Simple Questions, Simple Answers (FAQ in the OP)

[CPTBadAss]

@CPT, I think the picture that bluebar posted, the bottom of the screw head doesnt touch the plate. It just goes right through and directly mounts the pcb to the case. But thanks for your reply too

Ah I didn't see the picture. Was just focused on the text. I apologize. But I haven't seen that design very often. Typically the plates I've seen are bolted to the case somehow. I've also mostly worked on TKL and full sized boards.

[jdcarpe]

@CPT, I think the picture that bluebar posted, the bottom of the screw head doesnt touch the plate. It just goes right through and directly mounts the pcb to the case. But thanks for your reply too

Ah I didn't see the picture. Was just focused on the text. I apologize. But I haven't seen that design very often. Typically the plates I've seen are bolted to the case somehow.

On most full size, plate mounted keyboards I have encountered, neither the plate nor the PCB is bolted to the case. Held together by friction only! WTG, keyboard makers...wtf.

[Razor Lotus]

The bottom of the screw or bolt head touches the plate. And I've never seen screws that bolt into PCBs. The switch legs, solder joints, and the fit between the switch and plates hold the plate to the PCB. The plate then gets bolted to the bottom of the case in most of the keyboards I've seen.

It's usual for 60%s that the plate is not connected to the screws, except for some customs:
http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RG9LFA8.jpg

1. Seems like PCB Cherry stabs would work just fine for a plate mount as they're still mounted to the pcb without "touching" the plate.

2. What i wanted to know about the stabs was if there was a difference between plate and pcb mounted stabs and whether i would need to change stabs if i wanted to add a plate to my pure. And also, are pcb/plate stabs interchangable? I don't think so right?

1. If you use a thick acrylic plate there might be issues, but I'm not sure. Usually you should be fine. Make sure to lube and clip them while you're at it!
2. They're not interchangable as they have a different base.

Thanks. Any idea what keyboard this might be? Cause the switches are solded with the LEDs at the bottom but it's not a pure (which is the only 60% i know with LEDs soldered this way)

http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg

[jdcarpe]

The bottom of the screw or bolt head touches the plate. And I've never seen screws that bolt into PCBs. The switch legs, solder joints, and the fit between the switch and plates hold the plate to the PCB. The plate then gets bolted to the bottom of the case in most of the keyboards I've seen.

It's usual for 60%s that the plate is not connected to the screws, except for some customs:
http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RG9LFA8.jpg

1. Seems like PCB Cherry stabs would work just fine for a plate mount as they're still mounted to the pcb without "touching" the plate.

2. What i wanted to know about the stabs was if there was a difference between plate and pcb mounted stabs and whether i would need to change stabs if i wanted to add a plate to my pure. And also, are pcb/plate stabs interchangable? I don't think so right?

1. If you use a thick acrylic plate there might be issues, but I'm not sure. Usually you should be fine. Make sure to lube and clip them while you're at it!
2. They're not interchangable as they have a different base.

Thanks. Any idea what keyboard this might be? Cause the switches are solded with the LEDs at the bottom but it's not a pure (which is the only 60% i know with LEDs soldered this way)

http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg

Looks like a Poker X that someone added a plate to. And replaced stock LEDs with 2x3x4 rectagle LEDs.

I say it looks like it, because I believe that to be a Poker X I built.

[CPTBadAss]

On most full size, plate mounted keyboards I have encountered, neither the plate nor the PCB is bolted to the case. Held together by friction only! WTG, keyboard makers...wtf.

The Ducky Zero I just modded and, iirc, my Filco 104 both had bolts holding the plate in place.

Thanks. Any idea what keyboard this might be? Cause the switches are solded with the LEDs at the bottom but it's not a pure (which is the only 60% i know with LEDs soldered this way)

http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg

I think it's some form of 60% (Poker X, Poker 2, GON NS 38GT, etc) pcb in one of the low profile Tex 60% cases. And it looks like there's a custom painted/anodized plate. Perhaps from imsto.

[BlueBär]

Thanks. Any idea what keyboard this might be? Cause the switches are solded with the LEDs at the bottom but it's not a pure (which is the only 60% i know with LEDs soldered this way)

http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg

I think this might be a KBT KBC Poker X, ANSI, MX Clears, MX Grey in Spacebar, Lubed, Cherry Stabs, Costar Stabs in Spacebar, Beast Steel Plate (painted purple), KBT Pure Limited Aluminum Case, White LEDs on (Esc, WASD, Spacebar).

[jdcarpe]

Thanks. Any idea what keyboard this might be? Cause the switches are solded with the LEDs at the bottom but it's not a pure (which is the only 60% i know with LEDs soldered this way)

http://oi43.tinypic.com/23ud2r8.jpg

I think this might be a KBT KBC Poker X, ANSI, MX Clears, MX Grey in Spacebar, Lubed, Cherry Stabs, Costar Stabs in Spacebar, Beast Steel Plate (painted purple), KBT Pure Limited Aluminum Case, White LEDs on (Esc, WASD, Spacebar).

