Author Topic: GH60 Keyboard Project  (Read 418309 times)

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Offline agodinhost

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1700 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 11:51:28 »
If you are referring to the rev. B PCB posted in the GB, then no, there is no holes for any LEDs, except on Caps Lock.
Sorry, I were talking about the keypad, not about leds.
You are right.
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Offline Luke

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1701 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 12:06:33 »
If you are referring to the rev. B PCB posted in the GB, then no, there is no holes for any LEDs, except on Caps Lock.
Sorry, I were talking about the keypad, not about leds.
You are right.

Haha, you made me press my nose against my monitor at work trying to find holes on WASD on revB :P

Offline agodinhost

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1702 on: Fri, 22 March 2013, 14:27:30 »
Haha, you made me press my nose against my monitor at work trying to find holes on WASD on revB :p
LOL, I'm so sorry for you monitor man!
« Last Edit: Fri, 22 March 2013, 14:54:13 by alaricljs »
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Offline Ichy

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1703 on: Mon, 01 April 2013, 12:26:39 »
Jd or Komar007, I could use the help of either one of you.  I have a concept (on paper right now) for a DIY 35~ key gamepad I want to do, but i'm a little stuck at the PCB portion of the design layout. I was looking at what you Komar has done for the PCB and i'm struggling to grasp how it works (not i'm not an engineer of any kind, but I have done lots of research so far to doing this and thought some input from some one already doing a keyboard might be able to help). It would be greatly appreciated.

Offline vorn

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1704 on: Wed, 03 April 2013, 03:41:57 »
wow...it nice, I would like to help to make  the perfect case for it. just need the size and the position of the holes.hope it will have the same as pure. and i am in for one too.

Are you still planning on making a case?

Offline pix3l_fodder

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1705 on: Wed, 03 April 2013, 14:49:21 »
komar said he's making that change to the final revision PCB, I believe.

There will be holes with pads for LEDs in those positions (and Esc I think).

Excellent news! Glad to hear that will be added :)
« Last Edit: Thu, 04 April 2013, 02:28:36 by pix3l_fodder »

Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1706 on: Wed, 03 April 2013, 15:08:38 »
komar said he's making that change to the final revision PCB, I believe.

There will be holes with pads for LEDs in those positions (and Esc I think).

Excellent news! GFlad to hear that will be added :)
Yes, unfortunately some of the leds will be above instead of under the switch, because some of the switches have to be rotated 180 degrees and there's no way to do it differently.
This is also a bit crazier than I thought, I'm basically redesigning the whole board. I've done like a half of those pads so far;)
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Offline osxoep

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1707 on: Wed, 03 April 2013, 15:14:08 »
I'm just excited to get an ISO HHKB style board :D
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Offline pix3l_fodder

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1708 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 02:30:18 »
komar said he's making that change to the final revision PCB, I believe.

There will be holes with pads for LEDs in those positions (and Esc I think).

Excellent news! GFlad to hear that will be added :)
Yes, unfortunately some of the leds will be above instead of under the switch, because some of the switches have to be rotated 180 degrees and there's no way to do it differently.
This is also a bit crazier than I thought, I'm basically redesigning the whole board. I've done like a half of those pads so far;)

Does rotating have any impact on the feel, operation or reliability of a switch? If anything is really that adversely affected maybe it would be better not to do it.
« Last Edit: Thu, 04 April 2013, 03:06:58 by pix3l_fodder »

Offline Broadmonkey

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1709 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 02:45:39 »
It only affects how your keycap will be lit (top or bottom). A lot of backlit keyboards use 180 rotated switches to light the key cap in the top instead of the bottom. This is handy if the legend is on the upper part of the cap, which most are.

