Author Topic: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO  (Read 653465 times)

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Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1400 on: Mon, 23 March 2015, 17:16:04 »
I'd love to adapt it, according to what I've seen I could use Soarer's converter or xwhatsit's. Which one do you guys think is the best?  I ordered a Teensy recently to try and make this one, however I also found this converter on ebay [2], anyone bought something from him? is it safe? Nothing I'd ever make will look as neat so if it works I'd probably order it :)

What are the differences between [2] and [3]? I think the one I'll need is [2], anyone can confirm? there are pics on the album of my plug [1].

Also, is there any way to check if the keyboard internals are working before spending on the convertor?

[1] http://imgur.com/a/r55td
[2] http://www.ebay.com/itm/281476427201
[3] http://www.ebay.com/itm/271644933588


Orihalcon's gear is very clean and yes, it is far nicer than what you build yourself, although you will have more flexibility with a Teensy. You will have to have some appropriate hardware to use the XT with a modern computer.

You want the one you call [2] which is the "180 degree" DIN plug rather than [3] the "240 degree" version.

If you anticipate more experimenting, you could build something like my outboard converter box:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=58941.msg1348717#msg1348717
« Last Edit: Mon, 23 March 2015, 17:17:37 by fohat.digs »
The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline antdes457

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1401 on: Thu, 26 March 2015, 17:38:18 »
Anyone else noticed missing keystrokes with simultaneous keypresses when using Soarer's with a 122-key Model F?

Many 5+ key combinations such as 234we or pretty much any 5-key combinations on mixed rows and columns will only register 3-4 letters when pressed at the same time.

Another one, let's say you hold the shift key. Now press and hold 234we one by one while holding shift. If you release all the letters at the same time, the shift modifier will be lost. I don't know if this happens because of USB HID, the converter or the IBM controller. I'm trying to find out if other NKRO keyboards have the same problem with Soarer's converter or if xwhatsit's controller exhibits the same problems.

Offline Purpeltendire

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1402 on: Wed, 01 April 2015, 17:57:42 »
I appear to be having some problems with this, and I'm not sure if it's the keyboard or my converter. I decided to try one of the eBay converters, as I haven't really had time to make things lately.

The keyboard I'm using it with is a 122-key Computer Lab International with a five-pin AT.

When I first plugged it in (sadly didn't have HID Listen running) the keys seemed all off, and kept repeating (as if I held down the key). Not a big deal, I figured. Ran HID_Listen, recieved a keyboard ID of 0000, but keypresses would register as different keys and seemed to be reading in okay. No big deal, I figured. I'll just make a config with 'force set3' in it and send it over using scaswr.

After doing that, I've only been able to get this from HID_Listen:


The first line of error codes, which show up when I connect the board:
Code: [Select]
wF8 W085wF8 W085wF8 W085

The rest of the output is what happens when I press a key - any key. No matter what key is pressed, one line of this shows up:
Code: [Select]
R06 wFE
R06 wFE
R06 wFE
R06 wFE
R06 wFE
R06 wFE

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
I tried sending Halvar.sc and dvorak.sc using scaswr as well, but they resulted in the same output.

Edit: Some more information as I try to figure out what's going on:

Rebooted my computer, and keyboard changed back to Code Set 1 - The keypresses you see here are the result of my typing 'test'


After typing that, the keyboard again acted like I was holding down a key. In this case it was k. No keypresses are registering, but if I go into any window with a field that accepts characters, it's automatically filled with 'kkkkkkkkkkkkkk' and I had to unplug the keyboard for it to stop. On plugging it back in, I get this:



And here's the output of scinfo:
« Last Edit: Wed, 01 April 2015, 18:28:17 by Purpeltendire »

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1403 on: Wed, 01 April 2015, 19:13:10 »
I would boot the computer with a conventional PS/2 keyboard connected.

Then connect the subject keyboard to the Teensy and plug in the USB from the Teensy "hot" and wait for the computer to see it.

If it did not work from that point, I would then try re-booting the computer with the Teensy connected.

The computer can only "see" 1 Teensy, in any case. I usually start "cold" with no USB keyboards and plug in the Teensy USB "hot" the first time.
The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline Purpeltendire

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1404 on: Wed, 01 April 2015, 19:44:21 »
I would boot the computer with a conventional PS/2 keyboard connected.

Then connect the subject keyboard to the Teensy and plug in the USB from the Teensy "hot" and wait for the computer to see it.

If it did not work from that point, I would then try re-booting the computer with the Teensy connected.

The computer can only "see" 1 Teensy, in any case. I usually start "cold" with no USB keyboards and plug in the Teensy USB "hot" the first time.

