Author Topic: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB  (Read 2455 times)

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Online hineybush

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[IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:09:05 »
hey

Invisibiliti approached me about making a QMK-progammable PCB for his 10-unit run polycarb/acrylic (I forget which) Unicorn TKL group buy. He sent me a broken (some diodes and the USB port were borked) Mech27 PCB to use for reference. I've noticed a gap in proper QMK "kustom" TKL PCBs, so I'm here to fill that gap.





At this point, I've received the 10 PCBs for this run and have assembled one of them. I ordered diodes of the wrong package size, so I'm waiting for the right ones to come in.



RGB works nicely



In-switch LED works nicely

Okay so yeah, anyway.

Specs:
  • TKL PCB
  • Programmable via QMK
  • "Skinny A87" form factor - same footprint as B87, but same USB placement and stab layout as A87.
  • Standard ANSI and WKL bottom rows, ISO enter, short right and left shifts, 2u backspace
  • Top-side Mini USB port
  • Spacebar stab is under the spacebar switch (this is important for kustoms, and generally dictates compatibility). https://i.imgur.com/IODhEBW.png
  • RGB underglow
  • One-color in-switch LED
  • Powered by Atmega32U4 MCU
  • No physical reset switch - just short two pins on the PCB (for case compatibility)
  • Pins to solder a daughter board on (Moon TKL, for example)
  • Fully soldered and pre-programmed with a basic TKL map out of the box
  • SPI pins
  • Breakaway USB port for cases that use USB daughterboards
  • Matte black solder mask w/ white text. There will be a special edition sold by Cartel that will be red w/ black lettering.

Note that compatibility will vary for this. It is not a drop-in PCB for any TKL. It will be the buyer's responsibility to ensure that the PCB will work with their target case/board. I'll work on gathering a compatibility list from some sources I have in the community. I do have plans to make an "H87b" version that has the spacebar stab swapped to the north side of the switch.

Check out this thread to get an idea of theoretical compatibility - i will update as i learn this fits certain cases listed: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=96123.0

I expect to have these built and shipped to my 10 prototype buyers in the next two weeks. Once that is done, I will focus on getting this to market and mass production.

Price

At this moment based on my quotes/math, I'll be able to charge $45 per PCB with an MOQ of 50. If the total order number reaches 100, I should be able to drop that to $40 (TBD). These prices aren't 100% final yet, but are very close to my pricing goals.

If you have any questions, feel free to leave em below. I hope this can help the western keeb community get away from bootmapper/jigon.
« Last Edit: Fri, 13 July 2018, 12:46:03 by hineybush »

Offline Remsky

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #1 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:11:05 »
I need like 3 or 4. Def in

Offline oh_chesteroni

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:12:31 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(

Online dimo

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[IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:12:42 »
price looks great to just try out

What’s the best way to go about seeing if it would fit in a board (a prebuilt ducky one— idc about the usb port)

Are there measurements ? thanks, and consider me interested !

Offline Velvet_Crowe

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:12:49 »
Cant wait for my prototype to come in!
The lack of QMK pcbs for TKL kustoms is definitely an issue.

Offline cijanzen

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:13:09 »
Great to see the TKL world getting some much deserved love from QMK. Great job!


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Offline bisoromi

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:14:31 »
ohh very nice. def interested

Online hineybush

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:22:05 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(



Basically, A87 is larger and won't fit into some cases that were designed with B87 in mind. The A87 also has a south-facing spacebar stab, vs. north-facing for B87. That's why this is designated H87a.

price looks great to just try out

What’s the best way to go about seeing if it would fit in a board (a prebuilt ducky one— idc about the usb port)

Are there measurements ? thanks, and consider me interested !

This will not fit in a prebuilt Ducky (or any OEM TKL for that matter), I'm sure. The spacing between the alphas and the F-row is different for most custom TKLs - 0.25u closer to the alphas than an OEM-style TKL.

The size is as follows:
X (width) 344.8mm
Y (height) 117.9mm
The USB port island extends an additional 4.9mm off of the top, and is 9.4mm wide. It is centered between the F12 and Print Screen keys.
« Last Edit: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:26:04 by hineybush »

Offline oh_chesteroni

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:28:21 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(

Show Image


Basically, A87 is larger and won't fit into some cases that were designed with B87 in mind. The A87 also has a south-facing spacebar stab, vs. north-facing for B87. That's why this is designated H87a.
Thanks for the clarification!

