Taobao Goods

[Kellybear]

He isn't online very often either. He told me he had everything packaged and would be shipping the following day, but that was when he first got back. I haven't asked about it recently. I've been trying to get him to come back because I think it's better he respond to everyone instead of me speaking for him, but he isn't up for it yet. I'll definitely try to find out what's happened with the taobao stuff when I catch him online again.

[Tennobanzai]

He is embarrassed, obviously, so he has been communicating through Kelly.  And if his Paypal is hosed, he probably doesn't have money to ship out the Taobao goods.  He is still in high school and probably can't just eat the shipping like most of us would in this situation.

If this is really the case he needs to step up and be accountable for his actions. Between this and the other GB his integrity seems to be questionable and should really speak up for himself, regardless if he lied or anything. IMO I rather here him say stuff we don't want to hear then nothing at all. Right now at least for myself I'm left in the dark wondering whats going on

[hashbaz]

If this is really the case he needs to step up and be accountable for his actions. Between this and the other GB his integrity seems to be questionable and should really speak up for himself, regardless if he lied or anything. IMO I rather here him say stuff we don't want to hear then nothing at all. Right now at least for myself I'm left in the dark wondering whats going on

I don't think anyone here would disagree with this.

[dirge]

I'm not bothered.  If he comes back, does a quick sorry, that'll be the slate clean.

Just set us straight.

[MMB]

[Halverson]

(Attachment Link)

Mmm tender horse meat burgers I presume?

[MMB]

Mmm tender horse meat burgers I presume?

[mickd]

Yeah. If he comes back, apologises and gives up some updates whenever he gets them, that would be enough for me. Stuff happens. Communication is key.

[Kellybear]

[7:20:24 PM] Kelly: Hey people are still asking about the taobao stuff on the forums. Did you get them all shipped out?
[7:21:07 PM] Andrew : I've been really busy
[7:21:09 PM] Andrew : past few days
[7:21:22 PM] Andrew : but they are not shipped out yet
[7:21:26 PM] Andrew : i really want to ship them out
[7:21:30 PM] Andrew : but i dont have any tim
[7:22:37 PM] Kelly: Are you planning on shipping out soon?
[7:22:48 PM] Andrew : yeah i should have free time on tuesday
[7:22:52 PM] Kelly: Oki

[WhiteFireDragon]

Ok so he's been busy for the past few days. How about the past few months that we got no updates? Busy too?

For some reason, I just think that shipping out on Tuesday is just another empty promise.

[ekw808]

I'm pretty glad I got rejected from this GB.

[Elrick]

I'm pretty glad I got rejected from this GB.

Yes, you can sure say that again.  But also of note there are some other Group Buys that have failed.  Is this the future of Group Buys from now on, failure to deliver once payments have been made?

Maybe it's better off ONLY buying from registered sellers here on Geekhack instead of buying from privateers..... with next to no positive feedbacks.  Just something to think about before handing over any money to future Group Buys here on Geekhack.

[ChaoticKinesis]

Ok so he's been busy for the past few days. How about the past few months that we got no updates? Busy too?

For some reason, I just think that shipping out on Tuesday is just another empty promise.

Agreed, what does it mean for someone to be really busy? I understand not finding the time to do it over the course of a couple days, but really finding an hour or two to package things and take them to the post office should not be such a huge deal. Who is so busy that they honestly can't find the time to do that over the course of weeks or months? Similarly, taking a few minutes to post something does not take much longer than the two minutes devoted to those instant messages. To me, that just says this is very low on his priority list—or there are other reasons for him not doing this that are not being disclosed.

[Djuzuh]

I'm pretty glad I got rejected from this GB.

Yes, you can sure say that again.  But also of note there are some other Group Buys that have failed.  Is this the future of Group Buys from now on, failure to deliver once payments have been made?

Maybe it's better off ONLY buying from registered sellers here on Geekhack instead of buying from privateers..... with next to no positive feedbacks.  Just something to think about before handing over any money to future Group Buys here on Geekhack.

Changdrew had several positive feedback (about 15? and a few sales too) and was a mod on GH.

But he didn't have any time nor internet access for some time.

[IPT]

so has the kid gotten over his embarrassment?
i mean im a pretty laid back guy, and i'll chalk it up to a learning experience, but i had no clue Changdrew was a kid.
Should have a rule that you can't organize and handle GB's if you're underage.

