[GB] Sentraq TK78 Keyboard Kit (Closing/Troubleshooting)

[breitling]

Are these PCBs good to go? Or should I be testing it? I guess I'll test it anyway but kind of lazy... lol

Just finished testing all the keys on mine before assembly and they're working 100% so mine is good.

[doodersbrother]

Hey sorry for the delays. Got really busy preparing for Christmas. I'll get these out through tomorrow and the next day.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Hey sorry for the delays. Got really busy preparing for Christmas. I'll get these out through tomorrow and the next day.

Great! Hope you had a wonderful Christmas with your family

[Brammm87]

Hey sorry for the delays. Got really busy preparing for Christmas. I'll get these out through tomorrow and the next day.

Oooh baby, are those all boards? As in, mine as well (was one of the last to order)?

[doodersbrother]

Tracking Numbers will be updated soon on the spreadsheet. Link is on the first post of the whole thread.

edit: I'm out right now so it should be up noonish tomorrow

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Yay =D

[doodersbrother]

Check the spreadsheet! Jamtakno and Bramm87's shipped. Rest will be updated tomorrow.

[Brammm87]

Oh man, can't wait

[bciamny]

any update on whether others will be shipped out?

[doodersbrother]

More orders shipped out, check the spreadsheet.

[SmithTheNinja]

Thanks Dooders! So excited for this board!

[breitling]

Man I have re-programmed a lot of boards but never using the firmware from someone's github.. how do you run the software on a windows machine? I also went into TKG site but there's no Sentraq TK78 in the dropdown for boards. Anyone able to help? I can use it with default since its close to what I normally use but it would be nice to program a couple of the keys

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Man I have re-programmed a lot of boards but never using the firmware from someone's github.. how do you run the software on a windows machine? I also went into TKG site but there's no Sentraq TK78 in the dropdown for boards. Anyone able to help? I can use it with default since its close to what I normally use but it would be nice to program a couple of the keys

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Here is the official TMK firmware for the TK78. Which is a fork of the original TMK firmware. However, when programming my planck, I found it easier to use QMK which is a TMK derivative created by Jack Humbert (the creator of OLKB). I might end up re-creating the TK78 matrix into QMK for easier remapping... once I get my new PCB.

[Brammm87]

dooders, my shipping hasn't moved from "shipping label created" since Jan 3d. Assuming it still has to go out?

[doodersbrother]

You should see movement by now? People in the US should've already received.

Also, make sure to test the PCB before committing to soldering the whole thing!

[UsualSuspectXXX]

You should see movement by now? People in the US should've already received.

Mine started moving yesterday afternoon. Thanks for getting replacement PCB's out to us!

[tj_gee]

Have all the replacements shipped or just a few?

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Have all the replacements shipped or just a few?

Link is at the top of the OP. Does not look like yours has shipped.

[Brammm87]

You should see movement by now? People in the US should've already received.

Also, make sure to test the PCB before committing to soldering the whole thing!

Mine changed to "acceptance" on Jan 9th, hasn't moved since. I can wait a little longer

[breitling]

Man I have re-programmed a lot of boards but never using the firmware from someone's github.. how do you run the software on a windows machine? I also went into TKG site but there's no Sentraq TK78 in the dropdown for boards. Anyone able to help? I can use it with default since its close to what I normally use but it would be nice to program a couple of the keys

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Here is the official TMK firmware for the TK78. Which is a fork of the original TMK firmware. However, when programming my planck, I found it easier to use QMK which is a TMK derivative created by Jack Humbert (the creator of OLKB). I might end up re-creating the TK78 matrix into QMK for easier remapping... once I get my new PCB.

Thanks, but how do i run the firmware?

[SmithTheNinja]

Thanks, but how do i run the firmware?

You don't so much run the firmware as build it and install in onto your board.  Check out the QMK Wiki for some guides or try the Build Guide from TMK.  They both have basically the same steps and information.  If you still can't get it there's probably a guide here on the forums somewhere where you can ask for more help.

Also yay! My board is here and first plug in everything works as it's supposed to and all the keys worked correctly when shorted with some tweazers! Time to get soldering so I can post some pictures of this beauty on /r/MK!

Thanks for all the hardwork getting these out Dooders, I can't wait to get clacking away!

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Man I have re-programmed a lot of boards but never using the firmware from someone's github.. how do you run the software on a windows machine? I also went into TKG site but there's no Sentraq TK78 in the dropdown for boards. Anyone able to help? I can use it with default since its close to what I normally use but it would be nice to program a couple of the keys

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Here is the official TMK firmware for the TK78. Which is a fork of the original TMK firmware. However, when programming my planck, I found it easier to use QMK which is a TMK derivative created by Jack Humbert (the creator of OLKB). I might end up re-creating the TK78 matrix into QMK for easier remapping... once I get my new PCB.

