New Controller for KishSaver and Other Model F

[CPTBadAss]

By the way, anyone know if unicomp is able to produce the spring and pivot plate assembly or if it could be produced at a reasonable cost so we don't have to salvage some old model F?

You can buy the spring/flipplies on Unicomp. Not 100% sure if they're making them or they're NOS.

[The_Beast]

By the way, anyone know if unicomp is able to produce the spring and pivot plate assembly or if it could be produced at a reasonable cost so we don't have to salvage some old model F?

You can buy the spring/flipplies on Unicomp. Not 100% sure if they're making them or they're NOS.

Unicomp sells model M springs/flipper. Model F's use a different/longer flipper that might be a different material for the capacitance

[JPG]

By the way, anyone know if unicomp is able to produce the spring and pivot plate assembly or if it could be produced at a reasonable cost so we don't have to salvage some old model F?

You can buy the spring/flipplies on Unicomp. Not 100% sure if they're making them or they're NOS.

Unicomp sells model M springs/flipper. Model F's use a different/longer flipper that might be a different material for the capacitance

I just opened a thicket with them asking if they are still able to produce/provide them and if they are able to share some specs from these 2 pieces!

[E TwentyNine]

I just opened a thicket with them asking if they are still able to produce/provide them and if they are able to share some specs from these 2 pieces!

I asked them the same question a month or so ago.  Answer was a resounding no.

Which would make sense considering how Unicomp came to be,  the never dealt with F's.

[E TwentyNine]

Unicomp sells model M springs/flipper. Model F's use a different/longer flipper that might be a different material for the capacitance

It is a different material.

[JPG]

Unicomp sells model M springs/flipper. Model F's use a different/longer flipper that might be a different material for the capacitance

It is a different material.

Well, thx for the answers!

[wcass]

It might be worth asking Signature Plastics if they can reproduce them. And while at it, ask about model F barrels.

[The_Beast]

Unicomp sells model M springs/flipper. Model F's use a different/longer flipper that might be a different material for the capacitance

It is a different material.

I thought so, and it makes sense but I wasn't 100% sure

[dorkvader]

It might be worth asking Signature Plastics if they can reproduce them. And while at it, ask about model F barrels.

I think they say they they do custom (not keycap) stuff as long as it's small, but Pricing would be high.

We may want to shop around for a plastics place that will be cheaper / easier to deal with.

[wcass]

It looks like the DPH controller ready for public beta. Auto-calibration is working so no scope is needed. The first thing you will probably want to do is to order PCB and parts.

The files needed to make the PCB are here
https://gitorious.org/ibm-capsense-pcb

The above has a BOM, but here is another that is all sourced out
https://www.mouser.com/ProjectManager/ProjectDetail.aspx?AccessID=2e26f4ea5b

Teensy++ 2.0 (no pins)
http://www.pjrc.com/store/teensypp.html

After you have built your controller, or at lease after you get your Teensy, you will need to build the firmware and program the Teensy. The code and instructions are here
https://gitorious.org/kiibohd-controller/capsense-beta

You should be able to get everything for about $50. If you want/need one of these but all this looks like too much for you, remember that there are folks in this community that contract out their skills.

[The_Beast]

It looks like the DPH controller ready for public beta. Auto-calibration is working so no scope is needed. The first thing you will probably want to do is to order PCB and parts.

The files needed to make the PCB are here
https://gitorious.org/ibm-capsense-pcb

The above has a BOM, but here is another that is all sourced out
https://www.mouser.com/ProjectManager/ProjectDetail.aspx?AccessID=2e26f4ea5b

Teensy++ 2.0 (no pins)
http://www.pjrc.com/store/teensypp.html

After you have built your controller, or at lease after you get your Teensy, you will need to build the firmware and program the Teensy. The code and instructions are here
https://gitorious.org/kiibohd-controller/capsense-beta

You should be able to get everything for about $50. If you want/need one of these but all this looks like too much for you, remember that there are folks in this community that contract out their skills.

Very cool! Anyone down for running a GB to maybe get things cheaper/all in one package?

[Wildcard]

Also how many flippers/springs do we think we'll need (perhaps we do a poll).

[The_Beast]

Also how many flippers/springs do we think we'll need (perhaps we do a poll).

I don't know where you'd get model F springs/flippers. Unicomp makes model M ones, but you can't use those on an F due to the smaller size and the plastic/material used

Maybe a GB of a model C (I think that's the model) or an XT to get some flippers/springs

[riotonthebay]

Thanks so much to everyone involved in this!

