Author Topic: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65% - Prototypes in Production  (Read 24200 times)

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Offline Jae-3soteric

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Welcome to the interest check for the Lodestone, a collaboration between Flex (of the FLX-Virgo) and Jae (of the J-01 & J-02).

This is an early interest check for a magnet mounted and gasket combo 65%. The board is a blocked 65% with stylish base, and chunky bezels. Designed to look sleek and unique, with a seamless side profile, the board is as elegant as she is functional.



Design
Using the standard 65% layout, and inspired by large rounded bezels, the design puts aesthetic alongside function. This layout has long been popular within the community, and for good reason. With support for all usual layouts on the PCB (incl ISO, split or full left shift / right shift / backspace, and a few variations on the bottom row) you can be sure to be able to build this board to the layout of your choice. Please note - the top blocker area is till a work in progress. There is a version with or without it as currently stands.



Updates
Updates will be posted here and on my discord: https://discord.gg/qm944aC
You should also check out Flex's discord here: https://discord.gg/KRAuQRc



MagLev & Gasket Mounting
The board features a unique mounting system, comprising of both magnetic levitation for a cushioned feel, and a top mount gasket to isolate the plate from the case. This reduces ping and noise transference from the plate to the case; and will highlight the true sound of the switches and caps without detracting from the maglev experience.

This design requires a firmer plate material, due to the way the typing feel is accentuated by the forces applied to the magnetic repulsion when typing. As such we will default to Carbon Fibre, as it is non magnetic and rigid, whilst offering an even feel. Even so, due to the unique interplay with the magnets, the typing experience is cushioned across the board.




Naming
The first magnets were not invented, but rather were found from a naturally occurring mineral called magnetite. The mineral magnetite is an iron oxide that is easily magnetized when it forms. Magnetite is also known as Lodestone.



Prototypes
A prototype of the current iteration of design is on order and will be used as a test bed to determine the correct orientation and volume of magnets required. Through rapid prototyping we have experimented with multiple magnet mounting solutions to test the forces applied and required to keep an interesting typing feel.

Once the final Prototype is here we will share details of the build and videos of the experience you can expect.



Proof of Concept
We have completed multiple iterations of the board, and some working examples of how the mounting will work. Whilst there is too many iterations to share in the IC, I thought it would be useful for you to Flex's original POC with mounting two boards on a rigid, adjustable plane, and the strength of the magnets intended for use.

These invaluable experiments and multiple iterations have really shaped the final design.




Specification
  • 2piece case - Aluminium
  • Plate - Carbon Fibre (fixed ISO and ANSI variants)
  • PCB - USB C and QMK Compatible (ESD protected)
  • Breakout Daughterboard
  • 7 degree Angle
  • Colours TBC
  • Gasket; 1.5mm Nitrile Rubber



Group-Buy Details
Whilst we would like to take this product to Group Buy, we are dependent on the prototypes success. We have a good level of confidence, and believe in the potential of this board to deliver a new and innovative solution to the market.

Initially it would likely be a small 50 unit run post the prototype completion; with the potential for larger runs later if demand is there. No dates are currently planned for this; however the aspirational plan is that we would be looking at April for the first run.



Next Steps
  • More renders
  • Receive Prototype
  • Build and test Prototype
  • Share results
  • Arrange GB pending prototype success



Render Gallery
« Last Edit: Sat, 14 March 2020, 05:41:49 by Jae-3soteric »

Offline huey

  • Posts: 34
  • Location: UK
Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #1 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:53:41 »
Those are some THICC bezels, I love it.

Offline cijanzen

  • Posts: 471
Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #2 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:53:58 »
Gorgeous board and interesting concept. Iím excited to see where this goes!

Offline Kasterborous

  • Posts: 90
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Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #3 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:54:19 »
Yes pls

Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #4 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:54:46 »
MagLev

Offline bard

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Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #5 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:56:16 »
WKL? pleeeeeease ;)

Offline mrkantz

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Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #6 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:56:28 »
Oh hell yes

Offline bill_ng117

  • Posts: 16
Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #7 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:57:04 »
This is incredibly interesting Jae! Canít wait to see prototypes and soundtests  :thumb:

Offline 7empest

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Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #8 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:57:17 »
maglev eh???? i am interested for sure!