[Wildcard]

It's unfortunate, because these Taobao goods were ordered, packaged, and ready to ship. Changdrew did seem really nice in the forums, but this just fell through.

[CaiSter21]

so why the hell hasn't he sent out the stuff yet if its been packaged?
all you have to do is just take it down to the post office and send it out....

[Glissant]

I would guess it has turned into a money issue, but it's just a guess.

[WhiteFireDragon]

[7:22:37 PM] Kelly: Are you planning on shipping out soon?
[7:22:48 PM] Andrew : yeah i should have free time on tuesday

So it's way past Tuesday. They're not shipped out yet. Geez what a surprise...

[pyro_dragun]

I would guess it has turned into a money issue, but it's just a guess.

Except for we paid for shipping with our order :-/

[Glissant]

It's just speculation, but I'm guessing he might have spent the money he should have used on shipping on something else. That's the only logical reason for not being able to ship it now that he has been home for a while.
But like I said. These are only speculations.

[bisl]

Supposedly everything went off the rails as a result of a family emergency of some kind, right? Desperate times call for desperate measures as they say. Maybe you're right.

[IPT]

It's just speculation, but I'm guessing he might have spent the money he should have used on shipping on something else. That's the only logical reason for not being able to ship it now that he has been home for a while.
But like I said. These are only speculations.

as much as you'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, the simple fact that he hasn't shown his face publicly on this forum means he's still an immature kid who can't take responsibilities
I doubt he actually even has these Taobao keys in possession.

[pyro_dragun]

It's just speculation, but I'm guessing he might have spent the money he should have used on shipping on something else. That's the only logical reason for not being able to ship it now that he has been home for a while.
But like I said. These are only speculations.

as much as you'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, the simple fact that he hasn't shown his face publicly on this forum means he's still an immature kid who can't take responsibilities
I doubt he actually even has these Taobao keys in possession.

I did see some pictures of the keys a while back, so I think he has them.

[IPT]

It's just speculation, but I'm guessing he might have spent the money he should have used on shipping on something else. That's the only logical reason for not being able to ship it now that he has been home for a while.
But like I said. These are only speculations.

as much as you'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, the simple fact that he hasn't shown his face publicly on this forum means he's still an immature kid who can't take responsibilities
I doubt he actually even has these Taobao keys in possession.

I did see some pictures of the keys a while back, so I think he has them.

considering he hasn't actually come on the forums to speak, i will still believe he doesn't have them
granted im only out like $24.00, so i'll say its a lesson learned
but the immaturity he's displayed thus far is ridiculous.

i even went back through the PM, he was even asking for tips lol...

[rayuki]

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

[IPT]

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

to be fair, my time is more valuable than pursuing this through legal ground.
Similar to my parking ticket, the meter maid wrote me a citation stating i did not have meter receipt displaying in my car when I was parked in Municipal Lot #1, thing is, i was parked in Municipal Lot #4, and had my parking permit displayed
tried appealing by mail, was rejected.
Is it worth taking a day off of work to fight a $35.00 parking ticket?  not to me.

[Tennobanzai]

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

Well if we do want to take action we should before the statue of limitation comes into play. Which I don't know when it does

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

to be fair, my time is more valuable than pursuing this through legal ground.
Similar to my parking ticket, the meter maid wrote me a citation stating i did not have meter receipt displaying in my car when I was parked in Municipal Lot #1, thing is, i was parked in Municipal Lot #4, and had my parking permit displayed
tried appealing by mail, was rejected.
Is it worth taking a day off of work to fight a $35.00 parking ticket?  not to me.

This isn't $35. I'm willing to bet it was in the range of $500-1000. I'm guessing it's no little infraction. It would probably be a misdemeanor or possibly a felony

[rayuki]

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

to be fair, my time is more valuable than pursuing this through legal ground.
Similar to my parking ticket, the meter maid wrote me a citation stating i did not have meter receipt displaying in my car when I was parked in Municipal Lot #1, thing is, i was parked in Municipal Lot #4, and had my parking permit displayed
tried appealing by mail, was rejected.
Is it worth taking a day off of work to fight a $35.00 parking ticket?  not to me.

of course not but as Tennobanzai it isn't a small amount in total, to every individual it probably is a small amount and thats why these sort of scams usually work because the scammer relies on people not caring about the small amount, but they get a huge amount from everyone in total.

also you would think it is the principle of the thing to not let people get away with this.

