[IC] ALL NEW Midnight SA set

[Binge]

DCS and SA are not properly ergodox friendly... but if there's interest

SA is definitely ergodox friendly.  All alphas are the same profile.  Use blanks or blanks with colored symbols to represent other keys and make those keys the same profile.  Take Penumbra for example,

[Matt3o]

this wouldn't be all on row3 but a "proper" SA profile

[zflamewing]

DCS and SA are not properly ergodox friendly... but if there's interest

SA is definitely ergodox friendly.  All alphas are the same profile.  Use blanks or blanks with colored symbols to represent other keys and make those keys the same profile.  Take Penumbra for example,

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That Dox!  I'm just waiting on my kit from MassDrop and my Penumbra goodies to turn up.

[agodinhost]

I never used SA on it.
DCS is okay for me.

[Yslen]

this wouldn't be all on row3 but a "proper" SA profile

How would the fourth row be done? Round 5 has R2-R3-R4 alphas with R2-R3-R3 mods next to them. I'm still undecided whether I prefer that or the other approach, where R4 is excluded and the ZXCV row is R3 to match the mods. Hopefully I like the way it's been done in Round 5, or I'm going to have a ton of spherical caps to sell...

[Matt3o]

I don't know yet actually. I have to think about it. I'll check with SP.

[Matt3o]

ok this is getting closer to release.

I'll post the final kits in the coming days. DCS is 100% sure, if you are also interested in SA speak up your mind now!

[Kfactork]

ok this is getting closer to release.

I'll post the final kits in the coming days. DCS is 100% sure, if you are also interested in SA speak up your mind now!

I am! Is it possible at all to have 2 profiles at the same time?

[tbc]

interested in SA, but only if they come with translucent legends.

[Hofy]

I am interested in SA,  no interest in DCS.

[Matt3o]

so... translucent legends you say... you mean something like cyan polycarbonate? Interesting...

[slickmamba]

Very very interested for SA for ergodox

[Matt3o]

Very very interested for SA for ergodox

can you confirm that ergodox works with variable row SA?

[slickmamba]

You're going to need someone more knowledgeable than me to chime in.  Binge?

[tbc]

so... translucent legends you say... you mean something like cyan polycarbonate? Interesting...

ya.  that sounds great to me.

[ChillyVanilly]

SA all the way

[eMps]

This set looks great! If only there was a colemak kit...

[Elrick]

so... translucent legends you say... you mean something like cyan polycarbonate? Interesting...

If you use the nice dark black keys with the translucent blue/green legends (you haven't done that yet) then this key-set should be interesting to ALL those with lighted keyboards out there.

I have never seen any decent translucent key-sets for sale but your's could be a winner here.  If you stick with the black matte colour and only allow the light to shine through this key-set, then you shall have an avalanche of orders.

Just need to get Melissa to go through with some test samples of caps so that they can be installed into a lighted keyboard to see how it looks.  Making a proper lighted key-set isn't easy but yours could be the perfect one compared to what's currently being sold on Razer and Corsair keyboards.

[Matt3o]

yes that would be the idea. A few issues that come to my mind:

1) backlight color: if we use cyan PC how does it look with --say-- red backlight
2) is it better to go with transparent PC? (compatible with any LED color) How does it look when the keyboard is not backlit?

Also, the options would be quite a bit: standard midnight + midnight backlight. Maybe too much if we want to go both DCS and SA at the same time.

[tbc]

i'm voting for colored translucent.  specifically cyan.  or some darker variant.

look at it this way.  if there were no translucent legends, someone using red backlights would be screwed anyways.  with cyan, at least now you've caught the interest of blue backlighters as well as the regular no backlight folks.

i think before that this would be risky, but after seeing how gorgeous cherry replica was, colored translucent legends seems like the smart way to go.

[Matt3o]

just to be clear, both options would be available (translucent and solid color) and I have a very nice idea for alternative modifiers

[Elrick]

Also, the options would be quite a bit: standard midnight + midnight backlight. Maybe too much if we want to go both DCS and SA at the same time.

Yes I see your dilemma here.  But I have the solution, simply jettison the DCS in favour of the brilliant SA profile  .

Imagine being the FIRST guy to design a backlit SA Profile.  People will be erecting statues in your honour for making this happen.

[justnits]

i'm actually wondering about the visibility of the lighted legend across top led and bottom led.

if it's DCS profile, it'll benefit those users with reverse mount switches where the led is on the "top side".
i'm not sure how well will normal mount switches or bottom mount led will benefit from this set up.

if it's SA profile, i totally have no idea how it'll look like..  )

[Matt3o]

the legend is not just masked like standard backlight keycaps. inside the keycap you have the whole double shot scaffolding. I believe light goes through very well but I have no proof, apart maybe this picture

[tbc]

i'm actually wondering about the visibility of the lighted legend across top led and bottom led.

if it's DCS profile, it'll benefit those users with reverse mount switches where the led is on the "top side".
i'm not sure how well will normal mount switches or bottom mount led will benefit from this set up.

if it's SA profile, i totally have no idea how it'll look like..  )

i think only like 3 people have seen a backlit sa cap in rl lol

[slickmamba]

Also, the options would be quite a bit: standard midnight + midnight backlight. Maybe too much if we want to go both DCS and SA at the same time.

