Author Topic: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August 3rd 2018 on Massdrop  (Read 62814 times)

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Offline mdlt97

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #600 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 00:37:00 »
so than probably early 2019

i might get a set for photos cause its a really nice looking set
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Offline amnesia0287

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #601 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 05:04:03 »
But what about red cadet 🤞

Online Remsky

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #602 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 13:18:42 »

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #603 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 13:20:09 »

Online romevi

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #604 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 13:50:48 »

Offline roostrc0gburn

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #605 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 13:59:12 »
are we doing like star trek uniform colors? yellow/gold when?


Offline sickbabies

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #606 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 14:32:05 »
Would "Escape" be too cramped on the Esc key?





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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #607 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 16:19:32 »
Would "Escape" be too cramped on the Esc key?

Goes over the edge of the cap, tried that myself already.

Offline Jacob4341

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #608 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 16:45:40 »
So hyped for this set to drop!

Offline amnesia0287

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #609 on: Thu, 12 July 2018, 23:51:29 »
But what about red cadet 🤞

Crimson Cadet. 2019. Now shut up  :p

Show Image


Dang. I hadnít even considered the grey alphas with the red. Iím gonna spend too much again.

Offline darthzero

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #610 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 12:22:02 »
But what about red cadet 🤞

Crimson Cadet. 2019. Now shut up  :p

Show Image


Dang. I hadnít even considered the grey alphas with the red. Iím gonna spend too much again.
Would be awesome to have the grey alphas as an extra kit on "crimson cadet", would save quiet a bit for those that will get space cadet.
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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #611 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 20:02:35 »
Now we just missing violet and cream :p

Offline dimo

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #612 on: Fri, 13 July 2018, 21:02:14 »
Would it in any way be possible for:


Blue alphas + Blue mods being one base kit option.

Red alphas + Red mods being a second base kit option in the same drop.

And an extra add-on kit for GRAY alphas, for whoever wants it.


I know it flips the base kits, and although I have no idea how GMK production goes, I feel like it would be possible to have more than one base kit as one drop? Treating it as two separate.

Your reasoning for spreading out the dates might just be to keep the # of kits down since it might get crazy, but all we need is one mold to be made, right?

But ofc, the deal might already be set with Massdrop for the space cadet drop, and whatever happens, I'll wait out til 2019 (;


Good luck w everything

Offline amnesia0287

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #613 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 07:03:55 »
Would it in any way be possible for:


Blue alphas + Blue mods being one base kit option.

Red alphas + Red mods being a second base kit option in the same drop.

And an extra add-on kit for GRAY alphas, for whoever wants it.


I know it flips the base kits, and although I have no idea how GMK production goes, I feel like it would be possible to have more than one base kit as one drop? Treating it as two separate.

Your reasoning for spreading out the dates might just be to keep the # of kits down since it might get crazy, but all we need is one mold to be made, right?

But ofc, the deal might already be set with Massdrop for the space cadet drop, and whatever happens, I'll wait out til 2019 (;


Good luck w everything

While Iíd love this, you also gotta remember not everyone can swing all those caps in 1 month. I want the red keps, but I was always gonna buy all the blue / grey ones too.

I agree with the other dude too. Need my violet

Online Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #614 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 07:12:12 »
I don't want to do any other colorway while running the standard one, since we are already at 9 kits (to be posted later today). As amnesia pointed out, not everyone can afford to shell out 300+$ to get multiple base color options.

Crimson Cadet will not have as many child kits, but instead be accompanied by a third colorway.

Offline Allo

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #615 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 09:19:35 »
Crimson Cadet will not have as many child kits, but instead be accompanied by a third colorway.
Verde Cadet? 💧🔥🍃

Offline dimo

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #616 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 09:28:19 »
I don't want to do any other colorway while running the standard one, since we are already at 9 kits (to be posted later today). As amnesia pointed out, not everyone can afford to shell out 300+$ to get multiple base color options.

Crimson Cadet will not have as many child kits, but instead be accompanied by a third colorway.

Thanks, Iíll be waiting then ((:

Online Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update in OP
« Reply #617 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 16:57:08 »
Big update!

