Author Topic: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions  (Read 1330653 times)

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Offline zslane

  • Posts: 2305
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6300 on: Wed, 01 May 2024, 11:02:59 »
How often do we see keycap sets offered today with the kind of layout flexibility that the old 7-bit group buys used to offer? In settling on the Model M color scheme as the basis for keycap sets, we've sacrificed flexibility in favor of reduced cost (and production time). Maybe that's a reasonable trade-off for most folks, but I'm sure glad I got all my Round 6 CADET and HONEY keycaps when I did.

Offline _rubik

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6301 on: Wed, 01 May 2024, 12:48:53 »
How often do we see keycap sets offered today with the kind of layout flexibility that the old 7-bit group buys used to offer? In settling on the Model M color scheme as the basis for keycap sets, we've sacrificed flexibility in favor of reduced cost (and production time). Maybe that's a reasonable trade-off for most folks, but I'm sure glad I got all my Round 6 CADET and HONEY keycaps when I did.

I feels like we make assumptions based on what's trendy, not what people actually use/need. It's one thing if the IC decides to remove an under-loved kit, but it's another if they don't offer the kit to begin with.

IMO every set should have full TKL coverage with mandatory 40s, fullsize, and ISO kits with no MoQ threshold. It's frustrating to shop for new sets and have to rule out most options just because your keyboard is smaller than 60% or larger than 75%
ai03 Meridian ¤ Mech 27 ¤ E8.5 ¤ Brutal60 ¤ SSK White Label ¤ HHKB Pro JP ¤ vAEK68 Alps Blues ¤ RF87u

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6302 on: Wed, 01 May 2024, 13:04:49 »
I think the lack of better kitting comes from both people not knowing how to do it properly, but also demand/price of extras kits which I think is the most important thing.

A lot of the more niche things like extended 40s support and nordeuk just don't have the demand to reach separate moqs especially at what gmk wants for extra kits. So a lot of that stuff is either scrapped or very limited like modern 40s support (which is now 3 key I guess, that's what I've been seeing a lot when it comes to kitting)

It's a shame but what can you do.
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
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Offline wjrii

  • Posts: 79
  • Location: Texas
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6303 on: Wed, 01 May 2024, 16:53:31 »
Is there any sort of "standard" for kitting?  Even if unevenly followed and/or varying between makers?  I find I'm interested in projects that drift away from standard kitting, but there are only so many things you can do within the limitations of what will be on an ANSI 60%, which seems to be the only thing you can safely assume. 

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6304 on: Wed, 01 May 2024, 17:32:58 »
Is there any sort of "standard" for kitting?  Even if unevenly followed and/or varying between makers?  I find I'm interested in projects that drift away from standard kitting, but there are only so many things you can do within the limitations of what will be on an ANSI 60%, which seems to be the only thing you can safely assume.

There is no base standard when it comes to kitting, but the one I posted below is generally what the average kitting will look like (except for 1.5 function, that isn't common in base at least)



It really depends on the person, but generally a good set will accommodate all of this at the bare minimum (there are some exceptions, I have seen people remove 6.25u bottom row for smaller runs with sp for example)

For extension kits, you generally see stuff like mx hhkb support, r3 and r4 pg dn and up, shinethrough caps that sorta thing. But again that varies among designer, If I ever run a keyset mx hhkb support will probably be in base.
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
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Offline wjrii

  • Posts: 79
  • Location: Texas
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6305 on: Thu, 02 May 2024, 07:54:01 »

There is no base standard when it comes to kitting, but the one I posted below is generally what the average kitting will look like (except for 1.5 function, that isn't common in base at least)

It really depends on the person, but generally a good set will accommodate all of this at the bare minimum (there are some exceptions, I have seen people remove 6.25u bottom row for smaller runs with sp for example)

For extension kits, you generally see stuff like mx hhkb support, r3 and r4 pg dn and up, shinethrough caps that sorta thing. But again that varies among designer, If I ever run a keyset mx hhkb support will probably be in base.

Thanks.  My issue is always finding wider keys from sculpted profiles outside their normal rows. Even as blanks, that's not easy, though it certainly looks like I might have some options with R3 1.75u and R2 1.5u.  I am noodling around with one more hand-wire project before I start exploring PCB design. I haven't quite figured out what it'll be, but accommodating sculpted keycaps is something I'd like to include.
« Last Edit: Thu, 02 May 2024, 07:56:39 by wjrii »

Offline GummyPink

  • Posts: 4
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6306 on: Fri, 03 May 2024, 05:56:40 »
They should make more 100% keyboards. I still haven't found one I liked.

