Star Wars Force Awakens Discussion Thread (SPOILERS!!!)

[Signature]

I liked

However things like "this was the old death star (small af), and this is the new mega death star 2.0 xXx dragonslayer (huge)", is quite annoying.

[JaccoW]

I watched it yesterday together with my girlfriend. We both enjoyed it.
Though I did notice we did not end up discussing it afterwards.

Curious to see what happens in the next one.

[Glod]

It had it's issues and cheese but overall the cinematic experience was great and that's what matters with movies over other mediums, at least with movies like this. I left the theater with a big smile on my face.

Poe (Oscar Isaac) was under utilized I think, but with so many characters I guess he had to be put in the background.

If I start tearing apart the movie and its problems I'm afraid it will mess up the enjoyment I had, so I'm just going to ignore super mega death star cheese and keep smiling

[njbair]

Spoiler alert: basically this whole post.

They say art imitates reality, which I think is why we all have such a hard time with the idea of a single, monolithic enemy that can be easily targeted. Because we live in a world of small terror cells and faceless enemies. I kept trying to think of alternatives to the Starkiller base, but the trouble is you need something that can be destroyed by the end of the film. Only a single, giant weapon will do.

The weapon destroyed the Senate, and there's really no telling what the aftermath will be from that. But it's just kind of disappointing that after only about 20 years since events of the original trilogy they are basically still just a group of scrappy rebels, back under the thumb of yet another oppressive regime.

[raymogi]

I love the whole movie. And even though I don't understand the story as a whole to the dot, I enjoyed everything the SW universe has to offer. Only started watching on Monday and ended with the new movie on Friday. Watched it in this order: 4, 5, 2, 3, 6. Skipped 1 cause I kinda remember what happen in that movie and Jar Jar is super annoying.

With all that said, I LOVE Rey. I watched her in the Graham Norton show and she is such a lovely person. I think she said that this is her first ever movie and I can only hope that she will do even better for the sequels.

Ray <3 Rey

[zombimuncha]

I didn't catch / don't get how Poe Dameron and Kylo Ren both found out at the same time that some old dude on Jakku has information about Lukes whereabouts.

[katushkin]

WHAT IF RAE IS A KENOBI

[zombimuncha]

WHAT IF RAE IS A KENOBI

WHAT IF RAY IS REALLY REI AYANAMI?

[katushkin]

WHAT IF RAE IS A KENOBI

WHAT IF RAY IS REALLY REI AYANAMI?

Who dat.

[zombimuncha]

WHAT IF RAE IS A KENOBI

WHAT IF RAY IS REALLY REI AYANAMI?

Who dat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rei_Ayanami
A clone, from 30 years ago

[katushkin]

Oh.

I don't think so mayn, I think that would be a stretch.

[baldgye]

6/10

watched it a few weeks ago

[katushkin]

6/10

watched it a few weeks ago

Who are you and why am I friends with you?

[Fire Brand]

6/10

watched it a few weeks ago

Who are you and why am I friends with you?

I'm thinking the same

[ghostjuggernaut]

I finally saw the movie yesterday, and share similar opinions to most here.  I enjoyed the movie a lot and think it will have good replay value.  I think Disney went a bit overboard on the fan service though.  I understand they need to bring back the older audience, while establishing a new one, but it was a bit overkill.

I was mostly unimpressed by Kylo Ren's appearance.  I have always been under the impression once the dark side powers were used, the jedi's appearance changed.  I have only ever watched the movies, but they did this with Anakin and Palpatine.  I understand that Kylo still seems to be new to the dark side and still has more training, but he had some pretty strong abilities that I would assume would change him.

Overall I loved the film and will be watching it again in the future.  I just hope the next two are better and have more of a unique plot.

[katushkin]

Palpatine was bad all along and his appearance didn't change much. Also how do you know what he looked like before? I thought he was pretty kickass, I think he was chosen for the role soley on his voice alone

[ghostjuggernaut]

Palpatine was bad all along and his appearance didn't change much. Also how do you know what he looked like before? I thought he was pretty kickass, I think he was chosen for the role soley on his voice alone

Palpatine's appearance did change though, after he electrocuted someone... I think Anakin maybe?