Could someone please describe what steps I need to take to order a PCB, including a recommended manufacturer? Please explain like I'm 5.

[HPE1000]

Also how many flippers/springs do we think we'll need (perhaps we do a poll).

Why do we need any in the first place?

Thanks so much to everyone involved in this!

Could someone please describe what steps I need to take to order a PCB, including a recommended manufacturer? Please explain like I'm 5.

This ^

[vivalarevolución]

It looks like the DPH controller ready for public beta. Auto-calibration is working so no scope is needed. The first thing you will probably want to do is to order PCB and parts.

The files needed to make the PCB are here
https://gitorious.org/ibm-capsense-pcb

The above has a BOM, but here is another that is all sourced out
https://www.mouser.com/ProjectManager/ProjectDetail.aspx?AccessID=2e26f4ea5b

Teensy++ 2.0 (no pins)
http://www.pjrc.com/store/teensypp.html

After you have built your controller, or at lease after you get your Teensy, you will need to build the firmware and program the Teensy. The code and instructions are here
https://gitorious.org/kiibohd-controller/capsense-beta

You should be able to get everything for about $50. If you want/need one of these but all this looks like too much for you, remember that there are folks in this community that contract out their skills.

Very cool! Anyone down for running a GB to maybe get things cheaper/all in one package?

I would do a group buy, although I do not need a PCB.

[CPTBadAss]

Also how many flippers/springs do we think we'll need (perhaps we do a poll).

Why do we need any in the first place?

Thanks so much to everyone involved in this!

Could someone please describe what steps I need to take to order a PCB, including a recommended manufacturer? Please explain like I'm 5.

This ^

I'm also confused by these two things. How do we turn the Gerbers into a PCB? I'd be willing to help run or run a GB but I need to know how to get the PCBs made first. Second, why do we need more flippers/springs? When converting mine to ANSI, I removed flippers/springs. What layouts need more?

[Parak]

I just pushed a small pcb change to nudge the resistor array into a place that less interferes with the kishsaver ribbon - so heads up for anyone that already got the project.

Couple of ways of going about ordering these:

For small volume orders, you can go with something like oshpark - I made a project here. That gets you three nice quality boards with free shipping.

Alternatively, a group buy can be made via china (with quick turnaround), but is only worth it for a large number of PCBs, 20+ or so. If someone wants to organize that, I can help with the pcb fab contacts and such (I've dealt with them often).

[Wildcard]

Also how many flippers/springs do we think we'll need (perhaps we do a poll).

I don't know where you'd get model F springs/flippers. Unicomp makes model M ones, but you can't use those on an F due to the smaller size and the plastic/material used

Maybe a GB of a model C (I think that's the model) or an XT to get some flippers/springs

I have plenty of Model F parts, just not a lot of time. But I would be willing to send my stuff to someone if they wanted to distribute it. We can also still get XT's off ebay for under $50, so it wouldn't take much to take these apart to distribute the springs and flippers to get the Kishsavers working again.

Edit: if the volume is low, I might also be willing to ship these out on a weekend.

...Second, why do we need more flippers/springs? When converting mine to ANSI, I removed flippers/springs. What layouts need more?

I'm assuming for people who have damaged springs and/or flippers and need replacements. I would think we'd want to get them working with the new controller first though.

[Parak]

I'm assuming for people who have damaged springs and/or flippers and need replacements. I would think we'd want to get them working with the new controller first though.

Well, springs can be had from unicomp unlike flippies. I don't think flippies would be a problem for anyone though unless they want to use every single possible barrel, in which case one or two might be needed (don't recall exactly).

[The_Beast]

Also how many flippers/springs do we think we'll need (perhaps we do a poll).

Why do we need any in the first place?

Thanks so much to everyone involved in this!

Could someone please describe what steps I need to take to order a PCB, including a recommended manufacturer? Please explain like I'm 5.

This ^

I'm also confused by these two things. How do we turn the Gerbers into a PCB? I'd be willing to help run or run a GB but I need to know how to get the PCBs made first. Second, why do we need more flippers/springs? When converting mine to ANSI, I removed flippers/springs. What layouts need more?

Well, if you wanted a split backspace, or a short right shift you'd need an extra 2 flippers/springs.

But for the most part, just making the enter longer (standard ANSI) and the left shift longer, you'd gain 2 springs (if I remember the OG tinsaver layout)

[JPG]

I really need to prepare my wallet for the time when someone will say: GB for new model F layout = SSK or SpaceUnsaver, stainless steel (or hard anodized alu) case and plate, etc.