Offline mathisart

  • Posts: 25
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6307 on: Fri, 10 May 2024, 09:10:31 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.

Online Rob27shred

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6308 on: Fri, 10 May 2024, 17:04:35 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.
Meh, I'd pass hard on that opinion. Don't get me wrong you are right from an ergonomic & speed perspective, but TBH ortho layouts just look so bland to me. Also QWERTY is way to ingrained in me to even want to change. Although I do not use my keyboards at work & do not need the best ergonomics or most efficient layout, so I can see why these are more sought after for people who have to type all day for work.

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6309 on: Sat, 11 May 2024, 08:01:36 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.
Meh, I'd pass hard on that opinion. Don't get me wrong you are right from an ergonomic & speed perspective, but TBH ortho layouts just look so bland to me. Also QWERTY is way to ingrained in me to even want to change. Although I do not use my keyboards at work & do not need the best ergonomics or most efficient layout, so I can see why these are more sought after for people who have to type all day for work.

Yeah it definitely seems better for typing, but I'm just used to qwerty and staggered as well.

One ortho board that looks sick is the lumberjack 60 project, It's very visually appealing especially with the through hole components separating the two halfs. Would be a fun project to do too, even if it wouldn't get too much use

https://kbd.news/Lumberjack-a-60-ortho-56.html
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


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Online Rob27shred

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6310 on: Sat, 11 May 2024, 16:00:35 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.
Meh, I'd pass hard on that opinion. Don't get me wrong you are right from an ergonomic & speed perspective, but TBH ortho layouts just look so bland to me. Also QWERTY is way to ingrained in me to even want to change. Although I do not use my keyboards at work & do not need the best ergonomics or most efficient layout, so I can see why these are more sought after for people who have to type all day for work.

Yeah it definitely seems better for typing, but I'm just used to qwerty and staggered as well.

One ortho board that looks sick is the lumberjack 60 project, It's very visually appealing especially with the through hole components separating the two halfs. Would be a fun project to do too, even if it wouldn't get too much use

https://kbd.news/Lumberjack-a-60-ortho-56.html

I do agree the Lumberjack does look pretty cool, but I think that's more thanks to the exposed diodes/controller. Those boards always look really cool to me.

Offline Prince Valiant

  • Posts: 52
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6311 on: Tue, 14 May 2024, 15:01:38 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.
Which layout would you champion?

Offline _rubik

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6312 on: Tue, 14 May 2024, 17:55:23 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.
Which layout would you champion?

Not OP, but I've been rocking the 6 column Corne for the last few months. I really can't see myself needing anything more / less outside of curiosity and boredom. Staggered columnar with or without a numrow is probably the best bet for most folks looking to try out non-traditional layouts.
ai03 Meridian ¤ Mech 27 ¤ E8.5 ¤ Brutal60 ¤ SSK White Label ¤ HHKB Pro JP ¤ vAEK68 Alps Blues ¤ RF87u

Offline Prince Valiant

  • Posts: 52
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6313 on: Wed, 15 May 2024, 08:12:27 »
Not OP, but I've been rocking the 6 column Corne for the last few months. I really can't see myself needing anything more / less outside of curiosity and boredom. Staggered columnar with or without a numrow is probably the best bet for most folks looking to try out non-traditional layouts.
I meant key layout (dvorak, colemak, etc.). I've thought about trying something else out but I'd either have to get used to potentially swapping back to QWERTY frequently or buy another programmable KB to drag around. With physical layouts I think it's best to go with with whatever feels most comfortable.
« Last Edit: Wed, 15 May 2024, 08:14:17 by Prince Valiant »

Offline mathisart

  • Posts: 25
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6314 on: Wed, 15 May 2024, 14:55:57 »
QWERTY should be discontinued.
Staggered should be discontinued.
All keyboards should be ortholinear. Or hexagonal. Or something.
Which layout would you champion?
I don't exactly champion it. I'd like a better one (which I guess exists). I'm using QGMLWB.

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6315 on: Wed, 15 May 2024, 19:27:57 »
I don't exactly champion it. I'd like a better one (which I guess exists). I'm using QGMLWB.