[IPT]

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

Well if we do want to take action we should before the statue of limitation comes into play. Which I don't know when it does

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

to be fair, my time is more valuable than pursuing this through legal ground.
Similar to my parking ticket, the meter maid wrote me a citation stating i did not have meter receipt displaying in my car when I was parked in Municipal Lot #1, thing is, i was parked in Municipal Lot #4, and had my parking permit displayed
tried appealing by mail, was rejected.
Is it worth taking a day off of work to fight a $35.00 parking ticket?  not to me.

This isn't $35. I'm willing to bet it was in the range of $500-1000. I'm guessing it's no little infraction. It would probably be a misdemeanor or possibly a felony

so is it just me but why has this gone on so long without you guys taking this to the authorities if he has scammed you of all this money and hasn't delivered its fraud.

putting it under the header of a "groupbuy" doesn't make it any less fraud if he has failed to deliver the goods when they have been paid for.

to be fair, my time is more valuable than pursuing this through legal ground.
Similar to my parking ticket, the meter maid wrote me a citation stating i did not have meter receipt displaying in my car when I was parked in Municipal Lot #1, thing is, i was parked in Municipal Lot #4, and had my parking permit displayed
tried appealing by mail, was rejected.
Is it worth taking a day off of work to fight a $35.00 parking ticket?  not to me.

of course not but as Tennobanzai it isn't a small amount in total, to every individual it probably is a small amount and thats why these sort of scams usually work because the scammer relies on people not caring about the small amount, but they get a huge amount from everyone in total.

also you would think it is the principle of the thing to not let people get away with this.

Yes the total amount is 500-1000, but what are we all going to do?  Go to small claims court filing in CA?
Im gonna fly to CA, file in small claim's court and pay what, $50 for my court filing?
To claim $24? 

And its not like there's any group action that can be done about it, maybe if someone has thrown in like $500 themselves, they'll find it worth while to do this

Me?  Plane ticket + time = i'll just chalk it up as a douchebag on the internet.

[reaper]

Hey, there are more than a few of us here who live in the Bay Area.  If Andrew doesn't start refunding soon, we're gonna send people to go knock on his freaking doors (we have his address you know).  I need my $40 back. lol

[sth]

bay area? thought you were in LA bruh

[reaper]

bay area? thought you were in LA bruh

I'm in LA but we have "friends" everywhere.     Plus a trip from LA to the Bay Area isn't that far if that's what it'll take. 

[sth]

Well let us know if you come up here to break some kneecaps, we can plan the bay area meetup around the revenge trip

[hashbaz]

Changdrew said his Paypal is impaired in some way.  That could be a lie, obviously, but if it isn't it means he probably doesn't have access to the shipping money.

The fact that he's too ashamed to post here doesn't indicate that he doesn't have the goods.

Declarations of "should" and "if X then Y" are useless.  Kelly, can you find out in detail what is going on?  What exactly is wrong with his Paypal and what needs to be done to resolve it?  Get him to take a picture of the boxes?

[Kellybear]

Kelly, can you find out in detail what is going on?  What exactly is wrong with his Paypal and what needs to be done to resolve it?  Get him to take a picture of the boxes?

I will do the best I can but I'm trying to get him to come back and post about it himself too. I'll post anything I find out in this thread or the imsto one where he should be refunding people.

[Tennobanzai]

Yes the total amount is 500-1000, but what are we all going to do?  Go to small claims court filing in CA?
Im gonna fly to CA, file in small claim's court and pay what, $50 for my court filing?
To claim $24? 

And its not like there's any group action that can be done about it, maybe if someone has thrown in like $500 themselves, they'll find it worth while to do this

Me?  Plane ticket + time = i'll just chalk it up as a douchebag on the internet.

I was talking about criminal court, not civil court.

[WhiteFireDragon]

I just went back to both dyesub GB and this taobao GB to look at any inconsistencies in stories, and I realized everything is probably made up excuses.


1) All taobao stuff were packaged BEFORE this so called family emergency. They should have been shipped before the family emergency.

2) Shipping costs for taobao items shouldn't have been a problem. Shipping was already paid for BEFORE he supposedly ordered them

3) Lack of communication because of no internet while he was in China is an excuse. He was on the forum and posting during this "no internet" time.

4) Not shipping these packages because he's too busy is the lamest excuse. A few days is understandable, even a few weeks. But a couple months? He's still a kid, how busy can he really be? And it's summer, there's no school.