Thanks for your help - unfortunately, no changes doing that. I booted with nothing, booted with a USB keyboard, and booted with a USB keyboard via a PS/2 adapter. Still the same result. Forcing Set 3 causes all keypresses to output R06, and forcing something else causes incorrect output.

'test' is being interpreted as 'backquote k F5 F6 Escape.'

Offline antdes457

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1405 on: Fri, 03 April 2015, 06:32:09 »
I had a similar same problem with a Raspberry Pi and a F122. Maybe the keyboard takes more than 500mA from the USB port. Do you have a USB3.0 port or a powered hub to test?

Also, maybe the data + clock voltage are too low on the AT side? Is it a keyboard where it's worth having pull-up resistors?

Actually, these guys state that the keyboard will not work with a USB converter, but they're probably not talking about Soarer's since it's able to convert protocols:
http://www.twindata.com/CLI/clikeyboard.htm

Offline Purpeltendire

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1406 on: Sun, 05 April 2015, 16:02:55 »
I had a similar same problem with a Raspberry Pi and a F122. Maybe the keyboard takes more than 500mA from the USB port. Do you have a USB3.0 port or a powered hub to test?

Also, maybe the data + clock voltage are too low on the AT side? Is it a keyboard where it's worth having pull-up resistors?

Actually, these guys state that the keyboard will not work with a USB converter, but they're probably not talking about Soarer's since it's able to convert protocols:
http://www.twindata.com/CLI/clikeyboard.htm

I was actually using USB3.0 ports on the front of my case. I tried plugging it in directly to the motherboard but it didn't fix anything, sadly. Same results.

I'd be willing to try the pull-up resistor if I had time and this was my own Teensy, but as this is one from orihalcon's eBay I can't. I'm considering returning it and building my own instead, but I can't really think of a reason why that would work while his does not.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1407 on: Sun, 05 April 2015, 16:44:46 »
but as this is one from orihalcon's eBay I can't. I'm considering returning it and building my own instead,

If you send it back, ask him to test it.

I would guess that at least 10% of my computer problems come from faulty wiring or connections.
The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline antdes457

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1408 on: Thu, 09 April 2015, 07:57:14 »
The pull-up resistor is also possible directly on the IBM controller though.

Offline mougrim

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1409 on: Thu, 09 April 2015, 11:13:41 »
There are something strange with my Model F or convertor. From time to time it just begins to repeat last pressed key. It never happens when I typing on it, but if I leave my PC powered on and returns to it after half an hour or so, I can find ten or so new pages in my editor filled with last entered letter. When I press some other key, it stops doing so. Any idea? Maybe I should re-flash my Soarer's converter?
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Offline antdes457

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1410 on: Thu, 09 April 2015, 11:20:22 »
Can you try a USB 2 vs USB 3 port or a USB hub?

Offline Skechup

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1411 on: Tue, 21 April 2015, 13:13:07 »
This seems like something I would do.

Good Job!!!  :thumb:

Offline Skechup

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1412 on: Tue, 21 April 2015, 13:40:59 »
This seems like something I would do.

Good Job!!!  :thumb:

Offline pandroid

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1413 on: Wed, 06 May 2015, 22:05:34 »
Hi folks,

After reading through the thread and going through the documentation of stellar work done by Soarer I've decided to bite the bullet and convert a terminal type keyboard (p/n 1394193) to USB using a Pro Micro. Got the Pro Micro side done, I can see it reporting as:

Code: [Select]
$ sudo ./scinfo
scinfo: looking for Soarer's Converter: found
scinfo: sending info request: ok
device: ok

Protocol Version: v1.00
Code Version: v1.12
Max Settings Version: v1.01
Current Settings Version: v0.00
SRAM Size: 2560 bytes
SRAM Free: 1809 bytes
EEPROM Size: 1024 bytes
EEPROM Free: 1020 bytes

I am not quite sure about the physical connection, though. Here's what I am thinking:



Does this look about right? I'd appreciate another set of eyes going through my connections before I go ahead and fry my keyboard off :)

Thanks!

Offline Halvar

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1414 on: Thu, 07 May 2015, 01:48:14 »
Looks right to me.  :thumb:

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1415 on: Thu, 07 May 2015, 07:41:02 »
When is Soarer's/Teensy recognized by the BIOS, and is there any way to change it?

While booting up, I cannot use "Delete" to get into BIOS because the keyboard is not recognized yet. Having a 2nd (conventional) keyboard plugged in solves the problem, but that is a kludge.

"Soarer's Converter" appears as a device in the hardware list, but is it actually a "keyboard" in the early part of the cycle?

Thanks
The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline pandroid

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1416 on: Fri, 15 May 2015, 15:36:05 »
Looks right to me.  :thumb:

Indeed it was, thanks for checking. I'm now a proud owner of a new-old keyboard!

Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1417 on: Fri, 15 May 2015, 20:53:06 »
Got my Teensy in the mail today. I couldn't believe how easy this was to set up!

100806-0

Now I can fully take advantage of my PC-122's battle station keys.

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Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1418 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 11:40:33 »
So the docs say not to use FAKE_01 thru FAKE_19 because they are deprecated. Use EXTRA_* instead. But I don't see a replacement for FAKE_01 (B0) in the current table. This corresponds to the top-left nav cluster key on my PC-122 (where Insert usually is). The docs seem to skip over B0 and go right from AF to B1.

What EXTRA code do I use instead of FAKE_01? Am I missing something? Also, it looks like FAKE_18 (C1) is also missing from the main code listing.

Alpine Winter GB | My Personal TMK Firmware Repo
IBM Rubber Band "Floss" Mod | Click Modding Alps 101 | Flame-Polishing Cherry MX Stems
Review: hasu's USB to USB converter
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AEKII 60% | Alps64 HHKB | Ducky Shine 3, MX Blues | IBM Model M #1391401, Nov. 1990 | IBM SSK #1391472, Nov. 1987, screw modded, rubber-band modded | Noppoo EC108-Pro, 45g | Infinity 60% v2 Hacker, Matias Quiet Pros | Infinity 60% v2 Standard, MX Browns | Cherry G80-1800LPCEU-2, MX Blacks | Cherry G80-1813 (Dolch), MX Blues | Unicomp M-122, ANSI-modded | Unicomp M-122 (Unsaver mod in progress) | 2x Unitek K-258, White Alps | Apple boards (IIGS, AEKII) | Varmilo VA87MR, Gateron Blacks | Filco Zero TKL, Fukka White Alps | Planck, Gateron Browns | Monarch, click-modded Cream Alps

Offline E TwentyNine

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1419 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 12:02:17 »
It's deprecated, it should still work.
Daily driver: SSK or Tenkeyless IBM AT
1984 Model M Industrial Prototype ⌨ 1992 Black Oval Industrial SSK ⌨ 1982 5251 Beam Spring ⌨ 89 Key "SSK" ⌨ M13 triplets

Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1420 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 12:07:28 »
It's deprecated, it should still work.

Yes, the FAKE_* codes still work but I'm just wondering if there's a replacement for them so that I can future-proof my config.

Alpine Winter GB | My Personal TMK Firmware Repo
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Review: hasu's USB to USB converter
My boards:
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AEKII 60% | Alps64 HHKB | Ducky Shine 3, MX Blues | IBM Model M #1391401, Nov. 1990 | IBM SSK #1391472, Nov. 1987, screw modded, rubber-band modded | Noppoo EC108-Pro, 45g | Infinity 60% v2 Hacker, Matias Quiet Pros | Infinity 60% v2 Standard, MX Browns | Cherry G80-1800LPCEU-2, MX Blacks | Cherry G80-1813 (Dolch), MX Blues | Unicomp M-122, ANSI-modded | Unicomp M-122 (Unsaver mod in progress) | 2x Unitek K-258, White Alps | Apple boards (IIGS, AEKII) | Varmilo VA87MR, Gateron Blacks | Filco Zero TKL, Fukka White Alps | Planck, Gateron Browns | Monarch, click-modded Cream Alps

Offline E TwentyNine

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1421 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 12:54:07 »
You're future proofed.  May not be as pretty as you like though.

Soarer hasn't been around here for a while now :( and I doubt any updates are coming soon.

If he did update there's no real valid reason for removing deprecated constants.

Checking the binary there are 17 EXTRA_ codes and 19 FAKE_ codes defined.   I pulled all the codes out of the binary, in attached file.

I don't know if there's a generic HID_## definition that will let you specify the code directly, didn't see anything in the docs.
Daily driver: SSK or Tenkeyless IBM AT
1984 Model M Industrial Prototype ⌨ 1992 Black Oval Industrial SSK ⌨ 1982 5251 Beam Spring ⌨ 89 Key "SSK" ⌨ M13 triplets

Offline berserkfan

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1422 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 14:03:44 »
Hey Guys

 I have a couple of Arduinos but was never able to make them work.

I flashed them with great difficulty, but if anyone can suggest an easier way please tell. Dorkvader linked me to some rather complex instructions, already 95% refined by DV from the original discussion threads, but still hard enough to follow that I can't remember what I did.

Then I got soarer on them, but couldn't make progress after that. Windows Device Manager detects Soarer's Keyboard Converter. The red light is on, showing power is recieved.  scwr.exe shows that Soarer was indeed flashed correctly. My multimeter on DC voltage shows that voltage between vcc and gnd pins is 3.52v with the keyboard connected, and 4.55v without the keyboard.