What's the benefit of putting L in the top row?. I feel like that would result in more hand movements because L is a pretty common letter used.
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
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Offline Prince Valiant

  • Posts: 52
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6316 on: Thu, 16 May 2024, 07:59:40 »
I don't exactly champion it. I'd like a better one (which I guess exists). I'm using QGMLWB.
What do you think of it? The biggest issue I have with QWERTY is some of the awkward combos.

Offline clay

  • Posts: 45
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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6317 on: Sat, 18 May 2024, 01:57:29 »
"Thock" in MX boards sound cheap. The low pitched acoustic sound can be achieved in cheaper plastic boards when you stuff it with foams and polyfill etc. If you have a high end keyboard, embrace the sound that it naturally makes instead of forcing it to thock. Or better still, if you want true thock, you go Topre.

Offline iri

  • Posts: 998
  • Location: England
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6318 on: Sat, 18 May 2024, 05:04:06 »
"Thock" in MX boards sound cheap. The low pitched acoustic sound can be achieved in cheaper plastic boards when you stuff it with foams and polyfill etc. If you have a high end keyboard, embrace the sound that it naturally makes instead of forcing it to thock. Or better still, if you want true thock, you go Topre.
UNpopular opinions
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

-Ray Bradbury

Offline clay

  • Posts: 45
  • No foams
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6319 on: Sat, 18 May 2024, 23:39:37 »
One of the most popular opinions ever

Offline Attackly

  • Posts: 3
  • Location: Germany
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6320 on: Sun, 19 May 2024, 03:12:53 »
1. I hate 100% keyboards. Look ugly. Too big.

2. Hhkb to expensive for what it is.

3. SA keyboards. First keycap set was SA might have given up on this hobby because of them

4. Plastic cases. Im personally not a fan but can see why people chose it as a budget option. Or people new to the hobby.

5. artisan keycaps. Metal keycap for escape key cool and often good. But to many are over the top. Including resin keyaps.



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Offline shingi

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6321 on: Sun, 19 May 2024, 10:38:03 »
I find the lack of Southpaw-layout keyboards to be blasphemous!
Zeep zorp.
I like it when the "Enter" key is big.
I also like it when the number pad is on the left side.
And I really like it when my Human hands type on my 'board.
It is my favorite activity.

Online Rob27shred

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6322 on: Sun, 19 May 2024, 17:09:45 »
I find the lack of Southpaw-layout keyboards to be blasphemous!

You must not be keeping an eye out on ICs & GBs to well then. There has been quite a few KBs ran that were southpaw or at least had a southpaw option (The Class 0413 is a good example) in the last year or two. I will admit they are still definitely in the minority compared to traditional layout KBs, but there has definitely been quite a few available recently.

Offline mashie

  • Posts: 4
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6323 on: Tue, 21 May 2024, 07:28:25 »
Pretty much every key cap set with an ISO version/addon got the wrong colour of the pipe/backslash key next to the left shift as that key ends up with the alpha colour and not the colour of the shift key. As a result you get a very strange layout with dual colour setups and not the nice symmetrical look of an ANSI keyboard.

The only exception to this rule are the Keychron key caps.

Offline zslane

  • Posts: 2305
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6324 on: Tue, 21 May 2024, 11:01:58 »
The |\ key (and the ~` key) is not a modifier; it is an alpha. That's why it is colored like an alpha. This organizing principle is based on key purpose/functionality, not on an OCD-driven need for color symmetry. I prefer not to let the crazies dictate how we organize our keycaps, tyvm.

Besides, once you graduate to keyboards with more than 60 keys, color symmetry goes right out the window anyway, with the nav cluster weighing down the entire right side with mod-colored keys, and the numpad layout only half-surrounding the numbers (and period) with mod-colored operation keys (plus num lock and Enter). And then there's the alternating color blocks of F-keys, which makes no sense either functionality-wise or color-symmetry-wise. Best to just realize that the standard color/layout scheme we have is based on an ill-conceived IBM design and learn to embrace it since it's not going away any time soon.

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6325 on: Tue, 21 May 2024, 13:33:17 »
The |\ key (and the ~` key) is not a modifier; it is an alpha. That's why it is colored like an alpha. This organizing principle is based on key purpose/functionality, not on an OCD-driven need for color symmetry. I prefer not to let the crazies dictate how we organize our keycaps, tyvm.

