Author Topic: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each  (Read 10524 times)

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Offline sordna

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If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 13:20:40 »
Title says it all. Both your WPMs must be current, ie not what your QWERTY used to be before you switched :-)
Please note if you can do your 2 layouts in the same keyboard, or in different keyboards.
In my case, I type Dvorak on a Kinesis Advantage, and QWERTY on regular keyboards, so here are my current WPMs:

Dvorak: 90 WPM
QWERTY: 60 WPM
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline jwaz

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #1 on: Sun, 03 March 2013, 22:04:26 »
My QWERTY skills have seriously fallen off since switching, I definitely can't touch type it at all.

I probably should try to learn it again since I maintain server hardware without Colemak installed.

Offline gnubag

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #2 on: Mon, 04 March 2013, 02:06:48 »
QWERTY 80
Colemak ~40
I don't use colemak often but i still try to switch completely.


Offline ishumprod

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #4 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 06:58:04 »
i'm considering moving the caps of my razer and learning dvorak as it seems to be the most user-friendly AND work-effective layout outhere.
home-made TKL rubber dome keyboard !

Offline bugybunny

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 06 March 2013, 09:05:04 »
Neo2: 125WMP
QWERTZ: 50WPM

I can type both on my blank TECK
« Last Edit: Wed, 06 March 2013, 09:06:54 by bugybunny »

Offline jabar

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 06 March 2013, 14:56:19 »
i'm considering moving the caps of my razer and learning dvorak as it seems to be the most user-friendly AND work-effective layout outhere.
consider colemek, if only for preserving ZXCV for standard shortcuts
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Offline nesiax

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #7 on: Mon, 11 March 2013, 21:10:16 »
My QWERTY skills have seriously fallen off since switching, I definitely can't touch type it at all.

I probably should try to learn it again since I maintain server hardware without Colemak installed.
I had the same problem as i offer on site service support too; is very difficult to maintain the same skills on two different keyboard layouts because when you switch to colemak you don't want to go qwerty again, and because of that i designed a hardware based keyboard for colemak in mind, however you can change to another layout using a special key combination, i suggest you to check out the key64 project web page, i have published all the material i have done in order to build the keyboard so if you have time you can build your own, the firmware currently supports colemak, qwerty and dvorak as keyboard layouts.
The only drawback is you have to travel with the keyboard, but typing is a pleasure !!
« Last Edit: Mon, 11 March 2013, 21:12:07 by nesiax »
now: key64.org with cherry blue keys and dsa keys |  before: noppoo choc mini with cherry brown keys
Check out the key64.org project , A Libre * Design, Minimalist, Ergonomic, Splittable, Symmetric, Compact 64 Keys, Eco-Friendly, Durable, Native Colemak Keyboard, Embedded Mouse and Firmware Programmable USB Keyboard.  * Free as in Freedom.
The key64 need a case, if you want to design it please contact us

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 12 March 2013, 05:11:19 »
QWERTY: 65
Dvorak: 35 - keyboard cover. reminded me why I hate it.

Offline berserkfan

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 02 April 2013, 09:48:00 »
qwerty: 72

Colemak: 30 (still learning)
Most of the modding can be done on your own once you break through the psychological barriers.

Offline Macsmasher

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 02:47:29 »
I was a strong 70wpm on qwerty, which I've used for 30 years. Switched to Colemak 1/27/2013...So a little over two months.

I'm now 55 - 62wpm Colemak. fwiw, I quit qwerty cold turkey. Haven't used it since I switched. I'll maybe reintroduce qwerty at some point in time if I have to. The only reason I would need is when I'm at a client's office working on their server or something. But with PKL (portable keyboard layout) and some new boards coming out that have Colemak dip switchable at the keyboard, I may never use qwerty again.

I think Colemak will raise my wpm eventually, but I honestly don't care. I'm a programmer, so anything above 70wmp is irrelevant in terms of productivity anyway. What Colemak gave me was typing comfort. I love the layout and will never go back to qwerty.

