would push designers towards KAT as a bigger option.

Not at the moment, but will think about it later if people are interested.


It's just a little bit pity that it's not regular KAT font as it will create inconsistency in font if someone would want to mix it with other KAT sets, GLWGB

Thank you for the feedback. There's not really a "KAT font". If you see the same font in several sets it is because the designer chose to not alter the template file when you can do whatever you want with the legends.


Is a french kit doable ? With classic colorway like these you would sell some (not hundreds tho). I think I would buy two full sets, especially if you put the third legend like you did in NorDe kit. This third legend is missing in all KAT sets because of centered legends.
You would make some dudes like me very happy !
I second this, also North and South kits would make a lot of sense for this kind of set. Please think about it!

Will give it some thought!


please add R2 1.75u Control in mod kit.

do you think a separate spacebar kit is possible?

Haven't seen that many requests for a spacebar kit. R2 1.75u Control is happening though  ;D


Are you going to do any novelties?
No sorry, no novelties.



F row not on mods kits... I dont get the point. Even if I dont use them I prefer to have a full base kit and KAT prices are not that important to separate them. This way you will save few dollars per kit, not worth it imo

I have to agree that base sets in general should be more encompassing. ISO, Function and Numpad should always be in base in my opinion.  I don't know about the rest of you guys but I normally buy all parts of any set in case I decide to put it on a different board and maybe one that has not even been designed yet.

I really don't see the need in making a base kit full of keys people don't need. There is no increased price in extra kits.


The font legends look amazing, but is there any chance to have them centered? I think that would be a fresh look that's better than the current state of both GMK and KAT legends.

Thank you, but that sort of defeats the purpose of the whole idea.



« Last Edit: Mon, 01 June 2020, 16:08:14 by MacSurfy »

Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #102 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 15:53:56 »
Are there any black KAT keycaps out in the wild right now? I am curious to see how the dyesub will look for WoB. Otherwise, count me interested in this set.

Nope, none yet and I am curious like the rest of you how black we can get them. Like mentioned in an earlier post I will check color samples and see if the black is good enough. I will post my findings here so you can see for yourself once I have them in hand.


May I ask the reason for no full icon mods?
I just dislike them, so there's not much to refine except not offering them at all. Sorry. Hope there are other reasons for you to jump on the train anyway.



Would it be possible to have a small accent kit? Something like mr sleeves on Minimal. Would be very nice!
That's not something I will do in this round. Maybe R2



Great job! Any chance of adding a "Delete" on the F row?

Thank you, and yes  :D


The 40s kit is super weak for KAT. I suggest taking a look at KAT Explosion or KAT Space Cadet.

Thanks, I will have a look and check around among 40s peeps if they agree.
« Last Edit: Mon, 01 June 2020, 16:10:48 by MacSurfy »

Offline Senor Coconut

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #103 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 16:02:15 »
Is a french kit doable ? With classic colorway like these you would sell some (not hundreds tho). I think I would buy two full sets, especially if you put the third legend like you did in NorDe kit. This third legend is missing in all KAT sets because of centered legends.
You would make some dudes like me very happy !

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk
Same feeling, same question, same possible happiness
,,,

Offline psxndc

  • Posts: 391
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #104 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 16:09:06 »
Wanna consider Colevrak+ support? A strong 13 out of 613 Alphas orders for KAT Arctic came with Colevrak+ orders, for example :P
Okay I know the numbers are not strong, but a few of us do exist and would appreciate it!

I know you're calling for Colevrak support and being cheeky, but I personally had to skip Arctic because I already got colevrak kits for KAT Milkshake, KAT Space Cadet, KAT Lantis, and KAT Eternal. I only have so much money, guy.

But I'd totally get it for this GB.

Offline marshskitow

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #105 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 16:13:58 »
I would love to see CH swiss layout included in the NOR Kit <3

Offline Adelscott

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #106 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 16:40:09 »
.
« Last Edit: Wed, 03 June 2020, 18:06:02 by Adelscott »

Offline noorejji

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #107 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 17:26:53 »
This is looking very smart. Here's hoping the black in WoB will be decent.

Offline psxndc

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #108 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 17:39:46 »
Are you going to do any novelties?
No sorry, no novelties.

That's fair. Then can I request either (i) a kit of 2 blanks in each of R2 and R3 (so 4 additional keys) or (ii) an R2 1u CTRL or FN in the 40s kit?