Offline pix3l_fodder

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1710 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 03:07:30 »
Thats good to hear/read :)

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1711 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 07:05:26 »
The reason for rotating some of the switches 180 degrees, in this case, have to do with incorporating multiple layouts on the board. Some switch positions must be rotated so they do not overlap with other switch positions nearby. And also it may be necessary for routing the traces on the board. Believe me, if there were only one layout option for this board, none of the switches would be rotated. But the whole point of this community developed keyboard was to include several layout options, so that people could customize their keyboard to their own desired layout.
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Offline pasph

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1712 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 08:28:51 »
komar said he's making that change to the final revision PCB, I believe.

There will be holes with pads for LEDs in those positions (and Esc I think).

Excellent news! GFlad to hear that will be added :)
Yes, unfortunately some of the leds will be above instead of under the switch, because some of the switches have to be rotated 180 degrees and there's no way to do it differently.
This is also a bit crazier than I thought, I'm basically redesigning the whole board. I've done like a half of those pads so far;)

Will you release some pics for the various layouts to show which switches have to be rotated?
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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1713 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 08:36:32 »
This image is in the OP, and it is the Rev. A PCB. I believe we are on Rev. C now, and there may be another revision before it's final. This revision has some switches rotated 90 degrees, which none will be in the new revisions, but it illustrates why there is a need for rotating some switches.

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Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1714 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 08:47:36 »
Now we're on revision B, and hopefully there will be no C;)
As you can see I'm on the point of adding the LED pads.

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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1715 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 08:50:34 »
komar is awesome!

Just had to say that. :D
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Offline Broadmonkey

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1716 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 09:05:09 »
Is that LED pads on most all switches I see?  :eek:

Offline esoomenona

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1717 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 09:05:59 »
Mmm, yes. LEDs!

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1718 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 10:10:23 »
Is that LED pads on most all switches I see?  :eek:

I asked komar if he could include holes with solder pads, but no traces, on all switches for us. As you can see, he agreed, and he's in the process of doing that now.
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Offline Muffet

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1719 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 10:22:22 »
That sounds fair enough to me. Include basic LED support, for anyone who really wants to make it fully backlit it just takes a little more work individually.

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Offline Dubsgalore

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1720 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 10:23:53 »
:D :P great job guys
LEDS on the number row and wasd
would be legendary for me :P

Offline tricheboars

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1721 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 11:46:37 »
will adding LEDs add to the cost? this in no way would be an issue for me but it is something for JD and Komar to consider. I just wouldn't want them going out of pocket for additional features.

also will we have to wire and find power for the LEDs. not sure about power situation...
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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1722 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 11:51:36 »
To be clear, we aren't adding anything but holes with solder pads. Any LED options are totally DIY.

And no, the amount of holes on the board doesn't really affect the pricing of the PCB when manufactured, as long as there are <1000 or something.
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Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1723 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 13:11:35 »
Yes, the LEDs are totally a DIY thing. Power can be taken from either the ISP connector or the expansion connector, so this should not be a problem.
I'll also try to wire the WASD block and add some footprints for the resistors for them, but the rest will have only bare pads.
As for the number of holes, there are 3 options <300, [300, 600] and >600, we were at the second for the prototype, now we'll move to the third, but I don't think it changes the cost significantly.
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Offline mbreslin

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1724 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 14:59:36 »
I'd be happy to pay an extra 25$ assembly fee (plus the cost to order some leds) if you would solder in leds for mine?

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2. If you're too busy with all the other stuff and can't do it no worries!  ;D

Offline sth

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1725 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 16:29:08 »
Yes, the LEDs are totally a DIY thing. Power can be taken from either the ISP connector or the expansion connector, so this should not be a problem.

even for locks? (at least caps lock)
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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1726 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 16:31:36 »
Caps lock LED is supported already, as of Rev. A :)
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Offline domoaligato

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1727 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 17:31:44 »
Yes, the LEDs are totally a DIY thing. Power can be taken from either the ISP connector or the expansion connector, so this should not be a problem.
I'll also try to wire the WASD block and add some footprints for the resistors for them, but the rest will have only bare pads.
As for the number of holes, there are 3 options <300, [300, 600] and >600, we were at the second for the prototype, now we'll move to the third, but I don't think it changes the cost significantly.