For those considering the switch from qwerty, basically ANY other layout will be an improvement. There are several reasons I chose Colemak over Dvorak. Dvorak was developed in the 1930s and I think Colemak came out around 2006. Colemak is optimized for the English language, Dvorak is more international. Colemak is laid out with computer keyboard shortcuts in mind. And I read somewhere that 80% of English words are comprised of just 12 letters, and most of those are on the Colemak home row.

If you're considering an alternate layout as a coder or just for writing emails and documents, go to the below link and paste in some text or code that you write. It will analyze the text and tell you how efficient each layout is.

http://patorjk.com/keyboard-layout-analyzer/

Don't think that I'm pushing Colemak. If you're considering a layout change, you might look into Workman. And even though Dvorak was developed in the 30s, it's still a great layout. But if you're happy with qwerty, there's really no reason to switch.

Offline Grim Fandango

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 02:57:34 »
I would really like to try something other than QWERTY. However, because of work, there will still  be a lot of times when I have to use it. So I figure I may as well stick with it.
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Offline sordna

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 07:55:56 »
Folks, this thread is about people that actively maintain skills on multiple layouts, and prove it can be done! It's really worth it, especially if you deal lots of devices and other people's computers.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline paldepind

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #13 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 09:58:37 »
Colemak: ~ 70 wpm
QWERTY: ~ 45 wpm

I've been using Colemak for about 2,5 years. I didn't switch because of speed but because of ergonomics and I'm very happy with it. My Qwerty skills are still decent even though I've done nothing to maintain them except when I occasionally find myself in front of a QWERTY keyboard. I can switch almost seamlessly between layouts on the same keyboard.
« Last Edit: Thu, 04 April 2013, 10:04:05 by paldepind »

Offline Macsmasher

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #14 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 11:00:56 »
Folks, this thread is about people that actively maintain skills on multiple layouts, and prove it can be done! It's really worth it, especially if you deal lots of devices and other people's computers.

My Android phone is still qwerty. Does that count?  :D

I'll reintroduce qwerty in a few months. I just didn't want to confuse muscle memory while retraining it. I'm sure it will come back in a day or so.

I work with another programmer who grew up qwerty and switched to Dvorak about six years ago. He's about 100wpm in both, and switches seamlessly back and forth. I've seen him do it without missing a beat. He says it's like learning to speak another language. Once you're fluent in both, you simply put your brain in German or English mode when beginning to speak. Once you say a few words, your brain switches over and it's all automatic after that.

Offline sordna

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #15 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 18:42:16 »
Can he switch layouts and type 100WPM on the same keyboard ? That's very impressive!
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline TemurAmir

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #16 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 19:49:25 »
70 Colemak
50 QWERTY

I expect my colemak speed to increase until it's close or more than my old QWERTY speed. I had no meaningful reason to retain my QWERTY speed and I think it would be very difficult for me because of muscle memory issues.

Offline sordna

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #17 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 20:53:38 »
As long as you maintain a productive QWERTY speed, 50 is fine, for when using other people's keyboards, then you're fine! It's an important skill to keep IMO.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline sudowork

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #18 on: Thu, 18 July 2013, 19:01:22 »
Just started learning Colemak recently, but I went on a trip for about a month where I wasn't able to use a computer. Anyways, here are my current speeds (just tested on typeracer), with my previous speeds in parentheses:

QWERTY: 120 (150)
Dvorak: 90 (130)
Colemak: 100

Learning Colemak took a big toll on my Dvorak speeds.

Offline jalitt

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #19 on: Mon, 29 July 2013, 13:11:15 »
 I am probably 100 wpm qwerty, 70 wpm maltron, 60 wpm dvorak.

Though my dvorak is going to drop way off in a few more weeks once I get another Maltron keyboard for home.