I like Kylo Ren, and I think he has the potential to be better than Vader as a villain.  I just expected him to have less of a baby face.

[baldgye]

6/10

watched it a few weeks ago

Who are you and why am I friends with you?

I'm thinking the same

**** you guys

deathstar 3 was retarded and dumb
dull kids jokes
shallow plot

But I did like how Deep Vadar was totes bad ass and the new nose was still a ***** compared

[abjr]

Saw it a few days ago with the wife. It was a lot better than I expected, but was definitely a rehashing of ANH. I thought some of the acting was pretty stiff, but I did like Rey and Finn. Rey kind of reminded me of Keira Knightley by the way she talked/her accent. Hopefully the next 2 will be a bit more original. And please, no more "I am your Father" or "The Force is strong in my family"  moments. I have a bad feeling about this. Please.

but my head just confused right now with what Disney has done to the expanded universe, I was expecting that there will be links or even hint for Ben Skywalker

I was confused by this as well having read some of the EU novels. Disney basically axed it. This should clear things up:

http://www.starwars.com/news/the-legendary-star-wars-expanded-universe-turns-a-new-page
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/01/op-ed-disney-takes-a-chainsaw-to-the-star-wars-expanded-universe/

[katushkin]

Yes, d3athstar was stupid. Other than that it was good. The ginger General was a bit of a tit though.

[baldgye]

Yes, d3athstar was stupid. Other than that it was good. The ginger General was a bit of a tit though.

what else do you expect from a ginger ninja ?

[demik]

Kylo's mask voice was Gucci tho

[Sinanju]

Kylo's mask voice was Gucci tho

He really needed that during his fight with Rey.  Sounded like he was going through puberty when he asked Rey if he could teach her. 
Him catching the blaster bolt in mid air was badass.

I didn't mind the Ginger General beside him being so young for what I imagine a general to be.

Really was glad to see stormtroopers being a lot more efficient than the previous movies. TR-8R was a pretty cool example.

Saw it twice so far. Might have to go a third time to see it in Imax on Sunday and get one of those posters.  Guy I know has watched it 6 times already.

[azhdar]

Watched it the other day, it was my first time watching a star wars movie so I had high expectation.

I was really disappointed honestly, the "dark vilain" looked nice up until he removed the mask, then he looked ridiculous. The face of the actor really doesn't suit the job, they should have put scars or other alterations on his face or tell him to hit the gym a bit.
The story was really easy and not interesting imo, 2 "newbies" who save the face of the world easily versus trained persons ?? The black guy was somehow trained but how is the girl supposed to win Kylos in the first time she has the blade in here hands??
Also the same boring that you see in almost all movies nowadays:
- the couple,
- scenes were characters wait for (like the scene where kylo and Han are on the bridge), the hairy partner of Han should have used his gun way earlier, so should have the storm troopers,
- explosions, I mean when a planet explode, you can go full explosions, but cmon, don't overdo it in every scenes.


Aside from the universe , I fail to see how this is superior to a Transformer movie.

[Sinanju]

I was really disappointed honestly, the "dark vilain" looked nice up until he removed the mask, then he looked ridiculous. The face of the actor really doesn't suit the job, they should have put scars or other alterations on his face or tell him to hit the gym a bit.
The story was really easy and not interesting imo, 2 "newbies" who save the face of the world easily versus trained persons ?? The black guy was somehow trained but how is the girl supposed to win Kylos in the first time she has the blade in here hands??
Also the same boring that you see in almost all movies nowadays:

He probably didn't have scars or anything due to not really having any adversaries up until the movies time frame.  All the Jedi were wiped out according to the movie besides Luke.  He should have plenty of scars in the next movie.  Maybe even become more sith appearance like yellow eyes and all that since he is committed enough to kill Han.