  As reported here. https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71975.0

Findecanor has recommended that I short the J1 pins, but before I do anything that involves shorting anything I'd like to hear how other people did it!
Most of the modding can be done on your own once you break through the psychological barriers.

Offline Halvar

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1423 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 15:04:18 »
So the docs say not to use FAKE_01 thru FAKE_19 because they are deprecated. Use EXTRA_* instead. But I don't see a replacement for FAKE_01 (B0) in the current table. This corresponds to the top-left nav cluster key on my PC-122 (where Insert usually is). The docs seem to skip over B0 and go right from AF to B1.

What EXTRA code do I use instead of FAKE_01? Am I missing something? Also, it looks like FAKE_18 (C1) is also missing from the main code listing.

The top left key on the numpad of a 122 key terminal keyboard is ESC by default. I'm using that to remap it (to NumLock), and it works. If your PC-122 (?) is a mode 3 board (i.e. a terminal board), it should work for you, too.

Where on the keyboard is FAKE_18?





Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1424 on: Mon, 18 May 2015, 17:05:14 »


So the docs say not to use FAKE_01 thru FAKE_19 because they are deprecated. Use EXTRA_* instead. But I don't see a replacement for FAKE_01 (B0) in the current table. This corresponds to the top-left nav cluster key on my PC-122 (where Insert usually is). The docs seem to skip over B0 and go right from AF to B1.

What EXTRA code do I use instead of FAKE_01? Am I missing something? Also, it looks like FAKE_18 (C1) is also missing from the main code listing.

The top left key on the numpad of a 122 key terminal keyboard is ESC by default. I'm using that to remap it (to NumLock), and it works. If your PC-122 (?) is a mode 3 board (i.e. a terminal board), it should work for you, too.

Where on the keyboard is FAKE_18?

Mine is a Unicomp PS/2 PC-122. I did an ANSI layout conversion when I screw modded it, but that doesn't affect the keys in question.

BTW, I'm not talking about top left on the numpad, but rather the nav cluster (above the arrow keys). FAKE_01 works, I just saw the deprecation notice which is why I asked about it.

FAKE_18 corresponds to one of the meta cluster keys to the left of the alphas. I don't remember which one, but I think it was 2nd or 3rd from the bottom on the right. Again, FAKE_18 works fine to remap that key.

I'm just wondering why those two don't have replacement designations. Maybe Soarer didn't have a board to test these two when he redefined those constants?

Alpine Winter GB | My Personal TMK Firmware Repo
IBM Rubber Band "Floss" Mod | Click Modding Alps 101 | Flame-Polishing Cherry MX Stems
Review: hasu's USB to USB converter
My boards:
More
AEKII 60% | Alps64 HHKB | Ducky Shine 3, MX Blues | IBM Model M #1391401, Nov. 1990 | IBM SSK #1391472, Nov. 1987, screw modded, rubber-band modded | Noppoo EC108-Pro, 45g | Infinity 60% v2 Hacker, Matias Quiet Pros | Infinity 60% v2 Standard, MX Browns | Cherry G80-1800LPCEU-2, MX Blacks | Cherry G80-1813 (Dolch), MX Blues | Unicomp M-122, ANSI-modded | Unicomp M-122 (Unsaver mod in progress) | 2x Unitek K-258, White Alps | Apple boards (IIGS, AEKII) | Varmilo VA87MR, Gateron Blacks | Filco Zero TKL, Fukka White Alps | Planck, Gateron Browns | Monarch, click-modded Cream Alps

Offline Halvar

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1425 on: Tue, 19 May 2015, 02:16:49 »
Ah, I should read better.

You're probably right with your theory. I have both an IBM F-122 and an M-122, but they both use the terminal protocol, and I didn't need the FAKE_xx codes to fully convert them. The key on the upper left of the nav cluster on them just gives me INSERT like it's supposed to. I guess Unicomp might have come up with some different, special codes for their PC-122 boards that Soarer didn't consider.

Offline berserkfan

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1426 on: Tue, 19 May 2015, 07:14:50 »
Ah, I should read better.

You're probably right with your theory. I have both an IBM F-122 and an M-122, but they both use the terminal protocol, and I didn't need the FAKE_xx codes to fully convert them. The key on the upper left of the nav cluster on them just gives me INSERT like it's supposed to. I guess Unicomp might have come up with some different, special codes for their PC-122 boards that Soarer didn't consider.

Having owned different Model Ms and Fs I can reassure you that there are a lot of weird models out there which send weird scancodes. I suspect that during these early computing days when a lot of hardware was still fairly proprietary, there would be big organizations ordering like 10000 keyboards with a few unique scancodes that worked only on their software.