My poor wallet ...


My tears of joy!


My poor wallet ... 

[wcass]

I think that we can probably help everyone here with as much help as needed based on your willingness to learn/pay.

Gerber file are packed inside the tar file that you can download from that first link. Tar files are just like zip files; most apps that open zip open tar too. You can send these files to a PCB fab. OshPark is a PCB fab in the US that specializes in small batch jobs - $5 per square inch for 3 copies of your board (includes delivery). That would make these boards about $13 each if you have 2 buddies to order with you. This part will probably take the longest to get to you.

The second link is to order the discrete components that will populate the board. if you will be making 3 (one for yourself and two for friends or to sell in classifieds) look for the "'Order Project' X 1" box and change that 1 to a 3. You might want to add a few extra in case of mistakes (these are cheap). You can get these same components from other sources too, of course (I like Digikey).

The third link is for ordering Teensy++ (no pins). I think that many of us might already have one.

The forth link is for the firmware (also in a tar file). You will need this to designates what key is mapped where. Compiling the source requires some skilz, but I'm sure that some folks here would be only too happy to share their layout - a small hex file (feel free to post those here). You use the standard PJRC tools to get the firmware onto the Teensy.

If you feel like a 5 year old, just wait and watch. No one orders one PCB and the components are so cheap it makes sense to order in batches. But you probably will need to solder the ribbon cable your self.

[wcass]

There might be a reason to do a Unicomp GB for buttons (Unicomp speak for caps) and inserts (for ANSI Enter and left shift).

[vivalarevolución]

So has anyone been successful in constructing and programming this controller based on the most recent information from wcass?

[Parak]

I think HaaTa and I are the only ones at this point, but it does work well with the default keymap.

[jdcarpe]

I'll have one made soon. I have all the parts, it's just finding the time to build it!

[vivalarevolución]

Thanks guys.  Hopefully, I will get the time and motivation to get the parts and take a stab at it soon.  If I am successful, I might do it for hire for the others that want one.

In the meantime, I have a pile of bolt mods that I am trying to work through.

[Parak]

I'll have one made soon. I have all the parts, it's just finding the time to build it!

Where'd you get the pcb from, oshpark?

[jdcarpe]

I'll have one made soon. I have all the parts, it's just finding the time to build it!

Where'd you get the pcb from, oshpark?

Yes, I had three made at oshpark. I need two of them, anyway, for a Kishsaver and an F-122 that likely has a broken controller. And one extra in case I mess something up.

[Parak]

I'll have one made soon. I have all the parts, it's just finding the time to build it!

Where'd you get the pcb from, oshpark?

Yes, I had three made at oshpark. I need two of them, anyway, for a Kishsaver and an F-122 that likely has a broken controller. And one extra in case I mess something up.

Nice! The trickiest part is usually mounting the teensy - note how HaaTa has it mounted. You'll want it to be as low to the pcb as possible, while still allowing the usb cable sheath to fit.

Well, desoldering and resoldering the ribbon cable is tricky too, and will likely be the main cause of frustration

[wcass]

I am not very good  and not very fast at soldering, but it is coming along nicely.


I had so much trouble trying to de-solder the existing controller from my ribbon cable that i ended up just cutting it off. I'm going to try to strip the cable back just enough to tin and attach to the new controller. If that doesn't work, I found 8 conductor .156" ribbon cable here:
http://www.electronicsurplus.com/Item/152405/Waldom_Molex%20-%20Cable_%20ribbon_%2022-8C_%20-%2082225808/
I would need to run 4 cables instead of 2 (maybe a good thing), but this would be a lot tidier than 30 discrete wires. The minimum order is 10', but that would only cost $3.50. If i don't do it and someone else does - please share the love and pass that stuff around.

[hwood34]

really looking forward to this
edit: who wants to make one for me

[wcass]

Building it was really not bad. The toughest part was getting the ribbon cable off of the old controller. After spending about a half hour on that and getting nowhere, i gave up and just cut it as close to the controller as i could. It worked out just fine. More on that in a minute.

Take what I advise here with a grain of salt. I am not an expert with a soldering iron - in fact, i suck.

My assembly order was from shortest component to tallest. I started with the diodes, then standard resistors, the chips, switch, resistor array, then capacitors. The diodes, chips, resistor array, and that one odd capacitor have to go in one specific direction; don't put these in backwards or it will not work. This is where i stopped to take the picture in my last post.