Finn had training as a stormtrooper, and apparently the prequel book shows him and the other stormtroopers undergoing melee weapons training.
Rey seemed pretty capable fighting with her staff that could help out a little.

Also, there seemed to be a pretty big emphasis on the bowcaster (Chewie's weapon).  Hit hit hard enough for Han to like it, and would blast opposition away.  That thing scored a direct hit on Kylo, and probably weakened him a lot. You see him hitting himself trying to get some adrenaline, and even blood coming off the wound.  I don't think its too much of a stretch that he was defeated by those two.

[baldgye]

Watched it the other day, it was my first time watching a star wars movie so I had high expectation.

I was really disappointed honestly, the "dark vilain" looked nice up until he removed the mask, then he looked ridiculous. The face of the actor really doesn't suit the job, they should have put scars or other alterations on his face or tell him to hit the gym a bit.
The story was really easy and not interesting imo, 2 "newbies" who save the face of the world easily versus trained persons ?? The black guy was somehow trained but how is the girl supposed to win Kylos in the first time she has the blade in here hands??
Also the same boring that you see in almost all movies nowadays:
- the couple,
- scenes were characters wait for (like the scene where kylo and Han are on the bridge), the hairy partner of Han should have used his gun way earlier, so should have the storm troopers,
- explosions, I mean when a planet explode, you can go full explosions, but cmon, don't overdo it in every scenes.


Aside from the universe , I fail to see how this is superior to a Transformer movie.

idk it was nice that his face wasn't ****ed up and that just having scars makes you edgy as ****. He was just a bloke who wasn't very nice, not like all cereal killers have scars or facial burns and ****.

It's better than the Transformers movies because Megan Fox and Shia LaBeouf weren't in it, also it had good action scenes.

[E TwentyNine]

Him catching the blaster bolt in mid air was badass.

It was.  And I was thinking "damn, if this is the approach they're taking for the rest of the movie, excellent".  But nope, he never did it again.

[nubbinator]

Finally went and saw the movie and I have to say I was disappointed.  I wasn't expecting anything great, but it felt like a rehash of old tired plot lines and just nothing special.  With Star Trek it was at least doable because they explicitly stated that it's an alternate timeline, so the JJ Abrams flash can work for it.  Episode VII just felt like a more polished Lucas.  Who needs novel ideas, well developed characters, or anything else when you have awesome special effects?  Don't get me wrong, the visuals were awesome, but the story was lacking.

Rehash #1: Droid has secret plans needed to save the galaxy.  Like R2-D2, BB-8 is given information that good people died to get (Poe Dameron was supposed to die and many Bothans died for the Death Star plans) and ends up in the hands of a random person who is trying to get the information to people who need it.  They defend themselves and run away from the Empire/First Order in the Millennium Falcon to the rebel base.

Rehash #2: Let's have another Death Star.  Who needs something cool like the Galaxy Gun or World Devastator when you can have another Death Star?  And, you know what, let's even go so far as to have it destroyed the same way.  A small force goes down to the planet and shuts off the shield generator (DS2) while we sit and watch a countdown until our eventual destruction on this jungle planet (DS1).  Once the shield generator is down, let's fly a ship down the trench run we used for the original Death Star, fly it inside like the second Death Star, blow some stuff up, and fly out while it explodes behind you.

Rehash #3: Let's abandon important force strong children on a planet with no knowledge of who they are and then seek training from a hermit, one who feels responsible for much of the bad that happened in the universe (Obi-Wan/Luke).

There were others, but I think I'll stop with those.  It was still a fun movie and I know I'll end up buying it on DVD, but it was disappointing coming as a continuation of the series instead of a rehash.  Hopefully Episode VIII is better.

[Leslieann]

To all the disappointed Star Wars fans... Go see it again.

The first time you watch it, you are too full of expectations, and over analyze it far too much, no movie would stand up to the hype this has in front of it. Most fans have found seeing it a second time actually made it better because they had ditched the preconceived notions and just watched it as a Star Wars movie. Seriously, it's better the second time. Also, there is a lot of easter eggs, clues and such that you totally missed first time around.

