must... resist... topre

[swill]

can't... resist... topre...

and off to the dark side i go...  i just bought a FC660C.  i figure it is the best topre board for me to get my feet wet with.  want to try the ~60% size and want to try topre and this is the least expensive topre board i could find. 

if this goes well, i will probably be in the market for an hhkb, but we will see...

[ComradeSniper]

The lack of arrow keys does worry me a bit, well more than a bit as I use them often in my daily work. It's a lot of money to just give it a shot but I'm really intrigued by the layout. If I can't use it for work it would be fine for home use.

You should get the FC660C if you need the arrow cluster.

This.

Some people have reported getting used to the Fn+something to get arrow key functionality from the HHKB, but maybe because I switch between layouts too often I haven't gotten used to it yet.

I've had more trouble getting used to the backspace location than anything else. Still, the layout is growing on me and I'm beginning to wish that every keyboard had the HHKB layout.

[Michael]

Here is a precise example of what it is like to type on Topre switches:

[jwaz]

Here is a precise example of what it is like to type on Topre switches:

Show Image

Pretty much.

[PadawanGeek]

Here is a precise example of what it is like to type on Topre switches:

Show Image

Hallellujah, Bro Caps speaks the truth!  ;D

[Belfong]

Isn't that too mushy then?

[rowdy]

The lack of arrow keys does worry me a bit, well more than a bit as I use them often in my daily work. It's a lot of money to just give it a shot but I'm really intrigued by the layout. If I can't use it for work it would be fine for home use.

You should get the FC660C if you need the arrow cluster.

This.

Some people have reported getting used to the Fn+something to get arrow key functionality from the HHKB, but maybe because I switch between layouts too often I haven't gotten used to it yet.

I've had more trouble getting used to the backspace location than anything else. Still, the layout is growing on me and I'm beginning to wish that every keyboard had the HHKB layout.

I switched to the backspace just like that (clicks his fingers).  Switching back at work on a standard TKL was like \\\\\\\\\\\\ all the time.

[terran5992]

Here is a precise example of what it is like to type on Topre switches:

Show Image

~cloud of bewbs~

[rowdy]

But that space bar suggests that it is not the true cup rubber.

[Michael]

But that space bar suggests that it is not the true cup rubber.

It falls well below the cup rubber. It's an extra

[frvrngn]

I thought of the FC660C but honestly the size of the Type Heaven doesn't bother me all that much. The HHKB just has that allure to it that makes me want to try it!

[Sniping]

Yeah, the looks of the HHKB are pretty undisputed. Note that the FC660C has different sound from the Type Heaven, not sure if you know this already
(I think this is hyde's video if I remember correctly)

[frvrngn]

Thanks for the video. I wonder what it is that makes the sound different. The videos of the HHKB sound are one reason I want to try it so much!

I do need to tackle the silencing mod on the Type Heaven soon.

[keymaster]

Type Heaven uses ABS keycaps.

[frvrngn]

My mistake,  I thought it also used ABS to keep the price lower than RF. Thanks for the correction.

[unicomp_uc]

Well guys... the OP has yet again failed to resist Topre. Just ordered my black Realforce 87U silent for the office. I got sick of carrying my HHKB to and from work. Can't wait for it to get here!

Once elitekeyboards gets the white key caps back in stock they will be added. Eventually I'll get the tenkey pad and the Filco wristrest. $560 for a work keyboard set-up. I'm an idiot...

[tuxsavvy]

Well guys... the OP has yet again failed to resist Topre. Just ordered my black Realforce 87U silent for the office. I got sick of carrying my HHKB to and from work. Can't wait for it to get here!

Once elitekeyboards gets the white key caps back in stock they will be added. Eventually I'll get the tenkey pad and the Filco wristrest. $560 for a work keyboard set-up. I'm an idiot...

Like I said,"Resistance is futile!" and now I shall greet you like a happy seller whom just took away your money,"Thank you very much!"  )

Seriously it is pretty hard to avoid Topre when you can see the rest of us Toppers are happily talk/brag about it.

[terran5992]

Well guys... the OP has yet again failed to resist Topre. Just ordered my black Realforce 87U silent for the office. I got sick of carrying my HHKB to and from work. Can't wait for it to get here!