Thanks, but how do i run the firmware?

Woops, sorry, didn't see your response. What SmithTheNinja said is true.

To add to that, you should be able to use any hex loader. Teensy Loader and DFU Programmer should both be good options.

Edit: ****ered that up a bit

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Just gave mine a test and everything looks good.

However, I can't figure out how the Num Lock & Caps Lock LED's are supposed to light. Doesn't seem to be dependent on them being active.

Also, seems like the printing on the numpad is a bit off (not that it bothers me)

[SmithTheNinja]

Also don't be like me, the stabs are PCB mount, you need to install them before soldering or you're gonna have a bad time.

[SmithTheNinja]

Not having a lot of luck reprogramming this guy still, dfu-programmer, Atmel FLIP and QMK Firmware Flasher all die in the same spot with an error along these lines.  It seems like I can't erase the chip to reprogram it?  Anyone seen something like this before?

Code: [Select]

Error: Command failed: C:\Program Files (x86)\QMK Firmware Flasher\resources\app/dfu/dfu-programmer.exe atmega32u4 erase --force
Erasing flash...  Success
Checking memory from 0x0 to 0x6FFF...  Not blank at 0x1.

Erasing flash...  Success
Checking memory from 0x0 to 0x6FFF...  Not blank at 0x1.
dfu-programmer atmega32u4 flash *PATH*\tk78-r.hex
Checking memory from 0x0 to 0x5BFF...  Not blank at 0x1.
The target memory for the program is not blank.
Use --force flag to override this error check.
dfu-programmer atmega32u4 reset
Flashing complete!
The board works with the default layout, though the backlight key (fn0 + w) does some odd things, namely it only lights the top row (despite everything lighting up for a split second when plugging it in) and makes it no longer recognize as a keyboard, but I'd live without backlights if I can at least get the keymap I want to work.

EDIT:  The caps right above the MCU are also wicked hot which doesn't seem good... I'm talking burn your finger if you touch them hot.

[doodersbrother]

Not having a lot of luck reprogramming this guy still, dfu-programmer, Atmel FLIP and QMK Firmware Flasher all die in the same spot with an error along these lines.  It seems like I can't erase the chip to reprogram it?  Anyone seen something like this before?

Code: [Select]

Error: Command failed: C:\Program Files (x86)\QMK Firmware Flasher\resources\app/dfu/dfu-programmer.exe atmega32u4 erase --force
Erasing flash...  Success
Checking memory from 0x0 to 0x6FFF...  Not blank at 0x1.

Erasing flash...  Success
Checking memory from 0x0 to 0x6FFF...  Not blank at 0x1.
dfu-programmer atmega32u4 flash *PATH*\tk78-r.hex
Checking memory from 0x0 to 0x5BFF...  Not blank at 0x1.
The target memory for the program is not blank.
Use --force flag to override this error check.
dfu-programmer atmega32u4 reset
Flashing complete!
The board works with the default layout, though the backlight key (fn0 + w) does some odd things, namely it only lights the top row (despite everything lighting up for a split second when plugging it in) and makes it no longer recognize as a keyboard, but I'd live without backlights if I can at least get the keymap I want to work.

EDIT:  The caps right above the MCU are also wicked hot which doesn't seem good... I'm talking burn your finger if you touch them hot.

Hmm I'll get back to you on this

[skullydazed]

EDIT:  The caps right above the MCU are also wicked hot which doesn't seem good... I'm talking burn your finger if you touch them hot.

There's a short somewhere. The MCU should not get that hot.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

EDIT:  The caps right above the MCU are also wicked hot which doesn't seem good... I'm talking burn your finger if you touch them hot.

There's a short somewhere. The MCU should not get that hot.

I was about to say the same thing. This would also explain why the LEDS are only working on the top row.

You should check the LED traces somewhere around where the work and don't work. Should provide some insight as to where the short is (hopefully).

[skuko]

hey guys, i am trying to find someone to take over my order for 180$, any1 interested?

[SmithTheNinja]

hey guys, i am trying to find someone to take over my order for 180$, any1 interested?

I'll PM you when I get home from work. I'd be game for that.

Edit: PM sent

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Alright, so this is kind of strange...