Offline SolidCactus

  • Posts: 225
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Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:58:18 »
Magnets ;D  Looking forward to seeing how this one works out

Offline mgsickler

  • Posts: 620
Re: [IC] Loadstone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 08:59:06 »
This is crazy. Iím in.

Offline Carcha

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #11 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:01:26 »
I love it. Definitely interested!

Offline AcroNiseR

  • Posts: 5
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #12 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:02:58 »
Looks super sweet and itís 65%. Looking forward to seeing prototype and sound test!

Offline Bleddyn

  • Posts: 57
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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #13 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:04:51 »
This may well be my first 65% if it all comes out on a timeline i can work with. Love the Thick bezel look same as i loved the exent, more is better for to me in the looks department.

Offline Rob27shred

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #14 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:09:53 »
Wow, crazy ideal I really hope works out! Not a huge fan of the wide bezels, but that is something I can easily overlook because of the novel mounting system you guys are trying to put into place here. GL with everything moving forward!

Offline Xdoc6

  • Posts: 7
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #15 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:10:43 »
Iíve actually been thinking of a maglev keyboard design for the last few months. Glad to see Iím not the only one to think of it lol. Looks awesome!!

Offline hughtrue

  • Posts: 11
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #16 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:11:50 »
Like the design, not sure about the big bezel and iso layout  ;D

Offline Jae-3soteric

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #17 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:13:17 »
Wow, crazy ideal I really hope works out! Not a huge fan of the wide bezels, but that is something I can easily overlook because of the novel mounting system you guys are trying to put into place here. GL with everything moving forward!

Yeah we needed the bezels to hold the magnets in place and be the right size and thin enough to support as needed - we actually considered many types of magnet and positions before settling on this one

Iíve actually been thinking of a maglev keyboard design for the last few months. Glad to see Iím not the only one to think of it lol. Looks awesome!!


Awesome!! I've been toying with this since teh J-01 with the mag mounted pen rail. It took Flex to make the design work

Offline Jae-3soteric

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #18 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:14:13 »
Like the design, not sure about the big bezel and iso layout  ;D

It'll support ANSI!!!  :p

The bezels are there for the magnets mainly

Offline OmniSzron

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #19 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:21:47 »
Between this and the Evolv I am very impressed with the innovation in the community this year. Also, the design is gorgeous. That bottom piece is beautiful and the thick bezels look stunning. Love the seamless frame, too.

My only question here would be whether this MagLev implementation is susceptible to de-magnetization over time. Other MagLev applications I know of (japanese trains and computer fans) all use electromagnets to achieve suspension (that's why they're called EMS - Electromagnetic Suspension). This (I assume) uses permanent magnets, which can lose miniscule amounts of magnetism over time and can be completely demagnetized if exposed to a magnetic field of a reversed polarity. Temperature is also a factor in retaining magnetic properties. Is this something that was considered during the design process?
Varmilo VA87M | Anne Pro

Offline Surefoot

  • Posts: 232
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #20 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:23:02 »
Looks real good. These units will fly off quickly...

Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #21 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:23:50 »
I'm really digging that orange color board.  Orange + Thicc.  I'm in.

Offline Senor Coconut

  • Posts: 94
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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #22 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:25:57 »
Large Bezel + magnetic cushion + ISO = music to my ears!

You might need to write a few lines addressing the unmagnetizing possibilities and conditions?
,,,

Offline kjang

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #23 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:34:34 »
Looks great! Those orange renders are amazing.

What's the reason for not having an upper-right key? Would love a standard layout or something special to go in that corner.

