Author Topic: [IC] SA 8010  (Read 8392 times)

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Offline FRANCO

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[IC] SA 8010
« on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:13:37 »

Hi Everyone! Fredington and I would like to introduce you to SA 8010!

The colorway and legends were inspired by the Decision Data 8010 Keypunch keyboard. Similar to the IBM 029 Keypunch, the 8010 was a machine used to punch holes into data cards, which was a very old way of recording data. The keyboard’s unique colorway was designed to distinguish the numpad (dark grey) and modifiers (blue), from the alphas (white) on what is essentially a 60% keyboard


HaaTa's original pic
Another interesting feature are the dual legends where the uppercase featured the numerical and special characters, whereas the lowercase featured the alphabetical characters. You would toggle the uppercase with the Upper Shift key, and the lowercase with the Lower Shift key


A few other quirks about this keyboard:
  • SKIP was akin to Tab
  • DUP, when held down, would duplicate whatever was in the current position of the previous card
  • REL I believe stands for Release, which would release the current card from the machine
  • The 4 PROG keys gave you some ability to program the keypunch kind of like Macros

If you are interested, please fill out this form here!


Colors:
Coming Very Soon...


Kits:

Base Kit
Due to its unique colorway, the base kit features both Alphas and Modifiers, which isn't typical for SA sets. The Modifiers stay faithful as possible to the actual Decision Data keyboard, featuring new legends in place of standard modifiers (e.g. Right Adjust as the Enter key)




Numpad
The Numpad kit supports full-sized keyboard layouts




Extensions
On top of the standard modifier extensions, we wanted to provide two additional 1u blank white keys for a bit more flexibility when configuring the modifiers around the spacebar




Ortholinear
Honestly, why wouldn’t we make an ortho kit? It looks amazing. Some changes to call out are the abbreviation of various legends to fit in a 1u key, as well as a standalone PROG key without a number




ISO
Provides support for Physical ISO




Split Spacebars
Provides support for split spacebar boards, including the Alice layout




PROG
Derived from the PROG keys and expanded to 10 for Macros



Render Gallery by Abec13


M60-A by Rama Works







Iron 180 by Smith + Rune









Bauer by Dixie Mech









Atlas by nasp








Special Thanks
Fredington for basically doing everything lol (fonts, kit creation, suggestions and advice on kits, and running a GB)
Abec13 for the super realistic renders (Honestly, best I’ve seen) and putting up with my absolute lack of knowledge on fonts, rendering, colors, etc…
HaaTa at Deskthority allowing the use of the images of his actual NOS Decision Data 8010 keyboard (jealous)

To-do’s:
  • Finalize colors (in progress)
  • Additional renders (in progress)
  • Gather feedback (in progress)
  • Finalize kits (in progress)
  • Vendors
  • Pricing
  • GB date
  • Keyboard Cable?

If you'd like to support this project, please use the banner below:

Code: [Select]
[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106901.0][img width=475 height=120]https://i.imgur.com/5XAzzYO.png[/img][/url]
« Last Edit: Thu, 18 June 2020, 14:08:04 by FRANCO »

Offline bisoromi

  • Formerly Duwang
  • Posts: 137
  • owo
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #1 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:15:18 »
i love SA

please consider R4 bottom row!!!!
(credits to Kokaloo)

Offline Nyeezy

  • Posts: 5
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:15:57 »
This is great! Count me in

Offline wouldworks

  • Posts: 53
  • Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
    • Finder Works
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:16:17 »
Awesome! big fan of vintage source material

Offline Fredington

  • Posts: 194
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:19:02 »
 :thumb:

Pleasure working with on this. I think it goes without saying that I am in.
« Last Edit: Thu, 11 June 2020, 21:25:20 by Fredington »

Offline BirgusLatro

  • Posts: 20
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:45:26 »
:heavy breathing:

Offline konstantin

  • Formerly constexpr
  • Posts: 1021
  • Location: Serbia
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 20:56:52 »
Love the theme, and the kitting looks great. I'd maybe just ask for AltGr keys in the ISO kit.

Offline synthtastic

  • Posts: 72
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 21:05:22 »
Very nice...I'm ready to Prog.

Offline fireworm

  • Posts: 423
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 21:11:15 »
Please, consider adding:

WKL (1.5u, 1u, 1.5u, 7u, 1.5u, 1u, 1.5u)
HHKB (Split backspace, split right shift)

to your base kit. This also covers 65% (physically, with incorrect legends).

Extensions can simply become "correct" legends for those layouts, plus 2u, and 2.25u shift.

It was a tragedy when I bought a few SA / KAT sets, only to buy a WKL keyboard (which GMK sets cover), and realize I can no longer cover with my new set, thus sending me to the aftermarket.