Yes, that's it. The one I built for dustinhxc.

[Pacifist]

Unicomp's website is horrendus to find stuff. What do I have to do to get a custom colored ANSI F-121 set?

[CPTBadAss]

Unicomp's website is horrendus to find stuff. What do I have to do to get a custom colored ANSI F-121 set?

Just email them on their site.

[dorkvader]

1. I expected some springs or something like that but from the first look inside there are just rubbers. Are these keyboards rubber dome?

2. Or are they just noname cheap stuff and there are no sense of repairing them?

3. Also, this keyboards are recognize only 3 keys pressed together can I do something about it?

1. Yes, those are rubberdomes.
2. Yes.
3. This is called key rollover (or in short KRO). No you can't change that without some serious modding.

And welcome to Geekhack!

#2 No. ICL used to make very well respected mechanical switches that were mainly available in europe.
here is an example:
http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/hi-i-have-a-strange-keyboard-t2183.html

[BlueBär]

#2 No. ICL used to make very well respected mechanical switches that were mainly available in europe.
here is an example:
http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/hi-i-have-a-strange-keyboard-t2183.html

Ok then in this case it's branded cheap stuff that still isn't worth repairing

[Photekq]

Oh, I was actually meaning to ask about this before. Anyone here tried an ICL keyboard like this? If so, what did you think about it? I could only find that DT thread on it, but nothing was said about the switches other than 'feels amazing to type on' from one guy.

[swill]

I was asked a question via PM and I thought the answer would actually be interesting to a larger audience, so here it is...

The question:

Can I solder the switches before I attach the stabilizers (cherry style)?
Are the stabilizers just popped in or are they secured in any other way as well?

My response:
Disclaimer:  I am not an expert.  Everything I know is based on research and limited experience...

That being said, I am more than willing share what I know.

To get started, there are two different types of Cherry stabilizers; plate mounted and pcb mounted
Do you know which type you have?  What pcb are you using?  Are you using a plate?

It is easier to explain how both work by letting someone else do it.    >>> YouTube >>>

So to answer your question.  You need to add plate mounted stabilizers before you solder on the switch.  You can remove pcb mounted stabilizers with the switches soldered in place if you are not using a plate.  In some plates (like spirt's 5mm acrylic plate), you can (and need to) use pcb mount stabilizers with the plate because the whole area is cut out, so both the switch and the stabilizer is actually pcb mounted.  In this case, you can also remove the stabilizers with the switches soldered on.  I just checked with the universal tkl plate and with an IMSTO 60% plate and I could use cherry pcb mount stabs with both, BUT, you would have to desolder the WHOLE BOARD if you want to change them, so you would absolutely have to put them in first.  I would not recommend that, you would want to get plate mounted stabilizers in that case.

Here are some pictures that might help you understand.  These are pcb mount stabilizers and the different plates mentioned above.

[Razor Lotus]

But they are interchangable right?

Like the pcb would support both pcb and plate mounted stabs?

Just that if i'm lazy to go source for a plate mounted stab, i would have to mount the pcb stab first and desolder all the switches if i want to change anything. If not, i should just get a plate stab and mount it like a switch?

[BlueBär]

1. But they are interchangable right?
Like the pcb would support both pcb and plate mounted stabs?

2. Just that if i'm lazy to go source for a plate mounted stab, i would have to mount the pcb stab first and desolder all the switches if i want to change anything.

1. The PCB needs only space and nothing special to support plate mounted stabs. Since the Pure already supports PCB mounted stabs you can use both types.

2. Yes.

[swill]

But they are interchangable right?

Like the pcb would support both pcb and plate mounted stabs?

Just that if i'm lazy to go source for a plate mounted stab, i would have to mount the pcb stab first and desolder all the switches if i want to change anything. If not, i should just get a plate stab and mount it like a switch?

If your pcb does not have pcb mount stabilizer holes, you would have to clip off some plastic to use pcb mount stabs with a plate.

[BlueBär]

If your pcb does not have pcb mount stabilizer holes, you would have to clip off some plastic to use pcb mount stabs with a plate.

That won't work, then there will be nothing to hold the stabilizer properly in place.

[swill]

If your pcb does not have pcb mount stabilizer holes, you would have to clip off some plastic to use pcb mount stabs with a plate.

That won't work, then there will be nothing to hold the stabilizer properly in place.

I will take your word for it. U assumed that it would be locked between the plate and the pcb so it would not move. I could be wrong, but with my quick inspection it looked to be possible.

[BlueBär]

I will take your word for it. U assumed that it would be locked between the plate and the pcb so it would not move. I could be wrong, but with my quick inspection it looked to be possible.

