Simple Questions, Simple Answers (FAQ in the OP)

[nkzt]

Thanks. I'll avoid row 5.

[epzy]

Has anyone here lost a screw inside the keyboard's plate before? If so, what tool did you use to recover it? Desoldering is not an option.

[riotonthebay]

Has anyone here lost a screw inside the keyboard's plate before? If so, what tool did you use to recover it? Desoldering is not an option.

Remove enough keycaps to take the plate/PCB out of the case, and then just shake out the screw. Or am I missing something?

[gh_pp]

So I tried everything I can to fix the rattling of the spacebar on my QFR

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=52342.msg1158992#msg1158992

I'm still not satisfied with the result, the spacebar is just not as solid as other keys (especially the sound).

Will cherry stabilizer be better in that regard?
If yes I guess I'll go with cherry stab for my phantom build.

What are some of the good TKL with cherry stabilizer?

[Pacifist]

So I tried everything I can to fix the rattling of the spacebar on my QFR

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=52342.msg1158992#msg1158992

I'm still not satisfied with the result, the spacebar is just not as solid as other keys (especially the sound).

Will cherry stabilizer be better in that regard?
If yes I guess I'll go with cherry stab for my phantom build.

What are some of the good TKL with cherry stabilizer?

imo best cherry stabs are PCB mounted and clipped. And I think phantom only allows costar, but not 100% sure on that.

[Photekq]

Phantom allows costar and cherry plate mount.. Cherry plate mount is just as good as cherry pcb mount when clipped imo

[SpAmRaY]

So I tried everything I can to fix the rattling of the spacebar on my QFR

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=52342.msg1158992#msg1158992

I'm still not satisfied with the result, the spacebar is just not as solid as other keys (especially the sound).

Will cherry stabilizer be better in that regard?
If yes I guess I'll go with cherry stab for my phantom build.

What are some of the good TKL with cherry stabilizer?

imo best cherry stabs are PCB mounted and clipped. And I think phantom only allows costar, but not 100% sure on that.

My phantom had cherry stabilizers.

[CPTBadAss]

Has anyone here lost a screw inside the keyboard's plate before? If so, what tool did you use to recover it? Desoldering is not an option.

Remove enough keycaps to take the plate/PCB out of the case, and then just shake out the screw. Or am I missing something?

I would agree with riotonthebay. But I'm not 100% sure what you mean by "losing it in the plate".

1) So I tried everything I can to fix the rattling of the spacebar on my QFR

2) Will cherry stabilizer be better in that regard?

3) What are some of the good TKL with cherry stabilizer?

1) Did you try a new spacebar? Your previous spacebar could be warped. Just because you looked at it and it doesn't *look* warped, doesn't mean it's not warped somehow.

2) I've never had a rattling spacebar so I can't say if that will fix your problem. But I prefer clipped Cherry stabilizers over anything else. I think they're very stable and smooth. The clipping makes the bottom-out feel crisp like the Costar Stabilizers. However, stabilizers seem to be a personal preference thing more than anything else.

3) There's an impartial list in this post. I don't really know keyboards by stabilizers though.

And I think phantom only allows costar, but not 100% sure on that.

No, Phantom allows for Cherry or Costar stabilizers.

[Pacifist]

is there a guide on direct wiring?

[CPTBadAss]

is there a guide on direct wiring?

Um, not a guide per se but Matt30 took some really good pictures and I know TheFlyingRaccoon has used that as a guide for his keyboard. Check this out.

[Melvang]

is there a guide on direct wiring?

Um, not a guide per se but Matt30 took some really good pictures and I know TheFlyingRaccoon has used that as a guide for his keyboard. Check this out.

This link is about as good as it gets.

http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/workshop-threads-of-interest-t7192.html

[JPG]

Hey, I know there's some information on O-rings and the likes, but does some apply to alps keyboard? I don't own one, but a coworker won an alps keyboard. The problem is that the bottom out sound is super loud. I let him try my filco with browns and o-ring and he found it perfect. Yet, since the alp stem is rectangular, my O-rings won't fit and even landing pads have a round opening.

So anyone has used so kind of technique to lower the bottom out sound of alps?

[CPTBadAss]

Hey, I know there's some information on O-rings and the likes, but does some apply to alps keyboard? I don't own one, but a coworker won an alps keyboard. The problem is that the bottom out sound is super loud. I let him try my filco with browns and o-ring and he found it perfect. Yet, since the alp stem is rectangular, my O-rings won't fit and even landing pads have a round opening.

So anyone has used so kind of technique to lower the bottom out sound of alps?

I've never tried it but I think it would work. WhiteFireDragon has pictures and a video about o-rings and Alps here.