Offline konstantin

  • Formerly constexpr
  • Posts: 1021
  • Location: Serbia
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 21:22:54 »
Please, consider adding:

WKL (1.5u, 1u, 1.5u, 7u, 1.5u, 1u, 1.5u)
HHKB (Split backspace, split right shift)

to your base kit. This also covers 65% (physically, with incorrect legends).

Extensions can simply become "correct" legends for those layouts, plus 2u, and 2.25u shift.

It was a tragedy when I bought a few SA / KAT sets, only to buy a WKL keyboard (which GMK sets cover), and realize I can no longer cover with my new set, thus sending me to the aftermarket.

Having that compat in the extensions kit is how SA kitting has been done since... as long as I can remember. I doubt it's going to change for this set, and, personally, I don't think it needs to. Think of the extensions and ISO kits as parts of the base kit, that you can opt out of purchasing if you don't need them. Including or not including them in the base kit doesn't affect the price in any way with SP SA, so it's better to have them separate.

Offline logo4poop

  • Posts: 104
  • Location: Michigan, USA
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Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 22:29:07 »
loved sail, this looks good too
I am like a cat but with a keyboard

Offline psxndc

  • Posts: 321
[IC] SA 8010
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 11 June 2020, 22:30:41 »
Just nicely done, all around. So nice I'm not even going to ask for Colevrak support.

I was just thinking today that I might be done with SA and then you go and post something like this. RIP wallet.
« Last Edit: Thu, 11 June 2020, 22:32:43 by psxndc »

Offline fropsie

  • Posts: 82
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 00:04:13 »
Hells yeah! SA the best! Good to see the holy 112343 being used :D

Offline piit79

  • Posts: 300
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 00:38:22 »
Looks very nice. I'm not the biggest fan of SA, but I like the interesting colourway. I'm just a bit afraid of the price with all those custom legends...

Offline L-Ron

  • Posts: 12
  • Location: Australia
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 00:44:41 »
Absolutely in for this, always love vintage-style SA caps.

Offline Howgii

  • Posts: 12
  • Location: Sweden
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 02:30:51 »
Awesome set, I will probably join the GB

Offline harlekein

  • Posts: 313
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 03:08:23 »
Just nicely done, all around. So nice I'm not even going to ask for Colevrak support.

I was just thinking today that I might be done with SA and then you go and post something like this. RIP wallet.

I'm with you all the way. I love this. But Colevrak is going to be tough for this.

Offline Ja3_420

  • Posts: 25
  • Location: Netherlands, Zuid
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 04:26:09 »
very nise

Offline psxndc

  • Posts: 321
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 07:37:33 »
Just nicely done, all around. So nice I'm not even going to ask for Colevrak support.

I was just thinking today that I might be done with SA and then you go and post something like this. RIP wallet.

I'm with you all the way. I love this. But Colevrak is going to be tough for this.
Dual legends are hard. Multicolor is hard. Dual legends AND multicolor? Damn near impossible.

Offline ddrfraser1

  • Posts: 237
  • Location: Nashville TN
  • IWHBYD
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #19 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 07:44:55 »
Ok yeah, this is actually pretty cool. I’m in.

Offline Bonsa

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Belgium
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #20 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 08:37:25 »
Beautiful colors.

Offline FRANCO

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 78
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #21 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 10:54:49 »
Just nicely done, all around. So nice I'm not even going to ask for Colevrak support.

I was just thinking today that I might be done with SA and then you go and post something like this. RIP wallet.

Just nicely done, all around. So nice I'm not even going to ask for Colevrak support.

I was just thinking today that I might be done with SA and then you go and post something like this. RIP wallet.

I'm with you all the way. I love this. But Colevrak is going to be tough for this.

Yea, we tried to see how we could make Colevrak work, but for what we were trying to do with this set, it was definitely tough

Offline enrique.aliaga

  • Posts: 247
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #22 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 11:13:19 »
I joined SA SAIL and will most likely join this one as well. Love modern reproductions of vintage key sets!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline krautcat

  • Posts: 23
  • Location: The Big Gloom
  • local the flammable man without identity
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #23 on: Fri, 12 June 2020, 13:30:33 »
Joined SA Sail, joined Atlas. What's next, join this?  :)

Quietly dissappointed with kitting but understandable. I'd like to see more separated kits especially mods but it's likely I will have to take almost all kits here.
« Last Edit: Fri, 12 June 2020, 21:26:29 by krautcat »

Offline wil

  • Posts: 78
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #24 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 00:11:39 »
incredibly cool recreation. i think this is one of those sets that justifies the price of SA


Offline depletedvespene

  • Posts: 748
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    • Keyboard-related resources.
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 07:41:29 »
Just nicely done, all around. So nice I'm not even going to ask for Colevrak support.