I don't have something to test it but according to the spec sheet and my own measurments, plate cutouts should be too big to hold it down. The holes should be just as wide as the bases and about a millimeter longer.

Besides, I don't think that is a good idea anyways. Plate mounted stabilizers exist for a reason and they have a latching tab that fixes them to the plate, if you would use your idea there is really nothing but pressure from the top that holds them in place. Assembly would also probably be quite the hassle.

[swill]

I will take your word for it. U assumed that it would be locked between the plate and the pcb so it would not move. I could be wrong, but with my quick inspection it looked to be possible.

I don't have something to test it but according to the spec sheet and my own measurments, plate cutouts should be too big to hold it down. The holes should be just as wide as the bases and about a millimeter longer.

Besides, I don't think that is a good idea anyways. Plate mounted stabilizers exist for a reason and they have a latching tab that fixes them to the plate, if you would use your idea there is really nothing but pressure from the top that holds them in place. Assembly would also probably be quite the hassle.

Absolutely not recommended. I think it would depend on the plate. I think it could work with the plates I was looking at (universal TKL and IMSTO 60%). The pcb stab fits through the imsto plate pretty easily. On the universal plate it barely fits through and was hard to remove after. It definitely would not go completely through the plate.

Get the right part for the job is always the right choice.

[Kblavkalash]

Hi guys,

I have Filco tenkeyless mx blue switch keyboard which I bought 3 years ago. It's in very good condition, just some key caps wore off. Any idea what can I sell it for in Europe? Is it hard/easy to sell it? I payed 110£ 3 years ago, so what can I expect now for it?

Cheers.

[BlueBär]

I have Filco tenkeyless mx blue switch keyboard which I bought 3 years ago. It's in very good condition, just some key caps wore off. Any idea what can I sell it for in Europe? Is it hard/easy to sell it? I payed 110£ 3 years ago, so what can I expect now for it?

We have a seperate price check thread here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=31779.0

[Kblavkalash]

I have Filco tenkeyless mx blue switch keyboard which I bought 3 years ago. It's in very good condition, just some key caps wore off. Any idea what can I sell it for in Europe? Is it hard/easy to sell it? I payed 110£ 3 years ago, so what can I expect now for it?

We have a seperate price check thread here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=31779.0

Thanks mate.

[Eszett]

Sorry for the stupid question, but what actually is "Dolch", what does it mean. A certain color? a certain shape? a certain material? or what?

[intelli78]

Sorry for the stupid question, but what actually is "Dolch", what does it mean. A certain color? a certain shape? a certain material? or what?

Dolch was a company. But we mainly use it to refer to the dark gray color scheme that their keyboards had.

[Eszett]

@intelli78 Ah, the color scheme of white legends on grey background. Thank you!

[combataran]

Where can I find a wrist rest like this?

[Sifo]

Welp that's otd.kr's logo, would assume one of their members made it.

[BlueBär]

Where can I find a wrist rest like this?

Show Image

What Sifo said.
You can get custom wrist wrests in the artisan subforum, Beast and tigersharkdude make some.

[swill]

Where can I find a wrist rest like this?

Show Image

What Sifo said.
You can get custom wrist wrests in the artisan subforum, Beast and tigersharkdude make some.

Don't forget noko.

[BlueBär]

Don't forget noko.

Afaik Noko doesn't do pure wood ones though.

[Dubsgalore]

Where can I get 7x wires?

[swill]

Where can I get 7x wires?

Cherry?  You could makes some...

[CPTBadAss]

Where can I get 7x wires?

I think GON has some for sale and there's a couple sellers in the classifieds that might still have some. Forget their name offhand though.

[Dubsgalore]

Where can I get 7x wires?

I think GON has some for sale and there's a couple sellers in the classifieds that might still have some. Forget their name offhand though.

GON's shipping price 

I haven't seen any in the classifieds at all so that's why I posted here

[CPTBadAss]

Where can I get 7x wires?

Cherry?  You could makes some...

I know Melvang is working on a jig and a setup to bend his own stabilizer wires because it is hard to source parts. Not sure when he'll be finishing up though.

[Pacifist]

md can get qfs for $65. Is there any place selling them with a much shorter timeframe at around the same price? Friend is converting to mechs and everywhere I try to find qfs or qfr its $90+

[hwood34]

md can get qfs for $65. Is there any place selling them with a much shorter timeframe at around the same price? Friend is converting to mechs and everywhere I try to find qfs or qfr its $90+

MD is gonna be the best price you're gonna get new, although I'm sure plenty of people are selling them used for around $60. Massdrop is worth it if you're willing to wait the ridiculous time it takes

[intelli78]

Can you take the click leaf out of a Matias clicky switch and make a linear switch? If yes, what are the results like?