Once elitekeyboards gets the white key caps back in stock they will be added. Eventually I'll get the tenkey pad and the Filco wristrest. $560 for a work keyboard set-up. I'm an idiot...

One Does not simply resist topre

[rowdy]

Well guys... the OP has yet again failed to resist Topre. Just ordered my black Realforce 87U silent for the office. I got sick of carrying my HHKB to and from work. Can't wait for it to get here!

Once elitekeyboards gets the white key caps back in stock they will be added. Eventually I'll get the tenkey pad and the Filco wristrest. $560 for a work keyboard set-up. I'm an idiot...

No, you are a True Geekhacker!

[unicomp_uc]

I cancelled my order for the Realforce. I want the board, but I think I really want the white/gray version. It's hard to tell, from the pictures- does anyone know if the white and gray color schemes are the exact same color? I know it's different companies, but some pictures seem really similar and some of the Realforce pictures come appear as though the gray is more of an older IBM style gray.

Elitekeyboards is out of the white/gray, but ETA "in November" so if I get confirmation that the color is the same as my HHKB I'll wait.

[spiceBar]

I cancelled my order for the Realforce. I want the board, but I think I really want the white/gray version. It's hard to tell, from the pictures- does anyone know if the white and gray color schemes are the exact same color? I know it's different companies, but some pictures seem really similar and some of the Realforce pictures come appear as though the gray is more of an older IBM style gray.

Elitekeyboards is out of the white/gray, but ETA "in November" so if I get confirmation that the color is the same as my HHKB I'll wait.

Wow! Incredible how all the Realforce models flew off the shelves at EliteKeyboards!

You did well by canceling your order. On the black on black model the key legends are absolutely unreadable. I have a 88UB black on black and so I can tell you.

The white models look so much better! It's worth the wait IMO.

I cannot really answer your question about the color, as I don't own an HHKB, but what I can say is that I find the colors are fine. FWIW.

[dustinhxc]

Well guys... the OP has yet again failed to resist Topre. Just ordered my black Realforce 87U silent for the office. I got sick of carrying my HHKB to and from work. Can't wait for it to get here!

Once elitekeyboards gets the white key caps back in stock they will be added. Eventually I'll get the tenkey pad and the Filco wristrest. $560 for a work keyboard set-up. I'm an idiot...

One Does not simply resist topre

The truth.. Im giving in..

[reziak]

I've been holding out for a few months now, but I think I'm going to finally pull the trigger this month. It's really too bad you can't buy the HHKB with a black body and white/gray keycaps! Hands down my favorite keyboard look.

[ithinkimkorean]

Now I really want an hhkb just to put my new clack on...

[unicomp_uc]

I've been holding out for a few months now, but I think I'm going to finally pull the trigger this month. It's really too bad you can't buy the HHKB with a black body and white/gray keycaps! Hands down my favorite keyboard look.

Just pretend your black board costs $78 more than it really does and then your ideal combination is "free"... Geekhack logic

[dragonxx21]

I really want to get a topre. What's wrong with me.

[Moosecraft]

Now I really want an hhkb just to put my new clack on...

Or you could sell it to me

[vun]

I tried to resist, but recently gave in to temptation, and I'm glad I did because Realforce boards are amazing. This will now have to fight my edox over the daily driver status.

[ithinkimkorean]

Now I really want an hhkb just to put my new clack on...

Or you could sell it to me

Finally got lucky and joined on the clack game without spending 100+ for one. Can't give it up now. 

[rowdy]

Now I really want an hhkb just to put my new clack on...

Or you could sell it to me

Finally got lucky and joined on the clack game without spending 100+ for one. Can't give it up now. 

The first time you actually see one in person, like ... wow!

[reziak]

I've been holding out for a few months now, but I think I'm going to finally pull the trigger this month. It's really too bad you can't buy the HHKB with a black body and white/gray keycaps! Hands down my favorite keyboard look.

Just pretend your black board costs $78 more than it really does and then your ideal combination is "free"... Geekhack logic

Thank you. Conscience is clear. 