So I always do HID test. And I am often surprised.
Most of the modding can be done on your own once you break through the psychological barriers.

Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1427 on: Tue, 19 May 2015, 14:42:00 »
Ah, I should read better.

You're probably right with your theory. I have both an IBM F-122 and an M-122, but they both use the terminal protocol, and I didn't need the FAKE_xx codes to fully convert them. The key on the upper left of the nav cluster on them just gives me INSERT like it's supposed to. I guess Unicomp might have come up with some different, special codes for their PC-122 boards that Soarer didn't consider.

Having owned different Model Ms and Fs I can reassure you that there are a lot of weird models out there which send weird scancodes. I suspect that during these early computing days when a lot of hardware was still fairly proprietary, there would be big organizations ordering like 10000 keyboards with a few unique scancodes that worked only on their software.

So I always do HID test. And I am often surprised.

Yeah I did the HID test for every key. AFAIK there was no pattern to the scancodes for any of the keys in the F13-F24 bank or the meta cluster on the left.

I take that back. I believe the keys labeled F17-F24 corresponded to the scancodes for F13-F20, respectively. Everything else was an utter hodgepodge.

Oh, well. At least I've got the FAKE_* codes that I can use. And if Soarer ever removes those I'll just make some noise that the replacements need to be added. Fortunately, as already stated, this is unlikely to happen at this point.

Alpine Winter GB | My Personal TMK Firmware Repo
IBM Rubber Band "Floss" Mod | Click Modding Alps 101 | Flame-Polishing Cherry MX Stems
Review: hasu's USB to USB converter
My boards:
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AEKII 60% | Alps64 HHKB | Ducky Shine 3, MX Blues | IBM Model M #1391401, Nov. 1990 | IBM SSK #1391472, Nov. 1987, screw modded, rubber-band modded | Noppoo EC108-Pro, 45g | Infinity 60% v2 Hacker, Matias Quiet Pros | Infinity 60% v2 Standard, MX Browns | Cherry G80-1800LPCEU-2, MX Blacks | Cherry G80-1813 (Dolch), MX Blues | Unicomp M-122, ANSI-modded | Unicomp M-122 (Unsaver mod in progress) | 2x Unitek K-258, White Alps | Apple boards (IIGS, AEKII) | Varmilo VA87MR, Gateron Blacks | Filco Zero TKL, Fukka White Alps | Planck, Gateron Browns | Monarch, click-modded Cream Alps

Offline Halvar

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1428 on: Tue, 19 May 2015, 14:56:38 »
@berserkfan: Generally speaking that's definitely true, but we're talking about IBM in the late 80s to early 90s here, and I think IBM's hardware was pretty standardized at this time at this level. Do you have an example for a Model M keyboard with weird protocols/keycodes from the IBM time? The only example I can think of are their 122 key boards for PCs that were used to emulate a terminal on a PC, and those POS matrix boards.

The Unicomp PC-122 is a more or less modern keyboard though, and I don't really trust Unicomp to adhere to any IBM standards. Much more than IBM they are the kind of company that would custom-taylor controllers for special applications.

Offline JPG

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1429 on: Tue, 19 May 2015, 15:10:47 »
Hey Guys

 I have a couple of Arduinos but was never able to make them work.

I flashed them with great difficulty, but if anyone can suggest an easier way please tell. Dorkvader linked me to some rather complex instructions, already 95% refined by DV from the original discussion threads, but still hard enough to follow that I can't remember what I did.

Then I got soarer on them, but couldn't make progress after that. Windows Device Manager detects Soarer's Keyboard Converter. The red light is on, showing power is recieved.  scwr.exe shows that Soarer was indeed flashed correctly. My multimeter on DC voltage shows that voltage between vcc and gnd pins is 3.52v with the keyboard connected, and 4.55v without the keyboard.

  As reported here. https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71975.0

Findecanor has recommended that I short the J1 pins, but before I do anything that involves shorting anything I'd like to hear how other people did it!


The pro micro is the only converter I used so far. I used it on my AT, F122 and XT. Worked with all of them (even if the first time it was hard to find how to flash it). Some people said sometime you need a pullup resistor if your cable is very long, but I never had this issue. What keyboard are you trying to use?
IBM F122, IBM XT F X2, IBM AT F (all Soarer converted), Filco Camo TKL Browns

Offline berserkfan

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1430 on: Thu, 21 May 2015, 02:47:50 »
Hey Guys

 I have a couple of Arduinos but was never able to make them work.

I flashed them with great difficulty, but if anyone can suggest an easier way please tell. Dorkvader linked me to some rather complex instructions, already 95% refined by DV from the original discussion threads, but still hard enough to follow that I can't remember what I did.