Offline Jagriff

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #20 on: Wed, 31 July 2013, 01:33:18 »
60 QWERTY
100 Colemak

I used to be around 100 in QWERTY before I switched. I had to work decently hard for a week to get back up to 60 (while not losing Colemak memory) and don't really see any point to working to get any faster in QWERTY. When I switched I only used Colemak, but now I use Colemak on my home desktop (ErgoDox) and QWERTY everywhere else.

Offline tormentor

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #21 on: Wed, 31 July 2013, 01:50:55 »
80 wpm QWERTY
20 wpm Dvorak

As you can see I'm proficient in the wrong layout.

Offline suka

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #22 on: Wed, 31 July 2013, 04:14:04 »
44 WPM qwertz , hunt and peck style
75 WPM AdNW

Offline Linkbane

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 03 August 2013, 04:22:13 »
125 wpm Dvorak
75 wpm Qwerty, cannot touch type most words.
(using 10fastfingers)

EDIT:
137 top, 125 average Dvorak.
« Last Edit: Sat, 31 August 2013, 17:13:15 by Linkbane »
Quickfire TK MX Blue Corsair K60 MX Red Ducky Shine 3 Yellow TKL MX Blue Leopold FC660C
Current best: 162 wpm.

Offline Jack

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #24 on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 03:10:32 »
All-time average on Typeracer for Dvorak is 125.8 and climbing (vonunov). QWERTY is at 74.4, with the last ten races averaging 85 (krbgbrk). This is the progress from something more like 60 WPM after 365 races. Still trying to get a 100 WPM race on QWERTY but I'm working on some accuracy issues. I don't change physical keyboards.
« Last Edit: Fri, 30 August 2013, 03:14:45 by Jack »

Offline Annas

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #25 on: Thu, 28 November 2013, 07:42:46 »
QWERTY 65 wpm
Dvorak 30 wpm - 2 weeks practice

Offline Oobly

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #26 on: Thu, 28 November 2013, 08:14:08 »
44 WPM qwertz , hunt and peck style
75 WPM AdNW

I'm hoping to get to this^^

Currently:

40 to 50 WPM qwerty - anywhere between 3 and 7 fingers, looking now and then
20 WPM modified AdNW - no looking :)

Buying more keycaps,
it really hacks my wallet,
but I must have them.

Offline Linkbane

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #27 on: Thu, 28 November 2013, 16:19:51 »
EDIT: 154 Dvorak!
Still mid-70's Qwerty or thereabouts.
« Last Edit: Tue, 03 December 2013, 16:57:39 by Linkbane »
Quickfire TK MX Blue Corsair K60 MX Red Ducky Shine 3 Yellow TKL MX Blue Leopold FC660C
Current best: 162 wpm.

Offline kolonelkadat

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #28 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 06:49:33 »
Dvorak: 90 WPM
QWERTY: 15 WPM -- this is the fastest I ever achieved after ~10 years and 4 typing classes, hence the switch to dvorak.
"Obviously, windows are central to Windows. But what is a window?"

Offline Annas

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #29 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 09:27:42 »
Dvorak: 90 WPM
QWERTY: 15 WPM -- this is the fastest I ever achieved after ~10 years and 4 typing classes, hence the switch to dvorak.

Wow. Never saw such a big difference between Dvorak and QWERTY

Offline kolonelkadat

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #30 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 15:42:28 »
Its probably more psycological than anything else. Some sort of deep seated resentment for being stuck in typing class over and over again while all my friends were building cars and robots in shop class. Or maybe its just hatred of the layout from being forced to type stupid bull poo like 'fad' or 'sad' or 'lad' ad nauseum because those were the only words you could type in whatever stupid area of the board they were trying to get you to learn.

Like "oh. you want me to type words using only the home row? I'll show you typing words on the  home row.  :mad:"


Dvorak: 90 WPM
QWERTY: 15 WPM -- this is the fastest I ever achieved after ~10 years and 4 typing classes, hence the switch to dvorak.