Sorry, it's just that some/plenty of ortho people don't have Tab or Esc in R2 on the left side and use that key for something else.

Offline LightenS

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #109 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 17:42:00 »
+1 For Colevrak

Any chances to include Ergo?

Online kajahtaa

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #110 on: Mon, 01 June 2020, 23:52:32 »
I would also enjoy an Ortho kit roughly similar to KAT Space Cadet

Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #111 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:03:38 »
Updated the Mac kits and F-Row kits



Offline Mekberg

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #112 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:16:24 »
Could there be a R2 1.75u "Control" somewhere as well? For the not insignificant amount of people who like replacing Caps Lock with Control. Preferably icon, but anything is better than nothing.

Actually surprised that isn't in the HHKB kit by default, since that is default HHKB layout after all.

For me personally it could even go in the Mac kit, since I use Mac anyway and always map Caps Lock to Control in the system preferences. The "Command" key there is nice, but well, I don't have Command there... :)

Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #113 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:22:35 »
Could there be a R2 1.75u "Control" somewhere as well? For the not insignificant amount of people who like replacing Caps Lock with Control. Preferably icon, but anything is better than nothing.

Actually surprised that isn't in the HHKB kit by default, since that is default HHKB layout after all.

For me personally it could even go in the Mac kit, since I use Mac anyway and always map Caps Lock to Control in the system preferences. The "Command" key there is nice, but well, I don't have Command there... :)

Yup it is on the todo list already  :cool:

edit: sorry, it will be in the mod kit rather
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:26:03 by MacSurfy »

Offline itsmartin

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #114 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:30:41 »
Any particular reason that the R2 1.75u Control is going in the Mod kit rather than the HHKB kit?

It seems like a curious decision as the default HHBK layout has Control there; so the kit as-is assumes that users either change the default layout or want to have a differently labelled key there.

Edit: So for a HHKB user they'd want to get the HHKB kit and the Mod kit to get that one key for their desired layout, at which point there isn't really a reason to go for the HHKB kit at all. Everyone should just get the Alphas + Mod to cover HHKB/60%/65%/TKL, unless you're a HHKB user happy to go without the correct legend for the Control key you can then save some money by just getting the one kit.
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:36:54 by itsmartin »

Offline Bonsa

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #115 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:31:23 »
I'm with the people who requested French kit.
Also, I think there's not enough support for 40/ortho/ergo users(like me). I saw it mentioned before, but maybe you could take a look at KAT explosion or space cadet.

Offline wgsunrise

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #116 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 02:37:43 »
For me, trying a new profile with classic color scheme is definitely a good start.
However would you like to consider change arrows in text mod to text to fit the name better?

Edit: Forgot to mentioned that I have the same concern as others in previous comments, saying that how does the sculpted shaped of KAT caps affect the look of corner-aligned legend.
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 04:11:28 by wgsunrise »

Offline harlekein

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #117 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 06:15:54 »
Please do take advantage of KAT kitting options beyond offering HHKB layout.

I understand you are mimicking GMK, but we are no longer tied to their ridiculous MOQ model, so please let that part go. There's no reason to make 40s or ortho users buy full mod kits with addons here.

GMK kitting has always been a poor compromise where people beyond 60-full size QWERTY ANSI layouts are left behind or paying through the nose. With KAT we don't need to do that.

Please take a look at KAT WOB, Milkshake, Space Cadet for kitting options.
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 06:32:31 by harlekein »

Offline Escabrera

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #118 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 06:24:45 »
Boy you weren't kidding with crossing out the gmk in the title, the 40s kit is pulled straight out of it. Besides that my biggest concerns with the kitting is that you will be paying a huge premium just to have smaller kits when what rensuya/eski have kitted out works a whole lot better for this style of moq.
So what's the exact purpose of having all these overlapping keys and eccentric kitting that's just copied as if it was gmk moq systems. The whole reason I and many people like Kat is that it's very flexible and limits the amount of wasted keys so this kind of kitting is the very opposite of refined. I sure hope this doesn't set a dangerous precedent if the kitting stays but thats my two cents.

Offline Rafa_n

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #119 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:35:03 »
Caps lock keys in the HHKB kit don't make a lot of sense. It should be a 1.75 Control since that is what HHKB layout uses as standard.

I don't care about 1 legend not being correct but a lot of people do, and they would have to buy the mod kit just to use the control key for their hhkb layout, which kills the purpose of a layout specific kit.