[Pacifist]

Hey, I know there's some information on O-rings and the likes, but does some apply to alps keyboard? I don't own one, but a coworker won an alps keyboard. The problem is that the bottom out sound is super loud. I let him try my filco with browns and o-ring and he found it perfect. Yet, since the alp stem is rectangular, my O-rings won't fit and even landing pads have a round opening.

So anyone has used so kind of technique to lower the bottom out sound of alps?

I put some thin O rings on a few switches on my AT101W and it fits

[Melvang]

Is there a generally accepted date that distinguished "vintage" switches vs modern switches?

The reason I ask is the re-branded WYSE I am converting to hand matrix with NKRO has a silk screened date of '85 on the pcb but the hand stamped date is '95. 

So would these be considered modern or vintage.  I have already lubed them but they do feel noticeably stiffer than the blacks in the wife's Filco.  And this is coming from her.

[nubbinator]

"Vintage" have a different logo on the switch top than "new" blacks.  I've had old keyboards from the 80s and even 90s with one or the other or a mixture of both.  I've even seen ones with "new," "vintage," and what I'll call "old" Blacks that had a different logo on the housing that the other two.  It's not really a date thing.  Personally, I've had "vintage" Blacks that felt like crap and "new" and "old" ones that felt great.  I'd just use whatever you like best.

[Melvang]

"Vintage" have a different logo on the switch top than "new" blacks.  I've had old keyboards from the 80s and even 90s with one or the other or a mixture of both.  I've even seen ones with "new," "vintage," and what I'll call "old" Blacks that had a different logo on the housing that the other two.  It's not really a date thing.  Personally, I've had "vintage" Blacks that felt like crap and "new" and "old" ones that felt great.  I'd just use whatever you like best.

Awesome thanks nubs.  Is there any link that has an image of the different logos so I can compare?

[nubbinator]

This is the only one that I know of.  Even with that, it can be hard to tell what's what.  You kind of have to sort based on gut instinct first impression, come back and check, then figure out which is which.

[Melvang]

This is the only one that I know of.  Even with that, it can be hard to tell what's what.  You kind of have to sort based on gut instinct first impression, come back and check, then figure out which is which.

Awesome thanks Nub.

[Gaahl]

Does anyone use the dvorak layout? I am thinking about switching because I am pretty slow with QWERTY and I think that switching might help me improve my speed.

[Melvang]

Does anyone use the dvorak layout? I am thinking about switching because I am pretty slow with QWERTY and I think that switching might help me improve my speed.

Using Dvorak (or any other layout) is not really about speed but more about comfort.  While some people have reported speed increases it is rarely a significant increase.  From what I have read most people get up to their original qwerty speed between 3 and 6 months depending on how you go about the switch.

[Pacifist]

Anybody know how to open the 8113? It doesn't have screws but rather has a bunch of tabs. I don't really need the case that much, I just want to get to the PCB and desolder the switches. Is just taking a knife to the case an easy way to take it apart or will that not suffice?

[Coreda]

I've been looking at the 40-L Red O-ring sound dampeners and came across this item after a quick eBay search, which is cheaper than the WASD variety and appears to be the same thickness.

Are these the same?

[Pacifist]

I've been looking at the 40-L Red O-ring sound dampeners and came across this item after a quick eBay search, which is cheaper than the WASD variety and appears to be the same thickness.

Are these the same?

Not the exact same, but do the same job much cheaper

[CPTBadAss]

Anybody know how to open the 8113? It doesn't have screws but rather has a bunch of tabs. I don't really need the case that much, I just want to get to the PCB and desolder the switches. Is just taking a knife to the case an easy way to take it apart or will that not suffice?

Sounds like it's just snap fits. Pop them open. I would use something softer like a credit card or the tool that comes with QFR tops. A knife will work but might scratch your plastic.

I've been looking at the 40-L Red O-ring sound dampeners and came across this item after a quick eBay search, which is cheaper than the WASD variety and appears to be the same thickness.

Are these the same?

I don't know if the durometer rating is the same since the eBay listing doesn't say what hardness they are. The dimensions for the OD and ID are about the same as the WASD ones. And the thickness is 1.5mm versus the 2mm thickness of the WASD ones. So the o-rings aren't as thick. I have no experience with these o-rings though so I can't comment on how they feel.

[dorkvader]

Anybody know how to open the 8113? It doesn't have screws but rather has a bunch of tabs. I don't really need the case that much, I just want to get to the PCB and desolder the switches. Is just taking a knife to the case an easy way to take it apart or will that not suffice?

I used a nylon stick to pry the tabs directly. If you don't have one a flathead works nicely.

Don't work around the seam as you would normally do, instead just pry the tabs directly. Should come open pretty quick after that.
---
When hunting fro "vintage" blacks, I noticed three different logos on the shells. It was hard to say which was which. People who say the logo is different are only telling 2/3 of the story.