Wow. Never saw such a big difference between Dvorak and QWERTY
"Obviously, windows are central to Windows. But what is a window?"

Offline Tony

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #31 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 19:39:47 »
Colemak 70wpm Qwerty 25wpm. I dropped Qwerty completely after 1 month with Colemak.
Keyboard: Filco MJ1 104 brown, Filco MJ2 87 brown, Compaq MX11800, Noppoo Choc Brown/Blue/Red, IBM Model M 1996, CMStorm Quickfire Rapid Black
Layout: Colemak experience, speed of 67wpm

Offline Oobly

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 04 December 2013, 01:15:59 »
I notice how most people who learn Colemak either drop QWERTY completely or report a much reduced speed in it after switching, whereas some who have learnt Dvorak, Maltron, AdNW, etc. maintain their old QWERTY speed. This is an important factor, IMHO, when choosing layout.

Choosing a layout which is too SIMILAR to QWERTY (ie one which has the same shortcut key positions, etc, in order to be "easier" to learn) will cause you to lose speed in QWERTY or unable to maintain it as a skill due to muscle memory issues and similarity of the layouts.

It's worth taking into consideration for anyone who needs to maintain something close to their current functional speed in QWERTY during the transition, ie anyone who uses a computer for work.

I'm not saying Dvorak is better than Colemak, just that a DIFFERENT layout is better to learn IF you want to maintain functional speed during the transition. I am learning a modified AdNW layout, for what it's worth (in part due to the placement of "I", "U" and "L" in Dvorak).

I'm glad I thought of this when starting to learn my new layout as my QWERTY speed is the same as, or perhaps a little better than it was when I started due to confidence gained by realising my "floating" style is healthier long-term than touch-typing QWERTY.

Congratulations and good for you to all those who have learnt a 2nd layout, no matter which one it is (except TNWML)!
Buying more keycaps,
it really hacks my wallet,
but I must have them.

Offline Linkbane

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #33 on: Wed, 04 December 2013, 01:25:08 »
I notice how most people who learn Colemak either drop QWERTY completely or report a much reduced speed in it after switching, whereas some who have learnt Dvorak, Maltron, AdNW, etc. maintain their old QWERTY speed. This is an important factor, IMHO, when choosing layout.

Choosing a layout which is too SIMILAR to QWERTY (ie one which has the same shortcut key positions, etc, in order to be "easier" to learn) will cause you to lose speed in QWERTY or unable to maintain it as a skill due to muscle memory issues and similarity of the layouts.

It's worth taking into consideration for anyone who needs to maintain something close to their current functional speed in QWERTY during the transition, ie anyone who uses a computer for work.

I'm not saying Dvorak is better than Colemak, just that a DIFFERENT layout is better to learn IF you want to maintain functional speed during the transition. I am learning a modified AdNW layout, for what it's worth (in part due to the placement of "I", "U" and "L" in Dvorak).

I'm glad I thought of this when starting to learn my new layout as my QWERTY speed is the same as, or perhaps a little better than it was when I started due to confidence gained by realising my "floating" style is healthier long-term than touch-typing QWERTY.

Congratulations and good for you to all those who have learnt a 2nd layout, no matter which one it is (except TNWML)!

I've noticed that also. From my personal experience, I'm slower than at my peak Qwerty (75 versus 90 or so), but it's not much of a difference and I could type QWERTY if I had to. Just not something that I'd do voluntarily, and my school doesn't have an issue with me adding the layout (nobody manages to change to it accidentally, luckily).
Quickfire TK MX Blue Corsair K60 MX Red Ducky Shine 3 Yellow TKL MX Blue Leopold FC660C
Current best: 162 wpm.

Offline Tony

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #34 on: Wed, 04 December 2013, 01:42:24 »
The reason I dropped Qwerty is that I can always type in Colemak at any Qwerty computer by running a small software. Dvorak users also have DvorakAssist to do so.