Offline tanega

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #120 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:35:22 »
I'm supporting the requests for french, ergo, ...
Kat as a dream moq system for subkits, please don't drop them!

Offline D3LTA

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #121 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:36:37 »
Colevrak for WoB and BoW please
My man. +1 for colevrak+ in both WoB and BoW.

Dvorcol's excellent reference:
https://imgur.com/gallery/4Sy4ph1
+1 for colevrak support

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

Another vote for colevrak+ in both WoB & BoW.

Offline konstantin

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #122 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:37:25 »
This is an interesting project, good job MacSurfy! I have a few questions/remarks:

On the icon+text ISO and numpad Enter keys, the ↲ icon is above the Enter text, whereas it's traditionally always been the other way around on GMK and other Cherry profile sets, as far as I know. Is this on purpose?

The Backspace arrow tail seems a tad too long to me. Maybe make it a bit shorter, so it's halfway in between the Tab and Enter arrows in length? Just a suggestion — feel free to ignore it if you think what you currently have works better, as I'm sure you had a reason for making it longer. To me it doesn't look bad, just odd, but that may be because I'm not used to it.

By the way, you can move the R4 (R1) PgDn and End keys to the numpad kit, since those keys are never used on boards without numpads.

Please consider using R3 \|, R4 <> for the ISO keys, like GMK Firefly, Yugo and Rouge did. These keys cover more layouts than R3 #~, R4 \| do. 1 2

Overall, I think the way you have kitting set up is pretty interesting. Glad to see an alternative to the Code keys in the extra mods kits.
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:42:07 by konstantin »

Offline ceejaybvIbin

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #123 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:38:16 »
very interested. i love how clean this looks.

Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #124 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 07:52:32 »
This is an interesting project, good job MacSurfy! I have a few questions/remarks:

On the icon+text ISO and numpad Enter keys, the ↲ icon is above the Enter text, whereas it's traditionally always been the other way around on GMK and other Cherry profile sets, as far as I know. Is this on purpose?

The Backspace arrow tail seems a tad too long to me. Maybe make it a bit shorter, so it's halfway in between the Tab and Enter arrows in length? Just a suggestion — feel free to ignore it if you think what you currently have works better, as I'm sure you had a reason for making it longer. To me it doesn't look bad, just odd, but that may be because I'm not used to it.

By the way, you can move the R4 (R1) PgDn and End keys to the numpad kit, since those keys are never used on boards without numpads.

Please consider using R3 \|, R4 <> for the ISO keys, like GMK Firefly, Yugo and Rouge did. These keys cover more layouts than R3 #~, R4 \| do. 1 2

Overall, I think the way you have kitting set up is pretty interesting. Glad to see an alternative to the Code keys in the extra mods kits.

Thank you Konstantin for your constructive and thought out reply. Appreciated. I actually had the R3 \|, R4 <> in before but removed them on someones advice. But you aren't the first to mention them so might look to add them back in.

Backspace arrow is actually set up to shrink with the cap size at a certain percentage (not updated in the visuals yet). You can't see it very well but on the Lodestone render you'll notice how it perfectly lines up with enter which looks quite pleasing (especially when seeing it from a straight down top view). The same happens on Icon+Text mods. I am still tweaking that setup so I might revert to a shorter tail in the end.

Offline konstantin

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #125 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:10:11 »
Thank you Konstantin for your constructive and thought out reply. Appreciated. I actually had the R3 \|, R4 <> in before but removed them on someones advice. But you aren't the first to mention them so might look to add them back in.

Backspace arrow is actually set up to shrink with the cap size at a certain percentage (not updated in the visuals yet). You can't see it very well but on the Lodestone render you'll notice how it perfectly lines up with enter which looks quite pleasing (especially when seeing it from a straight down top view). The same happens on Icon+Text mods. I am still tweaking that setup so I might revert to a shorter tail in the end.

Ah, that makes sense, thank you for the explanation!

Regarding the ISO keys, the other international keyboardery folks (depletedvespene, dvorcol, kidviddy) and I are open to discussing the benefits and drawbacks of either approach. If you or anyone else working on the set have any thoughts on the matter, feel free to reach out to us. The data we've gathered so far seems to conclusively indicate that your initial approach is better in terms of users and layout coverage. Meanwhile, your current approach is evidently more common if we look at past GBs. We're pushing for R3 \|, R4 <> in future GBs in order to hopefully make the more useful approach more common too.