Besides, once you graduate to keyboards with more than 60 keys, color symmetry goes right out the window anyway, with the nav cluster weighing down the entire right side with mod-colored keys, and the numpad layout only half-surrounding the numbers (and period) with mod-colored operation keys (plus num lock and Enter). And then there's the alternating color blocks of F-keys, which makes no sense either functionality-wise or color-symmetry-wise. Best to just realize that the standard color/layout scheme we have is based on an ill-conceived IBM design and learn to embrace it since it's not going away any time soon.

As you said that colour symmetry goes out the window anyway, so why not throw it harder and use mod pipe lol.

Actually though, I did used to use `~ key in the modifier colour on the hhkb/tsangan layout because that keeps it all the colours the same, idk I've always found it looking weird that the beige hhkbs (the blanks especially) have the alpha coloured `~ key in the top right, maybes that's influenced by the fact that I had no idea why the keys were coloured differently until recently where I realised the obvious lol.

Also yeah why does the f-row alternate like that, that doesn't make sense but I think the IBM layout, was made to be useable to basically everyone and had everything there, even if it's not even the best layout that IBM did (the at is a lot better imo), so I guess some liberties were placed on making it look more aesthetically pleasing. I have a feeling this is true because they used to do full mod colour f rows on some of earliest examples of the modern layout with the ibm 3161 terminal, which is interesting to note.



 
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
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Offline Tseg

  • Posts: 57
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6326 on: Tue, 21 May 2024, 15:08:55 »
I've participated in a number of collectible hobbies over several decades.   Participating in the keyboard hobby for 3/4 of a year has been short-lived but enjoyable.   My touch-typing has more than doubled in speed,  I now own 7 keyboards with 2 more group-buys on the way, I gave another keyboard to my son.... I have 40% to 100% boards, Topre, Buckling-Spring, etc....  I probably am $3K-$4K into this hobby, but as far as hobbies go, that is low cost to be pretty immersed with key brands and technologies of the hobby.  Definitely no regrets, but I feel a bit like I've already hit the end of the internet with this one.  It definitely needs to go more upscale, somehow.  I'll still stay engaged, but there hardly is any next thing I seek.   The depth and breadth of the hobby is only slightly deeper than the vacuum collecting and snow blower collecting communities I've participated in... nothing like watches, cameras, knives, TV's, stereos, leather boots or even the barista coffee machine collecting communities, etc....

This may be an unpopular keyboard opinion.

Offline ArchDill

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Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6327 on: Tue, 21 May 2024, 15:10:02 »
I am digging the Logitech MX Mechanical Mini... Do not even use any other boards anymore.

It even has browns...

I love it.

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6328 on: Tue, 21 May 2024, 18:34:38 »
I've participated in a number of collectible hobbies over several decades.   Participating in the keyboard hobby for 3/4 of a year has been short-lived but enjoyable.   My touch-typing has more than doubled in speed,  I now own 7 keyboards with 2 more group-buys on the way, I gave another keyboard to my son.... I have 40% to 100% boards, Topre, Buckling-Spring, etc....  I probably am $3K-$4K into this hobby, but as far as hobbies go, that is low cost to be pretty immersed with key brands and technologies of the hobby.  Definitely no regrets, but I feel a bit like I've already hit the end of the internet with this one.  It definitely needs to go more upscale, somehow.  I'll still stay engaged, but there hardly is any next thing I seek.   The depth and breadth of the hobby is only slightly deeper than the vacuum collecting and snow blower collecting communities I've participated in... nothing like watches, cameras, knives, TV's, stereos, leather boots or even the barista coffee machine collecting communities, etc....

This may be an unpopular keyboard opinion.

Have you tried doing diving into stuff like handwiring or through hole projects? they are quite a bit different from the normal builds. I wouldn't say it's as in depth as something like photography (not by a long shot) but I still think there is a lot of tinkering, even with one mx board there is tons to experiment with like different switches, springs lubes and plate and keycap combos. I think the main issue is that a lot of that is quite materialistic, and those hobbies tend not to be the most sustainable.

I am digging the Logitech MX Mechanical Mini... Do not even use any other boards anymore.

It even has browns...

I love it.

you gotta love the browns.

keyboard collection - fjell
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cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
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Offline Tseg

  • Posts: 57
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6329 on: Wed, 22 May 2024, 09:10:19 »

Have you tried doing diving into stuff like handwiring or through hole projects?