Then I got soarer on them, but couldn't make progress after that. Windows Device Manager detects Soarer's Keyboard Converter. The red light is on, showing power is recieved.  scwr.exe shows that Soarer was indeed flashed correctly. My multimeter on DC voltage shows that voltage between vcc and gnd pins is 3.52v with the keyboard connected, and 4.55v without the keyboard.

  As reported here. https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71975.0

Findecanor has recommended that I short the J1 pins, but before I do anything that involves shorting anything I'd like to hear how other people did it!


The pro micro is the only converter I used so far. I used it on my AT, F122 and XT. Worked with all of them (even if the first time it was hard to find how to flash it). Some people said sometime you need a pullup resistor if your cable is very long, but I never had this issue. What keyboard are you trying to use?

I am trying to use my two Arduinos on a Model F 122 key.

On one arduino I used a big blob of solder to merge the two J1 components together. On the other ardunio, I used a piece of wire to bridge the two components. Both did not work – exactly same result as always where the Soarer keyboard converter could be found and the Arduino LED lighted up, but no HID codes could be detected.

Did I do something wrong? The J1 is a square pad with two tiny rectangular components. Should I have bridged the two J1 pads with the USB micro casing instead? Or bridged the J1 components with other pads?
I am trying to use my two Arduinos on a Model F 122 key.

On one arduino I used a big blob of solder to merge the two J1 components together. On the other ardunio, I used a piece of wire to bridge the two components. Both did not work – exactly same result as always where the Soarer keyboard converter could be found and the Arduino LED lighted up, but no HID codes could be detected.

Did I do something wrong? The J1 is a square pad with two tiny rectangular components. Should I have bridged the two J1 pads with the USB micro casing instead? Or bridged the J1 components with other pads?
I am trying to use my two Arduinos on a Model F 122 key.

On one arduino I used a big blob of solder to merge the two J1 components together. On the other ardunio, I used a piece of wire to bridge the two components. Both did not work – exactly same result as always where the Soarer keyboard converter could be found and the Arduino LED lighted up, but no HID codes could be detected.

Did I do something wrong? The J1 is a square pad with two tiny rectangular components. Should I have bridged the two J1 pads with the USB micro casing instead? Or bridged the J1 components with other pads?

As for cable, I changed to a very short USB micro cable just in case. USB micro cables of different lengths don't work.
Most of the modding can be done on your own once you break through the psychological barriers.

Offline dark_samus

  • Posts: 6
Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1431 on: Fri, 17 July 2015, 18:19:09 »
Soarer you should release the source code for this I want to port it to an atmega32u2 (maybe you can compile a version for me or something) any help would be apreciated  :)

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1432 on: Fri, 17 July 2015, 19:01:05 »
Soarer has been silent for well over a year now.

We all miss him badly.
The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline Snarfangel

  • Posts: 285
Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1433 on: Wed, 22 July 2015, 16:05:46 »
I bought a converter from orihalcon, and want to do major changes to the mapping from a Maltron two-handed keyboard. I have a single question to start with (I will have more! Oh yes, I will have many, many more!):

Is it easy to change Soarer's converter back to its default setting (i.e. wipe out all of the cruft -- mappings and macros) in memory? Or is it a matter of rewriting all of the settings?

I just want a format c: command for the thing (ignoring the firmware, of course), and start fresh. :))

Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1434 on: Thu, 23 July 2015, 22:22:55 »
I bought a converter from orihalcon, and want to do major changes to the mapping from a Maltron two-handed keyboard. I have a single question to start with (I will have more! Oh yes, I will have many, many more!):

Is it easy to change Soarer's converter back to its default setting (i.e. wipe out all of the cruft -- mappings and macros) in memory? Or is it a matter of rewriting all of the settings?

I just want a format c: command for the thing (ignoring the firmware, of course), and start fresh. :))

AFAIK you can use an empty file the same way as you would any other config (build .sc to .scb and write) and it should wipe all settings.