Any comments on my question about the icon+text vertical Enter icons?
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 14:58:38 by konstantin »

Offline Applet

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #126 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:34:11 »
Great work MacSurfy  :thumb:

If possible I'd love to see either a (split) space kit, or a addition of a 1.25 blank in the 40's kit, for basic split space support (2.25u+1.25u+2.75u is the most common setup)  ;D
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:50:57 by Applet »

Online Bl4ck

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #127 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:39:12 »
I support the previous comments of taking advantage of KAT kitting, +1 for North/South/French kits to be able to include as much languages.

Offline platypusduck

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #128 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:42:41 »
Interesting project – looks like you'll be testing KAT's dye sub capabilities.

A bit of a nitpick though – the numbers row could use some love. The symbols are visually all over the place, as if they come from a different typeface. Take the at symbol and the ampersand. I gather they'd do well in typical typesetting applications, but here they look out of place. The counters are distractingly large. As it is, 2, 4, and 7 really stand out. 9 ( and 0 ) could also use some horizontal alignment fixes. And there's something a bit off with W...

All in all, great effort here. This community needs more typographically-inclined people who don't say "that's good enough" to what we get with GMK legends.

Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #129 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:45:37 »
Boy you weren't kidding with crossing out the gmk in the title, the 40s kit is pulled straight out of it. Besides that my biggest concerns with the kitting is that you will be paying a huge premium just to have smaller kits when what rensuya/eski have kitted out works a whole lot better for this style of moq.
So what's the exact purpose of having all these overlapping keys and eccentric kitting that's just copied as if it was gmk moq systems. The whole reason I and many people like Kat is that it's very flexible and limits the amount of wasted keys so this kind of kitting is the very opposite of refined. I sure hope this doesn't set a dangerous precedent if the kitting stays but thats my two cents.

I hear you, and you aren't the only one who has commented on the kits. If I would follow previous "succesful" KAT-kitting I would end up with approximately 40 kits. Looking at the sales on a few different KAT sets I find it really hard to motivate the increased risk of QC/packaging errors AND all the extra work I have to put in (we're not talking a few hours here). The loud minority is present as always on GH  ;D. Personally I am also wondering how intimidating it is for people who aren't as deep in the hobby as we might be to pick the kits they need when there is so many of them. This is also something I have heard from vendors.

Your message was received loud and clear though. I will be thinking about how I can structure the kits in a more efficient way that has the biggest reach. If you have any pointers let me know and I will try my best to make it happen.

Offline tominabox1

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #130 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 08:55:27 »
Boy you weren't kidding with crossing out the gmk in the title, the 40s kit is pulled straight out of it. Besides that my biggest concerns with the kitting is that you will be paying a huge premium just to have smaller kits when what rensuya/eski have kitted out works a whole lot better for this style of moq.
So what's the exact purpose of having all these overlapping keys and eccentric kitting that's just copied as if it was gmk moq systems. The whole reason I and many people like Kat is that it's very flexible and limits the amount of wasted keys so this kind of kitting is the very opposite of refined. I sure hope this doesn't set a dangerous precedent if the kitting stays but thats my two cents.

I hear you, and you aren't the only one who has commented on the kits. If I would follow previous "succesful" KAT-kitting I would end up with approximately 40 kits. Looking at the sales on a few different KAT sets I find it really hard to motivate the increased risk of QC/packaging errors AND all the extra work I have to put in (we're not talking a few hours here). The loud minority is present as always on GH  ;D. Personally I am also wondering how intimidating it is for people who aren't as deep in the hobby as we might be to pick the kits they need when there is so many of them. This is also something I have heard from vendors.

Your message was received loud and clear though. I will be thinking about how I can structure the kits in a more efficient way that has the biggest reach. If you have any pointers let me know and I will try my best to make it happen.

You have the pointers, copy Space Cadet kitting.

Offline harlekein

  • Posts: 387
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #131 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 09:06:02 »
Boy you weren't kidding with crossing out the gmk in the title, the 40s kit is pulled straight out of it. Besides that my biggest concerns with the kitting is that you will be paying a huge premium just to have smaller kits when what rensuya/eski have kitted out works a whole lot better for this style of moq.
So what's the exact purpose of having all these overlapping keys and eccentric kitting that's just copied as if it was gmk moq systems. The whole reason I and many people like Kat is that it's very flexible and limits the amount of wasted keys so this kind of kitting is the very opposite of refined. I sure hope this doesn't set a dangerous precedent if the kitting stays but thats my two cents.