I do have an extensive fountain pen collection... not quite handwriting.  Even researching urushi lacquer (used on higher end pens) can be pretty in depth.   Not sure what "through hole projects" are?  I don't actually want to increase my skill, just increase my knowledge.

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6330 on: Wed, 22 May 2024, 09:25:46 »

Have you tried doing diving into stuff like handwiring or through hole projects?

I do have an extensive fountain pen collection... not quite handwriting.  Even researching urushi lacquer (used on higher end pens) can be pretty in depth.   Not sure what "through hole projects" are?  I don't actually want to increase my skill, just increase my knowledge.

Fair enough if you are just trying to learn more and not fulfilled by increasingly skillful projects.

Also through hole is like through hole components on keyboard pcbs (such as the mercutio keyboard, they do take more work (wouldn't say skill, if you know how to solder decently you should be fine) but I don't think those would help if you are just trying to increase knowledge. I do see them as more fun side projects that maintain more longevity in a hobby.
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
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Offline AmigaDisk

  • Formerly ohm-ish
  • Posts: 25
  • Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6331 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 01:28:21 »
Unpopular Keyboard Opinion:
I like my keyboard just as it is, straight out of the box :D

Ok I lied. I look at how I can improve it. At least I wanna get some custom keycaps
« Last Edit: Fri, 14 June 2024, 01:48:00 by ohm-ish »

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6332 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 03:36:05 »
Unpopular Keyboard Opinion:
I like my keyboard just as it is, straight out of the box :D

Ok I lied. I look at how I can improve it. At least I wanna get some custom keycaps

Yeah that's how I felt when I first got into the hobby, I thought I would be complacent with a stock keyboard but realised very quickly that I need to (and really like) modding things. Even stuff like the IBM model m, still needs proactive measures like bolt modding and repairing, restoring and converting the boards as well to get them in a good state (which is common among all vintage boards)

My hhkb is close to me just using it stock, but lubing is a big improvement so I will be doing that for my one.
keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
More

Offline bigmaxnonions

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Philly
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6333 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 10:35:57 »
My Unpopular Facts Opinions:

mod pipe is wrong

scooped is wrong

6.25U over 7U is wrong

clickies should be used for caps lock only

cherry is the best profile

i think its silly to have multiple of the same board

typing tests should only have correct characters, you spent all that timing tuning your backspace stab, show me how it works

weight engravings and pcb printing that i can't see without taking apart my boards are silly

Skog Reboot, INK Blacks, GMK Stealth | Neito, POMs, ePBT Ramenstop | KARA, Gat Yellows, KAT Cyberspace | AVA, Black Pandas, GMK Arch | QK65, Ergo Clears, GMK Laser | W1-AT, LE Creams, ePBT WoB | Odin R2, Meteor Whites, GMK Hooty | QK60, Boba U4Ts, PBT Notion | Liberi, New Nixies, GMK Grand Prix | Cypher R4, Root Beer Floats, (Undecided, currently PBT Stone) | Cycle7, POMs, GMK Striker

Sent from my SM Smart Fridge via TapTalk

Offline TomahawkLabs

  • Posts: 115
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6334 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 10:51:31 »
Pipe is an alpha and so is tilda. Color them appropriately.

If your thumbs rest on the spacebar between V-M why does it need to be larger (I noticed my keyboard is 6.25U spacebar).

SA > Cherry because it is scooped. Why do you dislike the scoop?

When you say duplicate boards are silly, do you mean same switches, and everything? Or do you mean having the same base board even with different switches is silly? I love my Apple AEK and I am working towards making a modern PCB to have it as my main board at work and at home because I enjoy the layout and sculpt more than most others (Alps is also a massive motivation). The goal is to have an AEK in every major Alps SCKM and SKCL switch release. (Currently have Pine White, Bamboo White, Bamboo Blacks, Bamboo and Pine Damped Creams, and Bamboo Damped Whites)
Always looking for Alps SKCM/SKCL switches. Feel free to DM.
AMD 5600x | RTX3080 | 2x 1TB NVME + 4x 4TB HDD | B550M Pro-P | 32GB RAM | RM850x | Node 804 | Schiit Modius/Magnius + Audeze LCD-2 | Dell S3422DWG
GMMK 1 Full Size Barebones | Zealio 67g ; Apple M3501 handwired | Alps SKCM Damped Cream
SA: Camping

Offline bigmaxnonions

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Philly
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6335 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 12:46:58 »
Pipe is an alpha and so is tilda. Color them appropriately.