I will enjoy doing this myself. that is why I am buying 2. I look forward to soldering all the led's on one of them and doing spring/stem mods etc to it. the otehr one will be for my office pc. :D

offtopic... can someone please link me some great soldering/desoldering/solder sucker/etc equipment available on amazon? If not in this thread then maybe in a PM please? this forum needs +thanks like xda dev forums. you guys are great!

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1728 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 18:28:50 »
I will post links later when I'm at a PC, but here is some good equipment to consider:

Soldering station:
Weller WES51
Weller WLC100
Hakko FX-888

Desoldering:
Hakko 808

Hot air station:
X-Tronic 4040
Aouye ??
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Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1729 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 19:05:38 »
offtopic... can someone please link me some great soldering/desoldering/solder sucker/etc equipment available on amazon? If not in this thread then maybe in a PM please? this forum needs +thanks like xda dev forums. you guys are great!

I'm just going to copy/paste directly from here.


budget setup:

Weller WLC-100
desoldering iron

decent setup:

Hakko FX-888
Edsyn Soldapullt


Rosin-core solder

Offline domoaligato

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1730 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 19:28:52 »
offtopic... can someone please link me some great soldering/desoldering/solder sucker/etc equipment available on amazon? If not in this thread then maybe in a PM please? this forum needs +thanks like xda dev forums. you guys are great!

I'm just going to copy/paste directly from here.


budget setup:

Weller WLC-100
desoldering iron

decent setup:

Hakko FX-888
Edsyn Soldapullt


Rosin-core solder

Thanks! this should get me going nicely.

Offline codyeatworld

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1731 on: Sun, 07 April 2013, 06:27:34 »
My \\ key sticks everytime its pressed \\ \\ \\ .

How do I fix this?




Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1732 on: Sun, 07 April 2013, 07:05:08 »
It's a bug which appears in windows, introduced by a fix of another bug in linux;)

EDIT: fixed
* ukbdc_gh60-git_a6bebd96.hex (21.28 kB - downloaded 104 times.)
« Last Edit: Sun, 07 April 2013, 07:27:36 by komar007 »
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Offline codyeatworld

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1733 on: Sun, 07 April 2013, 11:00:54 »
It's a bug which appears in windows, introduced by a fix of another bug in linux;)

EDIT: fixed
(Attachment Link)

Ok cool, I havent updated any firmware ye, and im in mac os x. I will have time to go thru the guide here later on.

I was thinking it was a bad switch :)




Offline duq

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1734 on: Sun, 07 April 2013, 21:13:10 »
If anyone wants to sell over  a proto to me I wouldn't mind doing additional testing :-).

Offline rknize

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1735 on: Tue, 09 April 2013, 15:32:56 »
komar, are you going to spin another small run of proto boards?  It seems like you are making quite a lot of changes and it would be a shame if the GB ended up with errors.
Russ

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1736 on: Tue, 09 April 2013, 16:10:45 »
komar, are you going to spin another small run of proto boards?  It seems like you are making quite a lot of changes and it would be a shame if the GB ended up with errors.

I believe that is the plan. Closed beta this time.
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Offline metalliqaz

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1737 on: Tue, 09 April 2013, 16:47:53 »
It's a bug which appears in windows, introduced by a fix of another bug in linux;)

EDIT: fixed
(Attachment Link)

How is that a windows bug?  Are you not sending the scancode for BACKSPACE_AND_PIPE ?

EDIT:  Oh wait, you mean it only shows up in windows, not that it's a bug with Windows itself.
« Last Edit: Tue, 09 April 2013, 16:49:57 by metalliqaz »

Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1738 on: Tue, 09 April 2013, 17:04:53 »
It's a bug which appears in windows, introduced by a fix of another bug in linux;)

EDIT: fixed
(Attachment Link)

How is that a windows bug?  Are you not sending the scancode for BACKSPACE_AND_PIPE ?