I hear you, and you aren't the only one who has commented on the kits. If I would follow previous "succesful" KAT-kitting I would end up with approximately 40 kits. Looking at the sales on a few different KAT sets I find it really hard to motivate the increased risk of QC/packaging errors AND all the extra work I have to put in (we're not talking a few hours here). The loud minority is present as always on GH  ;D. Personally I am also wondering how intimidating it is for people who aren't as deep in the hobby as we might be to pick the kits they need when there is so many of them. This is also something I have heard from vendors.

Your message was received loud and clear though. I will be thinking about how I can structure the kits in a more efficient way that has the biggest reach. If you have any pointers let me know and I will try my best to make it happen.

You have the pointers, copy Space Cadet kitting.

Or combine 40s/ortho if you have to. You won't even have to add kits. Just replace current 40s add-on kit with 40s/ortho. You will have the exact same number of kits. Just one good one instead of handicapped add-on.

I don't think anyone is asking for 6 more kits. 40s/ortho users are asking for one kit to be replaced. At the very least.

Now it would be nice to add one more kit for each colorway so there's a choice between icons and text, but that's okay. I understand you don't want to add more kits after having added 3 different regular mod kits with F keys separated already. (There's a solution for that as well, and people who use F keys have mentioned it in this thread.)


Offline MacSurfy

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #132 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 09:11:06 »
Boy you weren't kidding with crossing out the gmk in the title, the 40s kit is pulled straight out of it. Besides that my biggest concerns with the kitting is that you will be paying a huge premium just to have smaller kits when what rensuya/eski have kitted out works a whole lot better for this style of moq.
So what's the exact purpose of having all these overlapping keys and eccentric kitting that's just copied as if it was gmk moq systems. The whole reason I and many people like Kat is that it's very flexible and limits the amount of wasted keys so this kind of kitting is the very opposite of refined. I sure hope this doesn't set a dangerous precedent if the kitting stays but thats my two cents.

I hear you, and you aren't the only one who has commented on the kits. If I would follow previous "succesful" KAT-kitting I would end up with approximately 40 kits. Looking at the sales on a few different KAT sets I find it really hard to motivate the increased risk of QC/packaging errors AND all the extra work I have to put in (we're not talking a few hours here). The loud minority is present as always on GH  ;D. Personally I am also wondering how intimidating it is for people who aren't as deep in the hobby as we might be to pick the kits they need when there is so many of them. This is also something I have heard from vendors.

Your message was received loud and clear though. I will be thinking about how I can structure the kits in a more efficient way that has the biggest reach. If you have any pointers let me know and I will try my best to make it happen.

You have the pointers, copy Space Cadet kitting.

Or combine 40s/ortho if you have to. You won't even have to add kits. Just replace current 40s add-on kit with 40s/ortho. You will have the exact same number of kits. Just one good one instead of handicapped add-on.

I don't think anyone is asking for 6 more kits. 40s/ortho users are asking for one kit to be replaced. At the very least.

Now it would be nice to add one more kit for each colorway so there's a choice between icons and text, but that's okay. I understand you don't want to add more kits after having added 3 different regular mod kits with F keys separated already. (There's a solution for that as well, and people who use F keys have mentioned it in this thread.)

Tnx, will def look in to it and get back to ya'll

Online bananasplit_00

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #133 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 09:25:33 »
This is gona sell like hotcakes, gimme!  ^-^

Offline Slayer77

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #134 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 10:18:16 »
Has it been clarified if the white will be ws1 or ws2?

Sent from my GM1911 using Tapatalk


Offline stoffelduss

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Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #135 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 12:10:58 »
The numbers of the number row look pretty small in your pictures of the kits. Especially noticeable in the NorDe kit, symbols and characters like € and ß are way bigger than the numbers.

Offline cadrev

  • Posts: 64
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #136 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 13:23:15 »
Interested on this set, just wanna ask how is the black here different from KAT WOB?

Offline MacSurfy

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 211
  • Location: Amsterdam
  • Designer & 3D artist
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #137 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 13:37:41 »
The numbers of the number row look pretty small in your pictures of the kits. Especially noticeable in the NorDe kit, symbols and characters like € and ß are way bigger than the numbers.

This is true and intentional, and so does GMK.

I know GMK offer a few variations on this (GMK Striker for instance), but the "common" one is using 3 sizes (if we disregard a few anomalies). Alpha letter, number and sublegend, which is a little bit bigger than the numbers. The problem I think with it is that the sublegends are only a little bit bigger but not enough to be really obvious. In some cases they made them the same size as the numbers and in some cases they are quite a bit bigger. So it's all over the place depending on which one you are looking at.