[unicomp_uc]

I'm so back and forth. I just re-ordered the black realforce silent. The more I thought about it, the more I realized I'd probably like the black better on my light colored desk at work and I think the white/gray combo works best on the HHKB the more pics I look at last night.

O well, at least the agony of going back and forth is done! Now, I wait.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

I started getting odd pains in my hands and wrists ever since moving from scissor and straight rubber dome to Cherry MX brown/blue several years ago. Not carpal tunnel — this is the pinky side of my hand (forget what that one is called). These pains are annoying, and come and go every week or two.

I still have my MX blue at home, but at work I've been back on my Realforce for a few months, for a change. My hands and wrists feel all the better for it (though as I write this, I've just started getting a bit of pain in both hands!)

It may be that, no matter how adjusted I am to MX switches, I'm still suffering from the hard landing of the switches. I don't know. Personally I prefer MX brown, but my wrists most definitely prefer Topre ;-)

[spiceBar]

I'm so back and forth. I just re-ordered the black realforce silent. The more I thought about it, the more I realized I'd probably like the black better on my light colored desk at work and I think the white/gray combo works best on the HHKB the more pics I look at last night.

O well, at least the agony of going back and forth is done! Now, I wait.

So at least you know that you won't be able to read the legends on the keycaps. You have been warned.

[Belfong]

The point of barely able to read the keys is so that one day you can use blanks!

[unicomp_uc]

I'm so back and forth. I just re-ordered the black realforce silent. The more I thought about it, the more I realized I'd probably like the black better on my light colored desk at work and I think the white/gray combo works best on the HHKB the more pics I look at last night.

O well, at least the agony of going back and forth is done! Now, I wait.

So at least you know that you won't be able to read the legends on the keycaps. You have been warned.

I happily own a blank HHKB and purchased and am waiting on the arrival of blank DSA PBT's for my Minila. I touch type, so I don't rely on them. I love keyboards without legends unless the legends evoke a feeling in me. The HHKB with printed legends I really like, actually. I may end up buying a set to be able to switch back and forth when my moods change.

[spiceBar]

The point of barely able to read the keys is so that one day you can use blanks!

Well if you spend most of your time typing text, it's great. You will be forced to learn touch typing.

If you use your keyboard to program, it's really a different story. You can't really touch-type when you program, because it's more like typing one word or two and then a bunch of random symbols, then a word or two and so on. And then you need to go back one line or two and edit something...

You can't touch-type because your hands are constantly away from the home row. Well, you can, but it's very inefficient.

So I have found that using a blank keyboard for programming is very hard.

I wanted to warn him.

[unicomp_uc]

The point of barely able to read the keys is so that one day you can use blanks!

Well if you spend most of your time typing text, it's great. You will be forced to learn touch typing.

If you use your keyboard to program, it's really a different story. You can't really touch-type when you program, because it's more like typing one word or two and then a bunch of random symbols, then a word or two and so on. And then you need to go back one line or two and edit something...

You can't touch-type because your hands are constantly away from the home row. Well, you can, but it's very inefficient.

So I have found that using a blank keyboard for programming is very hard.

I wanted to warn him.

thanks man. I don't code, I type pretty much all day. I can see where that would be counter-productive for coders though.

[dustinhxc]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

[swill]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

I am also a developer.  I got the FC660C and it is the most natural keyboard I have worked on.  The arrow keys are actually more conveniently located than on my TKL.  On my TKL I find myself looking down when I need to put my hands on the arrow keys.  On the FC660C my fingers find them much easier and I never look down.  Another thing that I found very nice about the FC660C is they way they handled the Esc key.  Standard keypress is Esc, Fn + Esc = `, Shift + Esc = ~ (so that key behaves the same as a regular sized keyboard for the ~, which I find very nice).  I use stuff like 'ssh -i ~/.ssh/my.pem user@ip' all the time, so it is very nice to have the ~ exactly where I expect it.

I am in the market for an HHKB, but I will probably use it at home.  We will see if I can deal with its arrow cluster for coding...