[swimmingbird]

To all the disappointed Star Wars fans... Go see it again.

The first time you watch it, you are too full of expectations, and over analyze it far too much, no movie would stand up to the hype this has in front of it. Most fans have found seeing it a second time actually made it better because they had ditched the preconceived notions and just watched it as a Star Wars movie. Seriously, it's better the second time. Also, there is a lot of easter eggs, clues and such that you totally missed first time around.

I liked it the second time around more too

First time I was in plinkett mode and just analysing the **** out of everything. Second time round it was fun space adventures

[baldgye]

Why in a thread marked 'spoilers' are people using spoiler tags???

[demik]

Why in a thread marked 'spoilers' are people using spoiler tags???

because

[swimmingbird]

Why in a thread marked 'spoilers' are people using spoiler tags???

I was doing it in case people use spy

[mesteris]

Not a HUGE Star Wars fan, but I've read some of the EU and played some of the games. KOTOR etc.

Whole series has been Disney'd in my opinion. Entire movie felt like an overproduced pilot episode for a tv-series. It felt entirely like setup for the next movie. I realized after the movie that I didn't want to watch a movie in an essentially force-dead time period. I'm a huge fan of the fights in Star Wars. Although there are a number of problems with the prequels, they had the most impressive lightsaber duels along with the animated Clone Wars. I mean with the prequels we got neat stuff like obi/anakin vs maul, palpatine vs yoda, yoda vs dooku, grievous vs obi. Maybe it was too much to expect something like that from this movie. I had a ton of problems with the movie, but at the end of the day I suppose it was an alright watch.

Like many have already said, Abrams totally reinserted so many aspects of the old movies and I really think it hurt the expectations of many people. I'm glad people are also upset with the stale dynamic between the Rebels and the Empire. With three movies dealing with the toppling of the Empire, why does the new villain look like the exact same thing?



Ren stops a blaster bolt completely early in the movie. He then goes on to do nothing impressive ever again.  Having received some training from both his current master AND Luke, he's completely disappointing as a villain. Also the earth splits open to stop the fight? That's weak. Angsty and weak, then he gets the good old fashioned injury from hero to make him more villainy...for the next movie.

Rey's origins left intentionally vague? This is some real tease-y writing with the brief flashbacks. She's obviously not some random nobody. The entire movie, no one goes "Hey, so tell me a bit about who you're waiting for." I found this really obnoxious and I feel this was a large part of why it felt like a pilot episode or setup movie. Also, I assume this might make sense later, but how in the **** does Rey just feel like using Force persuasion? She just kind of uses it to escape with no prior knowledge of it? I really hope something explains that. ALSO, what was that whole "Stop grabbing my hand" nonsense for the SJWs? She's already proven she's a strong independent woman that don't need no man by beating the snot out of Finn immediately. Seemed unnecessary, kind of like the movie was nudging me in the side going LOOK LOOK HOW STRONG OUR FEMALE LEAD IS.

Captain Phasma? What? Somehow I felt I'd see a character archetype similar to that of Jango/Boba Fett. I mean ... special armor means you're badass, right? Did they waste Gwedoline Christie or is she actually doing something next movie?

No clones? Fine with me. Finn seems entirely too normal to be kidnapped from his family as a baby and subjected to a lifetime soldier training program though. Why isn't he like...Wow this is normal society and freedom? How neat!... or something? Maybe he's too busy being comic relief.

...That pilot totally should have been killed by Ren. Just sayin'. Beau? Bo?

Map to Luke? Seemed like they insinuated earlier in the movie that the other parts of the map would need to be located, but BAM R2D2 has all the other parts, don't worry.

Also I found Snoke to be irritatingly shrouded in mystery like everything else in this movie.


All in all, I think it's worth watching, but I don't think this Star Wars is written for me. I think Disney wants the younger kids. I feel like kids don't really care about Death Star v3 or lazy writing to resolve conflict.