The group buy is scheduled to launch on Massdrop in August. The exact day is usually decided a week ahead of the drop, so I will update when I have a specific date. But it should be [the end date of SA Green Screen] + [a few days]. If you haven't already, you can vote for it on Massdrop to be notified when it goes live: https://www.massdrop.com/vote/GMK-Space-Cadet

I've taken in all of the feedback generated so far, and from that created the currently soft-locked revision of kits you can see below. Ever since the last update, which has been quite a while ago now, the following things have changed:

- t0mb3ry assisted me by creating vector work for the unique APL symbols, as well as further fine tuning the hand icons and roman numerals for the Symbols kit. All renders now feature these custom legends.
- I have further optimized the coverage of the base kit, it currently covers WK, WKL, Fullsize, 96key, 1800, CP, 60%, 65%, 75%, HHKB-style, the C70, 60% with arrows, and a few more I can't think of right now.
- I removed Cadet specific alpha keys from the base kit to cut down cost, and I believe not many people would have ended up making good use of them anyways. I now have standard US-ANSI alphas with two extra pipe keys for physical ISO support.
- I removed Gray keys from the Symbols kit. Instead I increased layout support, such as vertical macro/function rows on VE.A/TC-V3/RedScarf II.
- I removed Community keys from the Symbols kit. There seems to be a lack of interest in these nowadays anyways.
- I added blue spacebars to the Black Modifiers, and renamed the kit to True Cadet.
- I added a Cherry Icon kit for those that dislike the text-only modifiers I chose for the base kit. I did not go for Icon+Text (the 'standard' GMK legends used on Carbon/Laser/Nautilus etc) as I felt they didn't change too much about the look. Instead I went for the style of old Cherry keyboards such as the G80-1800 where the center part uses icons only, while top and bottom row remain text only. GMK Muted is a set that used this style for example, and I have demonstrated this in some of the renders.
- I added blue spacebars to the Blue Alphas kit.
- I removed blue spacebars from the Spacebars and -Keys kit, which is now a Spacekeys kit only.
-- The addition of blue spacebars to True Cadet and Blue Alphas now ensures nobody needing them forgets to purchase them, and it cuts the number of kits you need to buy from 3 down to 2, which saves about 15-20$ in a GMK buy in 'kit split taxes'.
- NorDeUK is untouched
- I am introducing the Assembly Kit, which is a kit independent from the Base Kit that fully covers the Ergodox keyboard.
- I am also introducing the 40bit Kit, which is also independent from the Base Kit and covers Planck, Preonic and a variety of 40% keyboards.
-- Both these kits have brand new ASM inspired modifier legends. I mocked up a blank modifier version for both, but with the busy Cadet alphas in the center it looked very imbalanced. These kits will not be cheap, probably more expensive than the base kit as they will hit way lower MOQ's (100 for both would be a big success already) while the base kit will most likely hit 500 units, and hopefully also 1000. So please keep in mind that you are probably going to be paying the price of a kit that is only produced a hundred times, but I think it is very much worth the extra cost for the modifier legends, and I hope many of you agree. I will then also be able to use these legends in GMK Oblivion V2 next year. And again, the base kit is NOT required, all you need is either the Assembly or the 40bit kit for your special layout, and I've seen people shell out 180-200$ in previous GMK runs where Ergodox modifiers had to be purchased in addition to the base set.
- Colevrak kit will not be offered. It would be 99$ due to even more custom legends, more keys than usual Colevrak kits, and have an MOQ of 100.

Lastly, the excellent outragedpudding has created a packaging design for the GMK trays. The Assembly and 40bit kits will probably also be coming in trays, but this is TBD.

Please enjoy the renders, and let me know if you have any questions or feedback! I already received pricing for all the kits apart from the Assembly and 40bit kits (I had those layouts covered in a bigger single kit, but the price was not viable). While I can not reveal pricing for the other kits at this point, I can however assure you that you will be very pleased with the 1000 unit price point of the Base Kit.

40% and Ergodox renders will follow once I have the pricing for those and am certain these will be offered.


Kit renders:




















Packaging preview:






Keyboard renders:













PS: There will be a couple collaborations with other products for the sets, stay tuned.
« Last Edit: Sat, 14 July 2018, 17:06:45 by Oblotzky »

Offline xondat

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update in OP
« Reply #618 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 16:59:18 »
Love it. Excited for this, it'll be my first MD buy for a damn while...

Offline ideus

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update in OP
« Reply #619 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 17:04:48 »
You may consider asking for R4C 2.75u and 2.25u spacebars. I am pretty sure that demand for SC may justify the new molds. Yet, the upcoming carbon kit in its second round will include them. That makes two large quantity batches that may support the new molds.