Keeping two layouts is possible but totally unnecessary. Counting the time you have to type at another's computer and you decide for yourself whether it is really worth it.

For someone who still wishes to do so you can read a Colemak user's experience in keeping both layouts at the same time. From his experience it is even easier to keep both Qwerty and Colemak since they have 10 keys in common, you only have to learn the rest 17 keys.

http://www.ryanheise.com/colemak/

When I first started learning the Colemak keyboard layout, I tried to maintain a skill in both QWERTY and Colemak simultaneously. This was actually not too difficult to do since Colemak keeps many keys in the same place, and the result after 30 days of practice was 104 WPM for Colemak and 95 WPM for QWERTY (down from 104 WPM at the start).

After this little experiment, I discovered a nice way to switch to Colemak on other computers that did not have it installed: simply type in http://www.ryanheise.com/colemak.exe (provided that computer has Internet access) and the layout will automatically change. For computers without Internet access, you might carry the exe on a USB disk. Now, I do not bother with QWERTY anymore (although it seems my fingers still have the muscle memory).

For those interested in maintaining a skill in both layouts, my strategy was to type in QWERTY for about 5-10 minutes each morning immediately after waking up, and then to switch to Colemak for the rest of the day. You may find it surprisingly easy to switch back and forth.

Tips for learning

After the plateau at 50 WPM, I decided to pay attention to my weaknesses, and I noticed that my most commonly mistyped character was "G". After simply focusing on "G" as I typed, my speed instantly jumped up into the 60s.

When I got into the 90s, progress was quite slow getting up above 100 WPM. What helped was to practice by typing with a steady rhythm, using the same amount of time to think about each character. This forced me to take the time I needed to catch common mis-presses before they happened, something that I think would have taken much longer to correct otherwise.

Now that my speed is above 100 WPM, my typing technique works something like this: by default, force myself to type at a steady pace -- but, when I see words or strings of words that I know I can type very quickly (e.g. using known finger rolls) then I remember to speed up on those, -- and, when I see words that I know I have problems with, I remember to slow down and type carefully. This, I have found, is the fastest way for me to type, as it tends to eliminate a lot of wasted time introducing and correcting mistakes. However, it requires being aware of your strong and weak words.
« Last Edit: Wed, 04 December 2013, 01:47:19 by Tony »
Keyboard: Filco MJ1 104 brown, Filco MJ2 87 brown, Compaq MX11800, Noppoo Choc Brown/Blue/Red, IBM Model M 1996, CMStorm Quickfire Rapid Black
Layout: Colemak experience, speed of 67wpm

Offline Linkbane

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #35 on: Wed, 04 December 2013, 01:48:42 »
After the plateau at 50 WPM, I decided to pay attention to my weaknesses, and I noticed that my most commonly mistyped character was "G". After simply focusing on "G" as I typed, my speed instantly jumped up into the 60s.

When I got into the 90s, progress was quite slow getting up above 100 WPM. What helped was to practice by typing with a steady rhythm, using the same amount of time to think about each character. This forced me to take the time I needed to catch common mis-presses before they happened, something that I think would have taken much longer to correct otherwise.

Now that my speed is above 100 WPM, my typing technique works something like this: by default, force myself to type at a steady pace -- but, when I see words or strings of words that I know I can type very quickly (e.g. using known finger rolls) then I remember to speed up on those, -- and, when I see words that I know I have problems with, I remember to slow down and type carefully. This, I have found, is the fastest way for me to type, as it tends to eliminate a lot of wasted time introducing and correcting mistakes. However, it requires being aware of your strong and weak words.

Good advice. I tend to type the opposite, as quickly as possible unless something difficult comes up, which I will also attempt to type quickly (but not as quickly) so that I may accurately commit it to muscle memory. I didn't plateau until 140, though, hah. Took me a long while to get over that hump.
Quickfire TK MX Blue Corsair K60 MX Red Ducky Shine 3 Yellow TKL MX Blue Leopold FC660C
Current best: 162 wpm.