[mesteris]

That felt much shorter when I was typing it, I apologize for the wall of text of nerd complaints.

[E TwentyNine]

That felt much shorter when I was typing it, I apologize for the wall of text of nerd complaints.

I could have written a longer version.

I enjoyed the movie a lot.   The old faces, the new ones doing things better than them.  It was fun.

But the number of repackaged elements from the originals was overwhelming.

The standard excuse I'm hearing is "The force is trying to correct itself, and making the same events happen repeatedly" (ala the 'Battlestar Galactica' all this has happened before and will again).

But did DeathStarIII have to be blown up?  Via the same basic mechanism, AGAIN?  Wouldn't disabling it served the plot just as well?

Some of the retro stuff like the tech in the craft was a nice touch for "accuracy", but so much is rehashed original items.

Remined me of how Star Trek Nemesis took all the elements of The Wrath of Khan and repacked it in a sleeker but clearly repeated and less interesting story.

I know I'm not the target audience for these, having seen the originals in theatres.  But ANY story would have been new to the youngsters, why retell one that's already been told?

Now that they're out of it, and laid the groundwork (it did feel like its purpose was purely groundwork for sequels), I expect the next one to be better, and darker.  We'll see.

[Leslieann]

Ren stops a blaster bolt completely early in the movie. He then goes on to do nothing impressive ever again.  Having received some training from both his current master AND Luke, he's completely disappointing as a villain.

Did you forget about Han? That pretty much made him pretty evil. I thought he was a bit underwhelming, but younger kids today don't see Vader as all that threatening... different strokes...

but how in the **** does Rey just feel like using Force persuasion? She just kind of uses it to escape with no prior knowledge of it? I really hope something explains that.

They did explain it, but you probably didn't notice it. Star Wars likes to leave a lot unsaid, either purposely or accidentally, but it always has left some things unsaid while leaving hints as to what or why.

Anyhow, as to Rey learning, the force was teaching her, just as Vader learned how to use it somewhat when he was child, this was how he was able to pod race. Also, remember how Yoda explained that Qui Gon had learned how to communicate after death? The dream sequence contained Yoda and Obiwans voices. Basically, she was being trained by the force itself, as well as Yoda and Obiwan.

Captain Phasma? What? Somehow I felt I'd see a character archetype similar to that of Jango/Boba Fett. I mean ... special armor means you're badass, right? Did they waste Gwedoline Christie or is she actually doing something next movie?

She's being setup for a major role in the next ones. Also, some speculate that she is the spy Leia refers to when she says they have someone on the inside.

No clones? Fine with me. Finn seems entirely too normal to be kidnapped from his family as a baby and subjected to a lifetime soldier training program though. Why isn't he like...Wow this is normal society and freedom? How neat!... or something? Maybe he's too busy being comic relief.

He wasn't kidnapped, that was a lie to maintain his cover. He is a clone, that's why he didn't have a name.

Map to Luke? Seemed like they insinuated earlier in the movie that the other parts of the map would need to be located, but BAM R2D2 has all the other parts, don't worry.

R2-d2 and Luke timing was done so as not to overpower the story. Bad writing maybe, but it's suspected that Luke programmed R2 to remain dormant until he wanted or needed to be found.

All in all, I think it's worth watching, but I don't think this Star Wars is written for me. I think Disney wants the younger kids. I feel like kids don't really care about Death Star v3 or lazy writing to resolve conflict.

There was so much fan service for old fans it was silly.

You're exactly the type of person who needs to go see it again because you had far too many preconceived notions. It was never going to live up to the hype for you. Now that you're over it, go see it and enjoy it.

[Findecanor]

I was confused by this as well having read some of the EU novels. Disney basically axed it.

Many long-term fans are in up-roar: "We gave up the EU for this piece of crap?!" ...

To all the disappointed Star Wars fans... Go see it again.

Hey, I really liked it after I had seen it in the theatre. I was on such a high afterwards. The disappointment has come gradually, as I have thought more and more about it.