If your thumbs rest on the spacebar between V-M why does it need to be larger (I noticed my keyboard is 6.25U spacebar).

SA > Cherry because it is scooped. Why do you dislike the scoop?

When you say duplicate boards are silly, do you mean same switches, and everything? Or do you mean having the same base board even with different switches is silly? I love my Apple AEK and I am working towards making a modern PCB to have it as my main board at work and at home because I enjoy the layout and sculpt more than most others (Alps is also a massive motivation). The goal is to have an AEK in every major Alps SCKM and SKCL switch release. (Currently have Pine White, Bamboo White, Bamboo Blacks, Bamboo and Pine Damped Creams, and Bamboo Damped Whites)

Most of my opinions are based on my preferences for aesthetics. I like 7U because its symmetrical. I also mostly play video games with my keyboard so I primarily use my left thumb for space.

Again, I like the aesthetics of cherry compared to SA or KAT or something, I've tried all and found that SA is too tall for my liking. I like bars over scooped for a similar reason, I like the way the profile is the same and there's just a little bar on F and J, rather than a big indent, as it breaks up the row too much for my liking.

For duplicate boards, I mean having multiple copies of the same board. I'm a "one of all" type of collector, rather than an "all of one" collector, so the appeal of having every color NK65 for example is lost on me. I know some people do appreciate having the complete collection, but I like having one of each layout, I like looking at my collection and seeing all the different form factors and layouts rather than a bunch of different colored 65s or TKLs or something. I also don't rebuild boards and only do solder (to justify me spending so much on my soldering kit lol), so once switches are in, I don't change them unless one breaks. I can understand having multiple of the same boards with different switches, but to me it seems like a waste to spend all the extra money to buy the full board instead of just buying another plate and PCB, unless you are swapping out the boards every week or so.

I tend to keep my opinions to myself and only engage on posts/images/etc with positive feedback because everyone collects things differently and its not my place to yuck someones yum, but this thread is solely for opinions!
Skog Reboot, INK Blacks, GMK Stealth | Neito, POMs, ePBT Ramenstop | KARA, Gat Yellows, KAT Cyberspace | AVA, Black Pandas, GMK Arch | QK65, Ergo Clears, GMK Laser | W1-AT, LE Creams, ePBT WoB | Odin R2, Meteor Whites, GMK Hooty | QK60, Boba U4Ts, PBT Notion | Liberi, New Nixies, GMK Grand Prix | Cypher R4, Root Beer Floats, (Undecided, currently PBT Stone) | Cycle7, POMs, GMK Striker

Sent from my SM Smart Fridge via TapTalk

Offline TomahawkLabs

  • Posts: 115
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6336 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 13:16:36 »
Pipe is an alpha and so is tilda. Color them appropriately.

If your thumbs rest on the spacebar between V-M why does it need to be larger (I noticed my keyboard is 6.25U spacebar).

SA > Cherry because it is scooped. Why do you dislike the scoop?

When you say duplicate boards are silly, do you mean same switches, and everything? Or do you mean having the same base board even with different switches is silly? I love my Apple AEK and I am working towards making a modern PCB to have it as my main board at work and at home because I enjoy the layout and sculpt more than most others (Alps is also a massive motivation). The goal is to have an AEK in every major Alps SCKM and SKCL switch release. (Currently have Pine White, Bamboo White, Bamboo Blacks, Bamboo and Pine Damped Creams, and Bamboo Damped Whites)

Most of my opinions are based on my preferences for aesthetics. I like 7U because its symmetrical. I also mostly play video games with my keyboard so I primarily use my left thumb for space.

Again, I like the aesthetics of cherry compared to SA or KAT or something, I've tried all and found that SA is too tall for my liking. I like bars over scooped for a similar reason, I like the way the profile is the same and there's just a little bar on F and J, rather than a big indent, as it breaks up the row too much for my liking.

For duplicate boards, I mean having multiple copies of the same board. I'm a "one of all" type of collector, rather than an "all of one" collector, so the appeal of having every color NK65 for example is lost on me. I know some people do appreciate having the complete collection, but I like having one of each layout, I like looking at my collection and seeing all the different form factors and layouts rather than a bunch of different colored 65s or TKLs or something. I also don't rebuild boards and only do solder (to justify me spending so much on my soldering kit lol), so once switches are in, I don't change them unless one breaks. I can understand having multiple of the same boards with different switches, but to me it seems like a waste to spend all the extra money to buy the full board instead of just buying another plate and PCB, unless you are swapping out the boards every week or so.