[BlueBär]

1. Can you take the click leaf out of a Matias clicky switch and make a linear switch?

2. If yes, what are the results like?

1. Yes.
2. Feels weird - quite light and there is still some sort of bump. Edit: It gets caused by the end of the actuator leaf. You feel the point where it is bent.

[intelli78]

Ah. Thanks for the info.

[frosty]

what are the differences between smd and through hole diodes, beside through hole diodes being, well, through hole.

do i require both when i'm building a non led-backlit keyboard?

[Melvang]

what are the differences between smd and through hole diodes, beside through hole diodes being, well, through hole.

do i require both when i'm building a non led-backlit keyboard?

The diodes required will depend on which board you are using.  You should only need one type.  I don't remember seeing any that could use either one.  Through hole is much easier to solder than SMD.

[swill]

what are the differences between smd and through hole diodes, beside through hole diodes being, well, through hole.

do i require both when i'm building a non led-backlit keyboard?

i am guessing that you may be slightly confused by the components you need for an LED keyboard.  for any keyboard, you will need one diode per switch.  depending on the pcb, this could be either through hole or smd.  this diode basically works like a one way gate which makes each key press in the matrix uniquely identifiable by the controller.  now if you want to have LEDs, then you want to add resistors into the mix as well.  the resistors basically control how much power (probably actually current) goes to each led and they also make sure that the power that you do have can be distributed across the whole board of LEDs so they are all a consistent brightness. 

i probably did not describe this well enough, but i am sure someone will correct me if i made major errors.

in short, you need diodes for the matrix to function.  you need resistors if you plan to use leds as well...

[frosty]

what are the differences between smd and through hole diodes, beside through hole diodes being, well, through hole.

do i require both when i'm building a non led-backlit keyboard?

i am guessing that you may be slightly confused by the components you need for an LED keyboard.  for any keyboard, you will need one diode per switch.  depending on the pcb, this could be either through hole or smd.  this diode basically works like a one way gate which makes each key press in the matrix uniquely identifiable by the controller.  now if you want to have LEDs, then you want to add resistors into the mix as well.  the resistors basically control how much power (probably actually current) goes to each led and they also make sure that the power that you do have can be distributed across the whole board of LEDs so they are all a consistent brightness. 

i probably did not describe this well enough, but i am sure someone will correct me if i made major errors.

in short, you need diodes for the matrix to function.  you need resistors if you plan to use leds as well...

haha i understand the compenents need i just didn't you y'all to be confused between smd resistors and smd diodes. my question still stands; what are the differences between smd diodes and through hole diodes (besides through being "easier" to solder")

[intelli78]

They are functionally the same. no difference aside from how they are installed.

Also, rare case but keep in mind if you have old switches with built-in diodes, you don't need smd or external thru-holes.

[Melvang]

through hole diodes will have two legs or leads that will fit through the hole in the PCB that will get soldered and cut.  SMD diodes will just be a small rectangle with two metal ends that get soldered to a flat pad. 

[swill]

what are the differences between smd and through hole diodes, beside through hole diodes being, well, through hole.

do i require both when i'm building a non led-backlit keyboard?

i am guessing that you may be slightly confused by the components you need for an LED keyboard.  for any keyboard, you will need one diode per switch.  depending on the pcb, this could be either through hole or smd.  this diode basically works like a one way gate which makes each key press in the matrix uniquely identifiable by the controller.  now if you want to have LEDs, then you want to add resistors into the mix as well.  the resistors basically control how much power (probably actually current) goes to each led and they also make sure that the power that you do have can be distributed across the whole board of LEDs so they are all a consistent brightness. 

i probably did not describe this well enough, but i am sure someone will correct me if i made major errors.

in short, you need diodes for the matrix to function.  you need resistors if you plan to use leds as well...

haha i understand the compenents need i just didn't you y'all to be confused between smd resistors and smd diodes. my question still stands; what are the differences between smd diodes and through hole diodes (besides through being "easier" to solder")

no difference.  you basically just pick whatever your pcb supports.  a lot of the older pcbs only support through hole diodes.  some of the newer pcbs (like from sprit's gb) actually support both smd or through hole diodes, so you can choose which you want to use.

here is a picture of a pcb which allows you to choose which type of diode you want to use.

[swill]

They are functionally the same. no difference aside from how they are installed.

Also, rare case but keep in mind if you have old switches with built-in diodes, you don't need smd or external thru-holes.

Yes, you may have to remove the diodes in the switches if your pcb does not support through hole diodes in that orientation.  You can not use through hole diodes inside a switch with leds as they take up the same space...

Edit:  Here are a couple pictures of what intelli78 is talking about.  Here is a switch with a diode installed...

[intelli78]

Yup. And, some switches have wires instead of diodes, for stabilization.  If they do, REMOVE them and do not solder them in or they will short the terminals and bypass your diodes.