EDIT:  Oh wait, you mean it only shows up in windows, not that it's a bug with Windows itself.
Yes.
A little more elaborate: there is an error somewhere in the linux kernel, where if we're using a bitmap descriptor, the hid driver takes the keys one by one and checks for state changes. The error is, the previous states are kept in per-linux-code table, instead per-usb-scancode. Because there are 2 possible usb codes for '\|', they decided to map both to a single linux code, forgetting that the state for both is kept in one variable. So if I set scancode 49 (the standard for '\|'), and not set for 50, then the driver will detect a key press event, and just after that key release (when it finds that 50 is not set). This makes it impossible to press and hold this button in linux.
A quick fix was to set both 49 and 50 whenever the user presses '\|', and that's what caused the double press bahaviour in windows.
To fix this, I just removed code 50 from the descriptor, so that single bit is a constant field, and this solves the problem both for windows and linux.
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Offline domoaligato

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1739 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 12:05:37 »
Is there a discussion thread somewhere regarding developing a website like the ergodox has to create the firmware from a gui?

Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1740 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 12:07:58 »
Is there a discussion thread somewhere regarding developing a website like the ergodox has to create the firmware from a gui?
No, but there's a nearly working program for this and there will be a new, better one as well.
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Offline domoaligato

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1741 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 12:20:33 »
I am a c# developer. Please let me know if I can be of any help, if needed, for a windows GUI.

Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1742 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 07:22:31 »
I am a c# developer. Please let me know if I can be of any help, if needed, for a windows GUI.
Any help will be useful. The GUI will be most probably in C++/Qt it that's ok for you.

Now other things. Since we have the expansion connector with 4 free signals there, I've decided to use these 4 pins so that they're not wasted for those who don't need expansion. I've connected one of them to the WASD block leds, second to the escape led and the third to the Fn (to the right of right shift) led.
If someone is using the expansion connector, they just don't solder the resistors and there's no problem.
Now 1 signal is unused and I'm wondering where to connect it.
One option is backspace (you could do some visual indication in the upper right-hand corner of the keyboard with it).
The second option is the ISO backslash next to left shift (if someone wants to use it as Fn).
And the third is to connect it to the rcontrol, rgui, ralt, rshift block, to replicate the Poker arrows, so that they can glow when activated.

Please tell me what you think. I don't think there's time for another poll, so just write here.
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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1743 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 09:21:12 »
And the third is to connect it to the rcontrol, rgui, ralt, rshift block, to replicate the Poker arrows, so that they can glow when activated.

Please tell me what you think. I don't think there's time for another poll, so just write here.

I love this option!
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Offline rknize

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1744 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 10:32:38 »
Poker LEDs please!
Russ

Offline Broadmonkey

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1745 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 11:08:31 »
Yes, the Poker inspired arrows would be preferable.

Offline komar007

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1746 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 11:10:23 »
Yes, I think I agree.
We'll just have to find some nice low-current leds for WASD and arrows. We have at most 4mA per led here.
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Offline Dubsgalore

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1747 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 12:08:25 »
+1 for Poker Arrows

Offline domoaligato

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1748 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 12:43:14 »
I read in own of these threads that you were thinking about adding pads for leds on every switch hole but not adding traces to them all?
if this is the case then could the 4th lead be used to power the rest of the led's?

Offline jdcarpe

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Re: [Final Prototyping] GH60 Keyboard
« Reply #1749 on: Sat, 04 May 2013, 12:45:14 »
I read in own of these threads that you were thinking about adding pads for leds on every switch hole but not adding traces to them all?
if this is the case then could the 4th lead be used to power the rest of the led's?

It could, if you run hookup wire to all the other LEDs, since there are no traces to them. But I doubt if the current available will power all those LEDs.
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