Alpine Winter GB | My Personal TMK Firmware Repo
IBM Rubber Band "Floss" Mod | Click Modding Alps 101 | Flame-Polishing Cherry MX Stems
Review: hasu's USB to USB converter
My boards:
More
AEKII 60% | Alps64 HHKB | Ducky Shine 3, MX Blues | IBM Model M #1391401, Nov. 1990 | IBM SSK #1391472, Nov. 1987, screw modded, rubber-band modded | Noppoo EC108-Pro, 45g | Infinity 60% v2 Hacker, Matias Quiet Pros | Infinity 60% v2 Standard, MX Browns | Cherry G80-1800LPCEU-2, MX Blacks | Cherry G80-1813 (Dolch), MX Blues | Unicomp M-122, ANSI-modded | Unicomp M-122 (Unsaver mod in progress) | 2x Unitek K-258, White Alps | Apple boards (IIGS, AEKII) | Varmilo VA87MR, Gateron Blacks | Filco Zero TKL, Fukka White Alps | Planck, Gateron Browns | Monarch, click-modded Cream Alps

Offline Blaise170

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1435 on: Sun, 26 July 2015, 15:45:27 »
.
« Last Edit: Sun, 26 July 2015, 17:53:31 by Blaise170 »
I proxy anything including keyboards (キーボード / 鍵盤), from both Japan (日本) and China (中國). For more information, you may visit my dedicated webpage here: https://www.keyboards.es/proxying.html

View my current and past keyboards here: https://deskthority.net/wiki/User:Blaise170

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1436 on: Sun, 26 July 2015, 22:02:47 »
Orihalcon encloses his gear in a tiny package.

An actual Teensy has a reset button.
The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline Blaise170

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1437 on: Sun, 08 November 2015, 21:47:16 »
My search skills have failed me, so hope I can find an answer here. Is there a pinout for the Arduino Leonardo? I managed to get one of mine flashed with Soarer but I have no idea which pins to use.
I proxy anything including keyboards (キーボード / 鍵盤), from both Japan (日本) and China (中國). For more information, you may visit my dedicated webpage here: https://www.keyboards.es/proxying.html

View my current and past keyboards here: https://deskthority.net/wiki/User:Blaise170

Offline njbair

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1438 on: Sun, 08 November 2015, 21:53:30 »
My search skills have failed me, so hope I can find an answer here. Is there a pinout for the Arduino Leonardo? I managed to get one of mine flashed with Soarer but I have no idea which pins to use.
You may have to pull up a teensy pinout and the Leonardo one side by side and map it out.

Alpine Winter GB | My Personal TMK Firmware Repo
IBM Rubber Band "Floss" Mod | Click Modding Alps 101 | Flame-Polishing Cherry MX Stems
Review: hasu's USB to USB converter
My boards:
More
AEKII 60% | Alps64 HHKB | Ducky Shine 3, MX Blues | IBM Model M #1391401, Nov. 1990 | IBM SSK #1391472, Nov. 1987, screw modded, rubber-band modded | Noppoo EC108-Pro, 45g | Infinity 60% v2 Hacker, Matias Quiet Pros | Infinity 60% v2 Standard, MX Browns | Cherry G80-1800LPCEU-2, MX Blacks | Cherry G80-1813 (Dolch), MX Blues | Unicomp M-122, ANSI-modded | Unicomp M-122 (Unsaver mod in progress) | 2x Unitek K-258, White Alps | Apple boards (IIGS, AEKII) | Varmilo VA87MR, Gateron Blacks | Filco Zero TKL, Fukka White Alps | Planck, Gateron Browns | Monarch, click-modded Cream Alps

Offline Halvar

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1439 on: Mon, 09 November 2015, 07:38:23 »

Offline Blaise170

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1440 on: Mon, 09 November 2015, 07:48:11 »
Managed to find one, I'll link it here for future reference.


Edit: thanks, I just found it too.
I proxy anything including keyboards (キーボード / 鍵盤), from both Japan (日本) and China (中國). For more information, you may visit my dedicated webpage here: https://www.keyboards.es/proxying.html

View my current and past keyboards here: https://deskthority.net/wiki/User:Blaise170

Offline Misha353W

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1441 on: Sun, 06 December 2015, 11:17:59 »
Yesterday my order from China arrived, with 2 Arduino Leonardo clones :)
I flashed one of them with "Soarer_at2usb_v1.11_atmega32u4.hex". According to the Arduino builder the upload was successful but when I look in the device manager it shows 2 HID Keyboard Devices that both come from this one board. This doesn't seem right to me, should I try flashing the hex file again? I'm still waiting for a DIN socket to arrive so I can't test the keyboard yet...

Offline Ir0n

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1442 on: Mon, 07 December 2015, 11:56:43 »
Edit: I got it
« Last Edit: Mon, 07 December 2015, 15:54:19 by Ir0n »

Offline Misha353W

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1443 on: Wed, 09 December 2015, 15:26:46 »
It's alive! This is the first post I'm typing on my 1987 Model M! :thumb: I got the din socket in the mail yesterday and soldered all the parts together 10 minutes ago. It needs some fine tuning to work with the German layout but I'm quite happy it works and I want to enjoy the sound of it for a while before I do anything else with it.
After plugging in the keyboard for the 1st time it kept repeating the keys I pressed, but that problem seems to be gone now. The second keyboard still shows up in the device manager but apparently that doesn't cause any problems.