[rowdy]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

I am also a developer.  I got the FC660C and it is the most natural keyboard I have worked on.  The arrow keys are actually more conveniently located than on my TKL.  On my TKL I find myself looking down when I need to put my hands on the arrow keys.  On the FC660C my fingers find them much easier and I never look down.  Another thing that I found very nice about the FC660C is they way they handled the Esc key.  Standard keypress is Esc, Fn + Esc = `, Shift + Esc = ~ (so that key behaves the same as a regular sized keyboard for the ~, which I find very nice).  I use stuff like 'ssh -i ~/.ssh/my.pem user@ip' all the time, so it is very nice to have the ~ exactly where I expect it.

I am in the market for an HHKB, but I will probably use it at home.  We will see if I can deal with its arrow cluster for coding...

Another thing I have found with HHKB under Windows is using Ctrl+up/down arrows to scroll the code, but keep the cursor in the same place.  With the HHKB I just couldn't Fn+Ctrl+some other key to scroll.

Ultimately I think a TKL RealForce under Windows would suit me best.

[swill]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

I am also a developer.  I got the FC660C and it is the most natural keyboard I have worked on.  The arrow keys are actually more conveniently located than on my TKL.  On my TKL I find myself looking down when I need to put my hands on the arrow keys.  On the FC660C my fingers find them much easier and I never look down.  Another thing that I found very nice about the FC660C is they way they handled the Esc key.  Standard keypress is Esc, Fn + Esc = `, Shift + Esc = ~ (so that key behaves the same as a regular sized keyboard for the ~, which I find very nice).  I use stuff like 'ssh -i ~/.ssh/my.pem user@ip' all the time, so it is very nice to have the ~ exactly where I expect it.

I am in the market for an HHKB, but I will probably use it at home.  We will see if I can deal with its arrow cluster for coding...

Another thing I have found with HHKB under Windows is using Ctrl+up/down arrows to scroll the code, but keep the cursor in the same place.  With the HHKB I just couldn't Fn+Ctrl+some other key to scroll.

Ultimately I think a TKL RealForce under Windows would suit me best.

Interesting...  Can you not use Fn + L or . for PgUp or PgDn and get the functionality you are looking for?

Im on a Mac and my Ctrl + Up or Down are bound to functionality like 'show all open windows' and 'show all windows of this program'.  I use Fn + Up or Down to do PgUp and PgDn to move around code quicker.  On the FC660C, the Fn button is right next to the arrow cluster, so it is pretty natural once you start using it.  The one key I do find useless is the Insert key.  I can't even figure out how to make it work.  It appears to do nothing for me. 

[dustinhxc]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

I am also a developer.  I got the FC660C and it is the most natural keyboard I have worked on.  The arrow keys are actually more conveniently located than on my TKL.  On my TKL I find myself looking down when I need to put my hands on the arrow keys.  On the FC660C my fingers find them much easier and I never look down.  Another thing that I found very nice about the FC660C is they way they handled the Esc key.  Standard keypress is Esc, Fn + Esc = `, Shift + Esc = ~ (so that key behaves the same as a regular sized keyboard for the ~, which I find very nice).  I use stuff like 'ssh -i ~/.ssh/my.pem user@ip' all the time, so it is very nice to have the ~ exactly where I expect it.

I am in the market for an HHKB, but I will probably use it at home.  We will see if I can deal with its arrow cluster for coding...

Cool good to know man! I dont use as much code since Im mainly html 5 css 3 but that is awesome to know. Thats a good deal on elite also.. thanks

[rowdy]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

I am also a developer.  I got the FC660C and it is the most natural keyboard I have worked on.  The arrow keys are actually more conveniently located than on my TKL.  On my TKL I find myself looking down when I need to put my hands on the arrow keys.  On the FC660C my fingers find them much easier and I never look down.  Another thing that I found very nice about the FC660C is they way they handled the Esc key.  Standard keypress is Esc, Fn + Esc = `, Shift + Esc = ~ (so that key behaves the same as a regular sized keyboard for the ~, which I find very nice).  I use stuff like 'ssh -i ~/.ssh/my.pem user@ip' all the time, so it is very nice to have the ~ exactly where I expect it.

I am in the market for an HHKB, but I will probably use it at home.  We will see if I can deal with its arrow cluster for coding...

Another thing I have found with HHKB under Windows is using Ctrl+up/down arrows to scroll the code, but keep the cursor in the same place.  With the HHKB I just couldn't Fn+Ctrl+some other key to scroll.