Online Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update in OP
« Reply #620 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 17:07:25 »
You may consider asking for R4C 2.75u and 2.25u spacebars. I am pretty sure that demand for SC may justify the new molds. Yet, the upcoming carbon kit in its second round will include them. That makes two large quantity batches that may support the new molds.

I will check with CK if those will be available in time, but no guarantees.

Offline ideus

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update in OP
« Reply #621 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 17:08:12 »
You may consider asking for R4C 2.75u and 2.25u spacebars. I am pretty sure that demand for SC may justify the new molds. Yet, the upcoming carbon kit in its second round will include them. That makes two large quantity batches that may support the new molds.

I will check with CK if those will be available in time, but no guarantees.


Fair enough.

Offline dantambok

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #622 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 18:07:23 »
My wallet is ready to burn!!! Also, no red cadet.  >:D

Offline Snappo

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #623 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 20:04:47 »

Offline saucybulgogi

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #624 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 20:21:47 »
Fantastic update! Love the ergodox mods getting legends.  Looking forward to this buy.


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Offline xondat

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet
« Reply #625 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 20:22:38 »

Offline Overchecken8

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #626 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 21:03:59 »
Been waiting for this to drop for so long. So excited!!


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Offline nickaster1

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #627 on: Sat, 14 July 2018, 21:08:01 »


Offline T0mb3ry

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #629 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 01:39:48 »
Where is the 1u R4 "code" keycap in the True Cadet kit?
The code key you mentioned is in the base set in row3. The core idea of True Cadet is to give lower mods (last two rows which both are row 4) black legends like it was done in original space cadet. So the code key is not required in True Cadet.

Offline Giorgio

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #630 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 02:41:40 »
The 30% massdrop import tax, the wrong un-vim arrows make probably impossible for me to join this. But maybe a kit, I could buy that. What's the pricing.

Offline rioc

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #631 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 03:46:55 »
The 30% massdrop import tax, the wrong un-vim arrows make probably impossible for me to join this. But maybe a kit, I could buy that. What's the pricing.
you basically want the symbiosis ghjkl keys then I guess?


by import tax, you mean the import tax your country charges you? (cause that's not up to MD is it..)

Offline Wetherbee

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #632 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:02:03 »
Please include a grey F1-F4 and F9-F12 kit for your fans who want to use Oblivion modifiers. Otherwise good set, but this is killing me. :thumb:

Even better: put the blue F1-F4 and F9-F12 in the True Cadet kit and put the grey F1-F4 and F9-F12 in the base kit. That seems to go more in line with the purpose of True Cadet, which is to differentiate the vintage homage from the modern layout. This would allow buyers to get that real vintage look with the blue spacebars and blue top row while also making the base more standard and flexible for TKL / fullsize / 1800 / 96key fans of your sets while also keeping it affordable.
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:13:14 by Wetherbee »

Offline OracleKev

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #633 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:20:03 »
Please include a grey F1-F4 and F9-F12 kit for your fans who want to use Oblivion modifiers. Otherwise good set, but this is killing me. :thumb:

Even better: put the blue F1-F4 and F9-F12 in the True Cadet kit and put the grey F1-F4 and F9-F12 in the base kit. That seems to go more in line with the purpose of True Cadet, which is to differentiate the vintage homage from the modern layout. This would allow buyers to get that real vintage look with the blue spacebars and blue top row while also making the base more standard and flexible for TKL / fullsize / 1800 / 96key fans of your sets while also keeping it affordable.

+1

Overall, just awesome, and timing is not too late!
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:23:29 by OracleKev »

Online Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #634 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:36:14 »
I currently have no intentions of making the function row sandwich-style, sorry.

Offline Wetherbee

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #635 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:42:24 »
I currently have no intentions of making the function row sandwich-style, sorry.

Oh, no need to apologize to me. I have no intention of buying a set with a top row that would crank my OCD to 11. I think it is going to be a success anyways, I'll just have to wait for the next round. Unless someone is aware of another set that uses the same color codes?
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:45:36 by Wetherbee »

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #636 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:47:40 »
I currently have no intentions of making the function row sandwich-style, sorry.

Oh, no need to apologize to me. I have no intention of buying a set with a top row that would crank my OCD to 11. I think it is going to be a success anyways, I'll just have to wait for the next round. Unless someone is aware of another set that uses the same color codes?

What layout do you use where you feel anything other than sandwich style looks wrong?

Offline Wetherbee

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #637 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 05:52:39 »
What layout do you use where you feel anything other than sandwich style looks wrong?