You will have to identify three logos and determine which one(s) correspond to "vintage" switches. There was a picture on DT that showed them clearly, but I can't find it now. I think tsangan had it.

[CPTBadAss]

Is there a generally accepted date that distinguished "vintage" switches vs modern switches?

The reason I ask is the re-branded WYSE I am converting to hand matrix with NKRO has a silk screened date of '85 on the pcb but the hand stamped date is '95. 

So would these be considered modern or vintage.  I have already lubed them but they do feel noticeably stiffer than the blacks in the wife's Filco.  And this is coming from her.

Check out this post from WhiskyTango who talks about WYSE and vintage blacks.

When hunting for "vintage" blacks, I noticed three different logos on the shells. It was hard to say which was which. People who say the logo is different are only telling 2/3 of the story.

You will have to identify three logos and determine which one(s) correspond to "vintage" switches. There was a picture on DT that showed them clearly, but I can't find it now. I think tsangan had it.

I think you might be referring to this thread dorkvader?

Does anyone use the dvorak layout? I am thinking about switching because I am pretty slow with QWERTY and I think that switching might help me improve my speed.

Using Dvorak (or any other layout) is not really about speed but more about comfort.  While some people have reported speed increases it is rarely a significant increase.  From what I have read most people get up to their original qwerty speed between 3 and 6 months depending on how you go about the switch.

This isn't really a simple question and I don't think the discussion belongs in this thread. Please check out some of the dvorak/layout threads or make a new thread for discussion. This is a personal preference based on ergonomics and other factors.

[goobus]

After a long hiatus, I am back!

I got a silenced 10th AE Realforce 87u and replaced the domes with 55g domes, and all keys work perfectly (thing types like a charm!) but when I hit a key and let it go, there's a sound like a spring vibrating or rebounding.

Does anyone know what could possibly be causing this?

[SpAmRaY]

After a long hiatus, I am back!

I got a silenced 10th AE Realforce 87u and replaced the domes with 55g domes, and all keys work perfectly (thing types like a charm!) but when I hit a key and let it go, there's a sound like a spring vibrating or rebounding.

Does anyone know what could possibly be causing this?

Like is described in this thread?

 http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=46648.0

[goobus]

Yes! Spamray you are genius.

Guess I have to wait and see. Weird that the sound only started when I took apart and reassembled.

Thanks a whole bunch.

Also I have a LZ-FE and KMAC 2 I still haven't had time to put together...

[noisyturtle]

Keycaps in the dishwasher. Has anyone tried it? Any reason why I shouldn't clean my caps in there?

[Candyflip]

Keycaps in the dishwasher. Has anyone tried it? Any reason why I shouldn't clean my caps in there?

I've tried it with thin abs caps it cleaned them good nothing damaged.

[CPTBadAss]

Keycaps in the dishwasher. Has anyone tried it? Any reason why I shouldn't clean my caps in there?

I don't really see an issue, just make sure it's not on the bottom rack.

[heedpantsnow]

Keycaps in the dishwasher. Has anyone tried it? Any reason why I shouldn't clean my caps in there?

I've done it too.  Put them in a mesh potato bag and it worked great.  I then used denture cleaner to get what was left off.

[noisyturtle]

Keycaps in the dishwasher. Has anyone tried it? Any reason why I shouldn't clean my caps in there?

I've done it too.  Put them in a mesh potato bag and it worked great.  I then used denture cleaner to get what was left off.

Ohh, that's a good idea. I was going to put them all into a colander but was worried the jet stream would pop them out and I'd be greeted by melted plastic on the bottom of my dishwasher.

[Melvang]

Can Alps switches be dissassembled and cleaned?  I picked up an AEK with white-ish alps.  Some seem to have a slight click but most do not.  The board chow isn't to bad but the caps are pretty grubby.  The color on the caps is still pretty good.  I would assume dye subbed pbt with an abs spacebar?  The space bar is pretty yellow.  I didn't break anything pulling the caps off or the plate/pcb assembly out but man those caps are on tight.  Picked it up for $5.  This one did not come with a cable but has the port on both sides of the case.  If I remember right this was for mouse pass through.  Was this just a standard PS/2 cable?

Also anything I should watch out for when dissassembling a Lexmark Model M from '93?  I did rip the clips off the spacebar when I pulled that one off but I should be able to replace that from unicomp.  The board chow on this one is massive.  I just need to buy a nut driver to get at the bolts holding the case together.  It has a PS/2 connector on it so would this be NKRO?  I got this one for $5 as well.

[Rena]

So does the Leopold FC700R have a completely standard key layout? Because I thought it didn't at one spot since the space bar used a proprietary design and they keycaps were shorter, or something. More importantly I just need to know if it would fit the keycaps from the valentines group buy completely.