Ultimately I think a TKL RealForce under Windows would suit me best.

Interesting...  Can you not use Fn + L or . for PgUp or PgDn and get the functionality you are looking for?

Im on a Mac and my Ctrl + Up or Down are bound to functionality like 'show all open windows' and 'show all windows of this program'.  I use Fn + Up or Down to do PgUp and PgDn to move around code quicker.  On the FC660C, the Fn button is right next to the arrow cluster, so it is pretty natural once you start using it.  The one key I do find useless is the Insert key.  I can't even figure out how to make it work.  It appears to do nothing for me. 

Not really.  Ctrl-up a few times would scroll the text down, but leave the cursor in the same place.  This is SO useful because, for example, searching for text usually places the match in the middle of the screen, vertically.  If I want to edit that line, but also want to see a few lines that are just off the top or bottom of the screen, Ctrl-up or Ctrl/down lets me scroll a few lines (or more), but leaves the cursor exactly where it was, so I can just start typing.

I do this all the time, so a less intuitive key sequence to achieve the same thing would irk me considerably.

[swill]

Yeah I code so im debating a small topre w the arrow keys or a tenkeyless...

I am also a developer.  I got the FC660C and it is the most natural keyboard I have worked on.  The arrow keys are actually more conveniently located than on my TKL.  On my TKL I find myself looking down when I need to put my hands on the arrow keys.  On the FC660C my fingers find them much easier and I never look down.  Another thing that I found very nice about the FC660C is they way they handled the Esc key.  Standard keypress is Esc, Fn + Esc = `, Shift + Esc = ~ (so that key behaves the same as a regular sized keyboard for the ~, which I find very nice).  I use stuff like 'ssh -i ~/.ssh/my.pem user@ip' all the time, so it is very nice to have the ~ exactly where I expect it.

I am in the market for an HHKB, but I will probably use it at home.  We will see if I can deal with its arrow cluster for coding...

Another thing I have found with HHKB under Windows is using Ctrl+up/down arrows to scroll the code, but keep the cursor in the same place.  With the HHKB I just couldn't Fn+Ctrl+some other key to scroll.

Ultimately I think a TKL RealForce under Windows would suit me best.

Interesting...  Can you not use Fn + L or . for PgUp or PgDn and get the functionality you are looking for?

Im on a Mac and my Ctrl + Up or Down are bound to functionality like 'show all open windows' and 'show all windows of this program'.  I use Fn + Up or Down to do PgUp and PgDn to move around code quicker.  On the FC660C, the Fn button is right next to the arrow cluster, so it is pretty natural once you start using it.  The one key I do find useless is the Insert key.  I can't even figure out how to make it work.  It appears to do nothing for me. 

Not really.  Ctrl-up a few times would scroll the text down, but leave the cursor in the same place.  This is SO useful because, for example, searching for text usually places the match in the middle of the screen, vertically.  If I want to edit that line, but also want to see a few lines that are just off the top or bottom of the screen, Ctrl-up or Ctrl/down lets me scroll a few lines (or more), but leaves the cursor exactly where it was, so I can just start typing.

I do this all the time, so a less intuitive key sequence to achieve the same thing would irk me considerably.

Fair enough.  I didn't even know that was possible.  I have just dealt with the cursor moving with the PgUp and PgDn.  Now I want see if I can figure out how to do that on a Mac.  I don't use my current mapping for Ctrl + Up or Down right now because I have put the same functionality on mouse buttons.  I will have to look into that.  It makes so much sense and would be so useful.  Thx...

[reziak]

I lost the losing battle and made the purchase today. Will update when it's arrived.

[demik]

one of us! one of us!

[keymaster]

I lost the losing battle and made the purchase today. Will update when it's arrived.

I seriously hope you went with 55g Topre.

[rowdy]

I lost the losing battle and made the purchase today. Will update when it's arrived.

You have been assimilated into the Thorpe.

Resistance is futile.

[unicomp_uc]

I lost the losing battle and made the purchase today. Will update when it's arrived.

Congrats! My work Realforce 87u silent will be picked up by me on the way to work on Friday! Can't wait for Topre part deux!