Offline warfaren

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1444 on: Sun, 13 December 2015, 15:46:43 »
Been using it for a while now with my XT Model F and loving it! Now, if I could only get it to work with my KVM switch, it would be the best thing ever. It just won't work though, I'm assuming it's because of how it achieves full NKRO. If there's a way to disable that I would be perfectly happy with the 6KRO USB provides anyway.

Offline Blaise170

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1445 on: Sun, 13 December 2015, 16:44:07 »
It's alive! This is the first post I'm typing on my 1987 Model M! :thumb: I got the din socket in the mail yesterday and soldered all the parts together 10 minutes ago. It needs some fine tuning to work with the German layout but I'm quite happy it works and I want to enjoy the sound of it for a while before I do anything else with it.
After plugging in the keyboard for the 1st time it kept repeating the keys I pressed, but that problem seems to be gone now. The second keyboard still shows up in the device manager but apparently that doesn't cause any problems.



Been using it for a while now with my XT Model F and loving it! Now, if I could only get it to work with my KVM switch, it would be the best thing ever. It just won't work though, I'm assuming it's because of how it achieves full NKRO. If there's a way to disable that I would be perfectly happy with the 6KRO USB provides anyway.

Hi guys, unfortunately Soarer disappeared last year and (as far as I know) no one knows what happened. I don't know enough about AVR programming to help either. Sorry about that.  :thumb:
I proxy anything including keyboards (キーボード / 鍵盤), from both Japan (日本) and China (中國). For more information, you may visit my dedicated webpage here: https://www.keyboards.es/proxying.html

View my current and past keyboards here: https://deskthority.net/wiki/User:Blaise170

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1446 on: Sun, 13 December 2015, 18:10:17 »

unfortunately Soarer disappeared last year


I think it has been closer to 2 years. I just hope that he got a new girl friend and went off the grid in Pago Pago.

The difference in characterization of crime and who commits it skews what criminality looks like demographically. "What we're seeing so far is very similar to the process that we see with Islamic violent Jihad radicalization," said former FBI Assistant Director Frank Figliuzzi, "This wanting to belong to a cause greater than yourself, wanting to get affirmation from a group who may not even know who you are or ever met you. And then feeling like you're part of this deployment, this cause. You heard him say on the clip 'It's my job to protect this.'
No, it's not your job. But you think it is. And video last night shows him walking around roaming around with the assault rifle not really doing much of protecting anything." Figliuzzi made it clear that calling these characters "troubled" is a misnomer. "I would assert," Figliuzzi continued. "that it's time we stopped using the word ‘troubled’ with regard to white young people who act out like this and start thinking about the radicalized term that we used when people of color or people of Islamic faith act out like this. This is a radicalization process that's happening. It happened with the El Paso shooter in Texas. We kept hearing he was troubled. No, he was radicalized. And it's happening online."

Offline Blaise170

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1447 on: Sun, 13 December 2015, 20:24:07 »

unfortunately Soarer disappeared last year


I think it has been closer to 2 years. I just hope that he got a new girl friend and went off the grid in Pago Pago.

Yep, last login August 2014 so over a year ago.
I proxy anything including keyboards (キーボード / 鍵盤), from both Japan (日本) and China (中國). For more information, you may visit my dedicated webpage here: https://www.keyboards.es/proxying.html

View my current and past keyboards here: https://deskthority.net/wiki/User:Blaise170

Offline jiexi

  • Posts: 25
Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1448 on: Tue, 12 January 2016, 00:32:13 »
Just want to make sure, is this the most up-to-date soarer's mod thread? Can I use this with an IBM 5576-003? Can it be set to block obvious keychatter (double presses)?

Thanks!

Offline Halvar

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Re: XT/AT/PS2/Terminal to USB Converter with NKRO
« Reply #1449 on: Thu, 14 January 2016, 15:50:22 »
@jiexy: This is the thread on Soarer's PS/2 to USB converter, there is also a keyboard controller by Soarer, but that's a different thread.

You can probably use the converter with the 5576 since it has a PS/2 connector. That said, I haven't seen much talk about using it with JIS layout keyboards in this thread, so there might be problems we don't know about.

Keychatter is normally something that the original controller of the keyboard should take care of before producing PS/2 signals. The converter doesn't have a function for that IIRC.

If that's important to you, you should probably replace the original controller. You can use Soarer's controller instead, or there are also other alternative controller firmware source codes that can be compiled to run on Teensies or Arduinos. Soarer's controller is said to have good chatter control, and you can configure it without compiling.
« Last Edit: Fri, 15 January 2016, 05:09:08 by Halvar »