I had tested everything when I got my replacement PCB, all good. Finished soldering everything, plugged it in and everything worked perfectly until I flicked on the LEDs. They all lit up fine, but now I can't get any keypresses to register. Also, I can't turn the LEDs back off with Fn + S.

It almost seems like the LEDs are drawing all of the power away from the controller or the board got wiped somehow.

Any advice would be appreciated, cheers.

[doodersbrother]

Alright, so this is kind of strange...

I had tested everything when I got my replacement PCB, all good. Finished soldering everything, plugged it in and everything worked perfectly until I flicked on the LEDs. They all lit up fine, but now I can't get any keypresses to register. Also, I can't turn the LEDs back off with Fn + S.

It almost seems like the LEDs are drawing all of the power away from the controller or the board got wiped somehow.

Any advice would be appreciated, cheers.

Is it still detected by the computer, and if so can you still flash to it? And keyboard is not working at all, just the LEDs and those are unable to be turned off?

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Alright, so this is kind of strange...

I had tested everything when I got my replacement PCB, all good. Finished soldering everything, plugged it in and everything worked perfectly until I flicked on the LEDs. They all lit up fine, but now I can't get any keypresses to register. Also, I can't turn the LEDs back off with Fn + S.

It almost seems like the LEDs are drawing all of the power away from the controller or the board got wiped somehow.

Any advice would be appreciated, cheers.

Is it still detected by the computer, and if so can you still flash to it? And keyboard is not working at all, just the LEDs and those are unable to be turned off?

I can check in a bit. Let me go compile the firware to flash to it. But yes, only the LEDs turn on, keys do not send keycodes to the computer, and Fn + S does not lower them (which leads me to believe the controller is not running). I'll post back here inna bit after I get to re-flashing

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Plugged in --> all LEDs lit, no output

Using DFU Programmer, ran erase command

Ran flash command with default firmaware

Unplugged/re-plugged in --> no leds lit, all keys worked

Hit Fn + W to enable LEDs --> top row lit up but dim, no keys worked

Unplugged/re-plugged in --> all LEDs lit, no keys worked.

Repeated above steps to flash firmware --> "no device present."

At this point, DFU can no longer see the board to flash.

--

[UsualSuspectXXX]

So, got an update for yall.

Finally got DFU loader to recognize the board again, idk what happened. Did a force flash with the default firmware, all's well.

Installed into the case, popped on all my caps and realized I ****ered up a bit. Left shift was crooked and I had the 1.25u modifiers on the left side one position to the right.



Thank god I already had a solder sucker, so I went ahead and fixed that.



Back to my desk, and and everything is working fine...

Plugged in a different USB cable, all of the LEDs lit up, and I expected nothing to work...





Then all of a sudden (while taking that last picture), the LEDS turned off, board kept working. Turned LEDs on, and only top row lit up, then turned off. Nothing worked again.

Unplugged, re-plugged in, and no LEDs, but it's working again. Mostly. Four keys stopped working (Fn, RCtrl, Num0, NumDot).

Now I'm back to DFU loader no longer seeing the board...

This really feels like there is a sever issue with the LED controller

[doodersbrother]

So, got an update for yall.

Finally got DFU loader to recognize the board again, idk what happened. Did a force flash with the default firmware, all's well.

Installed into the case, popped on all my caps and realized I ****ered up a bit. Left shift was crooked and I had the 1.25u modifiers on the left side one position to the right.

Show Image

Thank god I already had a solder sucker, so I went ahead and fixed that.

Show Image

Back to my desk, and and everything is working fine...

Plugged in a different USB cable, all of the LEDs lit up, and I expected nothing to work...

Show Image

Show Image

Then all of a sudden (while taking that last picture), the LEDS turned off, board kept working. Turned LEDs on, and only top row lit up, then turned off. Nothing worked again.

Unplugged, re-plugged in, and no LEDs, but it's working again. Mostly. Four keys stopped working (Fn, RCtrl, Num0, NumDot).

Now I'm back to DFU loader no longer seeing the board...

This really feels like there is a sever issue with the LED controller

Alright, I'm still trying to figure out what could be going on. Can you post pics of the PCB, specifically the controller and LED driver?

Great looking board btw, love the color scheme. Just a shame you're having these issues.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

So, got an update for yall.

Finally got DFU loader to recognize the board again, idk what happened. Did a force flash with the default firmware, all's well.

Installed into the case, popped on all my caps and realized I ****ered up a bit. Left shift was crooked and I had the 1.25u modifiers on the left side one position to the right.

Show Image

Thank god I already had a solder sucker, so I went ahead and fixed that.

Show Image

Back to my desk, and and everything is working fine...