I'm pretty sure LZ GH v2 uses b87, if anyone knows for certain feel free to chime in. Regardless, even if it doesn't for 45 bucks I'm willing to buy at least a couple to stash away for future TKLs.

Online hineybush

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 05 July 2018, 23:30:36 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(

Show Image


Basically, A87 is larger and won't fit into some cases that were designed with B87 in mind. The A87 also has a south-facing spacebar stab, vs. north-facing for B87. That's why this is designated H87a.
Thanks for the clarification!

I'm pretty sure LZ GH v2 uses b87, if anyone knows for certain feel free to chime in. Regardless, even if it doesn't for 45 bucks I'm willing to buy at least a couple to stash away for future TKLs.

Awesome. Like I said in the OP I'll make an H87b version soonly too. I went with the B87 form factor to hopefully not run into issues with fitment.

Offline mech0nly

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 02:00:08 »
hiney, the another gap is mx & alps compatibility ;)
VE.A / LZ-CLS

Offline wholypantalones

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 06:57:31 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(

Show Image


Basically, A87 is larger and won't fit into some cases that were designed with B87 in mind. The A87 also has a south-facing spacebar stab, vs. north-facing for B87. That's why this is designated H87a.
Thanks for the clarification!

I'm pretty sure LZ GH v2 uses b87, if anyone knows for certain feel free to chime in. Regardless, even if it doesn't for 45 bucks I'm willing to buy at least a couple to stash away for future TKLs.

Leeku 87 boards, Kin 87 boards, Mech27, Mira, etc are all b87 from my understanding.

I personally don't care for QMK and like JiGon, but variety never hurt anyone I suppose.

Offline dgneo

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 07:05:22 »
In for at least one, great work hiney

Offline C³—Ears

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 08:09:47 »
Good luck!

Offline ns90

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 10:46:08 »
I would love one to replace my PCB on my Mira

Offline redbanshee

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 11:18:07 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(

Show Image


Basically, A87 is larger and won't fit into some cases that were designed with B87 in mind. The A87 also has a south-facing spacebar stab, vs. north-facing for B87. That's why this is designated H87a.
Thanks for the clarification!

I'm pretty sure LZ GH v2 uses b87, if anyone knows for certain feel free to chime in. Regardless, even if it doesn't for 45 bucks I'm willing to buy at least a couple to stash away for future TKLs.

Leeku 87 boards, Kin 87 boards, Mech27, Mira, etc are all b87 from my understanding.

I personally don't care for QMK and like JiGon, but variety never hurt anyone I suppose.

I wish the term b.87 would go away.... its confusing... B.87 in the way you are referring to it here, only pertains to the footprint (dimensions) of the PCB.

A legit B.87 pcb (from winkeyless.kr) would not actually fit any of those cases because the USB port is in the wrong spot and wrong side of the PCB.

IMO it should be called something different like "Skinny A87" form factor - same footprint as B87, but same USB placement as A87.  edit: looks like hineybush is referring to it in that way! yay!


« Last Edit: Fri, 06 July 2018, 11:51:15 by redbanshee »

Offline Kavik

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 11:44:55 »
I'm not sure if I need one, but I think the Moon TKL customers with defective/missing PCBs will appreciate this (if they can source a daughterboard). This looks pretty close to the PCB for Moon.

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 12:44:37 »
Fantastic price! For the less experienced ones out there, could you briefly describe the difference between a.87 and b.87 form factors?

I am the less experienced one :(

Show Image


Basically, A87 is larger and won't fit into some cases that were designed with B87 in mind. The A87 also has a south-facing spacebar stab, vs. north-facing for B87. That's why this is designated H87a.
Thanks for the clarification!

I'm pretty sure LZ GH v2 uses b87, if anyone knows for certain feel free to chime in. Regardless, even if it doesn't for 45 bucks I'm willing to buy at least a couple to stash away for future TKLs.

Leeku 87 boards, Kin 87 boards, Mech27, Mira, etc are all b87 from my understanding.

I personally don't care for QMK and like JiGon, but variety never hurt anyone I suppose.

I wish the term b.87 would go away.... its confusing... B.87 in the way you are referring to it here, only pertains to the footprint (dimensions) of the PCB.

A legit B.87 pcb (from winkeyless.kr) would not actually fit any of those cases because the USB port is in the wrong spot and wrong side of the PCB.

IMO it should be called something different like "Skinny A87" form factor - same footprint as B87, but same USB placement as A87.  edit: looks like hineybush is referring to it in that way! yay!