One such aspect of the movie that I did not immediately think myself but I have heard others point out is that the original characters are not treated right.
Han and Chewie are back as smugglers, Leia is a reistance fighter and Luke is isolated - back where they were at the start of the old trilogy. Han, Leia and Luke are friggin family - yet in the movie they have failed each other.
The characters deserve better than that.

Map to Luke? Seemed like they insinuated earlier in the movie that the other parts of the map would need to be located, but BAM R2D2 has all the other parts, don't worry.

A synopsis of the script leaked in April last year. It was exactly like the finished film except for one detail: BB-8 carried not a map to Luke Skywalker, but his lightsaber.
That leaked synopsis did not however tell the reason why Rey was kidnapped by Kylo Ren.

[baldgye]

One such aspect of the movie that I did not immediately think myself but I have heard others point out is that the original characters are not treated right.
Han and Chewie are back as smugglers, Leia is a reistance fighter and Luke is isolated - back where they were at the start of the old trilogy. Han, Leia and Luke are friggin family - yet in the movie they have failed each other.
The characters deserve better than that.

I think of all the flaws the movie and plot had, the fact that a family has drifted apart over some 40 years was one of the most realistic and believable aspects of the movie.

[FLFisherman]

One such aspect of the movie that I did not immediately think myself but I have heard others point out is that the original characters are not treated right.
Han and Chewie are back as smugglers, Leia is a reistance fighter and Luke is isolated - back where they were at the start of the old trilogy. Han, Leia and Luke are friggin family - yet in the movie they have failed each other.
The characters deserve better than that.

I don't know, I kind of liked that. Episode VI concluded with a happy ending and now VII rolls around and pretty much says, "**** happens to everyone, even the more-than-human jedi and war heroes." Life isn't perfect and TFA captures it beautifully. Han was never meant for family life. It's not unexpected that he'd leave (for one reason or another). I mean come on, his reply to Leia's "I love you" was the iconic "I know." And we're supposed to expect this guy to settle down?

As for Luke being isolated, I think that also makes sense. Guilt drives people to do some strange things, often out of character for them. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't feel too great after mentoring my sibling and best friend's child and having them just turn around and kill a bunch of people.

[E TwentyNine]

I think of all the flaws the movie and plot had, the fact that a family has drifted apart over some 40 years was one of the most realistic and believable aspects of the movie.

Yes, but Luke f'ed up training Jedis and his solution is to run off to a corner of the galaxy and hide while the bad guys tear up galaxy?

There had better be a DAMNED good explanation next episode.

[FLFisherman]

I think of all the flaws the movie and plot had, the fact that a family has drifted apart over some 40 years was one of the most realistic and believable aspects of the movie.

Yes, but Luke f'ed up training Jedis and his solution is to run off to a corner of the galaxy and hide while the bad guys tear up galaxy?

There had better be a DAMNED good explanation next episode.

Yoda did the same thing. As did Obi-Wan.

[Sinanju]

I think of all the flaws the movie and plot had, the fact that a family has drifted apart over some 40 years was one of the most realistic and believable aspects of the movie.

Yes, but Luke f'ed up training Jedis and his solution is to run off to a corner of the galaxy and hide while the bad guys tear up galaxy?

There had better be a DAMNED good explanation next episode.

Pretty sure I figured out the reason.  Prior to becoming Kylo Ren, Ben Solo challenged Luke to a galactic game of hide and seek.  He must have given him a decent amount of time in order to join the Knights of Ren and change his name.  This allowed him to slaughter the rest of the Jedi in training without Luke's intervention. Prior to Rey's appearance, Luke must have been thinking he was winning.

In all seriousness, I am hoping the similar and simple plot we were given was to mainly introduce the new characters and give us a background into this upcoming trilogy without being overly too new.  I'm really hoping the next movie answers a lot of our questions and is more original.

I think the StarKiller base destroying the Republic might have been a necessity for the upcoming movies and how the Resistance lost a large amount of their supporters. Also, with the capabilities of the First Order, will it cause more people to join the Resistance or to help the First Order out of fear?  Looking forward to the next movies regardless.