Yes I see your dilemma here.  But I have the solution, simply jettison the DCS in favour of the brilliant SA profile  .

Imagine being the FIRST guy to design a backlit SA Profile.  People will be erecting statues in your honour for making this happen.

Yes please! SA!

[Matt3o]

I'll work on the mockups today and send them for review.

We start next week problly

[Elrick]

I'll work on the mockups today and send them for review.

We start next week problly

Damn Matt you're a production line for SP now.  I sure hope they decide to offer some monetary compensation for all your hard work in making these designs?

They know if it wasn't for you, they'll have next to no orders coming through their workshop, hence speak to them about it.  Don't let a business exploit you for no reason especially when these days everything costs money, that includes time and experience you accrued already with designing a whole lot of key-sets.

Don't forget you alone are responsible for keeping their business running along with all the new key-sets designed by you.  Hence don't let anyone walk away without paying, because design costs and it should never be given away freely.

[Matt3o]

I'll work on the mockups today and send them for review.

We start next week problly

Damn Matt you're a production line for SP now.  I sure hope they decide to offer some monetary compensation for all your hard work in making these designs?

They know if it wasn't for you, they'll have next to no orders coming through their workshop, hence speak to them about it.  Don't let a business exploit you for no reason especially when these days everything costs money, that includes time and experience you accrued already with designing a whole lot of key-sets.

Don't forget you alone are responsible for keeping their business running along with all the new key-sets designed by you.  Hence don't let anyone walk away without paying, because design costs and it should never be given away freely.

Thanks for your message Elrick, I'm perfectly aware of the situation. The midnight should have been my last set for a good while, but then Granite came out and I wanted to push that first.

I'm now working back on midnight because I like to fulfill my commitments, but (unless something changes in the SP system) I'm not willing to work on other GBs. It takes really too much time, especially the sublimated ones.

Regarding my relationship with SP I'm not sure I can disclose our agreements, but they are well aware of the value I brought to their business.

[Elrick]

Regarding my relationship with SP I'm not sure I can disclose our agreements, but they are well aware of the value I brought to their business.

Just press it home to them because US businesses are use to getting everything their own way for years now.  SP needs to realize that when the showman (Matt3o) leaves the stage who else can they find to generate any more interest into their key cap business?

Even the most blind and stingy business owner will soon realize that having a 1st rate designer is worth keeping on tap if it increases their bottom line, simple economics 101  .

[Matt3o]

naaah, there are many who can design nice keysets. they can live without me

[Matt3o]

I started working back on this there are really a lot of options, but before going any further I want to ask SP if they can provide some samples of polycarbonate + abs in the colors we need. I'd like to go cyan polycarbonate but I believe simply transparent is more compatible.

Anyway the options would be as follow, pictures soon to come as soon as I get confirmation from SP.

Standard Midnight full ABS (the color between brackets)
1) Alpha base (VCO on GB)
2) Numpad base (VCO on GB)
3) ISO (VCO on GB)
4) Midnight mods (VCO on GEW)
5) Midnight numpad (VCO on GEW)
6) Midnight additional modfiers (GB on VCO)
7 Twilight Modifiers (GB on VCO)
8 ) Twilight Numpad (GB on VCO)
9) Twilight additional modifiers (GB on VCO)

Midnight Backlight (with polycarbonate/PC)
10) Backlight base set:
----- Alpha: PC on GB
----- Mod: VCO on PC or PC on GEW
12) Backlight Numpad:
----- Alpha: PC on GB
----- Mod: VCO on PC or PC on GEW
13) Backlight additional modifiers
----- Alpha: PC on GB
----- Mod: VCO on PC or PC on GEW

Some more options:
14) Glow in the dark (5 GOW keys)
xx) additional spacebars (7, 6.25, 6)


To create something unique I'd prefer VCO on PC over PC on GEW. The result would very close to this



(I believe images are by mkawa, not sure, sorry)

[CommonCurt]

I started working back on this there are really a lot of options, but before going any further I want to ask SP if they can provide some samples of polycarbonate + abs in the colors we need. I'd like to go cyan polycarbonate but I believe simply transparent is more compatible.

Anyway the options would be as follow, pictures soon to come as soon as I get confirmation from SP.