I only use TKL layouts on all of my keyboards. A solid top row looks really, really weird and off-putting, especially for folks who are fans of Tsangan layout who want that OG vintage feel or WKL feel, which is ironic because this is a vintage homage.

Now, one solid color for the whole keyboard looks great, which is why I like the all-blue option in this set.. but as soon as you differentiate the mod color from the alpha color you need that critical differentiation in the F-row or else .. you are calling the F-row a modifier row which doesn't really make sense. Although you could argue by this logic the F-row should be entirely alpha colored but that just doesn't look right either when viewed through the lens of over 30 years of keyboard layout history. I think if we looked back at the purpose of the function row, we would see that a function key could be either a modifier OR an alpha which is why some F keys had different colors, so you could keep your modifiers and your alphas separate when you programmed the function.

I'm not a 96 key user but if I was I would think that this would be even more critical because the F-row and the top row of alphas line up in a grid. Maybe it actual looks nicer on a 96 key layout this way because of color differentiation, but on a TKL it is kinda gross, not because it is a bad idea but because it ab-normal. Once you see it you can't unsee it. It killed GMK Taro for me and I absolutely freakin loved those colors.

I can definately see where you drew the inspiration from but the modern TKL layout should always, as a general modern standard, color the F1-F4 and F9-F12 the same as the Alphas. I can see how that is frustrating as a designer. I would always want to be breaking the rules.

On a less philosophical level and a more practical one - without standards in the community we lose the ability to interchange modifiers and alphas between sets. GMK Oblivion mods with Space Cadet Alphas was my plan - pure sex to my eyes, but now my plan is foiled.
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:04:52 by Wetherbee »

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #638 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:05:41 »
What layout do you use where you feel anything other than sandwich style looks wrong?

I only use TKL layouts on all of my keyboards. A solid top row looks really, really weird and off-putting, especially for folks who are fans of Tsangan layout who want that OG vintage feel or WKL feel.

Now, one solid color for the whole keyboard looks great, which is why I like the all-blue option in this set.. but as soon as you differentiate the mod color from the alpha color you need that critical differentiation in the F-row or else .. you are calling the F-row a modifier row which doesn't really make sense. Although you could argue by this logic the F-row should be entirely alpha colored but that just doesn't look right either when viewed through the lens of over 30 years of keyboard layout history.

I'm not a 96 key user but if I was I would think that this would be even more critical because the F-row and the top row of alphas line up in a grid. Maybe it actual looks nicer on a 96 key layout this way because of color differentiation, but on a TKL it is kinda gross, not because it is a bad idea but because it ab-normal. Once you see it you can't unsee it. It killed GMK Taro for me and I absolutely freakin loved those colors.

For me it was the other way around, once I saw the beauty of a uni-colored function row, the mixed ones look gross to me. I can accept it on something like 9009 where the colors are much closer and also have the 'OG factor', but for example Honeywell and Space Cadet, I don't like a mixed one at all. Also in terms of design rules, I agree that it makes most sense to have keys of the same 'group' have the same color. But I disagree that function row belongs with alphas, because alpha keys produce characters, which the function keys do not.

96key and 75% is a bit tricky indeed. Personally I prefer an entirely alpha colored function row on those layouts as well, but I don't want to add 12 keys (a solid 10$ in base kit price) to support that.

Offline Wetherbee

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #639 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:19:06 »
What layout do you use where you feel anything other than sandwich style looks wrong?

I only use TKL layouts on all of my keyboards. A solid top row looks really, really weird and off-putting, especially for folks who are fans of Tsangan layout who want that OG vintage feel or WKL feel.

Now, one solid color for the whole keyboard looks great, which is why I like the all-blue option in this set.. but as soon as you differentiate the mod color from the alpha color you need that critical differentiation in the F-row or else .. you are calling the F-row a modifier row which doesn't really make sense. Although you could argue by this logic the F-row should be entirely alpha colored but that just doesn't look right either when viewed through the lens of over 30 years of keyboard layout history.

I'm not a 96 key user but if I was I would think that this would be even more critical because the F-row and the top row of alphas line up in a grid. Maybe it actual looks nicer on a 96 key layout this way because of color differentiation, but on a TKL it is kinda gross, not because it is a bad idea but because it ab-normal. Once you see it you can't unsee it. It killed GMK Taro for me and I absolutely freakin loved those colors.