[E TwentyNine]

I think of all the flaws the movie and plot had, the fact that a family has drifted apart over some 40 years was one of the most realistic and believable aspects of the movie.

Yes, but Luke f'ed up training Jedis and his solution is to run off to a corner of the galaxy and hide while the bad guys tear up galaxy?

There had better be a DAMNED good explanation next episode.

Yoda did the same thing. As did Obi-Wan.

Yoda retreated after the slaughter, knowing that Obi-Wan was also retreating, but not to isolation, to watch over Luke until the time was right to fight the Empire.  They were coordinated amongst themselves and the rebels.

The Empire was already in power, having taken down the senate and killed the vast majority of the Jedi.

Hell broke loose on Luke and he retreated and let the First Order rise.   Would they have been easier to dismantle before they got so powerful?

You can say the same thing, that he's been waiting for the time is right, but was he overseeing the "savior" for this turn of the crank?   Was he really isolated?

I'm hoping not, and that he's been sneaking around in the shadows undiscovered.  We will see.

[baldgye]

I think of all the flaws the movie and plot had, the fact that a family has drifted apart over some 40 years was one of the most realistic and believable aspects of the movie.

Yes, but Luke f'ed up training Jedis and his solution is to run off to a corner of the galaxy and hide while the bad guys tear up galaxy?

There had better be a DAMNED good explanation next episode.

Yoda did the same thing. As did Obi-Wan.

Yoda retreated after the slaughter, knowing that Obi-Wan was also retreating, but not to isolation, to watch over Luke until the time was right to fight the Empire.  They were coordinated amongst themselves and the rebels.

The Empire was already in power, having taken down the senate and killed the vast majority of the Jedi.

Hell broke loose on Luke and he retreated and let the First Order rise.   Would they have been easier to dismantle before they got so powerful?

You can say the same thing, that he's been waiting for the time is right, but was he overseeing the "savior" for this turn of the crank?   Was he really isolated?

I'm hoping not, and that he's been sneaking around in the shadows undiscovered.  We will see.

Luke was always an emo loner

[Leslieann]

Many long-term fans are in up-roar: "We gave up the EU for this piece of crap?!" ...

I've heard a lot of the opposite, very few complaints.
I will admit, especially first time through, it bore way too much resemblance to ANH. They could have done something other than another death star, on the other hand, I think that was meant to be both humorous and tie it to ANH. It's not the same as the DeathStar, see, it's BIGGER.

I don't think people really expected humor in Star wars, but there was some really good lines in it. Like the trash compactor, or that's not how the force works, or  one of the best lines, when Chewie was cold.

Han and Chewie are back as smugglers, Leia is a reistance fighter and Luke is isolated - back where they were at the start of the old trilogy. Han, Leia and Luke are friggin family - yet in the movie they have failed each other.
The characters deserve better than that.

One thing I have heard, and this rings true on a lot of things... history is cyclical, especially in the Star Wars universe (as FLFisherman pointed out, it happened before).

And like Baldgye said, it's been decades, people drift apart, give yourself 20 or 40 years years and see how far you end up.

I've been all over, started businesses, changed careers. My friends and family have done similar. Married, divorced, kids, moved across the country, many moved back and/or settled in the middle. I've had friends and family die, some killed, some in jail. Many have drifted apart, people you never expect to drift end up being the ones who do. That goes for a lot of things. Seriously, you have no idea what 20 years will bring you, especially between your 20's and 40's, it's probably the most chaotic time in your life.

In Star Wars, you have to throw in the fact that they were in a war, and in Hans case, he was always cowboy on the outskirts of society, so it was very easy to see him taking off, especially when faced with a problem like his son becoming the enemy. It's quite common for a child dying (or becoming your worst enemy) causing a marriage to break up and for someone like him, of course he went back to his old habits, what else would he do, become a senator?

Map to Luke? Seemed like they insinuated earlier in the movie that the other parts of the map would need to be located, but BAM R2D2 has all the other parts, don't worry.