5) Several times, he gave a day where he had time to ship. Nope, never happened. More beating around the bush.

6) "family emergency" was only heard from kellybear, not Andrew himself. So apparently the 2nd time he went to China during this whole fiasco was for philanthropy, then all of a sudden it became a family emergency. Although this is possible, it's not believable to me. There's no family emergency, just another sob excuse for an emotional appeal.

7) He was so enthusiastic about receiving everyone's money, but never used it to even make the order for dysubs in the other GB. imsto confirmed it. Disappeared after almost everyone paid.

8 ) Paypal problems prevent him from refunding everyone? Then how is he able to refund some people and not everyone. More like he irresponsibly spent all the money and refunding some people back slowly as he gets more funds.


He still logs in this forum weekly. In fact, he was just on YESTERDAY (check his profile yourself), but still hides behind the computer and don't bother posting anything. If I'm dead wrong on any of these, then he can come in here to defend himself.

[demik]

8 ) Paypal problems prevent him from refunding everyone? Then how is he able to refund some people and not everyone. More like he irresponsibly spent all the money and refunding some people back slowly as he gets more funds.

after mass refunding, paypal will lock your account to see what's up.

happened to sherry. happened to RCT. But, it has been awhile now. And both sherry and RCT eventually were let to continue refunding.

[reaper]

Just got my refund.  Thanks Andrew! 

[telepete]

I asked for a refund on this but was told the goods were purchased. This is a load. It has to be. Can you take a little kid to court? They have no legal personality so I wouldn't know how to go about it. I got refunded for the other one but you still owe me $40 junior.

[hashbaz]

I just went back to both dyesub GB and this taobao GB to look at any inconsistencies in stories, and I realized everything is probably made up excuses.


1) All taobao stuff were packaged BEFORE this so called family emergency. They should have been shipped before the family emergency.

2) Shipping costs for taobao items shouldn't have been a problem. Shipping was already paid for BEFORE he supposedly ordered them

3) Lack of communication because of no internet while he was in China is an excuse. He was on the forum and posting during this "no internet" time.

4) Not shipping these packages because he's too busy is the lamest excuse. A few days is understandable, even a few weeks. But a couple months? He's still a kid, how busy can he really be? And it's summer, there's no school.

5) Several times, he gave a day where he had time to ship. Nope, never happened. More beating around the bush.

6) "family emergency" was only heard from kellybear, not Andrew himself. So apparently the 2nd time he went to China during this whole fiasco was for philanthropy, then all of a sudden it became a family emergency. Although this is possible, it's not believable to me. There's no family emergency, just another sob excuse for an emotional appeal.

7) He was so enthusiastic about receiving everyone's money, but never used it to even make the order for dysubs in the other GB. imsto confirmed it. Disappeared after almost everyone paid.

8 ) Paypal problems prevent him from refunding everyone? Then how is he able to refund some people and not everyone. More like he irresponsibly spent all the money and refunding some people back slowly as he gets more funds.


He still logs in this forum weekly. In fact, he was just on YESTERDAY (check his profile yourself), but still hides behind the computer and don't bother posting anything. If I'm dead wrong on any of these, then he can come in here to defend himself.

This is the kind of declaration I was referring to as pointless a few posts back.  What we need to do is work the problem, which at the moment is communication.

Changdrew, please talk to us or all this will continue to fester.  If you spent the money, please fess up.  If you have the goods, post some pictures.  Feel free to PM me or another mod or Kelly if you'd like.

[damorgue]

I guess a lot of you want to sell your key caps, or rather upcoming rights to potential key caps. I wonder if one could buy a couple of them cheap now from people who believe that they will never arrive.

[WhiteFireDragon]

Just got my refund.  Thanks Andrew! 

I asked for a refund on this but was told the goods were purchased. This is a load. It has to be. Can you take a little kid to court? They have no legal personality so I wouldn't know how to go about it. I got refunded for the other one but you still owe me $40 junior.

More BS right here. Reaper got his refund, but telepete was rejected because the stuff has supposedly already been ordered. If reaper got his refund, then indeed the stuff did NOT get ordered, just like the dyesubs in the other GB.

This is the kind of declaration I was referring to as pointless a few posts back.  What we need to do is work the problem, which at the moment is communication.

Changdrew, please talk to us or all this will continue to fester.  If you spent the money, please fess up.  If you have the goods, post some pictures.  Feel free to PM me or another mod or Kelly if you'd like.