I was just thinking today that I might be done with SA and then you go and post something like this. RIP wallet.

I'm with you all the way. I love this. But Colevrak is going to be tough for this.

This set is using the Data Entry keyboard layout, which is pretty much fixed. Even "international" versions of the Data Entry keyboards modified VERY LITTLE of the layouts where it comes to alphas (like in this IBM 3277 example). I don't think a Dvorak version of the Data Entry keyboard layout ever existed (much less make its way into a physical keyboard).

Offline FRANCO

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 78
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #26 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 11:27:05 »
Joined SA Sail, joined Atlas. What's next, join this?  :)

Quietly dissappointed with kitting but understandable. I'd like to see more separated kits especially mods but it's likely I will have to take almost all kits here.

Totally understand where you're coming from, and we definitely considered breaking out Alphas from mods, etc... But we felt with this unique colorway, the Alphas and mods are basically inseparable

Offline AJM

  • Posts: 66
  • Location: Germany
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #27 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 13:58:37 »
That could become my first ever SA set. I really like the color scheme and the "nerd-ness" to use this on a modern keyboard.
But I have a few suggestions:
I think we all agree, that the main goal is, to use the legends from the original punch card keyboard as far as possible.
1. Therefore I would prefer it at lot, if the 2u Backspace key would get the legend "VER CORR"
2. I can understand that a "FEED" key was "invented" for the ANSI layout, because the original keyboard has a ISO enter, but if I had an ANSI keyboard (which I have not), I would prefer the legend "HOME" from the original keyboard - Row 3. Or maybe "BACKSPACE" would even be better (from Row 4 of the original). Together with my my first suggestion it wouldn't result in a double "BACKSPACE" and for HHKB users it would even be the "correct" legend.
3. For the ISO kit (which I would use) I would really really really prefer the legend "HOME" instead of "FEED" - it would then even be in the correct original position. (I understand the reasoning to not have two HOME keys, but that argument isn't valid for all the 60 % keyboards and the 60 % + Numpad (in my case)).
4. In the ISO kit there is an "invented" REG key for Row 4. Since the original keyboard already offers an additional R4 key with the legend "BACKSPACE", I would very much prefer this. Again - together with my suggestion "1." that wouldn't result in a double legend.

Offline Shiro

  • Posts: 27
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #28 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 14:24:29 »
dang, this is really cool looking. might have to try out SA now.

Offline Fredington

  • Posts: 194
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #29 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 14:27:03 »
That could become my first ever SA set. I really like the color scheme and the "nerd-ness" to use this on a modern keyboard.
But I have a few suggestions:
I think we all agree, that the main goal is, to use the legends from the original punch card keyboard as far as possible.
1. Therefore I would prefer it at lot, if the 2u Backspace key would get the legend "VER CORR"
2. I can understand that a "FEED" key was "invented" for the ANSI layout, because the original keyboard has a ISO enter, but if I had an ANSI keyboard (which I have not), I would prefer the legend "HOME" from the original keyboard - Row 3. Or maybe "BACKSPACE" would even be better (from Row 4 of the original). Together with my my first suggestion it wouldn't result in a double "BACKSPACE" and for HHKB users it would even be the "correct" legend.
3. For the ISO kit (which I would use) I would really really really prefer the legend "HOME" instead of "FEED" - it would then even be in the correct original position. (I understand the reasoning to not have two HOME keys, but that argument isn't valid for all the 60 % keyboards and the 60 % + Numpad (in my case)).
4. In the ISO kit there is an "invented" REG key for Row 4. Since the original keyboard already offers an additional R4 key with the legend "BACKSPACE", I would very much prefer this. Again - together with my suggestion "1." that wouldn't result in a double legend.

I've actually already made some legend revisions that we can soon share. First of all, a couple things to note:

1. The DD 8010 does not have enough keys to fill out a modern keyboard without double legends. Thus, we looked to other keypunch boards for inspiration in filling out the required keys. These other boards are the IBM 026 and the IBM 029.

2. The objective was never to visually duplicate the DD 8010, but rather, a combination of visual and functional reasons why a particular legend went in a particular place. Legend function should be consistent across all possible layouts.

Therefore...

1. VER CORR = Delete, as there already is a BACKSPACE key on the DD 8010.

2. We will actually be replacing FEED with REG so that it will be visually correct on ISO layouts as per the IBM 029, from which it came. FEED (also from the IBM 029) will be replacing INS, which I feel makes more sense. There is already a BACKSPACE key for HHKB included in the Extension kit.

3 and 4. HOME already exists as a default key and will be staying as is. As stated above, FEED will be changing to REG to visually reflect the IBM 029. The current REG will be replaced with a new alpha key, as per ISO convention.
« Last Edit: Sat, 13 June 2020, 14:45:45 by Fredington »

Offline AJM

  • Posts: 66
  • Location: Germany
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #30 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 15:24:51 »
I see. Although my priorities might be different in some places, I understand your reasoning.