Offline dantambok

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #24 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:37:45 »
what the...
Stuff  I have
More
2x TGR Alice / TGR 910 RE / TGR 910 CE / TGR 910 VKC / 2x TGR Jane V2 / 2x Matrix 2.0 / Matrix 2.2 / 2x Matrix 1.2OG / Lyn Whale v2 / Lyn EM7 v3 / DK Saver / Keycult No. 1/60 / Hachi / Kyuu / Duck Orion V2 / 3x TGRxSinga Unikorn / QXP / TX1800 V1 /  JER80 / TMO50 / 2x 86u / ION i69 / LZ MP / Rukia / 2x FMJ80 / TGR Jane V2 CE / UTD 360C / Matrix Project F / IDB60 / Matrix Noah / is0 

Coming soon --  MXSS / Modern M0110 / PC HBCP / Noxary 280S / Noxary XRF / LZ PhysiX / Keycult 1/60 rev1 / Lynx50 / Matrix 2.0 OG / 2x GSKT-00 / Duck Viper v3 / FLX Virgo / Noxary Vulcan Pro

40 ish sets and 30ish sets in GB

Offline lolafineday

  • Posts: 274
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #25 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:40:07 »
The magnets will support all the weight of the  switches and keycaps?

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk


Offline clasicks

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #26 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:40:08 »
jae 65 so bad pls men gltho

Offline Zeelobby

  • Posts: 692
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #27 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:44:59 »
Between this and the Evolv I am very impressed with the innovation in the community this year. Also, the design is gorgeous. That bottom piece is beautiful and the thick bezels look stunning. Love the seamless frame, too.

My only question here would be whether this MagLev implementation is susceptible to de-magnetization over time. Other MagLev applications I know of (japanese trains and computer fans) all use electromagnets to achieve suspension (that's why they're called EMS - Electromagnetic Suspension). This (I assume) uses permanent magnets, which can lose miniscule amounts of magnetism over time and can be completely demagnetized if exposed to a magnetic field of a reversed polarity. Temperature is also a factor in retaining magnetic properties. Is this something that was considered during the design process?
Under normal conditions neodymium magnets lose 1% force over 10 years. Unless as you stated some weird science happens. They should be fine. There are also "permanent" magnets, though expensive.

Offline godofdeath

  • Posts: 355
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #28 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:49:59 »
interested
Had
DAS blue
DAS brown
Realforce 103ub

Current
Filco 104 browns

Offline nguyenhimself

  • Posts: 657
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #29 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 09:59:01 »
Everything looks great. As a Mac user though, I dearly wish you'd have a 1.25u-1.25u-1.25u bottom row. 1u WK (or ⌥ for Mac) is rather unergonomic for macOS usage.

Offline hkiri

  • Posts: 132
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #30 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:00:02 »
From an innovation standpoint: Highly interested!
Design-wise: Well...

Offline Jae-3soteric

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #31 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:01:06 »
The magnets will support all the weight of the  switches and keycaps?

Yes - easily.

Large Bezel + magnetic cushion + ISO = music to my ears!

You might need to write a few lines addressing the unmagnetizing possibilities and conditions?

Between this and the Evolv I am very impressed with the innovation in the community this year. Also, the design is gorgeous. That bottom piece is beautiful and the thick bezels look stunning. Love the seamless frame, too.

My only question here would be whether this MagLev implementation is susceptible to de-magnetization over time. Other MagLev applications I know of (japanese trains and computer fans) all use electromagnets to achieve suspension (that's why they're called EMS - Electromagnetic Suspension). This (I assume) uses permanent magnets, which can lose miniscule amounts of magnetism over time and can be completely demagnetized if exposed to a magnetic field of a reversed polarity. Temperature is also a factor in retaining magnetic properties. Is this something that was considered during the design process?

The Magnet lifespan was def considered. The Neodymium magnets we intend to use will only lose 1% of their repulsion force every ten years in this type of application. We will also share where the magnets can be bought from if anyone does accidentally expose their keyboard to a large electromagnet capable of damaging the mounting system.

Looks great! Those orange renders are amazing.

What's the reason for not having an upper-right key? Would love a standard layout or something special to go in that corner.

Just havent decided as yet - it was a design affectation just for the proto, but as you can see on the plate we do have a key there. This is just an early IC so will have more details post the Prototype. (personally I think we will just end up with a key there)


Offline Jae-3soteric

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #32 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:01:49 »
Everything looks great. As a Mac user though, I dearly wish you'd have a 1.25u-1.25u-1.25u bottom row. 1u WK (or ⌥ for Mac) is rather unergonomic for macOS usage.