[Lastpilot]

So does the Leopold FC700R have a completely standard key layout? Because I thought it didn't at one spot since the space bar used a proprietary design, or something. More importantly I just need to know if it would fit the keycaps from the valentines group buy completely.

The spacebar has a unique stem spacing on the FC700R. Unfortunately, it will not be able to use any other spacebar besides the Leopold one.

[jdcarpe]

So does the Leopold FC700R have a completely standard key layout? Because I thought it didn't at one spot since the space bar used a proprietary design, or something. More importantly I just need to know if it would fit the keycaps from the valentines group buy completely.

NO LEOPOLD KEYBOARD EXCEPT THE FC200R WILL WORK WITH ANY AFTERMARKET SPACEBARS.

Why Leopold, why?

[Rena]

Given the color scheme I'm trying to have I could still live with keeping the space there, but isn't it a lot shorter too?

I just measured it on my FC660M and the height is about 0.5cm at the shortest spot and 0.8cm at the tallest, as opposed to my Filco's approximate 1.2cm height

[jdcarpe]

I don't have an FC700R anymore to measure the spacebar height, but OEM height is usually taller than SP's DCS-profile.

[CPTBadAss]

1) Can Alps switches be dissassembled and cleaned? 

2) I would assume dye subbed pbt with an abs spacebar? 

3) Was this just a standard PS/2 cable?

4) Also anything I should watch out for when dissassembling a Lexmark Model M from '93?

5)  It has a PS/2 connector on it so would this be NKRO?

1) Look at the OP, there's a guide to modding your Alps switches. Yes you can open and clean them.

2) I think you're correct.

3) No, it had an ADB connection.

4) I recommend watching phosphorglow's video on how to properly bolt mod and clean any Model M

5) I think its only 2KRO because of the membrane. NKRO is on Fs.

Given the color scheme I'm trying to have I could still live with keeping the space there, but isn't it a lot shorter too?

I just measured it and the height is about 0.5cm at the shortest spot and 0.8cm at the tallest, as opposed to my Filco's approximate 1.2cm height

The profile on the 700R is indeed shorter than the Filco OEM and SP DCS profiles. I'm traveling so no measurements from me. But the 700R caps I had were almost DSA flat/height.

[Melvang]

1) Can Alps switches be dissassembled and cleaned? 

2) I would assume dye subbed pbt with an abs spacebar? 

3) Was this just a standard PS/2 cable?

4) Also anything I should watch out for when dissassembling a Lexmark Model M from '93?

5)  It has a PS/2 connector on it so would this be NKRO?

1) Look at the OP, there's a guide to modding your Alps switches. Yes you can open and clean them.

2) I think you're correct.

3) No, it had an ADB connection.

4) I recommend watching phosphorglow's video on how to properly bolt mod and clean any Model M

5) I think its only 2KRO because of the membrane. NKRO is on Fs.

Given the color scheme I'm trying to have I could still live with keeping the space there, but isn't it a lot shorter too?

I just measured it and the height is about 0.5cm at the shortest spot and 0.8cm at the tallest, as opposed to my Filco's approximate 1.2cm height

The profile on the 700R is indeed shorter than the Filco OEM and SP DCS profiles. I'm traveling so no measurements from me. But the 700R caps I had were almost DSA flat/height.

Thanks for the info CPT.  I didn't realize the alps disassembly stuff was here.

[Firebolt1914]

Recently, my Ducky Shine 3 space bar has been squeaking quite a bit. What should I do exactly to fix this problem?

[Pacifist]

Keycaps in the dishwasher. Has anyone tried it? Any reason why I shouldn't clean my caps in there?

I've done it too.  Put them in a mesh potato bag and it worked great.  I then used denture cleaner to get what was left off.

Ohh, that's a good idea. I was going to put them all into a colander but was worried the jet stream would pop them out and I'd be greeted by melted plastic on the bottom of my dishwasher.

I'm going to use a laundry bag to hold the 150 odd BS caps I'm washing

[CPTBadAss]

Recently, my Ducky Shine 3 space bar has been squeaking quite a bit. What should I do exactly to fix this problem?

Try reseating the board. If not, you can use superlube to put some lube on the stabs of your spacebar. There should be a link in the OP about it.

[Candyflip]

Recently, my Ducky Shine 3 space bar has been squeaking quite a bit. What should I do exactly to fix this problem?

Try this: http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=access,misc&pid=mechlube

[Firebolt1914]

Recently, my Ducky Shine 3 space bar has been squeaking quite a bit. What should I do exactly to fix this problem?

Try this: http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=access,misc&pid=mechlube

Thanks, will definitely check it out.

[morpheus]

Is there a thread that has a list of all the keyboards made by Co-Star and has Co-Star stabs?

[CPTBadAss]

Is there a thread that has a list of all the keyboards made by Co-Star and has Co-Star stabs?

Unfortunately there isn't.