How is it pointless? It calls him out on all the crap he's been lying about. If he's not going to communicate, then what? It's pretty obvious he doesn't want to; he still visits the forum and purposely does not respond to anything. Giving him the benefit of the doubt on a few things is fine, but when there are this many excuses/lies and hiding, why still give him any benefit of the doubt?

[hashbaz]

I'm not giving him the benefit of the doubt.  He screwed up, and is not doing enough to fix it (though refunds and information *are* slowly trickling in).  Anger is understandable, but I'm tired of irate speeches about responsibility that draw conclusions from too little information.  They are pointless.

[Kellybear]

Latest thing he's said to me:

[下午 06:22:35] Andrew Chang: The problem with paypal atm
[下午 06:22:46] Andrew Chang: is that they wont let me send money without a tax number
[下午 06:22:50] Andrew Chang: which i do not own
[下午 06:22:53] Andrew Chang: realisitically
[下午 06:23:01] Andrew Chang: I should be able to send the money out
[下午 06:23:06] Andrew Chang: but paypal is being dumb
[下午 06:23:47] Andrew Chang: oh
[下午 06:23:49] Andrew Chang: paypal let me
[下午 06:23:54] Andrew Chang: i should be able to do it
[下午 06:23:55] Andrew Chang: i hope
[下午 07:00:42] Andrew Chang: Yep
[下午 07:00:49] Andrew Chang: I should be able to refund all payments
[下午 07:00:53] Andrew Chang: by end of evening
[下午 07:00:57] Andrew Chang: and packages are going out tomorrow

I'll check with him again tomorrow night to see if he has actually shipped the stuff or not.

[IPT]

bay area? thought you were in LA bruh

I'm in LA but we have "friends" everywhere.     Plus a trip from LA to the Bay Area isn't that far if that's what it'll take. 

proxy kneecaps for me here in NY lol

[Quarzac]

Latest thing he's said to me:

[下午 06:22:35] Andrew Chang: The problem with paypal atm
[下午 06:22:46] Andrew Chang: is that they wont let me send money without a tax number
[下午 06:22:50] Andrew Chang: which i do not own
[下午 06:22:53] Andrew Chang: realisitically
[下午 06:23:01] Andrew Chang: I should be able to send the money out
[下午 06:23:06] Andrew Chang: but paypal is being dumb
[下午 06:23:47] Andrew Chang: oh
[下午 06:23:49] Andrew Chang: paypal let me
[下午 06:23:54] Andrew Chang: i should be able to do it
[下午 06:23:55] Andrew Chang: i hope
[下午 07:00:42] Andrew Chang: Yep
[下午 07:00:49] Andrew Chang: I should be able to refund all payments
[下午 07:00:53] Andrew Chang: by end of evening
[下午 07:00:57] Andrew Chang: and packages are going out tomorrow

I'll check with him again tomorrow night to see if he has actually shipped the stuff or not.

As another person who does not have a tax number, I know that most things that require you have a tax number allow you to use your SSN instead. Tell him to call him. And tell him I'm not happy with him giving the younger folk of this forum a bad name.

[IPT]

Latest thing he's said to me:

[下午 06:22:35] Andrew Chang: The problem with paypal atm
[下午 06:22:46] Andrew Chang: is that they wont let me send money without a tax number
[下午 06:22:50] Andrew Chang: which i do not own
[下午 06:22:53] Andrew Chang: realisitically
[下午 06:23:01] Andrew Chang: I should be able to send the money out
[下午 06:23:06] Andrew Chang: but paypal is being dumb
[下午 06:23:47] Andrew Chang: oh
[下午 06:23:49] Andrew Chang: paypal let me
[下午 06:23:54] Andrew Chang: i should be able to do it
[下午 06:23:55] Andrew Chang: i hope
[下午 07:00:42] Andrew Chang: Yep
[下午 07:00:49] Andrew Chang: I should be able to refund all payments
[下午 07:00:53] Andrew Chang: by end of evening
[下午 07:00:57] Andrew Chang: and packages are going out tomorrow

I'll check with him again tomorrow night to see if he has actually shipped the stuff or not.

As another person who does not have a tax number, I know that most things that require you have a tax number allow you to use your SSN instead. Tell him to call him. And tell him I'm not happy with him giving the younger folk of this forum a bad name.

i posted in the imsto thread i think how easy it is to get an EIN number for free (IRS just issues them)

[elton5354]

How old are you to NOT have a tax number?