For me it was the other way around, once I saw the beauty of a uni-colored function row, the mixed ones look gross to me. I can accept it on something like 9009 where the colors are much closer and also have the 'OG factor', but for example Honeywell and Space Cadet, I don't like a mixed one at all. Also in terms of design rules, I agree that it makes most sense to have keys of the same 'group' have the same color. But I disagree that function row belongs with alphas, because alpha keys produce characters, which the function keys do not.

96key and 75% is a bit tricky indeed. Personally I prefer an entirely alpha colored function row on those layouts as well, but I don't want to add 12 keys (a solid 10$ in base kit price) to support that.

Unfortunately, history is really the problem here.

We owe differentiation of F-row colors to the designers of the IBM Enhanced Keyboard in 1986. Since then the 101-key standard and how you color the clusters, modifiers, and F-rows has been the same for millions if not billions of keyboards.

You are welcome to innovate as a designer and break the rules, but for people that spend most of their lives staring at keyboards, it just looks wrong. One man fighting against history. I wish you the best of luck. Maybe if IBM made a different decision in 1986 we would all have solid top rows. I dunno. Its hard - you want to innovate and push the envelope but at the same time the biggest issue with all of these GMK sets is that nobody seems to stick to a standard base set configuration.

I have no problem with innovation but I'd love if the community could standardize on optimized base sets that follow very simple color rules. The innovation should happen in the add-on kits. That's what you buy when you want to get creative and achieve the designer's intent.

The irony has not escaped me that the Space Cadet is the inspiration here, not the IBM Enhanced layout.. but I think the enhanced layout represents the modern 101 key design whereas the True Cadet is really going after the OG look of the Space Cadet.

If Symbolics was as successful as IBM maybe we would all have Space Cadet layouts instead of 101-key. :)
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:37:30 by Wetherbee »

Offline Wetherbee

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #640 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:29:05 »
I guess I should also point out for the history nerds that the IBM PC/AT Model 339 actually had all-Alpha colored F-row keys. It wasn't until later that IBM started coloring F5-F8 the same as the modifiers! The popularity of the Model M is what really established the standard that we have all been using for 32 years.

Even in 1992 the Model M2 had an entirely alpha-colored top row. So Oblotsky should feel like there is precedent to break the rules, even in 2018. If I were Oblotsky I would cite the Cherry G80-0528 produced for NCR, Nixdorf, and Olympia. Although it wasn't the 101 key layout standard, the one I have here clearly has a modifier-colored F-row, all the way up to F30 (although NCR eventually adopted the IBM standard coloring scheme with the Cherry G80-1000 which was Cherry's first Model-M style layout keyboard and the one we all still use today).

The question becomes then, one of looking at where you want GMK Space Cadet to fall in history. Is it an homage to Space Cadet? Clearly yes - True Cadet is the purest form given the many, many constraints on you as a designer by economic and aesthetic realities.

But then we have this notion of a base set which isn't True Cadet... is that then supposed to represent a modern GMK base layout, perhaps inspired by Cherry's earliest 101-key keyboards? If so, I would argue that the 101-key standard of using alpha-colored F1-F4 + F9-F12 should be followed as it represents the standard rather than the exception. Break with tradition, by all means, but please do it with an add-on kit.
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:54:26 by Wetherbee »

Offline OracleKev

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #641 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 06:40:14 »
It would be nice to get alternating function colors in the Base kit.
With unicolor going into the True Cadet kit.

Either way, I'm in.

Offline yap68

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #642 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 07:19:42 »
Anyway, I much prefer mod unicolour f row
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 07:22:51 by yap68 »

Online ihalatch

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #643 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 07:31:15 »
Where is the 1u R4 "code" keycap in the True Cadet kit?
The code key you mentioned is in the base set in row3. The core idea of True Cadet is to give lower mods (last two rows which both are row 4) black legends like it was done in original space cadet. So the code key is not required in True Cadet.

Where is the 1u R4 "code" keycap in the True Cadet kit?
The code key you mentioned is in the base set in row3. The core idea of True Cadet is to give lower mods (last two rows which both are row 4) black legends like it was done in original space cadet. So the code key is not required in True Cadet.

What I meant is that it's good to have R4 1u "FN" keycap to go with the R4 1.75u right "SHIFT" in the True Cadet kit. Anyway, it's awesome. I'm definitely in and spending a lot of money :)


Online Oblotzky

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #644 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 07:35:37 »
Where is the 1u R4 "code" keycap in the True Cadet kit?
The code key you mentioned is in the base set in row3. The core idea of True Cadet is to give lower mods (last two rows which both are row 4) black legends like it was done in original space cadet. So the code key is not required in True Cadet.