Yeah I'm sorry about the confusion - another guy approached me about changing my wording up.

To clarify: The a and b in H87a/b denotes the spacebar stab orientation - a is south/under the switch (like in the a.87), b is north/over the switch (like in the b.87). The USB placement on both H87a andH87b is the same as a.87. Both the H87a and H87b have the same physical size - the same as the b.87.

hiney, the another gap is mx & alps compatibility ;)
I could do this
« Last Edit: Fri, 06 July 2018, 13:00:14 by hineybush »

Offline ProtonDecay

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 06 July 2018, 16:00:02 »
Definitely in for one.

Offline RealLaugh

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #19 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 05:29:52 »
I'm in for at least one but maybe I'll pick up 2 for old times sake.

Offline StickyBlueJuice

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 05:57:18 »
Damn, contemplating picking this one up.
I don't know if it'll fit the KDB8X though.

Offline E3E

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #21 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 06:23:57 »
hiney, the another gap is mx & alps compatibility ;)

Seconded. This would PCB would be absolutely killer with dual MXAlps compatibility.

Offline mech0nly

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #22 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 07:07:09 »
hiney, the another gap is mx & alps compatibility ;)

Seconded. This would PCB would be absolutely killer with dual MXAlps compatibility.

The first, possibly one and only ;)
VE.A / LZ-CLS

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 11:35:13 »
K I'll add it

Offline ProtonDecay

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #24 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 12:46:03 »
I feel like you'll get a ton of orders (>100) if you can make it compatible with off-the-shelf cases and can do the volume, will you have them built for you by a third party?
« Last Edit: Sat, 07 July 2018, 12:54:11 by ProtonDecay »

Offline redbanshee

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 12:54:36 »
Damn, contemplating picking this one up.
I don't know if it'll fit the KDB8X though.

unfortunately the kbd8x has the USB port on the bottom of the pcb, so this wont work with it  :(

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #26 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 17:39:30 »
I’m interested to know how well this PCB fits in a Mech27/v2

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #27 on: Sat, 07 July 2018, 19:10:21 »
I’m interested to know how well this PCB fits in a Mech27/v2

i used that pcb as my physical design reference. so pretty well hopefully

Offline loud_asian

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #28 on: Tue, 10 July 2018, 03:42:01 »
Any chance of adding lock light indicators between ESC and F1?
keyboards are lame

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #29 on: Tue, 10 July 2018, 07:59:18 »
Any chance of adding lock light indicators between ESC and F1?

Probably not, I've included in-switch ones

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #30 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 02:03:53 »
K I'll add it

jk

After talking to some other PCB makers, decided not to do alps. it messes with some of the footprint spacing, etc.

Will do an alps version soon after this one

Offline LifeZ

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #31 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 08:02:03 »
oh~~~~h nice.

Offline mech0nly

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[IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #32 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 08:03:23 »
K I'll add it

jk

After talking to some other PCB makers, decided not to do alps. it messes with some of the footprint spacing, etc.

Will do an alps version soon after this one

No problem, sign me in for one each
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Offline OracleKev

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #33 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 08:56:54 »
Switch is not flipped--great.  Alps combo support would be really nice.  Draught there.
PCB I can buy off Taobao has switch flipped.  AEK bottom row in addition to WKL, WK pls...

Just curious, what kind of direct to PCB connector do you use in case firmware is blown?

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #34 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 11:11:58 »
Switch is not flipped--great.  Alps combo support would be really nice.  Draught there.
PCB I can buy off Taobao has switch flipped.  AEK bottom row in addition to WKL, WK pls...

Just curious, what kind of direct to PCB connector do you use in case firmware is blown?

I'm hoping that doesn't happen since it's QMK and the bootloader is pretty robust. However I can add SPI pins.

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #35 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 11:34:24 »
Updates done/todo to Rev. 1 (prototype) to reach Rev. 2 (production version)

Bold needs to be done

  • Snap-off USB connector for daughterboard users
  • Re-added in-switch LED resistors for production
  • Add bottom border to spacebar area for stabs
  • Retooled some footprints for cleanliness/aesthetic
  • Add SPI pins
  • Add internal mount holes (same as b.87)

To do for Rev. 3 (or a renamed version)

  • Alps/MX hybrid switch footprints

h87b

  • Inverted spacebar stabilizer to match b.87

The QMK repo for h87a can be found here. It is also merged with the main QMK repo, and should be on the QMK Configurator.