I tend to keep my opinions to myself and only engage on posts/images/etc with positive feedback because everyone collects things differently and its not my place to yuck someones yum, but this thread is solely for opinions!

For me as long as you can articulate why you don't like something it is valid. Saying "because" doesn't do much for me. Those are all valid reason, and yeah having every colorway for a specific board does seem a bit silly to me. I like the idea of having a standard layout/feel and using the switches to be the difference. Like having two of the same car, but with different motors/mods for different flavors of the same chassis.
Always looking for Alps SKCM/SKCL switches. Feel free to DM.
AMD 5600x | RTX3080 | 2x 1TB NVME + 4x 4TB HDD | B550M Pro-P | 32GB RAM | RM850x | Node 804 | Schiit Modius/Magnius + Audeze LCD-2 | Dell S3422DWG
GMMK 1 Full Size Barebones | Zealio 67g ; Apple M3501 handwired | Alps SKCM Damped Cream
SA: Camping

Online Rob27shred

  • Posts: 1554
  • Location: Pittsburgh, PA
  • Insane in the Membrane! 👻
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6337 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 16:43:58 »
Pipe is an alpha and so is tilda. Color them appropriately.

If your thumbs rest on the spacebar between V-M why does it need to be larger (I noticed my keyboard is 6.25U spacebar).

SA > Cherry because it is scooped. Why do you dislike the scoop?

When you say duplicate boards are silly, do you mean same switches, and everything? Or do you mean having the same base board even with different switches is silly? I love my Apple AEK and I am working towards making a modern PCB to have it as my main board at work and at home because I enjoy the layout and sculpt more than most others (Alps is also a massive motivation). The goal is to have an AEK in every major Alps SCKM and SKCL switch release. (Currently have Pine White, Bamboo White, Bamboo Blacks, Bamboo and Pine Damped Creams, and Bamboo Damped Whites)

I think he was more pointing towards people who own like 5 Unikons, Kohakus, insert hype board here TBF. To me, I feel like to each their own really, if someone finds happiness in owning multiple of the same board I'm not gonna knock them for it. However I do find owning duplicates of a board redundant but that's just my opinion on it. I just usually try to grab a few extra PCBs & plates when I'm getting a high end board. That way I can build a few different setups I can swap in & out when I want a change on a certain board.

Offline bigmaxnonions

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: Philly
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6338 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 21:07:54 »
i have another opinion; wob looks good on everything
Skog Reboot, INK Blacks, GMK Stealth | Neito, POMs, ePBT Ramenstop | KARA, Gat Yellows, KAT Cyberspace | AVA, Black Pandas, GMK Arch | QK65, Ergo Clears, GMK Laser | W1-AT, LE Creams, ePBT WoB | Odin R2, Meteor Whites, GMK Hooty | QK60, Boba U4Ts, PBT Notion | Liberi, New Nixies, GMK Grand Prix | Cypher R4, Root Beer Floats, (Undecided, currently PBT Stone) | Cycle7, POMs, GMK Striker

Sent from my SM Smart Fridge via TapTalk

Offline Rhienfo

  • Posts: 740
  • Location: Melbourne, Australia
  • Why is everything I want here so expensive :(
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6339 on: Fri, 14 June 2024, 21:25:10 »
I think he was more pointing towards people who own like 5 Unikons, Kohakus, insert hype board here TBF. To me, I feel like to each their own really, if someone finds happiness in owning multiple of the same board I'm not gonna knock them for it. However I do find owning duplicates of a board redundant but that's just my opinion on it. I just usually try to grab a few extra PCBs & plates when I'm getting a high end board. That way I can build a few different setups I can swap in & out when I want a change on a certain board.

I prefer just swapping builds instead of getting several of the same boards. Variety is the spice of life.