I wanted to keep that train of thought with three sizes since I think it makes sense to create heirarchy. Especially when tertiary legends are involved (like in NorDeUK) but use a stronger contrast between them and stick to it as much as possible. I did play around with the idea of doing the numbers a lot bigger, roughly in the same size as Striker but it does look a little bit funky and maybe harder to swallow for some. Even though I like it a lot.

Below is an example of the current design compared to a GMK Norde kit

« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 13:40:02 by MacSurfy »

Offline drfranco

  • Posts: 12
  • Location: California
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #138 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 13:58:34 »
Definitely interested. Great design work.

Offline luxus

  • Posts: 2
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #139 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 15:20:43 »
Interested ..

Offline MacSurfy

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 211
  • Location: Amsterdam
  • Designer & 3D artist
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #140 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 16:08:33 »
40s kit will be replaced by a 40's & Ortho kit. Working on it right now. Hope it will please most of you :)
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 16:11:22 by MacSurfy »

Offline gminso

  • Posts: 88
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #141 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 16:11:42 »
Canadian vendor?  :)

Offline -Jehos-

  • Posts: 2
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #142 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 16:26:31 »
do you want to elaborate on why you chose to have an hhkb kit rather than a "tsangan 60%" kit?
at bare minimum, 2 more keys (2x 1.5u ctrl) would give you a 7u bottom row.
1 additional key (2.75u shift) would give you full right shift support.
2 additional keys (2u backspace and 1.5u pipe) would give full backspace support.
potentially, a fulltouch caps lock would round off all "needed" compatibility for a 7u 60% kit.

all in all, that is 6 additional keys which would make the kit much more desirable to a much wider range of people. so, the question stands - any reason you chose to make the kit hhkb only?

just my 2 cents, glwic :)
I agree that the HHKB kit is a little weird, since it seems like the entirety of the HHKB kit plus Tsangan support and normal ANSI support is covered by the letter + choice of mods.  I don't know if there are MOQs when you're talking about dye sub, but it seems like HHKB is overly specific as a kit, while also being overly opinionated about text/icons/both.

Online Bl4ck

  • Posts: 127
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #143 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 16:44:53 »
Btw, no IC form?

Offline Bonsa

  • Posts: 39
  • Location: Belgium
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #144 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 17:27:02 »
40s kit will be replaced by a 40's & Ortho kit. Working on it right now. Hope it will please most of you :)


You sir just sold me a set! Thank you very much for your effort. I believe this set is going to be a standard for future KAT groupbuys. It's like GMK and SA had a baby. And it's a beauty.
(edit: woops quoted wrong comment)
« Last Edit: Tue, 02 June 2020, 17:30:40 by Bonsa »

Offline Slaydo

  • Posts: 3
  • Dealing in the 3Ms > Movies - Music - Mechkeyboard
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #145 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 19:32:20 »
Love it! I fell in love with the KAT profile coming from SA and love the non-aggressive lines KAT offers. Really like the simplicity of going with WoB. Have you thought of possibly having scooped homing keys as opposed to the ones with the bump on 'em. Definitely be keeping an eye on this one, cheers!

Offline konstantin

  • Formerly constexpr
  • Posts: 1421
  • Location: Serbia
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #146 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 19:36:42 »
Love it! I fell in love with the KAT profile coming from SA and love the non-aggressive lines KAT offers. Really like the simplicity of going with WoB. Have you thought of possibly having scooped homing keys as opposed to the ones with the bump on 'em. Definitely be keeping an eye on this one, cheers!

Do KAT scooped homing molds exist? I don't think they do.

Offline digid3ar

  • Posts: 92
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #147 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 20:12:27 »
im not an expert with kitting sets, but the og 40s kit was ok to me. dont know if there is a special reason to mix 40s wtih ortho,i think ortholinear belongs more to the ergo kits, but that is only my opinion.

Offline !Q

  • Posts: 6
  • Location: US Illinois
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #148 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 20:26:56 »
Can we get asetniop compat? 2 1u convex keys.

Offline fropsie

  • Posts: 112
  • Location: Boston, MA
Re: [IC] KAT Refined
« Reply #149 on: Tue, 02 June 2020, 21:09:00 »
This is sick!!!! Definitely going to join in on it.