 
« Last Edit: Thu, 12 July 2018, 11:36:35 by hineybush »

Offline RealLaugh

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #36 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 15:33:34 »
Updates done/todo to Rev. 1 (prototype) to reach Rev. 2 (production version)

Bold needs to be done

  • Snap-off USB connector for daughterboard users
  • Re-added in-switch LED resistors for production
  • Add bottom border to spacebar area for stabs
  • Retooled some footprints for cleanliness/aesthetic
  • Add SPI pins
  • Add internal mount holes (same as b.87)

To do for Rev. 3 (or a renamed version)

  • Alps/MX hybrid switch footprints

h87b

  • Inverted spacebar stabilizer to match b.87

The QMK repo for h87a can be found here. It is also merged with the main QMK repo, and should be on the QMK Configurator.



what does this all mean in terms of GB dates?

I think I would pick up 1 v2 (or v1) and 1 v3 for that sweet ALPS compatibility

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #37 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 18:25:33 »
Rev 2 (next version) will be up for GB in the next 3-4 weeks.

Rev 3 will be hopefully right after that GB closes

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #38 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 19:52:39 »
:partyparrot:

Offline bciamny

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #39 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 23:00:39 »
Rev 2 (next version) will be up for GB in the next 3-4 weeks.

Rev 3 will be hopefully right after that GB closes

nice, i was just about to ask this too. i think i need to pick up two of these... do you know if this can be used to sub for a tx87 board? my prior pcb died and i'd rather get one with qmk/hiney design.

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #40 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 08:08:11 »
nice, i was just about to ask this too. i think i need to pick up two of these... do you know if this can be used to sub for a tx87 board? my prior pcb died and i'd rather get one with qmk/hiney design.

I'd assume so? I'm not 100% sure on that but I can check with some people I know to verify.

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #41 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 08:15:39 »
Just to make sure I'm clear on compatibility... This is a B87 size PCB with stabilizer orientation that is like the A87? Which boards are verified to be compatible?



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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #42 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 08:18:17 »
Just to make sure I'm clear on compatibility... This is a B87 size PCB with stabilizer orientation that is like the A87? Which boards are verified to be compatible?



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Correct. a.87 stabilizers and USB port placement, b.87 size. I'm unsure of the compatibility off of the top of my head, but there's a relatively complete spreadsheet going around that has most stabilizer/USB port info.

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #43 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 08:22:56 »
Just to make sure I'm clear on compatibility... This is a B87 size PCB with stabilizer orientation that is like the A87? Which boards are verified to be compatible?



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Correct. a.87 stabilizers and USB port placement, b.87 size. I'm unsure of the compatibility off of the top of my head, but there's a relatively complete spreadsheet going around that has most stabilizer/USB port info.
Yeah there's a thread for it.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=96123.0

So I just need to look for something that's the same as the Mech27?

(Edit, I just read OP again)

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #44 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 08:26:30 »
Just to make sure I'm clear on compatibility... This is a B87 size PCB with stabilizer orientation that is like the A87? Which boards are verified to be compatible?



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Correct. a.87 stabilizers and USB port placement, b.87 size. I'm unsure of the compatibility off of the top of my head, but there's a relatively complete spreadsheet going around that has most stabilizer/USB port info.
Yeah there's a thread for it.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=96123.0

So I just need to look for something that's the same as the Mech27?

(Edit, I just read OP again)

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Ahh yes that's the one I was talking about, redbanshee set it up. And yes, this PCB was based on the Mech27 PCB so that'd be its closest relative.

Offline redbanshee

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #45 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 10:24:54 »
Just to make sure I'm clear on compatibility... This is a B87 size PCB with stabilizer orientation that is like the A87? Which boards are verified to be compatible?



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Correct. a.87 stabilizers and USB port placement, b.87 size. I'm unsure of the compatibility off of the top of my head, but there's a relatively complete spreadsheet going around that has most stabilizer/USB port info.
Yeah there's a thread for it.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=96123.0

So I just need to look for something that's the same as the Mech27?

(Edit, I just read OP again)

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Ahh yes that's the one I was talking about, redbanshee set it up. And yes, this PCB was based on the Mech27 PCB so that'd be its closest relative.

yea i added a column for H.87a, all theoretical fits tho but based on the footprint and usb placement H.87a should fit a ton of cases

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Re: [IC] H87a: QMK-powered TKL PCB
« Reply #46 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 12:46:23 »
Added some stuff to the feature list in the OP.