Where is the 1u R4 "code" keycap in the True Cadet kit?
The code key you mentioned is in the base set in row3. The core idea of True Cadet is to give lower mods (last two rows which both are row 4) black legends like it was done in original space cadet. So the code key is not required in True Cadet.

What I meant is that it's good to have R4 1u "FN" keycap to go with the R4 1.75u right "SHIFT" in the True Cadet kit. Anyway, it's awesome. I'm definitely in and spending a lot of money :)

There are no FN keys in the base kit either. META and HYPER keys are intended to be used as FN for this set.

Offline zslane

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #645 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 11:45:15 »
I think it is specious to call upon IBM's history to justify any aesthetic decisions since the original Space Cadet keyboard--the only keyboard whose history has any real relevance here--did not have F-keys at all. It did, however, have a top row of keys with special functions, but they were all 2u in size and blue in color.

Of course this keycap set is free to play around with the original Space Cadet aesthetic in any way it wants, but resorting to "history" as an authority on what ought to guide that aesthetic is fraught with logical peril. Just because these keys are cylindrical does not mean that aesthetic provenance comes from the Model F/M. Alternating F-key blocks make no more aesthetic "sense" than all-blue F-keys, and I would even argue they make less sense since they form the top row, and the top row of the Space Cadet was, historically speaking, all blue.

Offline packman86

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #646 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 12:25:04 »
I asked for this before and I'm just going to make a last ditch effort before this thing goes to GB stage.

Any chance to get Alpha/Mods colored Frow? I really like the aesthetics of having F5-F8 in Mod color and the others in Alpha colors.

Regardless of what happens with that Frow, I am 100% in on the GB.

Good work, Oblotzky!
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Offline thelaughingman

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #647 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 12:29:07 »
Am I crazy in thinking the grey alphas would go great with Ivory Mods from Carbon R2?  :eek: :eek: :eek:

@Wetherbee: you could buy base kit + blue alphas to have the set in all blue and then sell the grey alphas too me you know  :p

Offline avid

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #648 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 13:47:26 »
Beautiful kits, can't wait for this!

Offline Wetherbee

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Re: [IC] GMK Space Cadet, launches August, big update
« Reply #649 on: Sun, 15 July 2018, 15:34:42 »
I think it is specious to call upon IBM's history to justify any aesthetic decisions since the original Space Cadet keyboard--the only keyboard whose history has any real relevance here--did not have F-keys at all. It did, however, have a top row of keys with special functions, but they were all 2u in size and blue in color.

I almost agree with you, but if that were the case Oblotzky would only release the True Cadet kit as the base and it would be an accurate throwback... But he goes through the effort of developing multiple kits to please different audiences with what I see as a fuax paus in set design, not for any rational reason but because my eyes are trained to look at keysets in a certain way. Humans naturally develope standards of beauty not because beauty is an objective truth but because we are attracted to the familiar standard of beauty that each of our cultures develops. In the keyboard culture then, where do we get our standard of beauty? Why have keyboards colored the F-rows this way for more than 30 years? Is it rational or historical? Or maybe it is an antiquated standard and Oblotsky is rebelling against it and calling for a revolution?

What you are saying is true about True Cadet, but in this case the base kit is clearly intended to be a more universal colorscheme in the theme of Space Cadet but with a modern Cherry GMK colorway scheme (what I call "modern standard"), in which case your argument doesn't apply - the modern standard was not established in writing like an IEEE standard, it was established by history when IBM standardized the look of the 101-key layout and everyone and their mother copied it. Layouts since then, including the G80-1000, were just copying that look. It established the standard to the point where it looks weird to not alternate the alpha and mod colors on the F row. Most GMK sets adhere to this (not saying that they must.)

I'm not saying that Oblotsky shouldn't do it. I'm asking for him to give his customers the CHOICE. Grant us the freedom to decide for ourselves personally how we want it to look. It is a small thing but it deters my ability to enjoy the set because of what.. 8 keys? I'd happily drop $50 on a kit to get the extra F keys.

Oblotzky himself acknowldges this when he put alpha-colored spacebars in the base kit and only put blue spacebars in the True Cadet kit, a compromise by splitting off the authentic throwback from the generally acknowledged look of a modern GMK set. If adhering to the modern standard applies to spacebars why not the F row?
« Last Edit: Sun, 15 July 2018, 16:01:14 by Wetherbee »