(that being said I might get a dupe hhkb, it's pretty nice lol)

i have another opinion; wob looks good on everything


wob on white kinda sucks, and silver and blue is a stretch but can still work imo.

keyboard collection - fjell
More
cherry blacks - unlubed - filmed and springswapped with tx 55g mediums - alu Plate | pretty happy with this, the blacks were cherry picked so they weren't that scratchy to begin with, but currently breaking them in, may lube them with a dry lube like ro59 or ptfe powder.
| hhkb bt
More
lubed with tribosys 3203 | like topre a lot, prefer it lubed but did make less tactile but that might have been a skill issue. probably will get more tactile over time as the domes age.
| m0115
More
bad orange alps lol | definitely needs a restoration. planning on wax boiling them and maybe a replacement pcb because the board has only 2 key rollover apparently.
| praxis
More
gateron yellows - lubed with 205g0 - 62g tx mediums - pc plate | probably my favourite keyboard already, feels super nice and sounds pretty good, it's got a great layout as well. probably gonna build this with mx browns, I feel like it would suit the board more.
| camo filco
More
stock with silent reds | Pretty cool looking board, the silent reds are actually good, they are smooth and I don't mind the mushiness (it's not even that mushy as well). the layout is pretty weird, but is useable. will probably mod this in the future. maybe a pcb and plate swap, change the keycaps to something dolch like, and also spring swap the springs in the silent reds.


collection in pixel art
More

Online Rob27shred

  • Posts: 1554
  • Location: Pittsburgh, PA
  • Insane in the Membrane! 👻
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6340 on: Sat, 15 June 2024, 09:49:28 »
I think he was more pointing towards people who own like 5 Unikons, Kohakus, insert hype board here TBF. To me, I feel like to each their own really, if someone finds happiness in owning multiple of the same board I'm not gonna knock them for it. However I do find owning duplicates of a board redundant but that's just my opinion on it. I just usually try to grab a few extra PCBs & plates when I'm getting a high end board. That way I can build a few different setups I can swap in & out when I want a change on a certain board.

I prefer just swapping builds instead of getting several of the same boards. Variety is the spice of life.

(that being said I might get a dupe hhkb, it's pretty nice lol)

i have another opinion; wob looks good on everything


wob on white kinda sucks, and silver and blue is a stretch but can still work imo.

Variety is the spice of life for sure! You hit on a point I forgot to mention with that quote actually. Buying multiples of of a high end board might impact my finances in a way that I have to skip out on a different board I really like. I would much rather have one of each board with multiple builds to change it up & be able to grab another board that interests me, vs being financial hamstrung because I bought multiples of a certain board causing me to have to skip a different one.

Offline HungerMechanic

  • Posts: 1389
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6341 on: Sat, 15 June 2024, 16:06:52 »
I am digging the Logitech MX Mechanical Mini... Do not even use any other boards anymore.

It even has browns...

I love it.

What kind of switches does it use? Gateron LP Browns?

Offline grids

  • Posts: 12
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6342 on: Wed, 19 June 2024, 03:41:27 »
Small keyboards need more keys.
Large keyboards need to be smaller.

Offline Mandan

  • Posts: 39
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6343 on: Thu, 20 June 2024, 08:37:37 »
Pipe is an alpha and so is tilda. Color them appropriately.

My IBM boards are all that way from the factory.

Quote
If your thumbs rest on the spacebar between V-M why does it need to be larger (I noticed my keyboard is 6.25U spacebar).

Witness!   The standard Japanese format got that right.

According to an article on Xah Lee's web site:

Quote
the typist suggested that two space keys be installed, one at each side of the keyboard, and given lips projecting inward, to make them easier to hit.

Densmore liked this idea so well that he wrote repeatedly to Milwaukee demaning that it be put into effect. Accordingly, Sholes directed Schwalbach to fashion the key buttons with lateral extensions, but when Glidden saw them he saked: “Why not join the two and have a single flat piece extending all the way across?” Thus originated the space bar …

- the typewriter and the men who made Them 1871 By Richard Nelson Current

So the answer is "because the spacebar has always been that way."  [sigh]  Lee has some pictures of old typewriters with one or two small space keys.

If I ever built my own keyboard, I'd put a TrackPoint and a couple of mouse buttons in the middle, and a 1.5u space key on each side of that. 


Offline Fraaaan

  • Posts: 383
  • Location: cucked (EU)
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6344 on: Sat, 22 June 2024, 16:25:24 »
Small keyboards need more keys.
Large keyboards need to be smaller.

Grass should be bluer and the sea should be greener.

Offline Evolurkeeb

  • Posts: 26
Re: Unpopular Keyboard Opinions
« Reply #6345 on: Tue, 25 June 2024, 02:54:35 »
Agree