Offline Oobly

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #36 on: Wed, 04 December 2013, 02:39:49 »
...
Keeping two layouts is possible but totally unnecessary.
...
For someone who still wishes to do so you can read a Colemak user's experience in keeping both layouts at the same time. From his experience it is even easier to keep both Qwerty and Colemak since they have 10 keys in common, you only have to learn the rest 17 keys.

...

For those interested in maintaining a skill in both layouts, my strategy was to type in QWERTY for about 5-10 minutes each morning immediately after waking up, and then to switch to Colemak for the rest of the day. You may find it surprisingly easy to switch back and forth.

...

It MAY be necessary to keep 2 layouts. Such as when you are learning the new one and need to keep typing at a decent speed in order to keep your job, like I do.

If you learn two DIFFERENT layouts, you don't need to put any effort into maintaining QWERTY, since you haven't replaced it, but instead have learnt a new skill in ADDITION to it.

I'm just saying this to help anyone who wants to learn a new layout, but is hesitating because they need to keep their current typing speed on QWERTY for whatever reason and don't want to put a lot of extra (unnecessary) effort into maintaining it.

A lot of companies won't let you run an unknown exe file from the net! Windows doesn't include Colemak support by default, but it does for Dvorak. You can add the Dvorak layout in "Text services and input languages" and switch between them using Alt-Shift. I keep the layout in the firmware of my keyboard, so I have to carry it around if I want to use it, but it works on any machine as a standard keyboard (they see it as a US QWERTY). Most of the time if I have to use someone else's machine I just use QWERTY.

His (Ryan Heise's) learning tips are good, though, I'll keep them in mind when my speed increases. I don't intend to go over about 80WPM, though, as I consider that to be fast enough for practically any purpose (and definitely fast enough for coding) and maintainable without too much practice (just everyday work typing should be enough) and I don't want to stress my tendons and fingers, etc.
Buying more keycaps,
it really hacks my wallet,
but I must have them.

Offline sordna

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #37 on: Sat, 07 December 2013, 12:13:21 »
Oobly, good points. I also had the same thoughts regarding maintenance of skill for 2 layouts. Like you, my theory is that it's better if they are as different as possible. I created this thread to test my theory! However several folks have reported excellent speeds on qwerty and Colemak. So I'm not so sure about this theory anymore... I think more data is needed.
Regardless, I'm happy I went with Dvorak and qwerty, it has served me well to maintain both. Losing qwerty entirely would be bad for my work and would make it hard to use friends' or public computers.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline pushcx

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Re: If you know 2 keyboard layouts post your current WPM for each
« Reply #38 on: Sat, 07 December 2013, 15:21:06 »
I'm running this experiment now. I've always used standard US qwerty + staggered kbs. I decided ~12 weeks ago to build an Ergodox with Norman layout. Since the decision, I've been testing my typing speed daily (using Amphetype) and it averages 98wpm.

I started using the Ergodox 7 days ago, practicing at least 20m/day with Klavaro. Also some use in surfing, email, light coding - but I'm still too slow for that not to be painful. Ergodox yesterday was 28wpm, and qwerty has increased to 104wpm averaged over the last week. I was surprised by that, but I think it's because 1. the columnar layout of the Ergodox forced me to get better about using the proper fingers instead of wandering around (my y, b were often wrong, hand, and some pinky keys were done with ring finger) and 2. I'm paying more attention to typing and care about doing well (Hawthorne effect).

We'll see how it works out in a month or two. My hope has been that I can keep qwerty at 90+ and get norman up into a usable 80+ within 6 weeks.
WTB a set of black-on-black, white-on-white, or gold side-printed cherry mx keycaps for the ErgoDox I'm building, please PM