Plugged in a different USB cable, all of the LEDs lit up, and I expected nothing to work...

Show Image

Show Image

Then all of a sudden (while taking that last picture), the LEDS turned off, board kept working. Turned LEDs on, and only top row lit up, then turned off. Nothing worked again.

Unplugged, re-plugged in, and no LEDs, but it's working again. Mostly. Four keys stopped working (Fn, RCtrl, Num0, NumDot).

Now I'm back to DFU loader no longer seeing the board...

This really feels like there is a sever issue with the LED controller

Alright, I'm still trying to figure out what could be going on. Can you post pics of the PCB, specifically the controller and LED driver?

Great looking board btw, love the color scheme. Just a shame you're having these issues.

Thanks. I really do love how it looks in black/green with the blanks on it!


This should be enough pictures to get started. Sorry for potatoes. If you need some better pics or more detail of a specific area, please let me know, I'd be happy to.

http://imgur.com/a/37b0X

[skullydazed]

So, got an update for yall.

Finally got DFU loader to recognize the board again, idk what happened. Did a force flash with the default firmware, all's well.

Installed into the case, popped on all my caps and realized I ****ered up a bit. Left shift was crooked and I had the 1.25u modifiers on the left side one position to the right.

Show Image

Thank god I already had a solder sucker, so I went ahead and fixed that.

Show Image

Back to my desk, and and everything is working fine...

Plugged in a different USB cable, all of the LEDs lit up, and I expected nothing to work...

Show Image

Show Image

Then all of a sudden (while taking that last picture), the LEDS turned off, board kept working. Turned LEDs on, and only top row lit up, then turned off. Nothing worked again.

Unplugged, re-plugged in, and no LEDs, but it's working again. Mostly. Four keys stopped working (Fn, RCtrl, Num0, NumDot).

Now I'm back to DFU loader no longer seeing the board...

This really feels like there is a sever issue with the LED controller

Alright, I'm still trying to figure out what could be going on. Can you post pics of the PCB, specifically the controller and LED driver?

Great looking board btw, love the color scheme. Just a shame you're having these issues.

Thanks. I really do love how it looks in black/green with the blanks on it!


This should be enough pictures to get started. Sorry for potatoes. If you need some better pics or more detail of a specific area, please let me know, I'd be happy to.

http://imgur.com/a/37b0X

When it was assembled someone got the positions of a capacitor and a resistor wrong. I'm not sure how your board ever worked like that but that would explain some of what you're seeing.



It also appears that most of the decoupling caps have been removed to accommodate the change to TQFP. This would explain why the problem manifests when you turn the backlight on and/or up. Without those caps the current draw from the LEDs turning on is too much for the MCU to withstand and it halts.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

When it was assembled someone got the positions of a capacitor and a resistor wrong. I'm not sure how your board ever worked like that but that would explain some of what you're seeing.

Show Image

It also appears that most of the decoupling caps have been removed to accommodate the change to TQFP. This would explain why the problem manifests when you turn the backlight on and/or up. Without those caps the current draw from the LEDs turning on is too much for the MCU to withstand and it halts.

Oh boy. I've never done any surface mount soldering, you think this is something that I can fix?

As for the second thing that you mentioned, what "decoupling caps" are you talking about? And what is TQFP?

In terms of overpowering the MCU, that makes sense. Surprisingly, everything worked with the LEDs on for a good 5 or 10 minutes.
And I guess the capacitor and resistor could explain why the board suddenly stopped working, but I agree, I'm surprised this works/worked at all to begin with.

Thanks for taking the time to look into my issues. Would you advise me to try to fix this PCB? And could you give me any suggestions for the SMD related soldering?

[doodersbrother]

When it was assembled someone got the positions of a capacitor and a resistor wrong. I'm not sure how your board ever worked like that but that would explain some of what you're seeing.

Show Image

It also appears that most of the decoupling caps have been removed to accommodate the change to TQFP. This would explain why the problem manifests when you turn the backlight on and/or up. Without those caps the current draw from the LEDs turning on is too much for the MCU to withstand and it halts.

Oh boy. I've never done any surface mount soldering, you think this is something that I can fix?

As for the second thing that you mentioned, what "decoupling caps" are you talking about? And what is TQFP?

In terms of overpowering the MCU, that makes sense. Surprisingly, everything worked with the LEDs on for a good 5 or 10 minutes.
And I guess the capacitor and resistor could explain why the board suddenly stopped working, but I agree, I'm surprised this works/worked at all to begin with.

Thanks for taking the time to look into my issues. Would you advise me to try to fix this PCB? And could you give me any suggestions for the SMD related soldering?