Parak used diode leg trimmings to mount his Teensy; I chose to use standard header pins. I only had 32 instead of the 43 that there are holes for, but this turned out OK - the controller only uses 31 pins. I soldered the pins onto the Teensy first and then checked the fit on the PCB. It looked really tight, so i mounted the controller in the keyboard to get a better idea. The Teensy comes very close to the barrel plate, but does not touch.  But the opening for the USB cable was too small for my cable to fit inside. It turns out that this is a known issue - some mini USB connectors have larger heads than others. The smallest ones will fit with no problem; average size and larger need to have the the casing trimmed off. I kept the controller mounted and with USB cable connected while I soldered the Teensy onto the controller PCB so that i was sure that they would fit properly.

The final step was to connect the ribbon cable. I cut the old controller off, so i now had to strip some insulation from the cable. I used a razor knife to cut a line about 5mm back, flip the cable to the other side and cut on top of the first cut; use tweezers to grab a spot of insulation between the wires and pull. I tinned the wires to prevent the strands from splitting as i fed all 30 through the holes on the controller PCB (the second toughest part of building this).

And pictures.

[HPE1000]

Nice, is it all up and running?

I might order one of these in the next month or so, I also plan on getting my case powder coated soon and ordering new keycaps. This thing has been sitting in my closet in a million pieces for I don't know how long.

[wcass]

I'm typing this using it.

Building the firmware in Windows is complicated. You Linux/Unix guys will have no problems.

In Windows, ... start by downloading software.
You will need Cygwin , CMake , PJRC VSP driver , putty , and Atmel AVR Toolchain
If you don't already have a Windows text editor that speaks Unix properly (Notepad and Wordpad do not; Notepad++ does), you will need to download one or use an editor under Cygwin.

Install PJRC Virtual Serial Port driver.
Install Putty. You don't need this for building the firmware, but for customizing it later.
Install Notepad++ (if required).
Install CMake (suggest you install to the default folder).
Install Cygwin. Avoid installing to any folder with a space such as C:\Program Files
Make sure that the following components are installed:

• make
• git (needed for some compilation info)
• cmake
• gcc-core
• gcc-g++
• libusb1.0
• libusb1.0-devel

Run Cygwin Terminal once to create a user profile. Exit Cygwin.
Run Atmel 8bit AVR Toolchain - this will extract files to a folder. Enter that folder, select all files and folders and Cut.
Navigate to the folder that you installed Cygwin to. Paste the files and folders. You will be merging some folders - that is OK.
Navigate to the home sub folder inside your Cygwin folder; here you will find your user profile. Enter that folder.
Open .bashrc with your Unix compatible text editor.
Add the following line to the end ...
alias wincmake="PATH='/cygdrive/c/Program Files/CMake 2.8'/bin:\"${PATH}\" cmake"
The above line presumes that you are running a 32bit version of Windows and you installed CMake to the default directory. If you have a 64bit version of Windows, your line should look something like ...
alias wincmake="PATH='/cygdrive/c/Program Files (x86)/CMake 2.8'/bin:\"${PATH}\" cmake"
If you did not install CMake to the default directory, you will need to change this line appropriately.
At this point, your Windows box should have everything it needs to build and make the firmware.

Run Cygwin Terminal and type the following commands:
  git clone https://git.gitorious.org/kiibohd-controller/capsense-beta.git
  cd capsense-beta
  mkdir build
  cd build
  wincmake -G "Unix Makefiles" ..
  make

If you followed these instructions and i didn't leave anything out, you will now have a 44kb file named kiibohd.hex
You will need to plug in your Teensy and press the button to get it ready to program. You can load that hex file on your Teensy with the PJRC tool Teensy.exe or load it directly from Cygwin with the command:
  ./load
Windows will start alerting you that new devices have been found, then you can start typing on your new keyboard.

[HaaTa]

Also, a big hint when disassembling for the first time.

Clean the PCB.

Trust me, it'll make your life way easier and everything should just work. You don't have to use any special cleaner, just get all the dirt off.

[CPTBadAss]

Quoting a post I made in the 6019284 Club thread:

OK kids. I got a hold of the powdercoater who did the Panavises to look at powdercoating the 6019284s. Does anyone want to powdercoat their board? What color? I'm thinking industrial grey or charcoal grey. And of course purple. But if we're going to GB it, I'll have to compromise.