Concerning the mentioned new R4 alpha key for the ISO kit: I would still prefer a key in modifier color. (Because the key color isn't logical for modern keyboard anyhow and I would consider it more "historically correct" - looking at an data-entry IBM 3276:
https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1113

Offline Fredington

  • Posts: 194
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #31 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 16:01:57 »
I see. Although my priorities might be different in some places, I understand your reasoning.

Concerning the mentioned new R4 alpha key for the ISO kit: I would still prefer a key in modifier color. (Because the key color isn't logical for modern keyboard anyhow and I would consider it more "historically correct" - looking at an data-entry IBM 3276:
https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1113

We will aim to provide a mod option for that key as well that is not REG.

Online ullr

  • Posts: 268
  • Location: Plant City, FL
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #32 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 17:02:24 »
The Bauer render persuaded me that this set is perfect for a 65%

Offline Fredington

  • Posts: 194
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #33 on: Sat, 13 June 2020, 17:06:30 »
The Bauer render persuaded me that this set is perfect for a 65%

For those ready to PROG, might I direct you to this currently open GB: https://r.works/zenith
« Last Edit: Sat, 13 June 2020, 17:08:03 by Fredington »

Offline megabacon

  • Posts: 3
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #34 on: Mon, 15 June 2020, 16:43:30 »
Is there any chance of adding an Ergodox kit?

Offline Slayer77

  • Posts: 222
  • Location: Pune, India
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #35 on: Tue, 16 June 2020, 00:14:02 »
Would have loved an mt3 set..

Sent from my GM1911 using Tapatalk


Offline horchata771

  • Posts: 23
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #36 on: Tue, 16 June 2020, 03:28:35 »
Just when I thought I was done, they bring me back in. I'm in!
I'm a sucker for dual legends inspired by vintage boards.



Offline voodoo6k

  • Formerly voodoo5
  • Posts: 443
  • Location: Canada
    • Group buy portal
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #37 on: Thu, 18 June 2020, 09:31:11 »
This is a great looking set! :eek:

Offline FRANCO

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 78
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #38 on: Thu, 18 June 2020, 11:15:37 »
Is there any chance of adding an Ergodox kit?

Unfortunately, given the colorway, it would be quite difficult to create it without making it too expensive. But we're still gathering feedback and if there's enough people, we're always open to adding

Would have loved an mt3 set..

Sent from my GM1911 using Tapatalk



You and me both man ;)

But I didn't think PBT would do the colors justice. However, over on the MT3 Susuwatari thread, they mentioned that they have worked out the production kinks and are starting to create MT3 doubleshot ABS kits "in all of our favorite colorways". So perhaps, there's a chance =)

Just when I thought I was done, they bring me back in. I'm in!
I'm a sucker for dual legends inspired by vintage boards.

One of my favorite movie lines to quote lol

Offline boxfrommoon

  • Posts: 26
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #39 on: Tue, 30 June 2020, 14:58:47 »
Doubleshot legends all the way! This looks so cool. Will definitely join once this hits GB phase

Offline vocal118

  • Posts: 17
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #40 on: Wed, 01 July 2020, 01:17:40 »
IN

Offline FRANCO

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 78
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #41 on: Wed, 01 July 2020, 12:32:31 »
Apologies for the lack of updates or engagement in the thread! We're currently in a holding pattern as we wait to finalize the colors.

Full transparency, we're not quite satisfied with the Pantone we initially chose for the blue keycaps.

But it's not necessarily how they're represented in the renders, because as we all know, the colors you see on your screen will never be a perfect match for what they look like in real life.

So, most likely, we'll be in a holding pattern for a couple more weeks as we wait for some things to come in. But once we finalize the colors, we'll be trying to get this into the group buy phase as quickly as possible

Offline Hamel

  • Posts: 115
  • Location: Seoul, South Korea
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Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #42 on: Sun, 05 July 2020, 19:22:47 »
Definitely IN.





Online ullr

  • Posts: 268
  • Location: Plant City, FL
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #43 on: Sun, 05 July 2020, 19:37:28 »
Fantastic, I am definitely in on this set. Love SA, love cool layouts with historical appeal, and I love this color scheme.

Online justinm

  • Posts: 6
  • Location: Vancouver
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #44 on: Fri, 10 July 2020, 15:13:15 »
very nice

Online funkmon

  • Posts: 238
Re: [IC] SA 8010
« Reply #45 on: Fri, 10 July 2020, 15:56:40 »
I would like it, but it would be cool to have an option that is slightly less authentic. That is, with the normal punctuation keys on the right of the letters. :P. I would buy for sure.