Decoupling caps limit the power delivered. TQFP is the package (form factor?) Of the controller. The PCB originally used a QFN package.

I'm not sure correcting the caps and resistors will fully fix it when decoupling caps are missing.

I'm out with the family right now, but I'll get back to you after.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Decoupling caps limit the power delivered. TQFP is the package (form factor?) Of the controller. The PCB originally used a QFN package.

I'm not sure correcting the caps and resistors will fully fix it when decoupling caps are missing.

I'm out with the family right now, but I'll get back to you after.

Thanks dooders. Enjoy your time with the family!

[skullydazed]

Decoupling caps limit the power delivered. TQFP is the package (form factor?) Of the controller. The PCB originally used a QFN package.

I'm not sure correcting the caps and resistors will fully fix it when decoupling caps are missing.

I'm out with the family right now, but I'll get back to you after.

Thanks dooders. Enjoy your time with the family!

I think fixing the cap/resistor that have been swapped will fix the "it doesn't come back ever after replugging" problem. The LED's turning on can still cause the undercurrent problem, but with the other problem fixed the MCU should reset and start working again after the current stabilizes. The decoupling caps can be added by soldering something like this directly to the proper pins on the MCU.

As for whether or not you can fix it, that's really a question you can answer better than I can. It's well within anyone's ability to do a swap like that, the question is whether you have the patience to do it by yourself without an experienced hand to watch and guide. I can honestly say that before I spent some time soldering SMD components I would not have had the patience. I have friends who did have the patience, and after they learned they taught me. You'll have to figure out which side of that fence you're on.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

I think fixing the cap/resistor that have been swapped will fix the "it doesn't come back ever after replugging" problem. The LED's turning on can still cause the undercurrent problem, but with the other problem fixed the MCU should reset and start working again after the current stabilizes. The decoupling caps can be added by soldering something like this directly to the proper pins on the MCU.

As for whether or not you can fix it, that's really a question you can answer better than I can. It's well within anyone's ability to do a swap like that, the question is whether you have the patience to do it by yourself without an experienced hand to watch and guide. I can honestly say that before I spent some time soldering SMD components I would not have had the patience. I have friends who did have the patience, and after they learned they taught me. You'll have to figure out which side of that fence you're on.

I guess I'll have to order some smaller soldering tips before  give it a shot though. Thanks for your help.

[SmithTheNinja]

Dang Skully you have eagle eyes for figuring that out so quick!

Also Dooders, mines the same deal with those caps and resisters being swapped so I would check the other boards that you have.

Does anyone have specs on what that resister and that cap are?  I'm not the best at surface mounted soldering and have junked a few parts getting them off of boards in the past, so I would like to grab a few extras in case I screw it up.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

When it was assembled someone got the positions of a capacitor and a resistor wrong. I'm not sure how your board ever worked like that but that would explain some of what you're seeing.

Show Image

It also appears that most of the decoupling caps have been removed to accommodate the change to TQFP. This would explain why the problem manifests when you turn the backlight on and/or up. Without those caps the current draw from the LEDs turning on is too much for the MCU to withstand and it halts.

skully, when I get around to switching these two components, what is the correct orientation of the resistor? Should it be the same as the picture or the same as the other resistor?

[SmithTheNinja]

skully, when I get around to switching these two components, what is the correct orientation of the resistor? Should it be the same as the picture or the same as the other resistor?

Resistors aren't directional.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

skully, when I get around to switching these two components, what is the correct orientation of the resistor? Should it be the same as the picture or the same as the other resistor?

Resistors aren't directional.

Good to know. Thanks

[doodersbrother]

skully, when I get around to switching these two components, what is the correct orientation of the resistor? Should it be the same as the picture or the same as the other resistor?

Resistors aren't directional.

Good to know. Thanks

Hey, how is it going? Any progress?

[UsualSuspectXXX]

skully, when I get around to switching these two components, what is the correct orientation of the resistor? Should it be the same as the picture or the same as the other resistor?

Resistors aren't directional.

Good to know. Thanks

Hey, how is it going? Any progress?

Haven't gotten a chance to swap cap and resistor yet. Need to pick up some desoldering wick first. Should be able to get to it Saturday night though. I appreciate you checking in though.

[UsualSuspectXXX]

Well, **** me.

I was doing so good, had both of them desoldered, moved the resistor over, and then I dropped the cap. Just spent the last 20 minutes looking all over the floor with one of those bright shop lights. nothing ='[

Can't even explain how angry I feel at myself right now