Multiple bottom rows will be avail - fear not!! I'll double check we included that on the OP as I thought we had

Offline Jae-3soteric

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #33 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:02:55 »
From an innovation standpoint: Highly interested!
Design-wise: Well...

Each to their own :D

We needed the bezels to house the magnets. The base is my favourite part

Offline nguyenhimself

  • Posts: 657
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #34 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:09:58 »
Looks great! Those orange renders are amazing.

What's the reason for not having an upper-right key? Would love a standard layout or something special to go in that corner.
I'm probably the minority here, but I prefer no key there for one actually practical reason:
When I need to delete text, I tend to just throw my finger to the upper left for Backspace without looking.
This often backfires when I use a 65% because I sometimes hit the key to the right of Backspace instead.
A logo there would be nice too.
« Last Edit: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:12:08 by nguyenhimself »

Offline hkiri

  • Posts: 132
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #35 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:11:16 »
From an innovation standpoint: Highly interested!
Design-wise: Well...

Each to their own :D

We needed the bezels to house the magnets. The base is my favourite part

I thought something like this.

Well, the J-02 grew on me too during the weeks leading to the GB. We will see if this is also the case with Lodestone ;)

Offline fabijolo

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #36 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:13:53 »
Although I'm not the biggest fan of the case design, the MagLev mounting mechanism definitely caught my attention, very interesting and innovative, great idea!

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #37 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:15:22 »
Very interesting mounting concept.  Not a fan of the wide bezel and skinny blocker. Top right blocked is /yawn at this point. Maybe consider Fc660c layout.  Looks better with big bezels. 

Offline OmniSzron

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #38 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:15:40 »
Quote
The Magnet lifespan was def considered. The Neodymium magnets we intend to use will only lose 1% of their repulsion force every ten years in this type of application. We will also share where the magnets can be bought from if anyone does accidentally expose their keyboard to a large electromagnet capable of damaging the mounting system.
Great to hear. The possibility of just replacing the magnets completely alleviates any concerns I had about the mounting system. :)

Quote
it was a design affectation just for the proto, but as you can see on the plate we do have a key there. This is just an early IC so will have more details post the Prototype. (personally I think we will just end up with a key there)
Personally, I would just engrave a little symbol resembling the schematic of a magnetic field. Something similar to this:
Varmilo VA87M | Anne Pro

Offline Peripheral Prophet

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #39 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:25:57 »
This is how you win at keyboards.. I love this.
Check out my live build streams on twitch and join my discord! https://discord.gg/QzeSQj2  https://www.twitch.tv/peripheral_installer

Offline nephlock

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #40 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:26:18 »
Bezel me daddy

Offline mrpetrov

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #41 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:28:55 »
we are living in the future!

flex and jae - apart from the mounting tech, which is super cool - that base looks divine. sensual curves. definitely a she.
« Last Edit: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:30:36 by mrpetrov »

Offline GMK83

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #42 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:30:01 »
Pretty interesting design.  Looking forward to updates.

Offline Vigrith

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #43 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:38:05 »
Love everything about it. Best of luck making it a reality and I look forward to purchasing a unit. Great work.

PS: WKL blocker.

Offline scatology

  • Posts: 57
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #44 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:44:33 »
Really cool mounting concept! You should put a logo, insert or something in the top right corner. It would look neat.
« Last Edit: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:47:02 by scatology »

Offline dom

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #45 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 10:54:00 »
 :thumb:  ME like it!

Online Hawksmoor

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #46 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 11:05:47 »
Very nice and interesting concept.
Could i ask what the expected front height is please?

Offline i luv chuletas

  • Posts: 126
Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #47 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 11:07:37 »
Finally, this becomes official! In for one, for sure!

Online o3okevin

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #48 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 11:20:10 »
hype

Offline Shutter_Shock

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Re: [IC] Lodestone - a Gasket and MagLev mount 65%
« Reply #49 on: Sun, 16 February 2020, 11:45:55 »
You definitely have my attention. Also love the GMK Midnight Rainbow in the renders. Can't wait for that set's gb to go live later this year!