Standard Midnight full ABS (the color between brackets)
1) Alpha base (VCO on GB)
2) Numpad base (VCO on GB)
3) ISO (VCO on GB)
4) Midnight mods (VCO on GEW)
5) Midnight numpad (VCO on GEW)
6) Midnight additional modfiers (GB on VCO)
7 Twilight Modifiers (GB on VCO)
8 ) Twilight Numpad (GB on VCO)
9) Twilight additional modifiers (GB on VCO)

Midnight Backlight (with polycarbonate/PC)
10) Backlight base set:
----- Alpha: PC on GB
----- Mod: VCO on PC or PC on GEW
12) Backlight Numpad:
----- Alpha: PC on GB
----- Mod: VCO on PC or PC on GEW
13) Backlight additional modifiers
----- Alpha: PC on GB
----- Mod: VCO on PC or PC on GEW

Some more options:
14) Glow in the dark (5 GOW keys)
xx) additional spacebars (7, 6.25, 6)


To create something unique I'd prefer VCO on PC over PC on GEW. The result would very close to this

Show Image

Show Image

(I believe images are by mkawa, not sure, sorry)

Excited.  Can't wait

[Matt3o]

The kits so far. This would be DCS, cherry replica legends with backlight kits.

Regarding SA, I still have to talk with Melissa (I believe it's holiday today in US). The options are: start SA together with DCS, start SA as soon as DCS is tipped, start SA anyway at the end of DCS.

1) Base


2) Midnight mods


3) Twilight mods


4) Moonlight (Polycarbonate legends, aka backlight friendly)

[yuiop]

Looks like my wallet is taking another major hit

[zah]

Any chance you could do a 4.5 unit spacebar?

I know SP has a 4.5 SA profile mold from past sets, but I've never liked any of them that have came out.

[Matt3o]

Any chance you could do a 4.5 unit spacebar?

I know SP has a 4.5 SA profile mold from past sets, but I've never liked any of them that have came out.

no problem

[Yslen]

That moonlight set.... that's going to look so amazing.

[Elrick]

The kits so far. This would be DCS, cherry replica legends with backlight kits.

Regarding SA, I still have to talk with Melissa (I believe it's holiday today in US). The options are: start SA together with DCS, start SA as soon as DCS is tipped, start SA anyway at the end of DCS.

1) Base

Show Image

2) Midnight mods

Show Image

3) Twilight mods

Show Image

4) Moonlight (Polycarbonate legends, aka backlight friendly)

Show Image

You know the SA will be the one I'll jump on, but if Melissa has difficulty in translating the back-light feature with that profile then leave it au naturel.

Because for those that want back lighting they'll choose the DCS profile but those that want full meaty ABS goodness, will go the SA route  .  Your group buy could offer a 50-50 key-set and those that want back lighting know which profile to go for.

Although I already bought some Toxic Key-caps from Bunny I wouldn't mind getting some Moonlight to try out on the Razer TKL (yes, kick me hard for using that product).

[CommonCurt]

The kits so far. This would be DCS, cherry replica legends with backlight kits.

Regarding SA, I still have to talk with Melissa (I believe it's holiday today in US). The options are: start SA together with DCS, start SA as soon as DCS is tipped, start SA anyway at the end of DCS.

1) Base

Show Image

2) Midnight mods

Show Image

3) Twilight mods

Show Image

4) Moonlight (Polycarbonate legends, aka backlight friendly)

Show Image

Very cool.  I think I will stick to the non-backlit set.

Waiting to hear about the SA sets 

[slickmamba]

Looks really good buddy.  Looking forward to ordering the SA set!  Congrats on this milestone!

[Elrick]

Just can't be a moron always ordering SA profile everywhere I go, I really do need a quality backlighted key-set for some keyboards (the youngsters want some on their Razer keyboards).

So when this Group Buy finally rolls I will need to also get some polycarbonate back-light sets.  Since most keyboard manufacturers out there use cheapo painted keysets to sell their keyboards, SP is the ONLY one currently selling a 2 shot molded DCS design  .

Trying not to be another SP shill here (hate being that) applauding their service, but I do need some translucent keys.

[Matt3o]

I'm not sure but I believe there's an ABS white color that is opaque but lets light pass thought, as if it were less "dense" than the others. I have to ask Melissa. She should be back today. I don't know if I'd prefer that to a completely transparent legend (polycarb).

[kekkon]

...

But the melting of those plastic....

[Matt3o]

sorry, what?

[Matt3o]

I talked with SP.

polycarbonate on SA is "discouraged" so, no backlight for the SA folks.

In DCS would be feasible but they say that PC legends on dark background is not recommended because the legends are not visible in daylight. The alternative would be to have some colored PC but it is not clear yet if it would be readable anyway.

I asked for some samples and they will check if they have some in stock. As of now backlight is pretty uncertain.

[Yslen]

Not readable by daylight? All the backlit boards I've used have transparent/colourless legends on their stock caps. They're perfectly readable with the LEDs off and even on the dimmest LED brightness setting are extremely clear.

[MrChunky]

I think the issue might be that in double shot keycaps you can see the pattern (scaffolding?) from the first shot, which is transparent, interlaced with the dark second shot behind the lettering, which might make it hard to read.

[Yslen]

I think the issue might be that in double shot keycaps you can see the pattern (scaffolding?) from the first shot, which is transparent, interlaced with the dark second shot behind the lettering, which might make it hard to read.

Ah, now I understand. Thankyou!

[Matt3o]

I got pictures of a dark keycap with yellow PC. sorry guys, it's a no-go. The legends are not visible in daylight.