A synopsis of the script leaked in April last year. It was exactly like the finished film except for one detail: BB-8 carried not a map to Luke Skywalker, but his lightsaber.
That leaked synopsis did not however tell the reason why Rey was kidnapped by Kylo Ren.
[/quote]I didn't know about the lightsaber, interesting.
Rey was kidnapped by Kylo Ren because Snoke told him too, he can see her power is even greater than Kylo's and wants to convert her to the dark side. This is another of those things that people easily missed or forgot just while watching.

They are planning several movies to deal with things that happened in between, movies centered around specific characters, so we may get a movie detailing what happened to Luke, another regarding Han and Chewy... Rumor is that these will be rolled out between the main movies.

[mesteris]

but how in the **** does Rey just feel like using Force persuasion? She just kind of uses it to escape with no prior knowledge of it? I really hope something explains that.

They did explain it, but you probably didn't notice it. Star Wars likes to leave a lot unsaid, either purposely or accidentally, but it always has left some things unsaid while leaving hints as to what or why.

Anyhow, as to Rey learning, the force was teaching her, just as Vader learned how to use it somewhat when he was child, this was how he was able to pod race. Also, remember how Yoda explained that Qui Gon had learned how to communicate after death? The dream sequence contained Yoda and Obiwans voices. Basically, she was being trained by the force itself, as well as Yoda and Obiwan.

No clones? Fine with me. Finn seems entirely too normal to be kidnapped from his family as a baby and subjected to a lifetime soldier training program though. Why isn't he like...Wow this is normal society and freedom? How neat!... or something? Maybe he's too busy being comic relief.

He wasn't kidnapped, that was a lie to maintain his cover. He is a clone, that's why he didn't have a name.

Did I totally miss the clues that pointed to Finn being a clone? I thought a First Order officer told Kylo how his men were trained and obtained.

I guess the dream sequence could make sense for Rey's sudden use of the force. Guess I'll have to check again at some point as I didn't quite get to digest the whole scene since it was brief.

Apparently I missed a bit so I'll definitely give it another watch at some point, but like I said, I'm more into the lightsaber duels and force lore. So I think the next one has some great potential here with the first Jedi temple etc.

[slip84]

So BB-8 is a sith lord, right?

[Vittra]

Keep in mind that by Episode IV, the Stormtroopers are a mix of DNA templates rather than just from Jango Fett, as well as recruited and "acquired" (aka kidnapped) people. This is a result of the Kamonian rebellion. Being provided a number rather than a name is a way to strip personal identity and build unity between the troops, rather than an indication of him being a clone.. but that's still a fairly possible prediction.

Kylo kidnapped Rey because he believed he could extract the information from her that he needed, rather than continue to chase BB-8. It was only after she resisted him that he saw her potential and wanted to convert her. Snoke showed no interest in Rey in the film.

Regarding the fights - Kylo goes into the Finn/Rey fight physically crippled by a Bowcaster shot, emotionally crippled due to various events (the sith/jedi struggle, killing his father), and most importantly beingundisciplined and unfocused as a force user, regardless of how powerful he may be. The whole movie is setup to show his potential, but how brash, foolish, and undisciplined he currently is. There's suggestion that Rey is even more powerful than he is, and she has already proven herself to be capable of melee combat. Finn, as all stormtroopers, are trained in melee combat. If you re-watch, pay attention to how he uses the Saber. It's handled more like a generic vibrosword, and less with any saber technique a force user would be trained in.

Initially I was pretty disappointed in the portrayal of the Kylo Ren, but after some reflection I can see there's some definite potential for growth in the character - possibly even becoming more interesting than Rey - if things are handled well.

Some of my expectations were my own fault, as Kylo's helmet looks suspiciously similar to Revans, a character that happens to be my favourite of any era.

[baldgye]

I don't think people really expected humor in Star wars, but there was some really good lines in it. Like the trash compactor, or that's not how the force works, or  one of the best lines, when Chewie was cold.

Because the original movies were so serious